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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9740 on: April 12, 2019, 12:55:51 pm »
Been doing this stupid teaching job for several years, I hate that I'm back and have to be told exactly how to run my classes. my co-teachers stop me in the middle of the class and tell me, you should do this, you should do that. while another teacher showed me how she runs her class, and then asks me if i can do it. I said I'd try, but I have my own style too which doesn't involve 20 minutes of drills. that is literally all they do in regular classes, is memorize a script and then read it about 20 times (not exaggerating) in every class, until they reach 100 times and then they get a sticker. I ask them simple questions which they can't answer or understand because it'snot on their script. When I try to deviate from how the teacher does things, she stops me and says that's too difficult and do it her way instead....

I've always wondered about memorising and repeating.  My coteachers are obsessed with it.  I think it's a tactic of theirs to fill time in the class by saying something like "memorise this dialogue for twenty minutes".  Well that works out pretty well for them and not having to plan much for the class.

They've suggested the same thing to me and I've always thought to myself "what was the point in me flying thousands of miles to come here if all you want me to do is have the students memorise and recite dialogues?"

It's one of those things where I question the point of us being here. I'm all for an easy lesson plan, but at least give it us some purpose here

I find that often my actual, unofficial, role is as an English editor i.e. finding and pointing out all of the English errors and bizarre style choices that somehow made it into the official materials (not to mention the extra materials made by KETs). I want to find out how much our city spends on the official English textbooks but at the same point I think I might self-immolate if I do.

In my experience, my coteachers are rarely interested in what's natural.  Even after I've given them the natural expression they'll take their phone out and get straight onto Naver translate to try and pick holes in what I've told them.  Even vocabulary...I'm telling you the word is "shoelace" not "rope". 


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9741 on: April 12, 2019, 01:08:26 pm »
Been doing this stupid teaching job for several years, I hate that I'm back and have to be told exactly how to run my classes. my co-teachers stop me in the middle of the class and tell me, you should do this, you should do that. while another teacher showed me how she runs her class, and then asks me if i can do it. I said I'd try, but I have my own style too which doesn't involve 20 minutes of drills. that is literally all they do in regular classes, is memorize a script and then read it about 20 times (not exaggerating) in every class, until they reach 100 times and then they get a sticker. I ask them simple questions which they can't answer or understand because it'snot on their script. When I try to deviate from how the teacher does things, she stops me and says that's too difficult and do it her way instead....

elementary school?  in all my time here and teaching in all types of schools, I found elementary to be the most controlling and limiting in what you should do.  stick to the textbook, get the students repeating sentences that are instantly forgettable, sing some songs, as that is the pathway to elementary success.  really stupid.  you really couldn't pay me enough to go back to teach elementary here.  i think it is the biggest waste of a native teacher to be put in an elementary.  most of the time there is no designated English teacher, just someone who got volunteered to do it.  by middle and high school, you actually have teachers who majored in English and most of the time they have a passion and various methods to teach.  you will still find the stalwarts who think their way is best and stop you from doing things, but it's a minority. 

like Aristocrat said, at the beginning of the year with new teachers, just sit down and ask them,'what do you want me to do?' usually the reply will be  'what did you do last year?'  'i planned and taught all the classes'  'okay, we do the same this year'  conversation finished.  generally, if you're competent, been at the school a few years, have a good rep from word of mouth, then you should be sweet.  but like I said, from experience, elementary school is the least flexible with what you can do freely and that gets in the way. 


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9742 on: April 12, 2019, 01:18:25 pm »
In my experience, my coteachers are rarely interested in what's natural.  Even after I've given them the natural expression they'll take their phone out and get straight onto Naver translate to try and pick holes in what I've told them.  Even vocabulary...I'm telling you the word is "shoelace" not "rope". 

Yeah, that last bit is what blows my mind the most. My coteachers are pretty good about accepting what I tell them, but sometimes one or two of them will challenge me when I correct word usage. Like this is the one thing that a native teacher can actually trump most non-native speakers over even when they have no teaching credentials, but it's the one thing that I get nitpicked at the most.

No, panties do NOT refer to both male and female undergarments.

No, briefs are not the same as boxers.

No, no one in the U.S. ever says "farming" when they're talking about gardening.

No, cake is not bread, and bread is not cake. Cereal is also NOT considered bread.

Yes, Maichuu is still considered a candy.

Yes, I understand that in Korea they've konglish'd some of those meanings, but they don't always understand that it's konglish, and then they try to force me to accept their own bastardized meanings in English-speaking settings, and just ****** no.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2019, 01:23:32 pm by Chinguetti »


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9743 on: April 12, 2019, 02:29:41 pm »
Been doing this stupid teaching job for several years, I hate that I'm back and have to be told exactly how to run my classes. my co-teachers stop me in the middle of the class and tell me, you should do this, you should do that. while another teacher showed me how she runs her class, and then asks me if i can do it. I said I'd try, but I have my own style too which doesn't involve 20 minutes of drills. that is literally all they do in regular classes, is memorize a script and then read it about 20 times (not exaggerating) in every class, until they reach 100 times and then they get a sticker. I ask them simple questions which they can't answer or understand because it'snot on their script. When I try to deviate from how the teacher does things, she stops me and says that's too difficult and do it her way instead....

I'm lucky enough to have CTs who're mature and we work well together, usually.

Co-teaching is something many Korean teachers aren't used to and instead of working with you, it's easier to tell you what to do.
It sounds like you've adopted a submissive role and your CTs are asserting their style, mainly because it's easier but perhaps, they feel the need to assert themselves as the dominate teacher, particularly to the students. Despite being English teachers, many CTs are incredibly insecure about their English ability and will go to great lengths not to jeopardize their reputation, this includes falling back into rote-learning, it's predictable to teach and there's little margin for error and making sure they're never put in a position to expose their English ability. Ever wondered why she doesn't want to you or the students to deviate from the script? She can't answer those questions and it terrifies her.

The easiest solution would be to split the period into your CTs time and your time.

The other way, of course, as to assert yourself as an authority of what you teach and as a teacher, this includes everything from how you present yourself, your tone of voice and projecting confidence. Conflict is likely to arise, but IMO, it's for the best.

- If your CT interrupts you mid-lesson,  cut him/her off before they can finish, tell them you'll speak about it later, and carry on.
- Stay polite, but be abrupt. Stop saying "ummm, well, I dunno etc." when asked to do something you don't want to, just say no.
- Stick to your guns and be stubborn but leave the door open for compromise.

You are the NET, you are the sole authority on correct English in your classroom. Act like it and your CT and students will treat you this way.  Good luck

I've just been talked to by another teacher, my head English teacher. She explained that this very teacher is not a regular teacher but is considered as one of those higher class teachers that is on a special list of some sort and that she not only teaches students she also teaches Teachers. I explained my point of view in that a script is useless outside of the classroom even though it may look good to other people when they are there watching (I was impressed in the first class, but then learnt they know nothing outside of it) but it's something they will never actually use. And her (head teacher)  response was that I should just follow her (co-T) and try to do it her way.  We've already split up the lessons and chapters, she does the odd numbers and I do the even numbered chapters, yet, in my classes, she takes up 15 to 20 minutes of drilling and repeating scripts and then I'm left with the rest of the time to rush through. So yeah.... it's only been 1 month.


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9744 on: April 12, 2019, 02:49:57 pm »
Yes, Maichuu is still considered a candy.

No, no, it's clearly a jelly.
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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9745 on: April 12, 2019, 02:59:54 pm »
My co teachers are a mixed bag of things that I hate in equal amount.

One teacher....will translate EVERYTHING i say. It's irritating beyond belief. I say "open your books to page 30" the students have already started to do it...but she feels the need to repeat it in Korean. I'll be in the middle of explaining something and a student will turn around and ask her what I mean WHILE I'm still speaking and she will answer in Korean over the top of me. It drives me wild and I usually stop them midway and ask them to hold any questions til the end. She even just starts chatting to a student while I'm talking too, usually I stop and stare at them and either wait or actually ask the student to be quiet. I've spoken to her multiple times about it but it's like she literally can't control herself.

The other....does NOTHING. She arrives 10-15 minutes late and brings her phone or a book and sits at the back. I had a real issue with one classes' behaviour last year (soccer students going wild every class) and she didn't even look up. I'd lose it and she'd rouse her head and say "Oh I'm sorry I couldn't help, I didn't see what happened". Yeah..no shit. Sometimes if I told a kid off the kid would get arsy and appeal to her, she'd have the absolute audacity to suddenly chime in and say to me "Oh he says he didn't do that," and I'd firmly have to tell her that I'm the teacher and if I say he did then he did.  After every class I'd tell her I needed her support in the class and she'd agree and never did a thing.

I honestly couldn't tell you which of these situations is worse.  Wow, true to the thread that was a RANT.


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9746 on: April 12, 2019, 03:14:31 pm »
My co teachers are a mixed bag of things that I hate in equal amount.

One teacher....will translate EVERYTHING i say. It's irritating beyond belief. I say "open your books to page 30" the students have already started to do it..

INT. KOREAN PUBLIC SCHOOL - MORNING

It's an average Tuesday morning. Kevin Teacher is up at the front, ready to pick the next student to read by burying his hand into a bucket full of popsicle sticks, each individually labelled with the students ID numbers, 1 through 25. The grade 6 children look on, some with pure terror in their eyes, others hoping to be the chosen one. Regardless, they have all gone through 3 odd years of English and know how to count to 1000. Kevin Teacher lifts his hand skyward, reveals a devilish smirk and plunges his right hand into the bucket below.

Kevin Teacher: Student. Number...................... Seven!

 :-* 칠번

 
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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9747 on: April 12, 2019, 03:26:47 pm »
My co teachers are a mixed bag of things that I hate in equal amount.

One teacher....will translate EVERYTHING i say. It's irritating beyond belief. I say "open your books to page 30" the students have already started to do it..

INT. KOREAN PUBLIC SCHOOL - MORNING

It's an average Tuesday morning. Kevin Teacher is up at the front, ready to pick the next student to read by burying his hand into a bucket full of popsicle sticks, each individually labelled with the students ID numbers, 1 through 25. The grade 6 children look on, some with pure terror in their eyes, others hoping to be the chosen one. Regardless, they have all gone through 3 odd years of English and know how to count to 1000. Kevin Teacher lifts his hand skyward, reveals a devilish smirk and plunges his right hand into the bucket below.

Kevin Teacher: Student. Number...................... Seven!

 :-* 칠번

 

Yeppp exactly that.  The student is already groaning and standing up but  she's all "칠번!! 칠번!!!!"

I think I noticeably clench my teeth when she does it. I've reminded her several times that they can count to 25.


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9748 on: April 12, 2019, 03:30:59 pm »
Except in my public middle school there are legit students who don't know any numbers above 10. Yesterday, I was completely dumbfounded when one 3rd grade girl didn't know the difference between summer and winter.

Am I doing something wrong? Lol


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9749 on: April 12, 2019, 03:33:30 pm »
Except in my public middle school there are legit students who don't know any numbers above 10. Yesterday, I was completely dumbfounded when one 3rd grade girl didn't know the difference between summer and winter.

Am I doing something wrong? Lol

lol no...but sometimes they very clearly know and she doesn't give them a chance to figure it out. She starts translating before I've even finished haha


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9750 on: April 12, 2019, 03:40:00 pm »
Am I doing something wrong? Lol

Yeah, some kids in Grade 6 have been my students for the entirety of their schooling.................................. And sometimes I wonder....................

BUT, think of it this way. Think of all the completely dolt-headed, complete idiot adults you've met/know.

They all went to public school. You've got hundreds of kids, there's bound to be some in there. It's depressing but it's  true.

Just do your best and attempt to help them pick up the slack.
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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9751 on: April 12, 2019, 09:23:03 pm »
Been doing this stupid teaching job for several years, I hate that I'm back and have to be told exactly how to run my classes. my co-teachers stop me in the middle of the class and tell me, you should do this, you should do that. while another teacher showed me how she runs her class, and then asks me if i can do it. I said I'd try, but I have my own style too which doesn't involve 20 minutes of drills. that is literally all they do in regular classes, is memorize a script and then read it about 20 times (not exaggerating) in every class, until they reach 100 times and then they get a sticker. I ask them simple questions which they can't answer or understand because it'snot on their script. When I try to deviate from how the teacher does things, she stops me and says that's too difficult and do it her way instead....

I'm lucky enough to have CTs who're mature and we work well together, usually.

Co-teaching is something many Korean teachers aren't used to and instead of working with you, it's easier to tell you what to do.
It sounds like you've adopted a submissive role and your CTs are asserting their style, mainly because it's easier but perhaps, they feel the need to assert themselves as the dominate teacher, particularly to the students. Despite being English teachers, many CTs are incredibly insecure about their English ability and will go to great lengths not to jeopardize their reputation, this includes falling back into rote-learning, it's predictable to teach and there's little margin for error and making sure they're never put in a position to expose their English ability. Ever wondered why she doesn't want to you or the students to deviate from the script? She can't answer those questions and it terrifies her.

The easiest solution would be to split the period into your CTs time and your time.

The other way, of course, as to assert yourself as an authority of what you teach and as a teacher, this includes everything from how you present yourself, your tone of voice and projecting confidence. Conflict is likely to arise, but IMO, it's for the best.

- If your CT interrupts you mid-lesson,  cut him/her off before they can finish, tell them you'll speak about it later, and carry on.
- Stay polite, but be abrupt. Stop saying "ummm, well, I dunno etc." when asked to do something you don't want to, just say no.
- Stick to your guns and be stubborn but leave the door open for compromise.

You are the NET, you are the sole authority on correct English in your classroom. Act like it and your CT and students will treat you this way.  Good luck

I've just been talked to by another teacher, my head English teacher. She explained that this very teacher is not a regular teacher but is considered as one of those higher class teachers that is on a special list of some sort and that she not only teaches students she also teaches Teachers. I explained my point of view in that a script is useless outside of the classroom even though it may look good to other people when they are there watching (I was impressed in the first class, but then learnt they know nothing outside of it) but it's something they will never actually use. And her (head teacher)  response was that I should just follow her (co-T) and try to do it her way.  We've already split up the lessons and chapters, she does the odd numbers and I do the even numbered chapters, yet, in my classes, she takes up 15 to 20 minutes of drilling and repeating scripts and then I'm left with the rest of the time to rush through. So yeah.... it's only been 1 month.

Someone I know is working with someone like that, during extra classes for middle schoolers. The NET and the Korea teacher are  teaching lessons focusing on writing. This Korean teacher is highly regarded because he's been teaching these extra classes for years and apparently, his classes are quite challenging.
After the first day, I was quickly enlightened as to what "challenging" meant in this context.

The guy jumps around between topics, like he's on crack, making his lessons confusing and all over the place.  Instead of teaching the basics of writing, he likes to show off by instructing them to write essays, right off the bat, and demonstrating how to write well, by showing his own writing, the opening sentence being:

"I grew up in a small town. First of all, as time goes by I grew up..."

I was told the guy goes just short of sniffing his own farts in class when he constantly quotes Einstein in a comical attempt to come off as sophisticated. His mission is to let everyone know how smart he is... he's actually terribly incompontent, insecure and rather dumb. When the NET points out the writing, riddled with spelling and grammatical errors, he brushes it off and says "mistakes are beautiful". He insists the awkward English material he uses is legit as it's from "Pearson" and "OXford". I did a little research and found it's one of the native Japanese and Korean publishers who slap an English person's name on as co-atuhor and somehow publish the books under the name Oxford and Pearson.

No exageration, in my 6yrs of teaching at 9 different schools, even among my CTs who I work well with and have great respect for, I have met only 1 Korean teacher who I'd say is competent at teaching English properly.


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9752 on: April 12, 2019, 09:52:35 pm »
He insists the awkward English material he uses is legit as it's from "Pearson" and "OXford".
Are you sure they didn't say "Pear's Son" and "Oxfam?"
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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9753 on: April 12, 2019, 11:19:21 pm »
He insists the awkward English material he uses is legit as it's from "Pearson" and "OXford".
Are you sure they didn't say "Pear's Son" and "Oxfam?"
My father-in-law  taught on a reserve called “Oxford House” as a semi-retirement job. I suggested he refer to that timeframe as, “while I was teaching at Oxford...”


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9754 on: April 13, 2019, 11:12:48 pm »
AliExpress sellers who take out a shipping number to stop to fulfillment clock, but then don’t ship for days!

There has to be a way they can police this better.


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9755 on: April 14, 2019, 08:09:19 am »
People who don't crush their empty water bottles before putting them into the recycling bin.  So instead of fitting in 50 bottles, we can fit about 8.

People who don't clean the leftover food waste out of the plastic containers before dumping them into the recycling bin.

Brand new teachers who have just arrived here with neither any experience nor training, happily charging parents 50,000 per hour plus meals to "teach" their children.  You've got to have some balls to do that haven't you?  I'm a little bit mad at the parents as well lol.


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9756 on: April 14, 2019, 10:04:17 am »
Quote
Brand new teachers who have just arrived here with neither any experience nor training, happily charging parents 50,000 per hour plus meals to "teach" their children.  You've got to have some balls to do that haven't you?  I'm a little bit mad at the parents as well lol.

People are always having a go on here about newbies accepting too little money so that sounds like a positive thing. If 50,000 becomes the norm for people with no experience or training why not 60,00 for those who have?

By the way, If those teachers are doing it legally and breaking their contracts, they have no right to complain about Korean employers not honoring their side of the deal.


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9757 on: April 14, 2019, 12:13:51 pm »
Quote
Brand new teachers who have just arrived here with neither any experience nor training, happily charging parents 50,000 per hour plus meals to "teach" their children.  You've got to have some balls to do that haven't you?  I'm a little bit mad at the parents as well lol.

People are always having a go on here about newbies accepting too little money so that sounds like a positive thing. If 50,000 becomes the norm for people with no experience or training why not 60,00 for those who have?

By the way, If those teachers are doing it legally and breaking their contracts, they have no right to complain about Korean employers not honoring their side of the deal.

Yeah that's a fair point which I didn't consider.

The thing that had me scratching my head and got me thinking was a Facebook post from someone who had just arrived and was talking about meetup groups for making friends.  She said something like "If you just want to talk to me to practice your English then first you'd better figure out how much you're going to pay me".  It seemed very arrogant to me, particularly from someone who has no credentials at all.


Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9758 on: April 14, 2019, 12:35:54 pm »
Quote
Brand new teachers who have just arrived here with neither any experience nor training, happily charging parents 50,000 per hour plus meals to "teach" their children.  You've got to have some balls to do that haven't you?  I'm a little bit mad at the parents as well lol.

People are always having a go on here about newbies accepting too little money so that sounds like a positive thing. If 50,000 becomes the norm for people with no experience or training why not 60,00 for those who have?

By the way, If those teachers are doing it legally and breaking their contracts, they have no right to complain about Korean employers not honoring their side of the deal.

Yeah that's a fair point which I didn't consider.

The thing that had me scratching my head and got me thinking was a Facebook post from someone who had just arrived and was talking about meetup groups for making friends.  She said something like "If you just want to talk to me to practice your English then first you'd better figure out how much you're going to pay me".  It seemed very arrogant to me, particularly from someone who has no credentials at all.

A lot of those newbies probably get their attitude from reading threads on here.


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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #9759 on: April 15, 2019, 02:16:51 pm »
My 6th Period class on Mondays... I swear, it's the exact opposite of the problems I had with some classes at my last school in that NONE of the students have any energy whatsoever. Maybe two students will half-heartedly answer a question I ask. It's as if they all had a death in the family over the past weekend. And this is the "high" level class mind you. I even showed them the "What Does the Fox Say?" video and the most I got was a smile from one of them.

It's not awful, but it's draining when you're presenting and getting literally nothing back. (insert tired face)
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