RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0

Just had one class reach that magical age where they like to say Puck You. So I deployed my usual massive overreaction. Shouting and all fun cancelled for the next two periods. At the end of the hell class I ask my co-teacher to explain why they should never use those words unless they like being punched in the face.

Dear girl could barely pretend to give a toss. It was all giggles and whatevs. Kids think it's just some odd quirk of mine now.

Does anybody teaching out of Korea feel like filming their students learning the Korean expression for 18, dog baby, eating boiled candy and crazy guy? I'm sure my co-teacher would see the humour in this situation.

Well,  that is one approach.

Have you ever tried simply to ignore it and not react?

Then, at the end of class you can simply address the student, individually, when the others have left, ask why he was held back and explain why using such language leads others to believe you are an uneducated dolt, a half-wit.

It has worked a charm at times.

Different strokes, different folks.

"Wow! Good English!"  has always stopped my kids dead in their tracks.  It's not the reaction they were hoping for expecting, and they never seem to feel the need to say it again.
I'm actually low-key proud of them when they pull out English swears.  It means they took the initiative to learn English outside of English class.

In the corridor, I heard one of my girl students tell another girl to 'piss off' in a joking way.  Brilliant.

I told my Swedish friends about the 'puck you' thing and they thought it was hilarious before mentioning that it isn't really a swear word because as the spelling has changed it's meaning has changed.  I think it is a second language thing.  I don't really hear it nearly as much as I did when I first came here, mind.  As I teach girls, the rate of hearing swearing has been reduced to about once a semester.  Boys middle and boys high would be ten times a minute.

I just ignore it from the kids now. They're just trying to get a reaction out of you.

My teachers class however, they decided that learning swear words would be fun so one of the lessons got super derailed and they learned the phrase "you're a piece of $#!t" along with others.

Just had one class reach that magical age where they like to say Puck You. So I deployed my usual massive overreaction. Shouting and all fun cancelled for the next two periods. At the end of the hell class I ask my co-teacher to explain why they should never use those words unless they like being punched in the face.

Dear girl could barely pretend to give a toss. It was all giggles and whatevs. Kids think it's just some odd quirk of mine now.

Does anybody teaching out of Korea feel like filming their students learning the Korean expression for 18, dog baby, eating boiled candy and crazy guy? I'm sure my co-teacher would see the humour in this situation.

For the most part, your average Korean is completely oblivious to audacity of saying the
f-word, s-word and all their variations and in many ways, it's understandable.

Those trashy Hollywood movies, on the English channel, and the hilarious display of K-pop artists trying to swear in English and act tough don't exactly come with disclaimers.
Kids, especially, think it's a joke. They completely understand the concept of the audacity of swearing in class.

When this happened a few weeks ago, I stopped the class and wrote the words 'f*ck' and 'sh*t', on the board. My students and CT didn't really bat an eye until I wrote it next to 씨발
and 젠장. The reaction was very different and the students and my CT turned white... My CT was visibly anxious about having those words on the board but thankfully didn't interrupt as she understood that I was about to give a vitally important lesson.

Explain, in a calm yet serious tone, that future swearing in English will bear the same consequences as swearing to a teacher in Korean.

There's nothing 'cool n' chill' about letting kids run around saying expletives, and it's even worse when they greet it with a chuckle or think it's cute. But, it also is a chance for an educational moment - a lot of the time if you explain to kids that it's actually a bad word, and that it's not cool or funny or cute, then a lot of the time they'll kind of clue in, and at least avoid saying it directly in front of you. Of course some kids are just jerks and will continue, but some students genuinely don't know that those are bad.

I totally get what you're saying. My students who have sworn know exactly what they are saying and they're doing it to look like a bada** and to get a rise out of me.  By denying them that any continued use becomes pointless.  So that's the strategy I use and will continue to use.
If I had students running around spouting random swear words, I would definitely stop them.  That hasn't been the case.
Going through school in French immersion, I had some teachers that would nonchalently teach us about swears and others who would freak out if we said "sacre bleu."  Neither strategy really changed the amount we swore. 
I don't either approach to this problem is wrong.  It's just a matter of personal preference, your students, and CoT support.

Too, true.

Employ what works and suits you and your situation.

Best practices, FTI: http://www.k12.wa.us/SpecialEd/Families/pubdocs/bestpractices.pdf

I think the swear word debate is interesting and I try to react how I would at home.

The first time I hear them swearing I explain what the words are and that they are swear words. Sometimes they genuinely don't know.

The second / third / fourth / 1 millionth time I hear them swearing - I don't give a sh*t. Why? I believe swearing can be good for the soul...and part of growing up. I swore at my friends in school. Everyone did. Everyone does.

I really don't believe these kids are going to grow up to work at some company, and greet their new foreign business partners with "Hello Mr.Smith. Nice to f**king meet you. You c**t. "  They'll grow out of it, and it gives them a chance to be creative with what is and isn't allowed.

This week in my school I've overheard -

"Oh my gas rangeeee"
"What the puck"
"What the luck"
"ship"
"Oh ship"
"What the fox say"


 


Anyway, this is only if I overhear them.

Swearing AT me would be different, but they don't cos they love me 

Nah, super small rural town.  It just happened to be a "busy" time and there were like half a dozen people clustered around one teller (apparently the only one who handles utility bills?).  I noticed this time that people just put their bills on the counter to show who was next in "line."  Reminded me of days of old when people would put tokens onto the arcade game screen to stake a claim for the next round. 

One of the bank employees handed out those small glass fruity (energy?) drinks to everyone who was waiting!  That was a nice surprise.

Isn't there a special machine at your bank for people to use to pay their utility bills? Even when I used to live in a super-rural part of Korea, the NongHyup banks there had this machine for paying utility bills.

Also, about a year ago when I went to a bank and was going to be there for a while (both waiting my turn and the matter I needed the bank teller to help me with), one of the female bank tellers brought me a glass of grape juice. It was a very unexpected and kind gesture, although unfortunately I don't like grape juice, so I ended up giving it to my friend who later came to meet me at the bank and was waiting for me. Haha.

Another time a few years ago, I had to go to the post office to pick up a large envelope that someone had sent me (and I guess it didn't get delivered to the place where I was living at the time because I wasn't home when they tried to deliver it and apparently I needed to sign for it). The employees at the post office happened to be having a bingsu party, and one of them surprised me by fixing me a bowl of bingsu and handing it to me while I was waiting. It was very nice (I guess this should probably go in the "Raving" thread, haha).

I think the swear word debate is interesting and I try to react how I would at home.

The first time I hear them swearing I explain what the words are and that they are swear words. Sometimes they genuinely don't know.

The second / third / fourth / 1 millionth time I hear them swearing - I don't give a sh*t. Why? I believe swearing can be good for the soul...and part of growing up. I swore at my friends in school. Everyone did. Everyone does.

I really don't believe these kids are going to grow up to work at some company, and greet their new foreign business partners with "Hello Mr.Smith. Nice to f**king meet you. You c**t. "  They'll grow out of it, and it gives them a chance to be creative with what is and isn't allowed.

This week in my school I've overheard -

"Oh my gas rangeeee"
"What the puck"
"What the luck"
"ship"
"Oh ship"
"What the fox say"


 


Anyway, this is only if I overhear them.

Swearing AT me would be different, but they don't cos they love me 

but swearing in class, in front of the teacher, when they clearly know what it means (and trying to push boundaries), is nothing but disrespectful. i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at school

swearing in class, in front of the teacher, when they clearly know what it means (and trying to push boundaries), is nothing but disrespectful. i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at school

Sorry, but that simply isn't the case.

These kids repeat what they hear from their parents, their peers, their music, and what they watch.

One student being angry and trying to express their frustration and anger, is different than someone who is calmly sitting in class using profanities.

As teachers, we need to be able to recognize and understand the difference.

It can be a teachable moment.

These kids are like sponges.  They are a product of what they stew in, day in and day out.

Gym teacher has no fuckin g indoor voice. Quiet the fuc k down.

swearing in class, in front of the teacher, when they clearly know what it means (and trying to push boundaries), is nothing but disrespectful. i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at school

Sorry, but that simply isn't the case.
These kids repeat what they hear from their parents, their peers, their music, and what they watch.
One student being angry and trying to express their frustration and anger, is different than someone who is calmly sitting in class using profanities.
As teachers, we need to be able to recognize and understand the difference.
It can be a teachable moment.
These kids are like sponges.  They are a product of what they stew in, day in and day out.

I think you missed Oglop's caveat (bolded).
When kids are swearing in order to push boundaries then it is definitely is a punishable offence. If some kid accidentally staples his hand to his desk, then I'll give the expletives a pass.
   You're right that we should judge according to intent, which I think most of us recognise.

Gym teacher has no fuckin g indoor voice. Quiet the fuc k down.

Yessss. Also, mine seems to think everyone wants to hear a loud grunt after he finishes eating. Just fkng be normal and get up and go away.

Gym teacher has no fuckin g indoor voice. Quiet the fuc k down.

Yessss. Also, mine seems to think everyone wants to hear a loud grunt after he finishes eating. Just fkng be normal and get up and go away.

Just try to out-grunt him to establish your dominance.

You'll either stop the behavior, or make a friend/enemy for life.

swearing in class, in front of the teacher, when they clearly know what it means (and trying to push boundaries), is nothing but disrespectful. i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at school

Sorry, but that simply isn't the case.

These kids repeat what they hear from their parents, their peers, their music, and what they watch.

One student being angry and trying to express their frustration and anger, is different than someone who is calmly sitting in class using profanities.

As teachers, we need to be able to recognize and understand the difference.

It can be a teachable moment.

These kids are like sponges.  They are a product of what they stew in, day in and day out.

Pennypie said that she stops the class and tells the students what it is they are saying, and that they are swear words -- and that the kids keep using them, even after knowing what they mean. in this case, the kids know they are in the wrong, but seeing what they can get away with

Gym teacher has no fuckin g indoor voice. Quiet the fuc k down.

Yessss. Also, mine seems to think everyone wants to hear a loud grunt after he finishes eating. Just fkng be normal and get up and go away.

Just try to out-grunt him to establish your dominance.

You'll either stop the behavior, or make a friend/enemy for life.

I should take this advice. I'm all for displays of dominance in Korea.

swearing in class, in front of the teacher, when they clearly know what it means (and trying to push boundaries), is nothing but disrespectful. i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at school

Sorry, but that simply isn't the case.
These kids repeat what they hear from their parents, their peers, their music, and what they watch.
One student being angry and trying to express their frustration and anger, is different than someone who is calmly sitting in class using profanities.
As teachers, we need to be able to recognize and understand the difference.
It can be a teachable moment.
These kids are like sponges.  They are a product of what they stew in, day in and day out.

I think you missed Oglop's caveat (bolded).
When kids are swearing in order to push boundaries then it is definitely is a punishable offence. If some kid accidentally staples his hand to his desk, then I'll give the expletives a pass.
  You're right that we should judge according to intent, which I think most of us recognise.

Absolutely.

i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at schoo
.........of course I did. Why did we do it? because we were pushing boundaries. I didn't do it to them, or at them or disrupt the class with it but within earshot...sure. I don't necessarily see pushing boundaries as a bad thing. Perhaps it's a British / American differences.


If the teacher ignored it, well eventually we didn't care.

Some teachers would tell us alternatives (I read one article about using Shakespearean insults to get teenagers interested in Shakespeare which was cool).

Those teachers that bore down on us every time they overheard a F or an S lost the battle every time.


Obviously I'm not talking about using bad language at the teacher, or in an abusive way but between friends, in a funny casual way is fine by me. Obviously if it is disrupting everyone in the class then I deal with the disruption.

I see "stopping fun for the next two periods" as overkill.

This is a big debate between British teachers right now too, and it's really interesting. Everyone is divided.

Nah, super small rural town.  It just happened to be a "busy" time and there were like half a dozen people clustered around one teller (apparently the only one who handles utility bills?).  I noticed this time that people just put their bills on the counter to show who was next in "line."  Reminded me of days of old when people would put tokens onto the arcade game screen to stake a claim for the next round. 

One of the bank employees handed out those small glass fruity (energy?) drinks to everyone who was waiting!  That was a nice surprise.

Isn't there a special machine at your bank for people to use to pay their utility bills? Even when I used to live in a super-rural part of Korea, the NongHyup banks there had this machine for paying utility bills.

hahah, there actually is a special machine but like much of the elderly population here, I never remember how to use it    Paying my bill to a clerk is a good way to use up my small change though. 

did you go to a rough school? if we were caught swearing, it was a quick way to be bollocked by the teacher or given a detention (hm.. wonder why they don't give detentions in korea?). even the bad kids weren't idiotic enough to continually swear when a teacher was present, as they knew it wouldn't end well for them

swearing in class, in front of the teacher, when they clearly know what it means (and trying to push boundaries), is nothing but disrespectful. i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at school

Sorry, but that simply isn't the case.
These kids repeat what they hear from their parents, their peers, their music, and what they watch.
One student being angry and trying to express their frustration and anger, is different than someone who is calmly sitting in class using profanities.
As teachers, we need to be able to recognize and understand the difference.
It can be a teachable moment.
These kids are like sponges.  They are a product of what they stew in, day in and day out.

I think you missed Oglop's caveat (bolded).
When kids are swearing in order to push boundaries then it is definitely is a punishable offence. If some kid accidentally staples his hand to his desk, then I'll give the expletives a pass.
  You're right that we should judge according to intent, which I think most of us recognise.

Absolutely.

i'm sure you didn't swear when a teacher or your parents were present when you were at schoo
.........of course I did. Why did we do it? because we were pushing boundaries. I didn't do it to them, or at them or disrupt the class with it but within earshot...sure. I don't necessarily see pushing boundaries as a bad thing. Perhaps it's a British / American differences.


If the teacher ignored it, well eventually we didn't care.

Some teachers would tell us alternatives (I read one article about using Shakespearean insults to get teenagers interested in Shakespeare which was cool).

Those teachers that bore down on us every time they overheard a F or an S lost the battle every time.


Obviously I'm not talking about using bad language at the teacher, or in an abusive way but between friends, in a funny casual way is fine by me. Obviously if it is disrupting everyone in the class then I deal with the disruption.

I see "stopping fun for the next two periods" as overkill.

This is a big debate between British teachers right now too, and it's really interesting. Everyone is divided.

Agreed.

Those that are "serious" about actually teaching would read up on "best practices" and implement some of those strategies.

Others simply "cowboy" through blindly.

I feel sorry for their students and for their coteachers.

Nah, super small rural town.  It just happened to be a "busy" time and there were like half a dozen people clustered around one teller (apparently the only one who handles utility bills?).  I noticed this time that people just put their bills on the counter to show who was next in "line."  Reminded me of days of old when people would put tokens onto the arcade game screen to stake a claim for the next round. 

One of the bank employees handed out those small glass fruity (energy?) drinks to everyone who was waiting!  That was a nice surprise.

Isn't there a special machine at your bank for people to use to pay their utility bills? Even when I used to live in a super-rural part of Korea, the NongHyup banks there had this machine for paying utility bills.

hahah, there actually is a special machine but like much of the elderly population here, I never remember how to use it    Paying my bill to a clerk is a good way to use up my small change though.

It makes no sense to me that those machines are turned off at 4PM when the banks close, but you can pay anytime at any ATM via bank transfer, too~~ (Maybe you knew; just in case you didn't).

Sometimes there's even a system to pay at a CVS.

I've always paid my bills with online banking.