RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0

"Tell me honestly, did you ACTUALLY go to church in America?"
"Yes. But it was different. We didn't go all day. We went from 10-12."
"And did your parents live together before they were married?"
"Yes."
"Oh, well good Christians don't do that."

...I'm really, really trying to work through what his possible thinking process could have been to think it was okay to say that to me. I have theories. But I'm way too talkative and this will turn into a novel no one cares about if I try to articulate. So. Just trust that I am super pissed.

Well, Mary and Joseph tried to get a hotel room together one Christmas Eve.

:o

Yesterday, I helped my CT pin up a nice large map, in our classroom. It was one of the Koreanized maps, with Korea in the center complete with  Dokdo and 'Sea of Korea' labelled in a bolder font than capital cities, but I digress.
There were a few other teachers in the class as we usually meet there, at 3, for coffee and conversation. We started playing a 'find the country' game. After giving her a few difficult and obscure ones, like Uzbekistan and Lithuania, and having her fail, I went easier:

Saudi Arabia
Sicily
Spain
Argentina
Greenland
Algeria
Iceland

... When she failed to find any of them, the other 2 teachers tried and couldn't find a single one.
I hid my shock by keeping the mood light and tried to help them save face by feigning ignorance to a few which they asked me to find (all Asian countries and ridiculously easy).
I'm no Geography whiz, but the level of Geography of fairly level-headed Koreans seems quite shocking. How can you go through life knowing so little about the outside world?

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

One would hope a teacher who is tasked with educating our children would, though.
I can not imagine any of my teachers from Elementary through highschool not knowing  where those countries were on a map.
There are some real dumb dumbs in the classrooms here.

"Tell me honestly, did you ACTUALLY go to church in America?"
"Yes. But it was different. We didn't go all day. We went from 10-12."
"And did your parents live together before they were married?"
"Yes."
"Oh, well good Christians don't do that."

...I'm really, really trying to work through what his possible thinking process could have been to think it was okay to say that to me. I have theories. But I'm way too talkative and this will turn into a novel no one cares about if I try to articulate. So. Just trust that I am super pissed.

Well, Mary and Joseph tried to get a hotel room together one Christmas Eve.

:o

Someone tell them about Manger Danger.

I have to sympathise a little with your CTs not knowing where countries are on a map. 

Some people probably haven't properly looked at a map (and really taken it in) since they were at school so I don't think you can expect them to know the position of every single country.

I think those different nuggets of 'general knowledge' information we all have might not be as general to other people as they are to you.

My knowledge of geography has improved since coming to Korea, lol. It was okay before but NOW I can name, point out on a map, and correctly spell every single country in Europe and Africa. I also now know that there's a difference between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland. xD

Some of the games I end up playing with the kids require me to know the answers prior.

I still haven't reached this level of mastery, though (warning: It's a vid).

Yesterday, I helped my CT pin up a nice large map, in our classroom. It was one of the Koreanized maps, with Korea in the center complete with  Dokdo and 'Sea of Korea' labelled in a bolder font than capital cities, but I digress.
There were a few other teachers in the class as we usually meet there, at 3, for coffee and conversation. We started playing a 'find the country' game. After giving her a few difficult and obscure ones, like Uzbekistan and Lithuania, and having her fail, I went easier:

Saudi Arabia
Sicily
Spain
Argentina
Greenland
Algeria
Iceland

... When she failed to find any of them, the other 2 teachers tried and couldn't find a single one.
I hid my shock by keeping the mood light and tried to help them save face by feigning ignorance to a few which they asked me to find (all Asian countries and ridiculously easy).
I'm no Geography whiz, but the level of Geography of fairly level-headed Koreans seems quite shocking. How can you go through life knowing so little about the outside world?

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

One would hope a teacher who is tasked with educating our children would, though.
I can not imagine any of my teachers from Elementary through highschool not knowing  where those countries were on a map.
There are some real dumb dumbs in the classrooms here.

The opposite side of this are foreign school elementary students.

My son and his buddies had a globe out one Sunday afternoon.

A bunch of 7-10 year olds saying " I lived there, and there, and there... and had holidays there, there, and there..."

Eastern Europe gives me some trouble because the map has changed since I was required to memorize it.

When I think of my school days, I don't remember being taught much geography.  Our classes focused mostly on North America and Europe. 

I do remember having to learn the capital cities of some European countries for a test, which I did and promptly forgot.

My 5th grade teacher, who was great,  brought school subjects together.  In our reading book, there would  be a short author bio.  She had a huge world map on a bulletin board and would call a student to find the author's home country and tell us what continent it was on. Then she'd place a stick pin on that country.  By the end of that year, there were several pins in that map.

What does sex have to do with living together?

You're so innocent.

Totes.
Oh, and while we're on this subject, I feel like this would be a great time for an out-of-context quote:

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

Can you find West Areola?

What does sex have to do with living together?

You're so innocent.

Totes.
Oh, and while we're on this subject, I feel like this would be a great time for an out-of-context quote:

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

Can you find West Areola?

Only if I know if she is facing north or south.  They are usually identified as left and right.

:)

Koreans are known for being blunt, and sometimes you do have to laugh it off, but I don't know. I think I have to draw the line at comments about my family. Usually I try to be the perfect picture of a happy-go-lucky foreigner, a "happy virus" as the Koreans call it, because I don't want to give all of us a bad name. But honestly, I also don't want to perpetuate a notion that you can say whatever you want to foreigners and get away with it. That's a separate rant in itself: how to not give people like you a bad name, while also not sacrificing your dignity/values. Have not figured that out yet.

But yeah. Went basically like this, if you wanted elaboration:

[Talking about differences in medicine culture because he's trying to tell me to go to the doctor for a simple stye... Lull in the conversation, and then]
Him: Tell me honestly, did you actually go to church in America?
Me: Yes. But it was different. We didn't go all day. We went from 10-12.
H: And did your parents live together before they were married?
M: Yes.
H: Oh, well good Christians don't do that.
M: [slipped into English because I was appalled] What?
H: Good Christians wait until after marriage to live together.
M: It doesn't say that in the Bible.
H: Huh? Bible? Ohhh-- Oh Bible... Well...
M: My parents are real Christians. Good Christians.
H: Oh...
[Awkward silence. He hits his thigh with his fist like he always does when he doesn't like the quiet.]
H: In Korea, Christians--
M: --are different. Because of the different cultures.
[More silence.]
M: Do you know Catholic?
H: Yes.
M: Do you know the Pope?
H: Pope? Pope... No, I don't know the Pope.
M: Ohhh. Okay.
[Then we had to go our separate ways anyway.]

Mind you... he had ample opportunity to tell me if I misunderstood, or if he didn't mean it in a bad way, didn't have ill intentions, etc. A simple "Wait, hold on, you're not understanding me--" would have made me write it all off as a language barrier thing. But he didn't.

Granted... I get that he's trying to "take care of" me. I really get it. But there's a line to be drawn there, too. I'm an adult. Yes, a young one, but still an adult. It'd be different if I was going out drinking to excess, ending up passed out in a bus shelter... Yeah, okay. Give me a lecture and try to change my ways, then. But plenty of people live together before getting married and are completely normal people, lead normal lives. It doesn't hurt anyone. It won't hurt me if it ever even happens. (Spoiler alert: I don't even have a boyfriend.) I'm not out here trying to change the Korean masses into co-habiting, sex-crazed fiends. (Which I've explained to him before it has nothing to do with sex and everything to do with wanting to make sure my s/o and I would be compatible living together.) It's really not his business in the first place, and disrespecting my parents in the pursuit of changing my mind makes me doubly annoyed.

Anyway. I'm probably going to act like it didn't happen, unless he decides to talk about it. (Doubt it. Saving face and all.) If he does, I'll just be honest and tell him I don't want to talk about the co-habiting topic anymore. That's reasonable enough. Avoid future issues and all, right?

Koreans are known for being blunt, and sometimes you do have to laugh it off, but I don't know. I think I have to draw the line at comments about my family... It's really not his business in the first place, and disrespecting my parents in the pursuit of changing my mind makes me doubly annoyed.

Anyway. I'm probably going to act like it didn't happen, unless he decides to talk about it. (Doubt it. Saving face and all.) If he does, I'll just be honest and tell him I don't want to talk about the co-habiting topic anymore. That's reasonable enough. Avoid future issues and all, right?

I think you did the right thing. You have to let people know what your boundaries are. He probably didn't think things through before saying that to you, but even if he had been talking to another Korean, I doubt they would have stood for him insulting the morality or religion of their parents.

Yesterday, I helped my CT pin up a nice large map, in our classroom. It was one of the Koreanized maps, with Korea in the center complete with  Dokdo and 'Sea of Korea' labelled in a bolder font than capital cities, but I digress.
There were a few other teachers in the class as we usually meet there, at 3, for coffee and conversation. We started playing a 'find the country' game. After giving her a few difficult and obscure ones, like Uzbekistan and Lithuania, and having her fail, I went easier:

Saudi Arabia
Sicily
Spain
Argentina
Greenland
Algeria
Iceland

... When she failed to find any of them, the other 2 teachers tried and couldn't find a single one.
I hid my shock by keeping the mood light and tried to help them save face by feigning ignorance to a few which they asked me to find (all Asian countries and ridiculously easy).
I'm no Geography whiz, but the level of Geography of fairly level-headed Koreans seems quite shocking. How can you go through life knowing so little about the outside world?

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

While I want to disagree and call you out, there are a lot of ignorant Americans when it comes to the outside world as well. Most Americans never even leave the US for any period of time. Sporcle is a good way to learn where plcaes are. It's helped me a lot when it comes to the obscure countries.

Yesterday, I helped my CT pin up a nice large map, in our classroom. It was one of the Koreanized maps, with Korea in the center complete with  Dokdo and 'Sea of Korea' labelled in a bolder font than capital cities, but I digress.
There were a few other teachers in the class as we usually meet there, at 3, for coffee and conversation. We started playing a 'find the country' game. After giving her a few difficult and obscure ones, like Uzbekistan and Lithuania, and having her fail, I went easier:

Saudi Arabia
Sicily
Spain
Argentina
Greenland
Algeria
Iceland

... When she failed to find any of them, the other 2 teachers tried and couldn't find a single one.
I hid my shock by keeping the mood light and tried to help them save face by feigning ignorance to a few which they asked me to find (all Asian countries and ridiculously easy).
I'm no Geography whiz, but the level of Geography of fairly level-headed Koreans seems quite shocking. How can you go through life knowing so little about the outside world?

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

While I want to disagree and call you out, there are a lot of ignorant Americans when it comes to the outside world as well. Most Americans never even leave the US for any period of time. Sporcle is a good way to learn where plcaes are. It's helped me a lot when it comes to the obscure countries.

I think it is sadly common for public schools in the US to neglect world geography.  I was always interested in learning more about other countries but instead it felt like classes always went over the same narrow scope.  Part of it was probably due to having to teach to standardized testing, I'm sure. 

But hey.  I can probably still name all 50 states and capitals from memory. 

Yesterday, I helped my CT pin up a nice large map, in our classroom. It was one of the Koreanized maps, with Korea in the center complete with  Dokdo and 'Sea of Korea' labelled in a bolder font than capital cities, but I digress.
There were a few other teachers in the class as we usually meet there, at 3, for coffee and conversation. We started playing a 'find the country' game. After giving her a few difficult and obscure ones, like Uzbekistan and Lithuania, and having her fail, I went easier:

Saudi Arabia
Sicily
Spain
Argentina
Greenland
Algeria
Iceland

... When she failed to find any of them, the other 2 teachers tried and couldn't find a single one.
I hid my shock by keeping the mood light and tried to help them save face by feigning ignorance to a few which they asked me to find (all Asian countries and ridiculously easy).
I'm no Geography whiz, but the level of Geography of fairly level-headed Koreans seems quite shocking. How can you go through life knowing so little about the outside world?

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

While I want to disagree and call you out, there are a lot of ignorant Americans when it comes to the outside world as well. Most Americans never even leave the US for any period of time. Sporcle is a good way to learn where plcaes are. It's helped me a lot when it comes to the obscure countries.

I think it is sadly common for public schools in the US to neglect world geography.  I was always interested in learning more about other countries but instead it felt like classes always went over the same narrow scope.  Part of it was probably due to having to teach to standardized testing, I'm sure. 

But hey.  I can probably still name all 50 states and capitals from memory.

Your USA may vary, but in my middle school, we actually had a global history/geography class. I don't remember too much, but my favorite part was what my grumpy/joking teacher liked to call "shut up and color." Every time we covered a new continent or area, we got a blank map of it, and had to find the GDP for each country, then label the countries and their capitals, coloring them in based on a GDP scale (very rich = green, average = yellow, etc.).

During this time, we listened to whatever music someone in the class had brought in, which varied from regular pop to Swedish rap. If someone forgot to bring in music, the teacher either played "Tunak Tunak Tun" (as we knew it, "that crazy Indian power ranger song"), or "I Like Traffic Lights" from Monty Python. Students rarely forgot their music after 1 time being subjected to that.

^mileage indeed varies.  I like to think I had excellent education in some areas but there were still some things that felt lacking.

Your teacher sounds awesome.

Yesterday, I helped my CT pin up a nice large map, in our classroom. It was one of the Koreanized maps, with Korea in the center complete with  Dokdo and 'Sea of Korea' labelled in a bolder font than capital cities, but I digress.
There were a few other teachers in the class as we usually meet there, at 3, for coffee and conversation. We started playing a 'find the country' game. After giving her a few difficult and obscure ones, like Uzbekistan and Lithuania, and having her fail, I went easier:

Saudi Arabia
Sicily
Spain
Argentina
Greenland
Algeria
Iceland

... When she failed to find any of them, the other 2 teachers tried and couldn't find a single one.
I hid my shock by keeping the mood light and tried to help them save face by feigning ignorance to a few which they asked me to find (all Asian countries and ridiculously easy).
I'm no Geography whiz, but the level of Geography of fairly level-headed Koreans seems quite shocking. How can you go through life knowing so little about the outside world?

To be fair, ask your average North American where anything is, and most of them won't know, either.

While I want to disagree and call you out, there are a lot of ignorant Americans when it comes to the outside world as well. Most Americans never even leave the US for any period of time. Sporcle is a good way to learn where plcaes are. It's helped me a lot when it comes to the obscure countries.

I think it is sadly common for public schools in the US to neglect world geography.  I was always interested in learning more about other countries but instead it felt like classes always went over the same narrow scope.  Part of it was probably due to having to teach to standardized testing, I'm sure. 

But hey.  I can probably still name all 50 states and capitals from memory.

Maybe my expectations of people are a bit too high, but (and this is just my opinion) I don't think you can blame your school. I mean, knowing where Spain, Sicily and Brazil is on a map is something you learn by just being alive.

Maybe my expectations of people are a bit too high, but (and this is just my opinion) I don't think you can blame your school. I mean, knowing where Spain, Sicily and Brazil is on a map is something you learn by just being alive.

You are of course welcome to have your opinion. I meant more in terms of actually learning about culture (for example, I learned about various Asian cultures via reading in my free time, learned scarcely anything about Asian cultures in school), not simply pointing out the countries on a map. It may be that my memory is foggy but I feel that my knowledge of where other countries are located can be more attributed to looking at encyclopedias as a child rather than to my schooling. I also think it would have been great if learning a second language started at a much younger level. 

My main point is that some schools just may not put much emphasis on learning about other countries and while I think that it's a shame, I'm not really going to judge those who are ignorant about geography.

There are many people who may simply not be interested in geography whether or not it's taught in school. There's a wealth of knowledge in the world and it's likely many people are more intrigued by other things. And I'm sure there are things in my knowledge bank that some would think ought to be generally known whereas others would disagree.

Koreans are known for being blunt, and sometimes you do have to laugh it off, but I don't know. I think I have to draw the line at comments about my family. Usually I try to be the perfect picture of a happy-go-lucky foreigner, a "happy virus" as the Koreans call it, because I don't want to give all of us a bad name. But honestly, I also don't want to perpetuate a notion that you can say whatever you want to foreigners and get away with it. That's a separate rant in itself: how to not give people like you a bad name, while also not sacrificing your dignity/values. Have not figured that out yet.

But yeah. Went basically like this, if you wanted elaboration:

[Talking about differences in medicine culture because he's trying to tell me to go to the doctor for a simple stye... Lull in the conversation, and then]
Him: Tell me honestly, did you actually go to church in America?
Me: Yes. But it was different. We didn't go all day. We went from 10-12.
H: And did your parents live together before they were married?
M: Yes.
H: Oh, well good Christians don't do that.
M: [slipped into English because I was appalled] What?
H: Good Christians wait until after marriage to live together.
M: It doesn't say that in the Bible.
H: Huh? Bible? Ohhh-- Oh Bible... Well...
M: My parents are real Christians. Good Christians.
H: Oh...
[Awkward silence. He hits his thigh with his fist like he always does when he doesn't like the quiet.]
H: In Korea, Christians--
M: --are different. Because of the different cultures.
[More silence.]
M: Do you know Catholic?
H: Yes.
M: Do you know the Pope?
H: Pope? Pope... No, I don't know the Pope.
M: Ohhh. Okay.
[Then we had to go our separate ways anyway.]

Mind you... he had ample opportunity to tell me if I misunderstood, or if he didn't mean it in a bad way, didn't have ill intentions, etc. A simple "Wait, hold on, you're not understanding me--" would have made me write it all off as a language barrier thing. But he didn't.

Granted... I get that he's trying to "take care of" me. I really get it. But there's a line to be drawn there, too. I'm an adult. Yes, a young one, but still an adult. It'd be different if I was going out drinking to excess, ending up passed out in a bus shelter... Yeah, okay. Give me a lecture and try to change my ways, then. But plenty of people live together before getting married and are completely normal people, lead normal lives. It doesn't hurt anyone. It won't hurt me if it ever even happens. (Spoiler alert: I don't even have a boyfriend.) I'm not out here trying to change the Korean masses into co-habiting, sex-crazed fiends. (Which I've explained to him before it has nothing to do with sex and everything to do with wanting to make sure my s/o and I would be compatible living together.) It's really not his business in the first place, and disrespecting my parents in the pursuit of changing my mind makes me doubly annoyed.

Anyway. I'm probably going to act like it didn't happen, unless he decides to talk about it. (Doubt it. Saving face and all.) If he does, I'll just be honest and tell him I don't want to talk about the co-habiting topic anymore. That's reasonable enough. Avoid future issues and all, right?

I can only speak for my school but we all signed papers ackowledging that we had been informed to not discriminate either students or co-workers based on their religion.

I'd recommend just saying you don't talk about religion at work in future situations and then immediately move the convo elsewhere.

Maybe my expectations of people are a bit too high, but (and this is just my opinion) I don't think you can blame your school. I mean, knowing where Spain, Sicily and Brazil is on a map is something you learn by just being alive.

You are of course welcome to have your opinion. I meant more in terms of actually learning about culture (for example, I learned about various Asian cultures via reading in my free time, learned scarcely anything about Asian cultures in school), not simply pointing out the countries on a map. It may be that my memory is foggy but I feel that my knowledge of where other countries are located can be more attributed to looking at encyclopedias as a child rather than to my schooling. I also think it would have been great if learning a second language started at a much younger level. 

My main point is that some schools just may not put much emphasis on learning about other countries and while I think that it's a shame, I'm not really going to judge those who are ignorant about geography.

There are many people who may simply not be interested in geography whether or not it's taught in school. There's a wealth of knowledge in the world and it's likely many people are more intrigued by other things. And I'm sure there are things in my knowledge bank that some would think ought to be generally known whereas others would disagree.

Yeah if someone's not interested in Geography or travelling then chances are they're not going to be able to point to a place on the map. All I remember from geography in school is that Great Bear Lake exists somewhere in Canada and it's either the biggest lake or big enough to be of note. And I know I'm awful world geography it but that's because
 A) I was a total jerkbag in school and didn't care/listen
and B) I only ever traveled to Florida from Canada before coming to Korea

Ask me about the world of Theadus and I can tell you exactly where the Tevinter Imperium is and about it's long history with blood magic. People have different interests and priorities. I'm not saying geography isn't important but chances are you don't remember it from school unless you were really interested in it.

Maybe my expectations of people are a bit too high, but (and this is just my opinion) I don't think you can blame your school. I mean, knowing where Spain, Sicily and Brazil is on a map is something you learn by just being alive.

You are of course welcome to have your opinion. I meant more in terms of actually learning about culture (for example, I learned about various Asian cultures via reading in my free time, learned scarcely anything about Asian cultures in school), not simply pointing out the countries on a map. It may be that my memory is foggy but I feel that my knowledge of where other countries are located can be more attributed to looking at encyclopedias as a child rather than to my schooling. I also think it would have been great if learning a second language started at a much younger level. 

My main point is that some schools just may not put much emphasis on learning about other countries and while I think that it's a shame, I'm not really going to judge those who are ignorant about geography.

There are many people who may simply not be interested in geography whether or not it's taught in school. There's a wealth of knowledge in the world and it's likely many people are more intrigued by other things. And I'm sure there are things in my knowledge bank that some would think ought to be generally known whereas others would disagree.

Yeah if someone's not interested in Geography or travelling then chances are they're not going to be able to point to a place on the map. All I remember from geography in school is that Great Bear Lake exists somewhere in Canada and it's either the biggest lake or big enough to be of note. And I know I'm awful world geography it but that's because
 A) I was a total jerkbag in school and didn't care/listen
and B) I only ever traveled to Florida from Canada before coming to Korea

Ask me about the world of Theadus and I can tell you exactly where the Tevinter Imperium is and about it's long history with blood magic. People have different interests and priorities. I'm not saying geography isn't important but chances are you don't remember it from school unless you were really interested in it.

*Thedas

FTFY

lost.