Read 88380 times

  • The Arm
  • Expert Waygook

    • 680

    • March 09, 2015, 09:15:02 am
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #180 on: April 20, 2017, 02:50:59 pm »
I find it pretty annoying when I'm out with my significant other, and I ask a question to some service staff in a restaurant or store, and they completely comprehend and understand, and then start answering - to my significant other.

It's not them asking for confirmation or clarification - they're literally answering the question I just asked, but not looking at me.


And then I'll make some comment or acknowledge that I heard their answer to my question, and either thank them or ask a follow-up question, and they will continue to speak to my significant other as if it was her talking.

This happens probably about 30-40% of the time when we're shopping together.

I ranted about that a bit, and significant other said that if she talked to someone in my home country, it would be the same thing. So when we went on vacation to my home country, I made a point to watch for it. And actually I was surprised - it did happen, but only once.

But yeah. DANG that's irritating.

This rant comes up a lot in learning/speaking Korean threads and I think the reaction of Koreans in this situation is understandable. 

Remember there's no way of them knowing your Korean ability.  Like many of us, you could have general service questions and requests memorised and well practiced.  But beyond that, there's a chance we know very little Korean outside of that.  So if they see you standing next to someone who they think is a native Korean, they'll more than likely address them.

I mean, if it particularly bothered you, you could confront them about it.  But then you could come completely unstuck as soon as they say something you don't understand and your gf has to step in to rescue you.


  • Savant
  • The Legend

    • 3709

    • April 07, 2012, 11:35:31 pm
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #181 on: April 20, 2017, 03:14:07 pm »
I find it pretty annoying when I'm out with my significant other, and I ask a question to some service staff in a restaurant or store, and they completely comprehend and understand, and then start answering - to my significant other.

It's not them asking for confirmation or clarification - they're literally answering the question I just asked, but not looking at me.


And then I'll make some comment or acknowledge that I heard their answer to my question, and either thank them or ask a follow-up question, and they will continue to speak to my significant other as if it was her talking.

This happens probably about 30-40% of the time when we're shopping together.

I ranted about that a bit, and significant other said that if she talked to someone in my home country, it would be the same thing. So when we went on vacation to my home country, I made a point to watch for it. And actually I was surprised - it did happen, but only once.

But yeah. DANG that's irritating.

This rant comes up a lot in learning/speaking Korean threads and I think the reaction of Koreans in this situation is understandable. 

Remember there's no way of them knowing your Korean ability.  Like many of us, you could have general service questions and requests memorised and well practiced.  But beyond that, there's a chance we know very little Korean outside of that.  So if they see you standing next to someone who they think is a native Korean, they'll more than likely address them.

I mean, if it particularly bothered you, you could confront them about it.  But then you could come completely unstuck as soon as they say something you don't understand and your gf has to step in to rescue you.

I think you've completely missed his point.

He isn't saying there is a language barrier but the service people are deferring to the person who they think looks Korean and/or more likely to look like they speak Korean.

It's why I just let my Korean wife order all the food when we go out to restaurants. I don't want to waste time with the staff confirming to my wife that the waegook speaking to us in Korean asked to order barbecue for 2 people, with me [and them] knowing that the menu states I must order for 2 people, and that my wife and I are indeed, 2 people.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 03:16:38 pm by Savant »


  • macteacher
  • Expert Waygook

    • 679

    • September 03, 2012, 09:59:00 am
    • south korea
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #182 on: April 20, 2017, 03:17:16 pm »
I find it pretty annoying when I'm out with my significant other, and I ask a question to some service staff in a restaurant or store, and they completely comprehend and understand, and then start answering - to my significant other.

It's not them asking for confirmation or clarification - they're literally answering the question I just asked, but not looking at me.


And then I'll make some comment or acknowledge that I heard their answer to my question, and either thank them or ask a follow-up question, and they will continue to speak to my significant other as if it was her talking.

This happens probably about 30-40% of the time when we're shopping together.

I ranted about that a bit, and significant other said that if she talked to someone in my home country, it would be the same thing. So when we went on vacation to my home country, I made a point to watch for it. And actually I was surprised - it did happen, but only once.

But yeah. DANG that's irritating.

This rant comes up a lot in learning/speaking Korean threads and I think the reaction of Koreans in this situation is understandable. 

Remember there's no way of them knowing your Korean ability.  Like many of us, you could have general service questions and requests memorised and well practiced.  But beyond that, there's a chance we know very little Korean outside of that.  So if they see you standing next to someone who they think is a native Korean, they'll more than likely address them.

I mean, if it particularly bothered you, you could confront them about it.  But then you could come completely unstuck as soon as they say something you don't understand and your gf has to step in to rescue you.


happens to me often with my SO as well. answering my questions to him. no eye contact. he just passes it off as "shy". whatevs

that's a reasonable approach to say that they're just being practical, however, its a split second decision. i doubt in their head they're going "well this 왜국 may not speak at a high enough level to understand my response, so i'll default to the 우리 나라 person instead". it's a common enough to be a "thing".

selfishly, it frustrates me because i want to maximize my practice in korean, but it gets thwarted. even youtuber, motivatekorean, has responded by saying "get a language exchange partner and don't expect too much practice in your day to day"


  • oglop
  • The Legend

    • 4619

    • August 25, 2011, 07:24:54 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #183 on: April 20, 2017, 03:30:54 pm »
happens to me too.

on a similar note:
anyone ever hand their card to the worker to pay for something, only for the worker to hand it back...but to your partner?


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #184 on: April 20, 2017, 03:49:57 pm »
I don't think a borderless world free for everyone to live where they please is the default "normal" view. In fact I think given 10,000 years of tradition as well as all the laws in the world, the we are all one view is the weird one. It's something to aspire to but not something that is anywhere close to reality or practicable.


As for what irritates me the most about Korea, nothing really big. I guess its being slowly sucked into the regulation world. Smokes are more expensive. Smoking is banned in bars and clubs and not the free choice of people to designate such establishments as smoke friendly and be freely patronized as a choice. They closed down all the soju tents. They'll probably ban street and mart drinking next. Used to be some kids in Hongdae could set up a stand with liquor bottles and a bucket of ice and some fruit and sell u cocktails off the street. Also they should tell the anti-dog meat people to piss off (though not the anti-cruelty people, important ditinction). Give a big finger to the world and embrace it. That being said, endangered specie crap like Rhino horn has got to go and should be beat out of people. Fortunately the mess of viagra and cialis business cards in the john says that the traditional stuff is losing its hold on everyone.

What else? Casino culture sucks. Everyone takes themself too seriously. Oh yeah and bring back BYOB to the ballgames. First game I went to I came in with a minikeg of Asahi or whatever as well as gin, vermouth, a mixer, a jar of olives, and 4 plastic martini glasses and a sushi tray to my table seat, Now all of that would be banned. I blame liberals.

Free speech laws could be loosened, but the country is technically at war so I understand. Make it easier to hunt n shoot and with the low taxes and with the minimal police presence this place is alright.


  • scpru
  • Veteran

    • 78

    • October 03, 2016, 09:46:41 am
    • Samcheonpo
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #185 on: April 20, 2017, 03:56:19 pm »
Also, ranting and venting is not a healthy way to deal with stress. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/high-octane-women/201102/feel-venting-you-may-want-think-again-literally

I never understand why people link to random articles that have no source. I looked for a link, or even just the name of a study, all that's there is one scientist's name and it doesn't even specify if he's the scientist that conducted the study.

And further, why is it people are so ready to believe any article that does properly cite a study? Keyword: a study. Part of science is that the study has to be replicated and get similar enough results each time to be really accepted as "true," and even that comes with exceptions, like when each study has a measly little sample size of, for example, under 100.

And then! The semantics!

Quote
It turns out that when put to the test, researchers have discovered that not only does venting not necessarily improve our psychological state, it may actually worsen it.

Meaning, not all the time, but sometimes.

Quote
Angry tirades, punching pillows (or anything else), and confrontation of the person we view as the cause of our anger.

This is hardly equivalent to just complaining to a friend, or, as the case is, internet strangers. Still a negative way to deal with things, sure, but I wouldn't go so far as to say aggressive.

That being said, I think there's a better argument that venting keeps you focused on the problem, which could potentially lead to a habit of obsessing about problems longer than you should.

Irk thing: burning yard waste. I realized today that back home, if I smelled something burning, I'd know something was wrong and there was the potential for danger. Here, I'm like "Time to close the windows I guess."


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #186 on: April 20, 2017, 04:26:02 pm »
I find it pretty annoying when I'm out with my significant other, and I ask a question to some service staff in a restaurant or store, and they completely comprehend and understand, and then start answering - to my significant other.

It's not them asking for confirmation or clarification - they're literally answering the question I just asked, but not looking at me.


And then I'll make some comment or acknowledge that I heard their answer to my question, and either thank them or ask a follow-up question, and they will continue to speak to my significant other as if it was her talking.

This happens probably about 30-40% of the time when we're shopping together.

I ranted about that a bit, and significant other said that if she talked to someone in my home country, it would be the same thing. So when we went on vacation to my home country, I made a point to watch for it. And actually I was surprised - it did happen, but only once.

But yeah. DANG that's irritating.

This rant comes up a lot in learning/speaking Korean threads and I think the reaction of Koreans in this situation is understandable. 

Remember there's no way of them knowing your Korean ability.  Like many of us, you could have general service questions and requests memorised and well practiced.  But beyond that, there's a chance we know very little Korean outside of that.  So if they see you standing next to someone who they think is a native Korean, they'll more than likely address them.

I mean, if it particularly bothered you, you could confront them about it.  But then you could come completely unstuck as soon as they say something you don't understand and your gf has to step in to rescue you.


happens to me often with my SO as well. answering my questions to him. no eye contact. he just passes it off as "shy". whatevs

that's a reasonable approach to say that they're just being practical, however, its a split second decision. i doubt in their head they're going "well this 왜국 may not speak at a high enough level to understand my response, so i'll default to the 우리 나라 person instead". it's a common enough to be a "thing".

selfishly, it frustrates me because i want to maximize my practice in korean, but it gets thwarted. even youtuber, motivatekorean, has responded by saying "get a language exchange partner and don't expect too much practice in your day to day"

I have nothing to add but "외국" is how you spell it.


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #187 on: April 20, 2017, 04:35:14 pm »
I find it pretty annoying when I'm out with my significant other, and I ask a question to some service staff in a restaurant or store, and they completely comprehend and understand, and then start answering - to my significant other.

It's not them asking for confirmation or clarification - they're literally answering the question I just asked, but not looking at me.


And then I'll make some comment or acknowledge that I heard their answer to my question, and either thank them or ask a follow-up question, and they will continue to speak to my significant other as if it was her talking.

This happens probably about 30-40% of the time when we're shopping together.

I ranted about that a bit, and significant other said that if she talked to someone in my home country, it would be the same thing. So when we went on vacation to my home country, I made a point to watch for it. And actually I was surprised - it did happen, but only once.

But yeah. DANG that's irritating.

This rant comes up a lot in learning/speaking Korean threads and I think the reaction of Koreans in this situation is understandable. 

Remember there's no way of them knowing your Korean ability.  Like many of us, you could have general service questions and requests memorised and well practiced.  But beyond that, there's a chance we know very little Korean outside of that.  So if they see you standing next to someone who they think is a native Korean, they'll more than likely address them.

I mean, if it particularly bothered you, you could confront them about it.  But then you could come completely unstuck as soon as they say something you don't understand and your gf has to step in to rescue you.


happens to me often with my SO as well. answering my questions to him. no eye contact. he just passes it off as "shy". whatevs

that's a reasonable approach to say that they're just being practical, however, its a split second decision. i doubt in their head they're going "well this 왜국 may not speak at a high enough level to understand my response, so i'll default to the 우리 나라 person instead". it's a common enough to be a "thing".

selfishly, it frustrates me because i want to maximize my practice in korean, but it gets thwarted. even youtuber, motivatekorean, has responded by saying "get a language exchange partner and don't expect too much practice in your day to day"

I have nothing to add but "외국" is how you spell it.

And if we're gonna nitpick which I guess we are; we're not 외국s either, that just means foreign country, we're 외국인(들).

But yeah I think everyone on this site understands when someone uses "waygook" to mean "foreigner". No big deal. It's not irksome.


  • macteacher
  • Expert Waygook

    • 679

    • September 03, 2012, 09:59:00 am
    • south korea
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #188 on: April 20, 2017, 05:01:02 pm »

wow you guys know the spelling of 외국인??  they should take down the statue of 세종대왕 and put up you guys as the great new ambassadors of the Korean language  8)


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #189 on: April 20, 2017, 05:19:10 pm »

wow you guys know the spelling of 외국인??  they should take down the statue of 세종대왕 and put up you guys as the great new ambassadors of the Korean language  8)

Well, that sounds a little much but if you wanna erect a statue of us NEXT to his that'd be super awesome  8)

My post was aimed more at nitpickers who make corrections without being completely correct themselves. That IS irksome. Couldn't care less about spelling on the internet. If I did I'd drive myself crazy haha


  • Loki88
  • Expert Waygook

    • 722

    • July 25, 2014, 08:41:07 am
    • Seoul
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #190 on: April 20, 2017, 05:57:35 pm »
I find it pretty annoying when I'm out with my significant other, and I ask a question to some service staff in a restaurant or store, and they completely comprehend and understand, and then start answering - to my significant other.

It's not them asking for confirmation or clarification - they're literally answering the question I just asked, but not looking at me.


And then I'll make some comment or acknowledge that I heard their answer to my question, and either thank them or ask a follow-up question, and they will continue to speak to my significant other as if it was her talking.

This happens probably about 30-40% of the time when we're shopping together.

I ranted about that a bit, and significant other said that if she talked to someone in my home country, it would be the same thing. So when we went on vacation to my home country, I made a point to watch for it. And actually I was surprised - it did happen, but only once.

But yeah. DANG that's irritating.

This rant comes up a lot in learning/speaking Korean threads and I think the reaction of Koreans in this situation is understandable. 

Remember there's no way of them knowing your Korean ability.  Like many of us, you could have general service questions and requests memorised and well practiced.  But beyond that, there's a chance we know very little Korean outside of that.  So if they see you standing next to someone who they think is a native Korean, they'll more than likely address them.

I mean, if it particularly bothered you, you could confront them about it.  But then you could come completely unstuck as soon as they say something you don't understand and your gf has to step in to rescue you.

I think you've completely missed his point.

He isn't saying there is a language barrier but the service people are deferring to the person who they think looks Korean and/or more likely to look like they speak Korean.

It's why I just let my Korean wife order all the food when we go out to restaurants. I don't want to waste time with the staff confirming to my wife that the waegook speaking to us in Korean asked to order barbecue for 2 people, with me [and them] knowing that the menu states I must order for 2 people, and that my wife and I are indeed, 2 people.


I feel like I have to further clarify (to further protect my fragile ego) - staff have zero problem understanding me. They're not checking with my significant other to make sure they heard correctly, or to ask what I said. They're literally, without missing a beat, answering the question I just asked. Just answering it to a person who didn't ask it.

The thing that gets me is when I hand them my card and they try and hand it back to my wife.



Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #191 on: April 20, 2017, 06:54:10 pm »

wow you guys know the spelling of 외국인??  they should take down the statue of 세종대왕 and put up you guys as the great new ambassadors of the Korean language  8)

Well, that sounds a little much but if you wanna erect a statue of us NEXT to his that'd be super awesome  8)

My post was aimed more at nitpickers who make corrections without being completely correct themselves. That IS irksome. Couldn't care less about spelling on the internet. If I did I'd drive myself crazy haha

If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.


  • scpru
  • Veteran

    • 78

    • October 03, 2016, 09:46:41 am
    • Samcheonpo
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #192 on: April 20, 2017, 07:05:19 pm »
If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.

And you think... what? That native Koreans are immune to misspelling their language's words? Plus 외 and 왜 aren't exactly dissimilar.


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #193 on: April 20, 2017, 07:11:40 pm »
If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.

And you think... what? That native Koreans are immune to misspelling their language's words? Plus 외 and 왜 aren't exactly dissimilar.

Of course people can misspell words. However, if you're claiming to speak a language and you make a basic mistake, one can't help but wonder how fluent you are/if they(the waitstaff) can really understand you. If someone claimed to speak English and subsequently misspelled an easy word, then I'd question them as well.

A person in America could order "Hamburger give me" and the waitress would understand, but might ask the native speaking partner what they'd like on it or if there's anything special they would like done to it.


  • macteacher
  • Expert Waygook

    • 679

    • September 03, 2012, 09:59:00 am
    • south korea
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #194 on: April 20, 2017, 07:28:46 pm »
If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.

And you think... what? That native Koreans are immune to misspelling their language's words? Plus 외 and 왜 aren't exactly dissimilar.

Of course people can misspell words. However, if you're claiming to speak a language and you make a basic mistake, one can't help but wonder how fluent you are/if they(the waitstaff) can really understand you. If someone claimed to speak English and subsequently misspelled an easy word, then I'd question them as well.

A person in America could order "Hamburger give me" and the waitress would understand, but might ask the native speaking partner what they'd like on it or if there's anything special they would like done to it.

first, they're pronounced the same. second, i have a topik 5 and am a permanent resident who had to pass a proficiency test to become one. third, i speak with my SO half the time in korean. fourth, um basically the whole world is filled with capable speakers who make spelling mistakes. have you ever met a 5th grader???

lastly and most importantly, im typing on a phone on this little forum of waygook. i couldn't care less about how formal my writing is.

spell checkers online are like those guys in your lecture hall who raises their hand to just repeat what the professor said. smile to themselves and say "i did that :)". bravo, you can spell. something that will likely be a relic in the not too distant future.


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #195 on: April 20, 2017, 07:36:04 pm »
If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.

And you think... what? That native Koreans are immune to misspelling their language's words? Plus 외 and 왜 aren't exactly dissimilar.

Of course people can misspell words. However, if you're claiming to speak a language and you make a basic mistake, one can't help but wonder how fluent you are/if they(the waitstaff) can really understand you. If someone claimed to speak English and subsequently misspelled an easy word, then I'd question them as well.

A person in America could order "Hamburger give me" and the waitress would understand, but might ask the native speaking partner what they'd like on it or if there's anything special they would like done to it.

first, they're pronounced the same. second, i have a topik 5 and am a permanent resident who had to pass a proficiency test to become one. third, i speak with my SO half the time in korean. fourth, um basically the whole world is filled with capable speakers who make spelling mistakes. have you ever met a 5th grader???

lastly and most importantly, im typing on a phone on this little forum of waygook. i couldn't care less about how formal my writing is.

spell checkers online are like those guys in your lecture hall who raises their hand to just repeat what the professor said. smile to themselves and say "i did that :)". bravo, you can spell. something that will likely be a relic in the not too distant future.

1. How can I know your background. The only information I have to go on is what I see on the screen. How you type is the only thing I have to go by. You mention wanting to get the most practice you can with Korean, yet you supposedly are at a level 5 and speak to your wife in Korean 50% of the time.

2. Your standard for a competent speaker is a 5th grader...

3. Do you truly think proper spelling is going to be a "relic" in the future?


  • macteacher
  • Expert Waygook

    • 679

    • September 03, 2012, 09:59:00 am
    • south korea
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #196 on: April 20, 2017, 07:48:20 pm »


um yes considering japan and china are finding that their students are starting to forget how to write some of their characters due to technology? do you think those kids are just going around like "hambugers give me!!!!" at some point in the future, i'm willing to bet that people will not need the ability to spell as many words due to machine learning.

or how about korea i believe had something of 80%+ illiteracy before the 20th century. do you think all those people walked around talking "hamburgers give me!!!!!!!".

most ESL teachers don't have to write korean very often. their writing ability will obviously lag behind listening and speaking, so i'd maybe find a different way of assuming someone's ability. i mean my SO is the best native Korean English speaker I know, but damn he cannot make a natural sounding paragraph to save his life. i don't ignore what he says or assume he's low level though.

i don't know why you're dissing 5th graders. speaking as well as 5th grader is an amazing feat for any second language learner, brah. i mean newspapers are written for that level, no? i get it you were being a little pedantic, so am i. even stevens


  • scpru
  • Veteran

    • 78

    • October 03, 2016, 09:46:41 am
    • Samcheonpo
Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #197 on: April 20, 2017, 07:52:09 pm »
If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.

And you think... what? That native Koreans are immune to misspelling their language's words? Plus 외 and 왜 aren't exactly dissimilar.

Of course people can misspell words. However, if you're claiming to speak a language and you make a basic mistake, one can't help but wonder how fluent you are/if they(the waitstaff) can really understand you. If someone claimed to speak English and subsequently misspelled an easy word, then I'd question them as well.

Speeeeeeeeeeeeeeak.

Not spell. Not read. Speeeeeeeeeak. You don't necessarily have to know how to spell to speak and listen to a language fluently.


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #198 on: April 20, 2017, 07:55:41 pm »


um yes considering japan and china are finding that their students are starting to forget how to write some of their characters due to technology? do you think those kids are just going around like "hambugers give me!!!!" at some point in the future, i'm willing to bet that people will not need the ability to spell as many words due to machine learning.

You are confusing points here. That sentence wasn't addressing the loss of writing skills, but was in regards to someone being able to order something, but being unable to comprehend the follow up questions that may arise.


most ESL teachers don't have to write korean very often. their writing ability will obviously lag behind listening and speaking, so i'd maybe find a different way of assuming someone's ability. i mean my SO is the best native Korean English speaker I know, but damn he cannot make a natural sounding paragraph to save his life. i don't ignore what he says or assume he's low level though.

Again, we are not speaking in person. All I have to go by is what I see in that particular topic at that time.

i don't know why you're dissing 5th graders. speaking as well as 5th grader is an amazing feat for any second language learner, brah. i mean newspapers are written for that level, no? i get it you were being a little pedantic, so am i. even stevens

Speaking at a 5th grade level is good, but think of all the ESL people we encounter back home at uni. If you're at TOPIK 5, then you are above my level, but we should still strive for better.


Re: Things Koreans do that irks us
« Reply #199 on: April 20, 2017, 07:58:52 pm »
If you can't spell a basic word, I wonder how good your Korean really is. Maybe there's another reason(besides your race) why they are speaking to your SO rather than you.

And you think... what? That native Koreans are immune to misspelling their language's words? Plus 외 and 왜 aren't exactly dissimilar.

Of course people can misspell words. However, if you're claiming to speak a language and you make a basic mistake, one can't help but wonder how fluent you are/if they(the waitstaff) can really understand you. If someone claimed to speak English and subsequently misspelled an easy word, then I'd question them as well.

Speeeeeeeeeeeeeeak.

Not spell. Not read. Speeeeeeeeeak. You don't necessarily have to know how to spell to speak and listen to a language fluently.

If a person is claiming to speak English but they spelled a basic word wrong, I would question their ability. Especially if they only used 3-4 words from that language in their post.