Read 26857 times

Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« on: October 17, 2014, 08:06:31 pm »
"Fourteen people have been killed and at least 11 others seriously injured when a ventilation grate gave way at an outdoor pop concert south of Seoul on Friday.

The accident took place at Seongnam's U-Space theatre in Gyeonggi Province during an evening concert by girl band 4Minute.

The Yonhap news agency said some 25 people fell 20 metres into an underground parking area when the grate collapsed.

They were standing on the grate to get a better look at the outdoor pop music performance, YTN TV said.

Most of the casualties were students, it added."



http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-17/fans-killed-at-south-korea-pop-concert/5823528
« Last Edit: October 17, 2014, 08:12:08 pm by marshmellow man »
"The people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world are the ones who do."  Steve Jobs


  • popeye2u
  • Expert Waygook

    • 875

    • April 05, 2011, 09:45:37 am
    • S of N. Korea
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2014, 08:31:00 pm »
I guess a lot of sad people tomorrow.  Hope things are open.
Illegally Screwed By Employers in Korea:  https://www.facebook.com/groups/1628928127347749/


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2014, 08:46:22 pm »
Holy F, look at the stress on that grate:

http://media.daum.net/photo/105846#20141017210608361


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2014, 10:40:45 pm »
expect a lawsuit from the families by next week, or a protest to blame someone for the accident.

on the other hand, if too many people (30, according to the korea times) congregate on a grate, wouldn't common sense tell you that it might become unsafe to be standing there. Or, is  it that same mentality that is so prevalent among koreans that "no harm will come to me / us"

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2014/10/116_166534.html, par. 5



  • weRborg
  • Super Waygook

    • 282

    • September 20, 2012, 05:15:44 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2014, 10:18:54 am »
Just this year, the ferry, the subway, now this. It's like this country is falling apart.

When will the locals learn to take safety regulations seriously? How many accidents have to happen?

Part of me thinks this has something to do with the mentality here. Everyone, especially younger people, have been so sheltered from the outside world since the early 80s, they're made to believe nothing ever bad happens here.

Ask some of your Korean friends that are mid 30s and younger. They'll tell you, their whole life has been cartoons, hagwons, soccer with friends, trips to grandma's house on weekends, and ramyeon noodles after school at the PC bang. It's a very pampered society.

There's a total disconnect between the dangers of the real world and the world they live in.
$10 off orders of $40 or more
or $5 off order under $40: www.iherb.com coupon code: ADO919

For all your health/bath&beauty/supplement needs! Lowest prices, low shipping, and quality reviews.


  • KoreaBoo
  • Expert Waygook

    • 618

    • May 25, 2014, 04:00:42 pm
    • Vancouver Island
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2014, 12:52:22 pm »
Don't sweat it.  These types of 'accidents' happen all the time.  Roofs collapse, buses fly down mountain cliffs, ships sink with 300 dead kids.

It doesn't matter at all overall.  This is more or less the cost of doing business here and keeping profits high.

I say this because if Korean society truly valued human life, they would spend the extra money, use some decent foresight and prediction about potential risks and sincerely look out for one another.

Time and time again Koreans have proven themselves not only unable to look out for one another (unless they are pormoting themselves on the international stage) but unwilling to really do anything meaningful about it.

The usual pattern will follow.

1) Accident
2) Shock
3) Blame will be assigned
4) People will bow in front of cameras (media frenzy will begin)
5) Meaningless promises will be made to appease hurt family members
6) Politicians will argue and debate, then get sidetracked
7) Families will be shown grieving at funerals
8) Politicians will show up for points with the public
9) More promises will be made
10) The witchhunt will begin to appease public anger
11) Media goes in full witch-hunt mode
12) People run or are arrested
13) Thos arrested are assumed guilty
14) Charges are promptly brought up
15) Kangaroo court convicts the accused.
16) Previous promises are more or less forgotten
17) After enough time, no one really cares about the incident and figures it's probably better (and cheaper) to just keep things as they were.

18) Wait for the next 'accident' to happen and watch the cycle repeat.


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2014, 02:08:55 pm »
Just this year, the ferry, the subway, now this. It's like this country is falling apart.

When will the locals learn to take safety regulations seriously? How many accidents have to happen?

Part of me thinks this has something to do with the mentality here. Everyone, especially younger people, have been so sheltered from the outside world since the early 80s, they're made to believe nothing ever bad happens here.

Ask some of your Korean friends that are mid 30s and younger. They'll tell you, their whole life has been cartoons, hagwons, soccer with friends, trips to grandma's house on weekends, and ramyeon noodles after school at the PC bang. It's a very pampered society.

There's a total disconnect between the dangers of the real world and the world they live in.
I'm curious to ask how your life has been less sheltered and more dangerous than theirs?

I would avoid blaming it on their sheltered mentality, it makes you seem unreasonably judgmental to Koreans and even disrespectful to victims. I don't even follow the logic considering life is a lot more cushy in most places we grew up rather than here . Also it's a lot safer. Furthermore wouldn't these repeated tragedies serve to remind Koreans that they can die tragic deaths if they aren't safe? I agree standing on a grate is not smart, but it looked safe under normal conditions. Did these people really die because they had comfortable lives? They just wanted to see their idols, they didn't just jump into the pit.

I guess trying to make some sense of your idea, maybe with threats from their neighboring countries, Korean eyes maybe looking outward too much, rather than inward. However, most people have lack of safety down to a ineffective laws, regulations, enforcement etc. Koreans get sad when tragedies happen and want safety and security just like all other humans.


  • terivinix
  • Expert Waygook

    • 695

    • October 19, 2011, 02:20:32 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2014, 04:55:43 pm »
Whether we know it or not, we all walk over grates like this every day. Just a couple hours I caught myself walking over one. I've climbed on some of the taller ones and even entered a few of them. Many of them are improperly fastened and could collapse. I guess this sort of accident was inevitable.


  • confusedsafferinkorea
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5721

    • October 08, 2010, 01:02:32 pm
    • Zhubei, Hsinchu County, Taiwan (not part of China)
    more
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2014, 05:07:37 pm »
Just this year, the ferry, the subway, now this. It's like this country is falling apart.

When will the locals learn to take safety regulations seriously? How many accidents have to happen?

Part of me thinks this has something to do with the mentality here. Everyone, especially younger people, have been so sheltered from the outside world since the early 80s, they're made to believe nothing ever bad happens here.

Ask some of your Korean friends that are mid 30s and younger. They'll tell you, their whole life has been cartoons, hagwons, soccer with friends, trips to grandma's house on weekends, and ramyeon noodles after school at the PC bang. It's a very pampered society.

There's a total disconnect between the dangers of the real world and the world they live in.
I'm curious to ask how your life has been less sheltered and more dangerous than theirs?

I would avoid blaming it on their sheltered mentality, it makes you seem unreasonably judgmental to Koreans and even disrespectful to victims. I don't even follow the logic considering life is a lot more cushy in most places we grew up rather than here . Also it's a lot safer. Furthermore wouldn't these repeated tragedies serve to remind Koreans that they can die tragic deaths if they aren't safe? I agree standing on a grate is not smart, but it looked safe under normal conditions. Did these people really die because they had comfortable lives? They just wanted to see their idols, they didn't just jump into the pit.

I guess trying to make some sense of your idea, maybe with threats from their neighboring countries, Korean eyes maybe looking outward too much, rather than inward. However, most people have lack of safety down to a ineffective laws, regulations, enforcement etc. Koreans get sad when tragedies happen and want safety and security just like all other humans.

Sejong.... I think you misinterpreted what he wrote.

There is absolutely no doubt Koreans lead sheltered lives and that is not judgmental of Koreans it is a valid observation. Kids in my country grow up much more independent and streetwise than here, that is not judgmental that is a fact.

So, I don't see anything negative in his statements, just an observation. Kids do tend to live the lives that he said they do. I just look at the way kids cross the street at my school, they have no idea about the danger of not looking before they cross the street. That is just one tiny example of how they are brought up to not think of dangers.

I am pretty sure that the people on that grate were not standing dead still, probably jumping up and down or at least moving to the beat of the music. I think it is pretty obvious that it was a dangerous situation for them.

I am extremely sorry this happened. BTW, I also don't think he meant to say that Koreans don't feel sadness at tragedies as you implied he did.
There is no known medical cure for stupidity!


  • SpaceRook
  • Expert Waygook

    • 814

    • November 18, 2010, 11:54:36 am
    • South Korea
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2014, 08:52:49 pm »
I walked by a newer subway station today near my home in Gyeonngido.  Outside the station, there are grates at waist-height just like in the photo, but they are all surrounded by high plexi-glass that is specifically designed to keep people out.  The plexiglass has clearly been there for a few months at least, so it isn't some new thing that was just added today.

I think this concert tragedy was just a case of one old place not getting upgraded like the new places.  Tragic, but it's just one of those things that happens. 


  • Korea13
  • Super Waygook

    • 494

    • May 29, 2013, 08:36:18 am
    • korea
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2014, 09:12:12 pm »
So is this how South Korea take responsibility for blaming themself? Committed sucide is the way to go?

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/10/18/world/asia/south-korea-concert-accident/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


  • terivinix
  • Expert Waygook

    • 695

    • October 19, 2011, 02:20:32 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2014, 12:36:23 am »
I walked by a newer subway station today near my home in Gyeonngido.  Outside the station, there are grates at waist-height just like in the photo, but they are all surrounded by high plexi-glass that is specifically designed to keep people out.  The plexiglass has clearly been there for a few months at least, so it isn't some new thing that was just added today.

I think this concert tragedy was just a case of one old place not getting upgraded like the new places.  Tragic, but it's just one of those things that happens.

Sinbundang Line is about as new as it gets. These vents come in many different sizes and heights.


  • qi
  • Veteran

    • 207

    • July 21, 2011, 12:16:33 pm
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2014, 06:58:31 am »
So is this how South Korea take responsibility for blaming themself? Committed sucide is the way to go?

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/10/18/world/asia/south-korea-concert-accident/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Wow, I guess that's the end of 4minute! How can Koreans enjoy their goddesses now that they might have to think about safety standards when they look at them. They could recruit a new member, change their name to 5Minute and let things roll on I suppose..

Condolences to the families. Hope they kick up a major raucous.

Where were the stewards?? Oh, let me guess Texting on their f*@ing phones as usual, or applying their manicure. Useless..


  • ciannagh
  • Super Waygook

    • 275

    • March 03, 2014, 06:34:16 pm
    • Korea
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2014, 11:25:12 am »
expect a lawsuit from the families by next week, or a protest to blame someone for the accident.

on the other hand, if too many people (30, according to the korea times) congregate on a grate, wouldn't common sense tell you that it might become unsafe to be standing there. Or, is  it that same mentality that is so prevalent among koreans that "no harm will come to me / us"

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2014/10/116_166534.html, par. 5

This is what was on my mind. Is this really another lapse in safety measures? A ventilation grate like that isn't exactly designed to hold 30+ jumping, overexcited concertgoers. That's not to say that the incident isn't tragic, but it seems like there was a complete lack of common sense. Ventilation grates aren't meant to be jumped around on by a bunch of people. There should have been some sort of sign saying not to stand on the grate, but I'm not thoroughly convinced that this is a prime example of Korea's shoddy safety protocol.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2014, 11:29:53 am by ciannagh »


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2014, 11:49:12 am »
My first response to hearing this news was "But they knew standing on a ventilation grate was a bad idea... They must have known that." And I skipped the mincing hand-wringing about what a tragedy it is, I'm so sad, etc.

And that's not to say I blame the victims, but... They had to know that standing on a ventilation grate was a bad idea. So like ciannagh said, it's a problem with common sense, not safety. You can't stab your hand with a knife and blame the knife for not being safe.

But things like this happen everywhere, so there's no point, this time, in blaming Korean society. And again, not to blame the victims, but... Seriously? The world isn't baby-proofed; think about what you're doing.


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2014, 07:33:53 pm »
Usually, when a death toll like this is recorded in America, a gunman is part of the equation.

The point being, and this is just my impression of things, western countries have a much longer history of urban infrastructure. Everything that exists in western cities has been through the full evolution of the state of the art every step of the way. They've learned everything through trial and error and experience. Korea, is large part, was slapped together with rubber bands and mud after the war and dressed up to look like a modern country. They didn't go through any of the growing pains and development of western countries.

(By the way: this isn't a statement about how western cities are better or worse or the ultimate goal at all.)

By and large, 'accidents' of this magnitude taking place in the west is almost always due to a specific act of criminality or a negligent individual. In Korea, these are just the growing pains of urban development. Nothing here is built to last. It's all thrown together as cheaply and quickly as possible and the fašades will not last forever. Just like the Samsung products that enabled this entire economy to exist as it is today, everything made in Korea has a shelf life and a planned obselescence.

There's something to be said for going through the paces on your way to a modern western city. There's wisdom and experience in the engineering side that you can't take for granted.

We should always make efforts to improve failed systems and do everything we can to predict and reduce failures, but it's simply impossible to predict every scenario. It doesn't make any sense to go crazy and fire everyone in a haze of vengeance and anger. Maybe they'll redesign these things so they can support the weight of 50 people and then, someday, 51 people will climb up and we'll be right back where we started.


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2014, 07:35:11 pm »
My first response to hearing this news was "But they knew standing on a ventilation grate was a bad idea... They must have known that."
You're assuming the kids knew it was a ventilation grate. I doubt they did.


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2014, 07:55:44 pm »
Usually, when a death toll like this is recorded in America, a gunman is part of the equation.

The point being, and this is just my impression of things, western countries have a much longer history of urban infrastructure. Everything that exists in western cities has been through the full evolution of the state of the art every step of the way. They've learned everything through trial and error and experience. Korea, is large part, was slapped together with rubber bands and mud after the war and dressed up to look like a modern country. They didn't go through any of the growing pains and development of western countries.

(By the way: this isn't a statement about how western cities are better or worse or the ultimate goal at all.)

By and large, 'accidents' of this magnitude taking place in the west is almost always due to a specific act of criminality or a negligent individual. In Korea, these are just the growing pains of urban development. Nothing here is built to last. It's all thrown together as cheaply and quickly as possible and the fašades will not last forever. Just like the Samsung products that enabled this entire economy to exist as it is today, everything made in Korea has a shelf life and a planned obselescence.

There's something to be said for going through the paces on your way to a modern western city. There's wisdom and experience in the engineering side that you can't take for granted.

We should always make efforts to improve failed systems and do everything we can to predict and reduce failures, but it's simply impossible to predict every scenario. It doesn't make any sense to go crazy and fire everyone in a haze of vengeance and anger. Maybe they'll redesign these things so they can support the weight of 50 people and then, someday, 51 people will climb up and we'll be right back where we started.
Well said^^


Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2014, 09:14:07 pm »
You're assuming the kids knew it was a ventilation grate. I doubt they did.

They were middle-aged office workers, and I do assume they knew it was a ventilation grate. And I assume they knew it wasn't suitable for standing on. It was a grievous mistake on their part, though that doesn't mean they were deserving of the results or too stupid to avoid the mistake. It was a lapse in judgment with uncommonly terrible consequences.

Though yes, if it had been younger people I would insist they should have understood as well.


  • mayanon
  • Waygookin

    • 18

    • September 11, 2014, 07:08:27 am
    • europe
Re: Fourteen South Korean concert goers killed
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2014, 09:20:17 pm »
My first response to hearing this news was "But they knew standing on a ventilation grate was a bad idea... They must have known that."
You're assuming the kids knew it was a ventilation grate. I doubt they did.

they did. They were told to come down because it was dangerous too