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  • NorthStar
  • Super Waygook

    • 252

    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
    • Seoul
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #740 on: March 03, 2019, 09:05:05 pm »
Quote
Nonsense, you are clueless.

Last winter was not "brutal" at all and the Korean climate is indeed warming

Right, what you say IS nonsense.  Right, you ARE clueless.

Wikpedia?  Really?


  • Cyanea
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1052

    • September 04, 2016, 01:48:24 pm
    • Las Vegas
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #741 on: March 04, 2019, 12:18:39 am »
Quote
Nonsense, you are clueless.

Last winter was not "brutal" at all and the Korean climate is indeed warming

...) Really?

yes..really.


Quote
in Korea, there has been a significant increase in the annual mean temperatures according to data of the past 29 years. The increase in January temperatures was in the order of 0.8 ∼ 2.4 C.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023%2FB%3ACLIM.0000043141.54763.f8

Catch my drift?


  • SanderB
  • Super Waygook

    • 409

    • June 02, 2018, 06:25:54 pm
    • Gouda cheese Be Best cheese
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #742 on: March 04, 2019, 03:28:38 am »
How bad do you think the air pollution gets in the biggest port of Europe, Rotterdam on a regular (=windy) day?

3/3/2019

PM2.5   9   8   9   8   4   5   6   3   1   5   5   2   4   4   2   4   6   5   6   6   6
PM10  21   17   19   18   23   15   13   12   9   9   6   6   10   9   9   8   15   18   20   18   11

Seoul
PM2.5 AQI
   204   
PM10 AQI
   125   
« Last Edit: March 04, 2019, 03:41:17 am by SanderB »
Fiat voluntas tua- All that you want is allowed


  • gogators!
  • The Legend

    • 3471

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #743 on: March 04, 2019, 05:32:03 am »
I was talking to someone here in the US about the air quality in Seoul and when I mentioned the numbers they meant nothing to her because it's something you just don't think about here.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3191

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul


  • SanderB
  • Super Waygook

    • 409

    • June 02, 2018, 06:25:54 pm
    • Gouda cheese Be Best cheese
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #745 on: March 04, 2019, 06:19:43 am »
That is a great site, it does look like the wind is coming from China!
Fiat voluntas tua- All that you want is allowed


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5032

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #746 on: March 04, 2019, 08:43:48 am »
How bad do you think the air pollution gets in the biggest port of Europe, Rotterdam on a regular (=windy) day?

3/3/2019

PM2.5   9   8   9   8   4   5   6   3   1   5   5   2   4   4   2   4   6   5   6   6   6
PM10  21   17   19   18   23   15   13   12   9   9   6   6   10   9   9   8   15   18   20   18   11

Coming from somebody who spends a fair bit of time there, I can tell you that the Netherlands in general can have quite a bit of air pollution (although not nearly as bad as parts of Korea).
    The big problem in Holland (and Rotterdam in particular) is NO2 levels rather than ultra-fine particulates. Apparently it's bad enough that the EU has given NDL a slap on the wrist and told them to sit in the corner until they can get their cows' flatulence under control.  :smiley:
« Last Edit: March 04, 2019, 08:46:04 am by kyndo »


  • CO2
  • The Legend

    • 4375

    • March 02, 2015, 03:41:14 pm
    • Gunpo
    more
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #747 on: March 04, 2019, 09:04:35 am »
    The big problem in Holland is NO2 levels rather than ultra-fine particulates.

I apologise, he's the black sheep of the family.
The joys of fauxtherhood


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5032

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #748 on: March 04, 2019, 09:28:43 am »
    The big problem in Holland is NO2 levels rather than ultra-fine particulates.
I apologise, he's the black sheep of the family.

I dunno. According to this study, the two of you get along *very* well. Very very well.  :wink:

     "The thermodynamic behavior of the carbon dioxide + nitrogen dioxide (CO2 + NO2) mixture was investigated using a Monte Carlo molecular stimulation approach. This system is a particularly challenging one because nitrogen dioxide exists as a mixture of monomers (NO2) and dimers (N2O4) under certain pressure and temperature conditions. The chemical equilibrium between N2O4 and 2NO2 and the vapor-liquid equilibrium of CO2 + NO2/N2O4 mixtures were stimulated using simultaneously the reaction ensemble and the Gibbs ensemble Monte Carlo (RxMC and GEMC) methods. Rigid all atoms molecular potentials bearing point charges were proposed to model both NO2 and N2O4 species. Liquid-vapor coexistence properties of the reacting NO2/N2O4 system were first investigated. The calculated vapor pressures and coexisting densities were compared to experimental values, leading to an average deviation of 10% for vapor pressures and 6% for liquid densities. The critical region was also addressed successfully using the subcritical Monte Carlo simulation results and some appropriate scaling laws. Predictions of CO2 + NO2/N2O4 close phase interactions at 300, 313, and 330 K were then proposed. Derivative properties calculations were also performed in the reaction ensemble at constant interlocking pressure for both NO2/N2O4 and CO2 + NO2/N2O4 systems. The calculated heat capacities show a climax in the temperature range where N2O4 "dissociation" occurs, in agreement with available experimental data."


  • CO2
  • The Legend

    • 4375

    • March 02, 2015, 03:41:14 pm
    • Gunpo
    more
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #749 on: March 04, 2019, 09:37:26 am »
I dunno. According to this study, the two of you get along *very* well. Very very well.  :wink:

What can I say? We have chemistry.
The joys of fauxtherhood


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3191

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #750 on: March 04, 2019, 06:55:00 pm »
According to the Korea Meteorological Administration, the bad air condition is forecast to continue for a while
https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/nation/2019/03/371_264764.html
Worse, the weather agency said stronger-than-usual yellow dust is expected this spring.


  • Cyanea
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1052

    • September 04, 2016, 01:48:24 pm
    • Las Vegas
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #751 on: March 05, 2019, 12:28:57 am »
The big problem in Holland (and Rotterdam in particular) is NO2 levels rather than ultra-fine particulates. Apparently it's bad enough that the EU has given NDL a slap on the wrist and told them to sit in the corner until they can get their cows' flatulence under control. 

Nonsense.

Cows do not produce NO2. Most nitrogen dioxide is produced by vehicles.

If grazing animals were a threat to the global atmosphere then the world would've been in deep trouble until about 300 years ago when vast herds of wild animals roamed the earths surface.
Catch my drift?


Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #752 on: March 05, 2019, 03:54:25 am »
 I have taught in China, where air pollution can be very dense and comes in several colours or flavours. Having taught in Beijing, yes, pollution was an issue. I was there for a while, and for a while nothing seemed to bother me, but it was in the 3rd year I felt stress, and was troubled by annoyances like noise, traffic, smog.
  Yes, it could be bad. I remember getting the school bus at 7:10 a.m. and the far buildings and those in the middle distance were all hazy or invisible. Then, on other days, the north wind might blow it all away, and the sky would be pristine; the air shining in its pellucid clarity all the way to the distant horizon. I was shocked :shocked:and amazed by these perfect days. Hills I had never seen before appeared in the west, outside Beijing, and you could almost count the trees on them.
   But the BAD air days were a lot worse than what I was used to in South Korea in 2018.


  • SanderB
  • Super Waygook

    • 409

    • June 02, 2018, 06:25:54 pm
    • Gouda cheese Be Best cheese
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #753 on: March 05, 2019, 06:26:30 am »
If all cars were to become fully electric wouldn't Beijing be a cool place to work at?
Although I saw a doc about Russia and their plans and I'm a bit depressed now...
Fiat voluntas tua- All that you want is allowed


  • zola
  • The Legend

    • 2635

    • September 30, 2012, 06:56:11 am
    • Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #754 on: March 05, 2019, 07:02:54 am »
The big problem in Holland (and Rotterdam in particular) is NO2 levels rather than ultra-fine particulates. Apparently it's bad enough that the EU has given NDL a slap on the wrist and told them to sit in the corner until they can get their cows' flatulence under control. 

Nonsense.

Cows do not produce NO2. Most nitrogen dioxide is produced by vehicles.

If grazing animals were a threat to the global atmosphere then the world would've been in deep trouble until about 300 years ago when vast herds of wild animals roamed the earths surface.
I have no idea if its no2 or co2 but agriculture, especially dairy farming produces greenhouse gases.
Kpip! - Martin 2018


  • CO2
  • The Legend

    • 4375

    • March 02, 2015, 03:41:14 pm
    • Gunpo
    more
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #755 on: March 05, 2019, 07:44:54 am »
Cows produce methane which is 35x more powerful than CO2.
The joys of fauxtherhood


  • JNM
  • The Legend

    • 3903

    • January 19, 2015, 10:16:48 am
    • Seoul, South Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #756 on: March 05, 2019, 07:47:29 am »
If all cars were to become fully electric wouldn't Beijing be a cool place to work at?
Although I saw a doc about Russia and their plans and I'm a bit depressed now...
How do you make enough electricity to make that happen?


  • zola
  • The Legend

    • 2635

    • September 30, 2012, 06:56:11 am
    • Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #757 on: March 05, 2019, 07:58:14 am »
In every breakdown I've seen, transport contributes a much smaller proportion than i expected, at least in China. By far the largest sectors are electricity production/heating and manufacturing.

Any decrease is a good thing, of course.
Kpip! - Martin 2018


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5032

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #758 on: March 05, 2019, 08:07:51 am »
The big problem in Holland (and Rotterdam in particular) is NO2 levels rather than ultra-fine particulates. Apparently it's bad enough that the EU has given NDL a slap on the wrist and told them to sit in the corner until they can get their cows' flatulence under control. 

Nonsense.

Cows do not produce NO2. Most nitrogen dioxide is produced by vehicles.

If grazing animals were a threat to the global atmosphere then the world would've been in deep trouble until about 300 years ago when vast herds of wild animals roamed the earths surface.
I have no idea if its no2 or co2 but agriculture, especially dairy farming produces greenhouse gases.
Cyanae is absolutely right. Cows produce methane, mostly (a terrible greenhouse gas), and don't really have much to do with NO2. I messed up my comment: I meant to go on a bit about how NDL has issues with methane production as well, which is what I was referring to with that bit about cows. My bad!

    But I don't agree with Cya's second statement. Cows are huge contributer towards today's environmental issues, which I'm sure everybody is already aware of. There are over a billion cows globally, which according to most research, exceeds the biomass of herbivores that were wandering around during the Pleistocene (the golden eras of grazers). To provide for them, huge swathes of carbon sinks (forest/jungle) are slash-and-burned, further contributing to greenhouse gas production. Intensive cattle farming also produces massive amounts of free nitrogen, ammonia, and phosphates which ruin watersheds, and are a not-insignificant contribution to ocean acidification.

I like steak as much as the next non-vegan/vegetarian/weirdo, but for the reasons above (and many others) it's definitely a guilty pleasure.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2019, 08:28:42 am by kyndo »


Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #759 on: March 05, 2019, 08:21:11 am »
If all cars were to become fully electric wouldn't Beijing be a cool place to work at?
Although I saw a doc about Russia and their plans and I'm a bit depressed now...

What are the Russians planning?

It is quite a large distance from Beijing to the borders of Russia. If you live in Beijing you should be much more concerned about what is going on in Hebei province rather than in remote Russia.