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  • Datasapien
  • Super Waygook

    • 392

    • February 04, 2012, 09:36:25 pm
    • Chungcheongbuk-do
    more
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #440 on: March 05, 2018, 11:27:18 am »
And long may it continue! Love it when it rains  ;D
A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man.


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4943

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #441 on: March 05, 2018, 11:28:36 am »


Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #442 on: March 06, 2018, 11:30:58 am »
Been out of Korea 3 days and my skin already looks healthier and my stomach isn't upset all the time. Blue skies all day every day.
Quote
Quote from: Mr.DeMartino on Yesterday at 01:40:32 PM

    Trump is a liar and a con man.


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4943

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #443 on: March 06, 2018, 11:44:49 am »
Been out of Korea 3 days and my skin already looks healthier and my stomach isn't upset all the time. Blue skies all day every day.
Is the grass really greener? I've been away so long... I can't remember...  :sad:


  • daktariB
  • Adventurer

    • 33

    • March 05, 2018, 07:12:24 am
    • South Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #444 on: March 06, 2018, 03:11:26 pm »
As a former ESL teacher in China, I can say as long as you don't sneeze black goo, then it is "decent" air. 200 is laughable. try living in a city that averages 1000. not a typo, 1000. 200 days were a blessing. I love China, but Beijing isn't the worst pollution in China by a long shot.


  • hangook77
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1018

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #445 on: March 19, 2018, 07:50:09 pm »
Apparently the single best thing you can do for the environment is not have children. So as a childless middle aged man Iím doing my bit.

Korea, Japan and Europe are doing their bit.

However I think that will be offset by population growth in India and Africa.
Insofar as carbon footprints are concerned, the average Western individual consumes more resources than a dozen third world denizens.
Here's a nice little visual of CO2 emission per capita per country to depress you:

I've often heard the quote that the world's richest 10% are responsible for more than half the world's greenhouse gases.  :huh:

Air quality is better in North America than in East Asia.  Big polluters over here. 


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4943

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #446 on: March 20, 2018, 07:56:37 am »
Apparently the single best thing you can do for the environment is not have children. So as a childless middle aged man Iím doing my bit.

Korea, Japan and Europe are doing their bit.

However I think that will be offset by population growth in India and Africa.
Insofar as carbon footprints are concerned, the average Western individual consumes more resources than a dozen third world denizens.
Here's a nice little visual of CO2 emission per capita per country to depress you:

I've often heard the quote that the world's richest 10% are responsible for more than half the world's greenhouse gases.  :huh:

Air quality is better in North America than in East Asia.  Big polluters over here.
   You'll probably be super amazed to hear this, but the real difference in air quality between Asia and North America is due to population density. East Asia's population/km2 is an order of magnitude higher than that of North America, so of course the air quality is gonna suck.
   Additionally, a lot of North America's dirtiest manufacturing has, conveniently, been moved to Asia, so North Americans should technically be held responsible for a fair bit of Asia's pollution as well.
All in all, per capita, North Americans are filthy animals.


  • JNM
  • The Legend

    • 3831

    • January 19, 2015, 10:16:48 am
    • Seoul, South Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #447 on: March 20, 2018, 08:43:53 am »
Air pollution 101:


There are many different types of "air pollution", but three of them get the most press.

Carbon:

CO2 has been in the headlines (not you, Kevin) recently.  This is a direct product of combustion, and is considered to be a greenhouse gas. This happens with even the purest of carbon fuels.

CxHy + O2 --> CO2 + CO + H2O + Energy

To reduce this, countries are getting off of carbon-based fuels, and moving to wind, solar, and nuclear. CO2 doesn't really impact air quality unless it starts to displace oxygen.  Plants love it!

If you don't have enough O2 to make CO2, you produce more CO, which, in the context of home heating, can get to harmful levels quick. This is why you need to keep oil and gas burning appliances in good working order.

"Carbon footprint" usually refers to consumer behaviour; as noted above, even if production is off-shored, it gets assigned to the consumer's location, giving rich countries worse scores.

Nitrogen and Sulphur:

Engineers usually list these together.

NOx and SOx are produced by burning dirty fuel - the sulphur and nitrogen in coals and oils get mixed up in the above chemical formula. This is the brown haze that you see in cities (without "yellow dust".) To reduce this, modern coal and oil burning plants are equipped with scrubbers. Lower sulphur coals are more expensive, so there is still a lot of high sulphur coal being burned.

Particulates:

Particulate is a different one.  Some of it comes from dirty combustion, some of it from dust, so what you see is usually dust that has picked up dirty combustion products. Electrostatic precipitators can be used to reduces particulate emissions from a power plant or other industrial facility (smelter etc.)

Reclaiming deserts is about the only way to reduce the dust component.

(Edit: miss-placed title)
« Last Edit: March 20, 2018, 10:57:15 am by JNM »


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4943

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #448 on: March 20, 2018, 10:49:53 am »
Air pollution 101:

Carbon:

There are many different types of "air pollution", but three of them get the most press.

CO2 has been in the headlines (not you, Kevin) recently.  This is a direct product of combustion, and is considered to be a greenhouse gas. This happens with even the purest of carbon fuels.

CxHy + O2 --> CO2 + CO + H2O + Energy

To reduce this, countries are getting off of carbon-based fuels, and moving to wind, solar, and nuclear. CO2 doesn't really impact air quality unless it starts to displace oxygen.  Plants love it!

If you don't have enough O2 to make CO2, you produce more CO, which, in the context of home heating, can get to harmful levels quick. This is why you need to keep oil and gas burning appliances in good working order.

"Carbon footprint" usually refers to consumer behaviour; as noted above, even if production is off-shored, it gets assigned to the consumer's location, giving rich countries worse scores.

Nitrogen and Sulphur:

Engineers usually list these together.

NOx and SOx are produced by burning dirty fuel - the sulphur and nitrogen in coals and oils get mixed up in the above chemical formula. This is the brown haze that you see in cities (without "yellow dust".) To reduce this, modern coal and oil burning plants are equipped with scrubbers. Lower sulphur coals are more expensive, so there is still a lot of high sulphur coal being burned.

Particulates:

Particulate is a different one.  Some of it comes from dirty combustion, some of it from dust, so what you see is usually dust that has picked up dirty combustion products. Electrostatic precipitators can be used to reduces particulate emissions from a power plant or other industrial facility (smelter etc.)

Reclaiming deserts is about the only way to reduce the dust component.

+1
It's important to note the distinctions between what contributes towards air-quality problems, and what contributes to the green-house effect, as they're 2 very separate issues that people still often conflate.

You can dump as much sulphur into the air as you like without worrying too much about global warming... but it may then melt your face off the next time it rains...


  • hangook77
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1018

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #449 on: March 24, 2018, 10:36:33 pm »
Apparently the single best thing you can do for the environment is not have children. So as a childless middle aged man Iím doing my bit.

Korea, Japan and Europe are doing their bit.

However I think that will be offset by population growth in India and Africa.
Insofar as carbon footprints are concerned, the average Western individual consumes more resources than a dozen third world denizens.
Here's a nice little visual of CO2 emission per capita per country to depress you:

I've often heard the quote that the world's richest 10% are responsible for more than half the world's greenhouse gases.  :huh:

Air quality is better in North America than in East Asia.  Big polluters over here.
   You'll probably be super amazed to hear this, but the real difference in air quality between Asia and North America is due to population density. East Asia's population/km2 is an order of magnitude higher than that of North America, so of course the air quality is gonna suck.
   Additionally, a lot of North America's dirtiest manufacturing has, conveniently, been moved to Asia, so North Americans should technically be held responsible for a fair bit of Asia's pollution as well.
All in all, per capita, North Americans are filthy animals.

The governments passed the costly regulations that made the companies move to Asia in the first place.  They didn't save the earth.  They should have worked with industry through benchmarking and targets, while investing in research for better technology.  They could have kept the jobs while gradually improving world air quality long term.  Sure we might have had more pollution that we do over in NA.  But, it would be going down, whereas over here, it's huge.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3179

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #450 on: March 25, 2018, 03:13:06 pm »
New York City's AQI: 16
https://aqicn.org/city/newyork
Seoul's AQI: 207
https://aqicn.org/city/seoul
Over ten times as much!  :shocked:


Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #451 on: March 25, 2018, 03:28:07 pm »
New York City's AQI: 16
https://aqicn.org/city/newyork
Seoul's AQI: 207
https://aqicn.org/city/seoul
Over ten times as much!  :shocked:

Jesus that is insane. I have a pretty sweet gig here, but I'm seriously considering moving because of this. I know it's always bad during this time of year, but things here are going in the wrong direction. The problem seems to be getting worse as time goes on. This is probably going to take years off my life


  • hangook77
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1018

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #452 on: March 26, 2018, 03:03:47 pm »
Early spring is always the worst air quality in Korea.  It will prob suck on and off for the next month. 


Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #453 on: March 26, 2018, 09:56:31 pm »
Yes, early spring is the worst...and winter...and much of summer...and most of fall...basically you get like 10 days of nice clear blue skies a year.



Quote
Quote from: Mr.DeMartino on Yesterday at 01:40:32 PM

    Trump is a liar and a con man.


  • CJ
  • Super Waygook

    • 463

    • November 15, 2010, 08:11:00 am
    • Down south
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #454 on: March 27, 2018, 07:55:33 am »
Been out of Korea 3 days and my skin already looks healthier and my stomach isn't upset all the time. Blue skies all day every day.

What? You make it sound like itís hell on earth. Koreans generally look quite healthy; maybe itís just you. Iíve had very little stomach problems, but the pollution does play havoc with my respiratory system; Iím pretty active usually and the heavily polluted days give me a sore throat and headache if Iíve been exercising.


  • hangook77
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1018

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #455 on: March 27, 2018, 07:59:28 am »
Yes, early spring is the worst...and winter...and much of summer...and most of fall...basically you get like 10 days of nice clear blue skies a year.



Something like that.  Lots of bad days throughout for sure.  Spring is still worst.


  • kiwikimchi
  • Expert Waygook

    • 625

    • December 27, 2010, 10:15:31 am
    • South Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #456 on: March 27, 2018, 08:17:21 am »
Having been here for 8 years I've noticed that the air polution getting worse. Spring was always the worst but now it's all year round. If you care about your health you can't really go outside. I've had a hike planned for the last month but have had to cancel because of the toxic air. Outdoor exercise is basically out of the question until the levels go to green or even yellow. I live down south in "rural" Korea but no part of Korea is spared the shitty air.

While I have a good gig here and am saving a lot and getting ahead financially I've decided it's time to leave Korea. The main reason being the air. The most important thing in life is your health. If you don't have that then...
I can think of better ways to die than lung cancer. And let's be honest Korea isn't going to do anything to stop it. They will continue to blame China as the cause and The great nation of Korea is the victim bla bla. So value every day that has clean air and a sunny sky as they are going extinct.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2018, 08:19:25 am by kiwikimchi »


Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #457 on: March 27, 2018, 09:27:39 am »
The air quality here definitely played a part in my decision not to renew. I like to spend my free time outdoors and I live in a beautiful rural area in the south with mountains basically in my backyard. Every weekend I want to go out for a hike but decide against it. The last time I remember a stretch of nice weather + clear blue skies where I live was like 2 years ago.

When teachers ask what I did over the weekend and I respond that I wanted to go hiking but the air was too bad, they frown and say things like the air is better here down south...

Also, my neighbor has piles of old furniture that he constantly burns in his stove. It's all low quality particle board/ plastic laminate/  pressure treated wood, etc that is very toxic to burn. It wafts into my window any time I open it and it's right next to the school, where kids are outside playing soccer. 
 




  • CJ
  • Super Waygook

    • 463

    • November 15, 2010, 08:11:00 am
    • Down south
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #458 on: March 27, 2018, 09:40:11 am »
Koreaís life expectancy is set to rise; I guess itís all that pollution, huh? Try not smoking, not eating too much fatty meat, regular exercise and you might find that will increase your life expectancy rather than leaving Korea.

https://www.nature.com/news/life-expectancy-set-to-hit-90-in-south-korea-1.21535


  • zola
  • The Legend

    • 2607

    • September 30, 2012, 06:56:11 am
    • Korea
Re: Air pollution - bad enough to leave Korea?
« Reply #459 on: March 27, 2018, 09:42:17 am »
Also, my neighbor has piles of old furniture that he constantly burns in his stove. It's all low quality particle board/ plastic laminate/  pressure treated wood, etc that is very toxic to burn. It wafts into my window any time I open it and it's right next to the school, where kids are outside playing soccer.
Jeez. That is serious. Some treated wood smoke can damage your lungs with just a few inhalations. I hope it's not that kind.

There's an empty lot near where I live that I look down directly on to from my apartment, where people grow vegetables. Like an allotment you'd see in England. The only difference being that it's also the trash burning area for local a-holes. I saw an old man throw one of those ride on remote control cars that kids have here, on to the fire. Fully plastic. A lady burns her kids nappies. Basically anything you shouldn't burn, they burn.
Kpip! - Martin 2018