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  • JVPrice
  • Expert Waygook

    • 846

    • August 29, 2017, 10:26:13 am
    • Cheongju, South Korea
Discrimination against Male Teachers
« on: October 08, 2022, 02:00:23 pm »
What's the deal?

My director told me she won't renew my contract because they want to hire a female teacher. My foreign co-worker said that before he got hired at our academy, he was denied from a different branch of the same academy because they wanted a female teacher. I've seen it numerous times in job postings "Looking for female teachers only". If they were looking for a female teacher the whole time, it really feels like they just temporarily hired us because pickings were slim.

On the surface level, sure, I get why academies do it. But it's just wierdly normalized here. This is legitimate discrimination based on gender, but nobody seems to really talk about it.
The World Ends With You


Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2022, 04:29:34 pm »
Korea isnít made for foreigners to have careers.


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4010

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2022, 04:57:41 pm »
Korea isnít made for foreigners to have careers.
Please...
  • choose another career for money;
  • choose another career for fame;
  • choose another career for advancement; (yay, you get to not teach but instead direct teachers? No to such promises of DELTA & MATESOL; though it might help you teach).
  • Choose another career for security... er, wait, back home family cries with happiness when their children grow up to get strong union jobs (the equivalent to railroad and nurses unions).
  • Choose teaching to teach, to make a difference, to help students exceed expectations, to get up in the morning and plan and prepare to make your students better. Raise all boats, if you can, but certainly put your head on the pillow knowing SOME are going to do better tomorrow because of what you did today.
Edit: in all my 20 years here, i have ignored all gender biased ads. The funny thing is back in my last job last decade on Jeju, the female director worried about hiring a 71-year-old career female teacher from South Africa, but said she might hire her contingent on an in-person interview, despite willing to hire her lackadaisical can't-hold-down-any-job son. Flash forward a year and my hagwon director offered her a 2nd year contract with a raise ON CONDITION that her son not re-sign. LOL. Both opted to return to SA. I thought that apt. And gender-busting here.
(Sorry. I have told this story twice before. But it has been years...)
« Last Edit: October 08, 2022, 05:14:14 pm by VanIslander »
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6341

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2022, 02:54:14 am »
You know what is interesting?  Considering the horrid state of U.S. public education, just under 80% of the teachers are women....hmmmmmm. 

Yeah..personally, I think women do not make good teachers...babysitt ers, perhaps.  But, not good teaches. 

In Korea its all about jazz hands and giltter-sparkle fingers.  Women are straight-up inside the box thinkers, are easily manipulated and will just do as their told (for the most part).   They will work for awful salaries in the "name of the kids"...suckers.


Van is a woman?

I guess you're not currently working, having mesmerized some rich woman into supporting you.


  • SPQR
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1421

    • March 08, 2018, 07:04:54 pm
    • Sierra Leone
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2022, 08:35:33 am »

This is obviously an assumption, by I bet almost all of you
posters out there are butt ugly, old, corpulent and have
garbage attitudes to boot.

I would hire some twenty-something waaay hawt and skinny
female teacher in a second if I had a school.

 
Blocked: JonVoightCar


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4010

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2022, 08:59:29 am »
This is obviously an assumption, by I bet almost all of you
posters out there are butt ugly, old, corpulent and have
garbage attitudes to boot.

I would hire some twenty-something waaay hawt and skinny
female teacher in a second if I had a school.
And your school would look across the street at a TOEIC 910, 920, 940 and recently (friggin' "only" but i tell her still great) 890 student-performed academy, but it would be glad to have a newbie to start to teach the youngums?! K. As bubble gum is sweet.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2022, 09:06:47 am by VanIslander »
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2022, 03:47:35 pm »
Quote
On the surface level, sure, I get why academies do it. But it's just wierdly normalized here. This is legitimate discrimination based on gender, but nobody seems to really talk about it.

Discrimination is permitted in Korea. Legally speaking, and on a more general, social level. Employers can discriminate on the basis of race, gender, sexuality, age and attractiveness. There are no consequences to pay for it. A lot of people have lost good opportunities in Korea because of it, and a lot of schools have lost out on good teachers because they preferred someone else's face, hair color or some other superficial feature.

On top of that, Korean bosses, and the people committed to keeping in their bosses' good books, lie about many things. Some of those lies are trivial and some are not. I know that this being Waygook.org, someone's going to jump in and say that I'm denying that discrimination against men exists, that I'm an apologist for such discrimination and that, by extension, I believe every single thing ever said by every feminist ever, while also gaslighting the OP. None of that is true. However, knowing how Koreans casually lie in work contexts, there may be more to the contract renewal issue than simply wanting to hire a female teacher. When Koreans tell these workplace lies, it's often because they think it's the easiest way to smooth over a situation and avoid causing fuss. Sometimes they badly miscalculate how that's going to go down with their foreign employees, who feel disrespected by their lack of truthfulness.

I have no idea whether they're lying to you or not, and my point isn't to suggest that you're wrong about why your contract isn't being renewed. It's simply to say that you may never really understand the rationale. That sucks and you have my sympathies. I hope you get another, better job soon. If you're in a big city, that shouldn't be too difficult. Good luck.   
« Last Edit: October 09, 2022, 03:49:52 pm by makebudlightgreatagain »
Who let the dogs out?

- Mitt Romney


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4010

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2022, 08:23:35 pm »
Maybe a guy isn't hired because they are looking for a female teacher.

But no man is not re-signed SIMPLY BECAUSE he is not a woman.
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2022, 03:28:26 pm »
Maybe a guy isn't hired because they are looking for a female teacher.

But no man is not re-signed SIMPLY BECAUSE he is not a woman.

Yeah I mean those pictures you have to submit for employment are just so they can  judge your character. :/


  • Spliced
  • Super Waygook

    • 313

    • August 05, 2022, 12:15:38 am
    • Jeolla
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2022, 09:49:28 pm »
Yeah I mean those pictures you have to submit for employment are just so they can  judge your character. :/

 ^
 I
 I
 I


  • T_Rex
  • Super Waygook

    • 327

    • April 23, 2019, 08:10:20 am
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2022, 12:12:37 am »
At least in Korea they're upfront about it. I thought it was comical that on may job applications in the US there is some notice about a non-discrimination policy despite being asked to provide your race, gender, abled-bodied status, and veteran status so that they can discriminate. If you're an abled-bodied white male who hasn't served in the military then you're SOL for a lot of jobs.


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 4010

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2022, 12:47:56 am »
If you're an abled-bodied white male who hasn't served in the military then you're SOL for a lot of jobs.
Really? In most of the 50 states?

I don't think so.

I have had two altercations with police in America and I was on the sweet end of both of them i believe because of prejudice: a puzzling wink from a fellow blue-eyed highway officer and a "walk away" demand from a fight i had with a black guy.

In both instances i thought i was advantaged (not disadvantaged) because of how i looked.

Maybe in liberal media and certainly in casting rooms for Survivor, The Amazing Race, Masterchef, etc yeah there is such bias, but on the streets? Has it really changed?
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


  • JVPrice
  • Expert Waygook

    • 846

    • August 29, 2017, 10:26:13 am
    • Cheongju, South Korea
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2022, 05:36:31 am »
Sometimes they badly miscalculate how that's going to go down with their foreign employees, who feel disrespected by their lack of truthfulness.

I have no idea whether they're lying to you or not, and my point isn't to suggest that you're wrong about why your contract isn't being renewed. It's simply to say that you may never really understand the rationale. That sucks and you have my sympathies. I hope you get another, better job soon. If you're in a big city, that shouldn't be too difficult. Good luck.   

Oh believe me, I'm sure there is a layer of dishonesty, especially with some stuff that happened earlier in the year. I'm having a hard time trusting anyone these days, even outside of work. Giving me that specific reason doesn't change the fact they won't renew me. Despite my issues with my previous job, that director at least acknowledged my hard work and wanted me to stay. Heck, even one of my Korean co-workers told me "there are better places to work," so I'll take her word for it. Just an opportunity to find a job that appreciates me.

Thanks for the encouragement
The World Ends With You


Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2022, 08:09:45 am »
At least in Korea they're upfront about it. I thought it was comical that on may job applications in the US there is some notice about a non-discrimination policy despite being asked to provide your race, gender, abled-bodied status, and veteran status so that they can discriminate. If you're an abled-bodied white male who hasn't served in the military then you're SOL for a lot of jobs.

Percentage of male US population: 49.5%
Percentage of US working population that is male: 53%

Percentage of white US population: 75.8%
Percentage of US working population that is white: 77.5%


https://www.bls.gov/cps/cpsaat11.htm


White men are overrepresented in the workforce.
Who let the dogs out?

- Mitt Romney


  • D.L.Orean
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1069

    • February 25, 2020, 09:34:41 am
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2022, 08:12:38 am »
:rolleyes:

Staff bonding camping weekends on the beach. What happens in the tent stays in the tent.


  • Spliced
  • Super Waygook

    • 313

    • August 05, 2022, 12:15:38 am
    • Jeolla
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2022, 08:38:19 am »
Staff bonding camping weekends on the beach. What happens in the tent stays in the tent.

..is there any gambling?


  • hangook77
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5607

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2022, 01:14:39 pm »
What's the deal?

My director told me she won't renew my contract because they want to hire a female teacher. My foreign co-worker said that before he got hired at our academy, he was denied from a different branch of the same academy because they wanted a female teacher. I've seen it numerous times in job postings "Looking for female teachers only". If they were looking for a female teacher the whole time, it really feels like they just temporarily hired us because pickings were slim.

On the surface level, sure, I get why academies do it. But it's just wierdly normalized here. This is legitimate discrimination based on gender, but nobody seems to really talk about it.

The ajossis in charge want a pretty white female who speaks North American English to look at.  Good to see Korea is falling back into their previous prejudiced narrow mindedness they had years ago, but without the good pay that went with it at the time.  I swear with just about everything, Korea is going back to the past.

Honestly, folks put up with Korea's BS because the money was so good back in the day.  But now?  Seriously, try for China next year.  Maybe BIlly can help you out. 

https://jobs.echinacities.com/?fromat=4

20,000 RMB = 3,983,341.82 KRW
25,000 RMB = 4,979,492.50 KRW
30,000 RMB = 5,975,391.00 KRW

Again speak to Billy and some others for actual conditions on the ground. 
745sticky, Augustiner, Bakeacake, D.L.Orean, Lazio, Mithras, Renma, Rye are still blocked and I can't see them.


  • hangook77
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5607

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2022, 01:16:12 pm »
Van is a woman?

I guess you're not currently working, having mesmerized some rich woman into supporting you.

What's a woman?

www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWtGzJxiONU
745sticky, Augustiner, Bakeacake, D.L.Orean, Lazio, Mithras, Renma, Rye are still blocked and I can't see them.


Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2022, 04:53:37 pm »
You could always come to China. In China they probably prefer female teachers because there's so few of them but the demand is so great that they can't afford to be picky.
Beyond Inappropriate


  • hangook77
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5607

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Discrimination against Male Teachers
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2022, 06:32:21 pm »
You could always come to China. In China they probably prefer female teachers because there's so few of them but the demand is so great that they can't afford to be picky.

Basically, that's how Korea use to be.  The shortage of teachers kept some of the arrogance and shallowness in check. 
745sticky, Augustiner, Bakeacake, D.L.Orean, Lazio, Mithras, Renma, Rye are still blocked and I can't see them.