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  • T_Rex
  • Super Waygook

    • 311

    • April 23, 2019, 08:10:20 am
Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« on: August 28, 2022, 06:57:16 am »
What do you think of Biden's student loan forgiveness plan? Is he really trying to solve the root cause of the problem or just pandering to his base? Is 10k USD in forgiveness per debtor really going to make much of a difference in the long term?



Universities know that raising tuition will not lead to reduced enrollment. The federal government is always there to lend students more money.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2022, 06:58:52 am by T_Rex »


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7854

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2022, 07:12:07 am »
Are you aware students can get student loans well beyond the the amount of tuition? It's supposed to be for living expenses, but it's way more than a student would need to live. This money is used to study abroad in Europe, party in Ibiza, and subsidize not working.

Payments to help people "get by" disincentivize working... at a time there is a labor shortage.

And did you see it's up to 20k now, not 10k. Disgusting. Adding more money to the federal debt. It's pandering to get more votes. 2022 election coming soon.


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7854

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2022, 07:19:26 am »


Looking for a debt chart image online.... here's one that looks recent: 2020. $23 trillion in debt.

But now in 2022 it's just shy of $31 trillion. What tha?! $7 trillion added in such a short amount of time?! Trump and Biden ran up debt like crazy. (So did Obama.) Shame on them.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2022, 07:29:33 am by L I »


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2022, 08:15:34 am »
My father used to "spoil" me like crazy. He delivered KFC to forgotten-packed lunches, he paid for all my ski trips and golf games. But the day I turned 18, he gave me a gold (real gold) chain with a gold eagle, and said "You're a man now." He then said he will never give me another penny (in the 30 years thereafter he never gave me a penny) and i was shocked. I have never skiied or played an 18-hole golf course since. (I played a 9-hole course twice since).

I went from kid who got everything (a gawd-damn factory Kuwahara in elementary school, microscope, telescope, pets i wanted: rabbits, cats, dogs, birds, cats (yes, i know i said cats twice. I grew up always having one or more cats; my dad wasn't wrong when he said i was a cat person. Though, i think i'm more of a general animal person. My favorite non-human ever was the half-terrier, half-Chihuahua i gave my dad when he retired, giving 10 years of joy).
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7854

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2022, 08:18:44 am »
I hope someone like your father will become president of the United States.


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2022, 08:23:51 am »
Wait. This thread is about money.
Yeah. My family gave me ZERO money when I finished high school, so congrats!

Since 1987 it's been 35 years on my own coin.
I don't care about money until i don't have any!
That's why having a SAVINGS account is a real advantage. I didn't have one in uni. I red lined it with p/t jobs thru it all. But nowadays having extra coin is crucial.

I paid my way through uni with part-time and summer jobs. Because I had ZERO financial help, i was zeroed in on the effort needed.

My best friend got a friggin' car for graduating high school. A Mustang! He had been in honors math in junior high, but he dropped out of college to be a bartender, then carpet salesman, then assistant manager to a car paŕts store. Even now, decades later, he awaits inheriting a lot.

His family smothered him and he kneeled.
My dad slapped me in the face (figuratively) when i was 18, and i got a B.A. and M.A. (i would've gotten a Ph.D but my acceptance to Bowling Green University (believe it or not, despite the silly name, it is respected) was met with... wtf? No scholarship year one because i ain't American? Maybe year two. But $60,000 tuition?... uh, i took a Canadian master's program that covered my tuition and paid thousands each month for me to teach undergrads (which i did for two years, minus the first semester in which a friggin' photocopy-boy role my assigned prof put me in).
« Last Edit: August 28, 2022, 08:42:18 am by VanIslander »
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2022, 08:40:05 am »
https://www.cnbc.com/amp/select/how-to-get-a-refund-for-federal-student-loans-paid-during-the-pandemic/

For those morons who made payments and/or paid off their loans with the stimulus money. I am one of those morons.


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7854

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2022, 08:41:26 am »
I read massive amounts of coronavirus relief money went towards buying Bitcoin, crypto, and NFTs. And food. Obesity grew a ton during the pandemic. You used the stimulus money to pay down student debt? What a moron! Should致e just waited for a bailout. Think of all the cool stuff you could have gotten.

覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧

Free money - welfare payments - makes people soft.

Tough love forges them into better people.

覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧

Sometimes good intentions have unintended consequences.

覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧

For the bank bailouts, the banks had to pay the money back. And did. Welfare payments to people 妬n need (who a lot of the time really aren稚) won稚 ever be payed back.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2022, 08:59:45 am by L I »


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2022, 08:53:52 am »
I am 100% for giving TALENT support.

The top students should be helped because it helps us all. The better our scientists, doctors and artists are, the better our lives will be.

But kick the "C+/B-" students to the curb. Encourage 'em to get a great skill, a trade, become a welder, locksmith or plumber. There is money in those trades, much more than being a uni grad working as a clerk at 7-Eleven or as a "barista"/cafe clerk.
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7854

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2022, 09:06:44 am »
Not everyone should go to college.

I just read 40% of those with student debt didn稚 even graduate. Is that true? Omg!

I knew people living off student loans, enrolling in classes just to keep that money coming. Grants first which was a hell of a lot of money because they were 斗ow income, then after that ran out, loans. People who were in their sixth year of doing a BA.


  • chimp
  • Super Waygook

    • 302

    • April 19, 2015, 05:16:31 am
    • Zoo
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2022, 09:11:47 am »
Wait. This thread is about money.
Yeah. My family gave me ZERO money when I finished high school, so congrats!

Since 1987 it's been 35 years on my own coin.
I don't care about money until i don't have any!
That's why having a SAVINGS account is a real advantage. I didn't have one in uni. I red lined it with p/t jobs thru it all. But nowadays having extra coin is crucial.

I paid my way through uni with part-time and summer jobs. Because I had ZERO financial help, i was zeroed in on the effort needed.

My best friend got a friggin' car for graduating high school. A Mustang! He had been in honors math in junior high, but he dropped out of college to be a bartender, then carpet salesman, then assistant manager to a car paŕts store. Even now, decades later, he awaits inheriting a lot.

His family smothered him and he kneeled.
My dad slapped me in the face (figuratively) when i was 18, and i got a B.A. and M.A. (i would've gotten a Ph.D but my acceptance to Bowling Green University (believe it or not, despite the silly name, it is respected) was met with... wtf? No scholarship year one because i ain't American? Maybe year two. But $60,000 tuition?... uh, i took a Canadian master's program that covered my tuition and paid thousands each month for me to teach undergrads (which i did for two years, minus the first semester in which a friggin' photocopy-boy role my assigned prof put me in).

So boring and dumb.

You wouldn't have made it through a PhD looking at the way you sloppily conflate the topic of a tepid attempt to handle America's train-wreck of a student loans situation and money in general. Even worse in this thread, you come out with not one but two boring shaggy dog stories.

‐------------------------------------------------

In answer to the topic, it being interesting despite VanLol's best efforts to bore us to death, obviously Biden's policy has been unsatisfactory all-round. On the one hand it's too small to make a dent in the problem, on the other it will be endlessly pilloried based on the usual dullard Yank/moral hazard talking points of "I paid my loan you should pay yours", "why should I pay your loan?", "it's not my fault your [insert pet hate] studies degree is worthless" and blah blah f-ing blah. The loan thing will never be solved because the pile of debt is just too big now and Yanks simply cannot wrap their heads around the concept of Higher Education being a public good. To them it's only a personal investment, like buying shares in a junk food company, so they will never ever be able to accept a) that the tuition fee/loans model as it stands has been a giant fk-up and b) that the ridiculous debts that have been accrued might be written-off at public expense.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2022, 09:18:41 am by chimp »
oo oo ahh ahh


Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2022, 09:48:05 am »
I don't think it's a good idea to give student debt relief before the problems of tuition rates has been addressed. That will just cause tuition to increase. Address the source of the problem, then relieve the symptoms.
A proud member of The Hateful Eight


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7854

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2022, 09:53:00 am »
USA federal debt is rising so much. Big problem. Politicians should try to make balanced budgets. Way too much spending that far exceeds revenues.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eOVOmflYSXE


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2022, 09:56:17 am »
... You wouldn't have made it through a PhD looking at the way you sloppily conflate the topic of a tepid attempt to handle America's train-wreck of a student loans situation and money in general.
To be clear: the lack of money drove me to provide thereafter for myself and limited my ceiling (Ph.D) but motivated me from the floor (e.g., my friend's uni dropout, car parts store job). If you don't get the message from that, it's on you.


« Last Edit: August 28, 2022, 09:59:22 am by VanIslander »
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #14 on: August 28, 2022, 10:20:55 am »
How is the car parts store doing these days? Maybe he did better than some of us.
A proud member of The Hateful Eight


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
    more
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #15 on: August 28, 2022, 05:05:49 pm »
How is the car parts store doing these days? Maybe he did better than some of us.
If by "do better" you mean make more money selling mufflers and tires, then k, though no money could make me get up every day to sell automobile parts. (Ask yourself every day: "What are you doing?!")
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6166

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #16 on: August 28, 2022, 10:09:20 pm »
Are you aware students can get student loans well beyond the the amount of tuition? It's supposed to be for living expenses, but it's way more than a student would need to live. This money is used to study abroad in Europe, party in Ibiza, and subsidize not working.

Payments to help people "get by" disincentivize working... at a time there is a labor shortage.

And did you see it's up to 20k now, not 10k. Disgusting. Adding more money to the federal debt. It's pandering to get more votes. 2022 election coming soon.
Since the money has already been loaned, it won't add a penny to the federal debt. As an educator, such ignorance of the facts should disgust you.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6166

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #17 on: August 28, 2022, 10:11:06 pm »
I read massive amounts of coronavirus relief money went towards buying Bitcoin, crypto, and NFTs. And food. Obesity grew a ton during the pandemic. You used the stimulus money to pay down student debt? What a moron! Should致e just waited for a bailout. Think of all the cool stuff you could have gotten.

覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧

Free money - welfare payments - makes people soft.

Tough love forges them into better people.

覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧

Sometimes good intentions have unintended consequences.

覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧

For the bank bailouts, the banks had to pay the money back. And did. Welfare payments to people 妬n need (who a lot of the time really aren稚) won稚 ever be payed back.

Where did you read it? Exactly how much is massive amounts?

The Treasury Department continues to claw back money from those who fraudulently received pandemic funds.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6166

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #18 on: August 28, 2022, 10:30:05 pm »
Since it has both the left and the right up in arms, it's probably a good middle ground. It's certainly going to help many who were being stymied by student loan debt from getting on with their lives and doing things like buying a house, getting married, starting a family, etc.

I worked my way through college and paid back my student loans and I have no problem with helping out folks with the Sisyphean task of paying back student loans on (much) lower than expected salaries. Not only is it the Christian thing to do, but it will help the economy in the long run.

Only 8% of college graduates have defaulted, while 40% of non-graduates have. Those 40% are working blue collar jobs and the like. They understandably tried to pursue higher education since that's the best way to be successful in the US and failed. Maybe they weren't up to it intellectually, but more likely life got in the way. And don't forget the thousands who were hoodwinked into taking out loans by for-profit colleges.

Like E.M. Forster giving two instead of three cheers for democracy, I give Dark Brandon two cheers for his loan forgiveness program.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6166

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Biden's student loan forgiveness plan
« Reply #19 on: August 28, 2022, 10:31:11 pm »
USA federal debt is rising so much. Big problem. Politicians should try to make balanced budgets. Way too much spending that far exceeds revenues.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eOVOmflYSXE

Watching Youtube makes people intellectually soft.