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  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Is civil war brewing in the US?
« on: February 05, 2022, 01:12:13 am »
More and more people are voicing their worries about the possibility of a civil war in the US. They are not suggesting a war between two armies, but rather more and more attacks on the government, such as in Oklahoma City, more assassination attempts such as the planned kidnapping of the Michigan governor and violent responses from the left.

Here's one example:
Quote
Jake Epstein
Fri, February 4, 2022, 10:06 AM
Ray Dalio on the Forum stage during day two of Web Summit 2018.
Ray Dalio.Eoin Noonan/Web Summit via Getty Images
Billionaire investor Ray Dalio said on Thursday that the US appears to be on the path to "some form of civil war."

Dalio said the country is witnessing greater amounts of populism and extremism.

He outlined his thoughts in a LinkedIn post that summarized excerpts from his book.

Billionaire investor Ray Dalio said on Thursday that the US appears to be on the path to "some form of civil war."

Dalio based his analysis on historical cases — arguing that the combination of financial burdens, such as large deficits, high taxes and inflation, and large wealth and value gaps in a nation "leads to some sort of fighting for control."




  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • South Gyeongsang province for 13 years (with a 7-year Jeju interlude)
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Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2022, 03:26:43 am »
I am not American but...

How can a country with so many flag-waying homes coast to coast (i've traveled there),...

Be so quick to talk of breaking the country up?

Nationalism gone haywire. ???
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 4683

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2022, 09:04:40 am »
Well, now that the GQP has declared the insurrection as “legitimate political discourse”…they’ve opened the door to free for all (on the right) political violence.

We are watching an empire implode in real time.


Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2022, 01:17:35 pm »
Well, now that the GQP has declared the insurrection as “legitimate political discourse”…they’ve opened the door to free for all (on the right) political violence.

We are watching an empire implode in real time.
Reichstag Firing the Capitol Riot doesn't help things.

Regardless, people are nuts if they want to go to war.

Also, wasn't I mocked on here for saying IF it did happen, it would resemble something like The Troubles or Bosnia or Iraq and not ye olde Civil War? Now people who disagreed are posting articles and agreeing with that vuew of how it would look.

I'd like to add something to the DeMart argument chain- half the arguments involve something that if said by a poster besides me, wouldn't bat an eye or would even get agreement, but because I post it, reflex kicks in.


  • Savant
  • The Legend

    • 3481

    • April 07, 2012, 11:35:31 pm
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2022, 01:30:54 pm »
Reichstag Firing the Capitol Riot doesn't help things.

Regardless, people are nuts if they want to go to war.

Also, wasn't I mocked on here for saying IF it did happen, it would resemble something like The Troubles or Bosnia or Iraq and not ye olde Civil War? Now people who disagreed are posting articles and agreeing with that vuew of how it would look.

I'd like to add something to the DeMart argument chain- half the arguments involve something that if said by a poster besides me, wouldn't bat an eye or would even get agreement, but because I post it, reflex kicks in.

Or you have a proven track history of making BS arguments because you totally believe in everything you're saying but at the end of the day it's still just BS.

You are mocked because you are up to your ears in BS but you still keep peddling away.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2022, 01:33:46 pm by Savant »


  • hippo
  • Super Waygook

    • 405

    • July 16, 2011, 11:28:36 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2022, 06:58:05 pm »
I think the US lost it’s sense of purpose after the Soviet Union imploded.  The US has been brought together by war since the beginning,(French and Indian War/7 Years War, the War for Independence, the War of 1812, The Mexican War,Civil War, many campaigns against Indians in the West, etc. etc.).  Since the end of the second World War and especially the Korean War, the US stopped reducing the military after wars, so the war economy functions as a major driver of the US economy.  After the collapse of the Soviet Union, the US pursued a lot of poor decisions.  The US has not won any wars since the Second World War (with the help of Allies).  At some point, (leaving morality aside), the US is just not good at global empire.   There is a bloated war bureaucracy and related bureaucracy of intelligence agencies that face no accountability.  At this point, I don’t see how you can build a decent sense of purpose when there’s no national healthcare or similar services enjoyed by other developed countries  while money goes to war and spying yet despite having reported failures such as not foreseeing 9/11, WMDs, and the wars against Afghanistan and Iraq.   At some point militarized societies suffer internally.


Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2022, 07:30:10 pm »
There’s an argument that the current political fighting has been created or perhaps amplified to ignore the fact of the enormous transfer of wealth that has been happening since Reagan. The media in America is absolute shite on both sides. They have completely brainwashed people into only thinking in terms of democrat or republican, not even considering what is best for the country and it’s people. Look at quality of life indexes and you will see America spiraling downwards compared to most other first world countries.

 So yes more violence is certainly possible and probably likely, but I doubt it will be a civil war and probably more like what demart has posted above.

Americans are too complacent and rely much to heavily on biased news. Idiocracy may be closer to the mark for America’s future than say demolition man or some other dystopian future.

https://www.google.co.kr/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/07/global-inequality-tipping-point-2030

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/quality-of-life-rankings



  • confusedsafferinkorea
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5996

    • October 08, 2010, 01:02:32 pm
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Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2022, 07:42:42 pm »
I am not American but I still think America is great. As an outsider I think the problem is a lack of a good, strong leader at the helm.

If the US can get a great, strong leader as its next president, I think it will go a long way to solving some of the issues.  I hear what is being said about not having affordable health care and all the money going on defense (mostly of other countries) and I feel so sorry for the average American because they deserve to have the money that is being spent on other countries, spent on them.

The US is in a very difficult damned if you do and damned if you don't situation.  If some country, starts rattling sabres then it is expected for the US to step in and help and when they do, then they are often made out to be the bad boy and if they don't then people are saying, where is the US?  A tricky situation indeed.

Despite all the doom and gloom, people still would give their eye teeth to go to America, so I don't think it is game over. Sure things may not be peachy right now, but I really believe that they can get through this.

There is no known medical cure for stupidity!


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2022, 10:47:33 pm »
Reichstag Firing the Capitol Riot doesn't help things.

Regardless, people are nuts if they want to go to war.

Also, wasn't I mocked on here for saying IF it did happen, it would resemble something like The Troubles or Bosnia or Iraq and not ye olde Civil War? Now people who disagreed are posting articles and agreeing with that vuew of how it would look.

I'd like to add something to the DeMart argument chain- half the arguments involve something that if said by a poster besides me, wouldn't bat an eye or would even get agreement, but because I post it, reflex kicks in.
I like the way you try and shield yourself from criticism by claiming "everyone is picking on me" (maybe you should think about why). That's a pretty good tell that you know your argument is full of holes.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2022, 11:02:53 pm »
There’s an argument that the current political fighting has been created or perhaps amplified to ignore the fact of the enormous transfer of wealth that has been happening since Reagan. The media in America is absolute shite on both sides. They have completely brainwashed people into only thinking in terms of democrat or republican, not even considering what is best for the country and it’s people. Look at quality of life indexes and you will see America spiraling downwards compared to most other first world countries.

 So yes more violence is certainly possible and probably likely, but I doubt it will be a civil war and probably more like what demart has posted above.

Americans are too complacent and rely much to heavily on biased news. Idiocracy may be closer to the mark for America’s future than say demolition man or some other dystopian future.

https://www.google.co.kr/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/07/global-inequality-tipping-point-2030

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/quality-of-life-rankings


It's too easy to blame it all on the media. The media give the people what they want because that's what brings in the money. Thus the news moved from an objective accounting of the day's happenings to becoming more about entertainment in the fight for ratings. I bet more people listen to the commentary than the speeches. Got to keep their stock prices up.

Local news is much less biased.

No doubt people are too complacent, but that's the price you when people are seen first and foremost as consumers.


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2022, 11:03:40 pm »
I am not American but I still think America is great. As an outsider I think the problem is a lack of a good, strong leader at the helm.

If the US can get a great, strong leader as its next president, I think it will go a long way to solving some of the issues.  I hear what is being said about not having affordable health care and all the money going on defense (mostly of other countries) and I feel so sorry for the average American because they deserve to have the money that is being spent on other countries, spent on them.

The US is in a very difficult damned if you do and damned if you don't situation.  If some country, starts rattling sabres then it is expected for the US to step in and help and when they do, then they are often made out to be the bad boy and if they don't then people are saying, where is the US?  A tricky situation indeed.

Despite all the doom and gloom, people still would give their eye teeth to go to America, so I don't think it is game over. Sure things may not be peachy right now, but I really believe that they can get through this.


Everyone's looking for a hero.


  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

    • 7853

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2022, 11:08:29 pm »
We are watching an empire implode in real time.

Not true. The USA will continue to be the world's sole superpower for as long as we live.

(Some) Commonwealthers predict / root for its downfall, but that never happens and never will happen, as least for as long as we're alive.

Good opportunities to make loads of money there for the smart and ambitious.

Travel nurses can make $15k a month. Why so high? Most nurses have families, and thus can't / don't want to travel. Supply and demand.


  • hippo
  • Super Waygook

    • 405

    • July 16, 2011, 11:28:36 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2022, 12:12:47 am »
Not true. The USA will continue to be the world's sole superpower for as long as we live.

(Some) Commonwealthers predict / root for its downfall, but that never happens and never will happen, as least for as long as we're alive.

Good opportunities to make loads of money there for the smart and ambitious.

Travel nurses can make $15k a month. Why so high? Most nurses have families, and thus can't / don't want to travel. Supply and demand.

My brain hurts after reading the last paragraph. 

I'm not sure what you mean when you refer to the United States as a superpower (i.e. empire).  After the Second World War, the United States controlled slightly over half of the world's wealth.  I don't know of any precedent that comes close at any time in history.  So some power loss was almost inevitable but a lot of stupid decisions have been made leading to blowback and lost wars including the current war in Iraq, current starvation of the population of Afghanistan (including people who do not like the Taliban), droning in Yemen, and lack of effective diplomacy with Russia, a nuclear armed power.  Do you not think other powers are going to get stronger, especially given that our economies have closer ties?

What do you mean when the United States will not be the "sole superpower"? What does that mean? What functions does the "sole superpower" do right now? 

How do traveling nurses relate to being a superpower?  That was a position created to incentivize nurses to travel to different hospitals, where they are likely to be less effective than nurses who only work at one hospital.  And I have heard many accounts of it being used to create more profit for the healthcare industry.  It likely creates animosity between travel nurses and in-house staff.  It would be nice if in-house nurses were paid more adequately for all the sh** they have had to deal with.  I am sure the hospitals are profiting well.  This system seems like an incentive for in-house nurses to quit to become traveling nurses.  And I am a bit baffled at what it has to do with being a superpower. 

The entire US health system is an international embarrassment.  Research for new drugs is done with US taxes and then just given to pharmaceutical companies.  Then, if you get extremely sick suddenly you have almost no power to negotiate, when you are in an ambulance thinking you might die, you are billed obscene rates for healthcare.  Are you going to try to haggle when you are having a heart attack? The US healthcare industry even advertises new medicines on television advertisements.

Anyway, what do you think being the world's sole superpower means and why do you think the US will continue to be the world's sole superpower?











« Last Edit: February 06, 2022, 12:41:52 am by hippo »


  • Adel
  • The Legend

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    • The Abyss
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Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2022, 05:01:59 am »


Anyway, what do you think being the world's sole superpower means and why do you think the US will continue to be the world's sole superpower?


Clearly, it was a very emotional response. Surely you've Li's jingoistic nonsense before.  :rolleyes:


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2022, 05:45:29 am »
Not true. The USA will continue to be the world's sole superpower for as long as we live.

(Some) Commonwealthers predict / root for its downfall, but that never happens and never will happen, as least for as long as we're alive.

Good opportunities to make loads of money there for the smart and ambitious.

Travel nurses can make $15k a month. Why so high? Most nurses have families, and thus can't / don't want to travel. Supply and demand.
So since you're not in the US, does that mean you're neither smart not ambitious? Asking for a friend.


  • JNM
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5054

    • January 19, 2015, 10:16:48 am
    • Cairo, Egypt (formerly Seoul)
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2022, 05:08:29 pm »
What do you think?


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 3850

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
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Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2022, 06:00:51 pm »
Look.

As long as the military, to be specific: the Pentagon and Air Force are commanded by whomever is elected to the White House, things will end very badly for any open hostile treasonmongers.

And i ain't even American.

That flag is creepily in many places in every town and city i've been to there, except San Fran, but hey, they are unlikely to try and break up the Union.
Life's to live! Live! Breathe. Relax. Enjoy. Animals teach us to focus on family, friends and avoid danger. Get what you need and get along with others. That said, some rock the boat, but they know capsizin' it means they're sunk. Some sink, let's swim! The sea's big, great, but has undercurrents.


Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2022, 06:59:33 pm »
Venezuela had a coup attempt that largely depended on the media.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/03/11/how-the-venezuelan-government-made-the-media-into-its-most-powerful-ally/


Good documentary that happened to be there; https://m.imdb.com/title/tt0363510/


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2022, 09:31:30 pm »
Venezuela had a coup attempt that largely depended on the media.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/03/11/how-the-venezuelan-government-made-the-media-into-its-most-powerful-ally/


Good documentary that happened to be there; https://m.imdb.com/title/tt0363510/

"With the 2004 passage of the Law on Social Responsibility in Radio and Television, the government won wide latitude to censor media in order to "promote social justice and further the development of the citizenry, democracy, peace, human rights, education, culture, public health, and the nation’s social and economic development." The law was expanded to include the Internet and social media in 2011."

Not to say it couldn't happen, but the US hasn't come close to controlling the media to this extent. In fact, the FCC seems to have drifted in the opposite direction.


Re: Is civil war brewing in the US?
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2022, 11:58:01 pm »
The Left will likely eat itself before we get to a civil war. That's my hope at least.