The Ukraine War

Sure thing, but the Ukrainian army is still better at soldiering than the Russian army.

Military experts tell us this, you and your google-fu don't.

Good thing my point has only been that Ukrainian Army isn't uniform, that 3 weeks is NOT enough to make someone skilled in combined arms warfare, and that the Russian Army isn't bumbling incompetent across the board.

But keep arguing with the strawman.

Good thing my point has only been that Ukrainian Army isn't uniform, that 3 weeks is NOT enough to make someone skilled in combined arms warfare, and that the Russian Army isn't bumbling incompetent across the board.

But keep arguing with the strawman.

That's 3 points. Each of which, individually, has merit but it not the discussion. But grouping them together is a great diversion.

Ukrainian army is better trained than the Russian army. Still waiting on you to refute this?

My gosh, it seems Marty is incapable of sticking to a topic. We are talking about the Russian military and he goes off on his usual tangents and talks about the US, ancient Rome or some obscure battle to justify his deflecting arguments. Pathetic. Anyway, I am out of this discussion with him as it is a monumental waste of time trying to get him to stay focused.

Sigh Marty. No one is claiming you have an effect. We are saying you know NOTHING

I knew enough to know that feeding individual soldier into veteran units vs. having entirely new units is a debate and that there are actually some significant pros to having soldiers join veteran units.

You seem to think that this kind of thing is some sort of inaccessible information that only Ph. Ds or people in the military have access to. The inability to distinguish which kinds of knowledge are knowable by experts vs. speculated by experts and which kinds of knowledge are available to the general public vs. experts only is YOUR problem, not mine.

AGAIN, we are talking about the Russian military, stop DEFLECTING.

And I am still going with the US military guy and not you.

Another failure of critical thinking: The inability to distinguish individual expert opinion vs. consensus expert opinion. You seem to think this issue has a consensus amongst military experts. It does not.

You realize I too am going with "U.S. military guys", right? You do realize not every "U.S. military guy" shares Gen. Herting's opinion on replacement policy, right?

Maybe if you focused less on me and more on the issue, you'd realize that and understand this issue is a lot more nuanced.

we are talking about the Russian military, stop DEFLECTING

You're not talking about the Russian military the conflict in Ukraine, you're talking about me. Follow your own voice.

My gosh, it seems Marty is incapable of sticking to a topic. We are talking about the Russian military and he goes off on his usual tangents and talks about the US, ancient Rome or some obscure battle to justify his deflecting arguments.

We are talking about effective replacement policy for combat troops. That is the question. In order to determine whether the Russian policy of sending their call-ups to existing units (assuming that's what they're doing and not constituting whole new units) is an effective one or not. In order to make that determination, one place you would look at is the historical effectiveness of such a policy.

You do realize that if Putin announced that rather than joining existing units, Herting would be on CNN talking about how that was wrong and it means they'll just be tossing in whole new units with no one experienced to lead them and guide them and how it would be a disaster, right? In other words, no matter what Russia does, he'll characterize it as the wrong choice.

But of course you have to reinforce by one of those two methods. Every army on the planet in the history of the world has had to. What you certainly CAN'T do is just do nothing and leave the existing army out there to wilt away.

Blah, blah Marty, have a nice day.

FACTS...FActs..Facts......facts. 

That echo, is me in your head, telling to you keep on consulting with your intellectual equals.

The city I live in has a Republican mayor, the state has a Repugnican governor and there's at least one shooting a day. The homeless are growing in number and coming to an intersection near you. Plenty of drugs, in fact one suspected dealer right down the street from me.

Those are the facts, jack, not that regurgitated fox nonsense you spew.

Jacksonville narrowly elected a Republican mayor, and the state of Florida narrowly elected a Republican governor.

Old folks tend to vote Republican and old folks often retire in Florida because of the warm weather - no snow - and advantageous tax laws.

Jacksonville is overall more criminal than the average city, and has been for a while… but depends on where in the city you are. Those without much money will be stuck in a worse area.

What is drill rap and how has Jacksonville become the epicenter of it?

https://www.firstcoastnews.com/amp/article/entertainment/jacksonville-drill-rappers-yungeen-ace-foolio-ksoo-spotemgottem-yr-mookey-jdot-breezy-spinabenz-whoppa-wit-da-choppa/77-b7b3c950-daca-4b54-b2b7-eb3985c12841

The word “drill” in drill rap refers to killing. Drill songs are diss songs between rival gangs where the rapper mocks or disses “dead ops,” or members of rivals killed in gang violence.
————

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YFfGgeddAc4

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fYI3MpgV-0Y

Back on topic.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktKin2REv50

Also, an expert's view

www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GrKzYjx1eI

The US Weapon Beating the Russians in Ukraine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN64Zkp7nb0

Ukraine has managed to push back against Russian military forces with the aid of a US-supplied weapon. Check out the video to see how this United States weapon could make things very difficult for Putin and his plans to take over Ukraine.

Back on topic.

And where is the video with the Russian men answering the call-up?

Without context as to the scale of each, this video is meaningless. You're taking anecdotes and using them as representative samples.

Also, an expert's view

Some remarkable claims-

"300,000 people who don't want to go to war. There's not any going to be happy about going."
1) How does he know this? Is he a mind-reader?
2) Just because someone isn't happy, doesn't mean someone isn't willing. There's this thing called "grim determination."

"You're going to be bringing in a lot of people who have a habit of alcohol"
1) Couldn't one say the same thing about the British? Or the Ukrainians for that matter?
2) You are bringing in 300,000 people who are low-grade. When someone reads something like this, applied to any entire nationality, one has to wonder how much bias and prejudice are affecting their assessment.

"They don't have skills for fighting anymore than the ones Russia currently have...the Ukrainians are so much better soldiers"
1) The ones Russia currently has have repulsed multiple Ukrainian counterattacks in Kherson and Donbass. In fact, the only way the Ukrainians were able to achieve a counterattack was with massed superior numbers against the least-manned front of the Russian army.
2) How does what he's saying in regards to reservists and low quality not apply to the Ukrainians reserves that have been mobilized?

Then we get the talk about casualties- "If only 5,000 have been killed why do we need 300,000 more?"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

Invasion forces (2003)
309,000
 United States: 192,000[13]
 United Kingdom: 45,000
 Australia: 2,000
 Poland: 194
Kurdistan Region Peshmerga: 70,000

Coalition forces (2004–09)
176,000 at peak

And this was against a significantly smaller enemy, in a significantly smaller country.

Now, argue the points made, not the person making them.

And where is the video with the Russian men answering the call-up?

Without context as to the scale of each, this video is meaningless. You're taking anecdotes and using them as representative samples.
Some remarkable claims-

I'm not sure who or what you are arguing with or about. All I did was post a video with some personal anecdotes of some Russian kids involved.  I felt this topic was drifting into domestic American politics which I would argue is somewhat unrelated to the original topic posted by old Sagi on page 1.

The implications you draw from the video are entirely of your own vivid imagination and have nothing to do with my post. No doubt you will disagree, but that's why so many people simply ignore you Marti. 

I'm not sure who or what you are arguing with or about. All I did was post a video with some personal anecdotes of some Russian kids involved.  I felt this topic was drifting into domestic American politics which I would argue is somewhat unrelated to the original topic posted by old Sagi on page 1.

The implications you draw from the video are entirely of your own vivid imagination and have nothing to do with my post. No doubt you will disagree, but that's why so many people simply ignore you Marti. 

...SOP.

Putin can't win the war by fighting so now he resorts to this. There is no end to his evilness.

Guess Marty will be along to defend Putin soon.


https://youtu.be/PK2VIMZBOCY?t=63

Guess Marty will be along to defend Putin soon.

He's now on my ignore list. I feel like a born-again Waygooker.

I'm just going to keep posting stuff diminishing Russia's war capabilities but feel great that I don't need to see Marty contort himself to reply in such a way to defend the Motherland.

Jacksonville narrowly elected a Republican mayor, and the state of Florida narrowly elected a Republican governor.

Old folks tend to vote Republican and old folks often retire in Florida because of the warm weather - no snow - and advantageous tax laws.

Jacksonville is overall more criminal than the average city, and has been for a while… but depends on where in the city you are. Those without much money will be stuck in a worse area.

The legislature has a Republican super-majority. Keep googlin.

"The stridently pro-Kremlin editor of Russia's state-run RT news channel expressed anger on Saturday that enlistment officers were sending call-up papers to the wrong men, as frustration about a military mobilisation grew across Russia.

Wednesday's announcement of Russia's first public mobilisation since World War Two, to shore up its faltering invasion of Ukraine, has triggered a rush for the border by eligible men, the arrests of over 1,000 protesters, and unease in the wider population.

Now, it is also attracting criticism of the authorities from among the Kremlin's own official supporters, something almost unheard of in Russia since the invasion began seven months ago.

"It has been announced that privates can be recruited up to the age of 35. Summonses are going to 40-year-olds," the RT editor-in-chief, Margarita Simonyan, railed on her Telegram channel.

"They're infuriating people, as if on purpose, as if out of spite. As if they'd been sent by Kyiv."

In another rare public sign of turmoil at the top, the Russian defence ministry said on Saturday the deputy minister in charge of logistics, four-star General Dmitry Bulgakov, had been replaced "for transfer to another role". It gave no further details."

More bad news for putin and his invasion.

This !

A Russian man who was called up to fight in Ukraine shot an official at a local enlistment office, reports say

"A Russian man who was called up to fight in the war in Ukraine shot an official at a local enlistment office, multiple reports said.

The incident took place in the Siberian city of Ust-Ilimsk on Monday and was captured on video, according to The Guardian, Reuters, and independent Russian news outlet The Insider.

The video shows two military officials on stage in front of a group of new recruits who had been called up to fight in the ongoing war in Ukraine, The Insider reported.

Suddenly, a gunshot rings out and one of the officials collapses as everyone else runs out of the enlistment in panic, the video shows."


https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-man-opens-fire-at-enlistment-office-shoots-official-reports-2022-9