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  • hangook77
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Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« on: January 04, 2022, 02:26:56 pm »
https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/nation/2022/01/113_321549.html

By Lee Hyo-jin

Debate is heating up over the government's planned expansion of the coronavirus vaccine pass system to department stores and large retailers, which has prompted a strong backlash from unvaccinated individuals, who argue that their freedoms will be excessively limited if the system is implemented there.

According to the Ministry of Health and Welfare, beginning Jan. 10, people entering department stores, large retail and discount stores measuring 3,000 square meters or more must show either a vaccination record or a negative PCR test result.

A one-week grace period will be applied until Jan. 16, after which violators will be fined.

Unlike cafes and eateries where unvaccinated people are allowed to sit if they are alone, an unvaccinated individual will not be able to enter department stores or large retail stores, even if he or she goes alone.

The expansion of the vaccine pass, which is currently applied to multiuse facilities including cafes, eateries, indoor gyms, movie theaters and public baths, comes as the country is facing an increasing spread of the Omicron variant.

But the government's decision to curtail individual freedoms further to protect public health has triggered heated debates.

"This is crossing the line. The government is virtually forcing the vaccine on the public by barring unvaccinated people from entering retailers where they go to purchase groceries and daily necessities," an internet user commented on the Naver website.

Another user who claimed to be partially vaccinated wrote, "Now I will have to rely on delivery services for my groceries. The authorities should stop treating the unvaccinated group as potential virus spreaders."

Regarding such complaints, Sohn Young-rae, a spokesperson at the health ministry, said during a briefing, "It is difficult to say that department stores have lower risks of infection, considering that they are crowded indoor areas."

Chon Eun-mi, a professor of respiratory medicine at Ewha Womans University Mokdong Hospital viewed that the decision lacks scientific basis.

"If we look at subways and buses that are highly crowded during rush hours, group infections have not occurred there yet because people wear face masks properly. The same situation applies to shopping malls and discount stores, where visitors spend one or two hours with their masks on. These new measures can be perceived among unvaccinated people as infringements on their freedom," she said.



  • hangook77
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2022, 02:29:09 pm »
The government came out of nowhere on Friday and restricted large stores even after they previously said they wouldn't.  They did this sneakily on a Friday letting protest rip over the weekend.  Truly disgusting.  Considering this country was once occupied by fascists (Japan and the Axis powers), I am surprised they would embrace fascism and total government control now. 


  • VanIslander
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2022, 04:03:31 pm »
Has the gov't given up contact tracing?

I saw a video about malls and big stores in Thailand requiring a phone scan when entering. That with masks and marks at the cashier line indicating social distancing (footprint lines to stand behind) and limiting the number of entrants per hour would be preferable to the companies and the customers.


Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2022, 04:06:55 pm »
I am surprised they would embrace fascism and total government control now.
You know how I bash leftists on here for calling Jan. 6th an insurrection and acting like Trump was Hitler? This is the same thing. Fascism this is not. Stop trying to exaggerate something into the singularly worst interpretation instead of the most accurate interpretation.


  • CO2
  • Waygook Lord

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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2022, 04:07:02 pm »
Has the gov't given up contact tracing?

I saw a video about malls and big stores in Thailand requiring a phone scan when entering. That with masks and marks at the cashier line indicating social distancing (footprint lines to stand behind) and limiting the number of entrants per hour would be preferable to the companies and the customers.

Where the hell have you been?

What on EARTH are you talking about? Are you under the impression that Thailand has been doing this and we haven't?


  • VanIslander
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2022, 10:59:32 pm »
Where the hell have you been?

What on EARTH are you talking about? Are you under the impression that Thailand has been doing this and we haven't?
Phone scan officers to allow us to enter?
Marks on floor at cashiers indicating distance?
Limiting the number of entrants?

No. I have not seen this. But I haven't been to Seoul since the pandemic began. Two other cities and the town I'm in, E-mart and shopping malls. Have seen none if it here.

Those procedures would be more effective than a vaccine pass to enter department stores.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2022, 11:08:42 pm by VanIslander »


  • tylerthegloob
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2022, 07:23:38 am »
what city are you in that you don't have to call a number or scan a QR code to enter E-mart..? every E-mart i've been to since 'rona (mostly around Busan and Jinju) have had QR codes or phone numbers to call and usually a guy there making sure you do it
more gg more skill


Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2022, 07:30:55 am »
It sounds like Korando-less city, and well, that's a city I just don't wanna live in.
Join the WhenInRome Fan Club!
Shout out to Mr. DeMartino... the first member. Thank you my son! ;)


  • hangook77
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2022, 08:03:15 am »
You know how I bash leftists on here for calling Jan. 6th an insurrection and acting like Trump was Hitler? This is the same thing. Fascism this is not. Stop trying to exaggerate something into the singularly worst interpretation instead of the most accurate interpretation.

Fascism is private ownership but total government control.  The individual's voice is not allowed and must be suppressed and ignored at all costs.  Also, I do believe the Nazis also checked people's papers and status. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwFvaSZfXNk



  • L I
  • Waygook Lord

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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2022, 08:26:45 am »
what city are you in that you don't have to call a number or scan a QR code to enter E-mart..?

In more rural areas, E-marts arenít as big. Itís possible to walk right into a smaller mart with only a few people inside.


Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2022, 11:02:27 am »
Fascism is private ownership but total government control.  The individual's voice is not allowed and must be suppressed and ignored at all costs.  Also, I do believe the Nazis also checked people's papers and status. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwFvaSZfXNk


Just because it has something in common does not make it that. There are also key differences, namely the fact that you are still free to dissent and say what you want. You also can vote in whomever you want.

Sort of big differences from fascism.


  • hangook77
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2022, 02:59:10 pm »
Just because it has something in common does not make it that. There are also key differences, namely the fact that you are still free to dissent and say what you want. You also can vote in whomever you want.

Sort of big differences from fascism.

Except that no matter how much you vote and how much you object, you don't get listened to.  When governments increasingly ignore the electorate and the media covers for them giving their preferred candidates better coverage who push the ideas THEY want.  And I do not have choice if I cannot go to Marts or any other places.  That is not freedom and it is total government control.  It is not respective of personal choice.  It also sets precedent that if people will comply with this, what else will they comply with?  What other freedom will they give up?  What crises can be manufactured or blown out of proportion to take away people's rights and freedoms?  Never let a good crises go to waste.  It's all about stepping stones.  If you can't see what ought to be common sense, then I can't help you. 


  • pkjh
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2022, 06:22:22 pm »
The government came out of nowhere on Friday and restricted large stores even after they previously said they wouldn't.  They did this sneakily on a Friday letting protest rip over the weekend.  Truly disgusting.  Considering this country was once occupied by fascists (Japan and the Axis powers), I am surprised they would embrace fascism and total government control now. 
What protests? Are we talking about here in Korea? All the businesses I've had to shop, or sit in, I've had scan, or call in, since like September 2021.


  • pkjh
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2022, 06:27:55 pm »
In more rural areas, E-marts arenít as big. Itís possible to walk right into a smaller mart with only a few people inside.
Interesting. I've been to some smaller counties, and their E-marts/Nonghyups, I've had to scan/call in. Must be a really, really, small villages. Perhaps it's in Gangwondo?


Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2022, 06:38:09 pm »
Except that no matter how much you vote and how much you object, you don't get listened to.
Yes, hangook77, YOU don't get listened to. The people who voted for the candidate that got the most votes get listened to, which was not your guy. Should they not be listened to?

Dude, the world does not revolve around you. You are not the only person on the planet. You repeatedly make mistakes/comments that show this sort of perspective.
Quote
When governments increasingly ignore the electorate and the media covers for them giving their preferred candidates better coverage who push the ideas THEY want.
You're suggesting a lot of Americans don't like center-left policies of expanded welfare state perks and being perceived as the educated, progressive types?

Quote
  And I do not have choice if I cannot go to Marts or any other places.
You can got to the local Si-jang or buy from the Bongo truck or stop by any small mart.

Quote
That is not freedom and it is total government control.
You calling it total government control is an insult to people who live under actual total government control. Stop LARPing like you're in Nazi Germany or North Korea.

Quote
It is not respective of personal choice.  It also sets precedent that if people will comply with this, what else will they comply with?
The government also has a duty to protect the lives and welfare of its citizens. They are working off of imperfect and unpredictable information. They have opted for a variety of measures and left large amounts of control up to the individual states. Considering the range of measures taken, especially considering those in China, this is in the cmiddle ground of "Do Nothing" vs. "LOCKDOWN!!!!!"

Seriously, you don't know what real fascisms and authoritarianism is. You're just like the snowflakes who scream Trump was Hitler. Calm down and stop being so easily frightened and scared. Control your emotions. And if you want a real taste of authoritarianism, swim over to the Norks.

Do it. Stop being all talk like you are about everything.


  • Sagi Keun
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    • May 10, 2018, 11:47:23 am
    • Los Angeles
Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2022, 12:49:47 am »
what city are you in that you don't have to call a number or scan a QR code to enter E-mart..? every E-mart i've been to since 'rona (mostly around Busan and Jinju) have had QR codes or phone numbers to call and usually a guy there making sure you do it

Same, although from Jan 16 they will require proof of vaccination as well.

Are photos or photocopies of vaccine certificates sufficient? or do they require an actual passport app.



  • tylerthegloob
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2022, 07:27:29 am »
Are photos or photocopies of vaccine certificates sufficient?
what country are you in? it's korea, of course they use the QR code
more gg more skill


  • hangook77
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    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2022, 07:43:30 am »
Yes, hangook77, YOU don't get listened to. The people who voted for the candidate that got the most votes get listened to, which was not your guy. Should they not be listened to?

Dude, the world does not revolve around you. You are not the only person on the planet. You repeatedly make mistakes/comments that show this sort of perspective. You're suggesting a lot of Americans don't like center-left policies of expanded welfare state perks and being perceived as the educated, progressive types?
You can got to the local Si-jang or buy from the Bongo truck or stop by any small mart.
You calling it total government control is an insult to people who live under actual total government control. Stop LARPing like you're in Nazi Germany or North Korea.
The government also has a duty to protect the lives and welfare of its citizens. They are working off of imperfect and unpredictable information. They have opted for a variety of measures and left large amounts of control up to the individual states. Considering the range of measures taken, especially considering those in China, this is in the cmiddle ground of "Do Nothing" vs. "LOCKDOWN!!!!!"

Seriously, you don't know what real fascisms and authoritarianism is. You're just like the snowflakes who scream Trump was Hitler. Calm down and stop being so easily frightened and scared. Control your emotions. And if you want a real taste of authoritarianism, swim over to the Norks.

Do it. Stop being all talk like you are about everything.

Yes, apologist.  Amything done in KOrea is always correct and everyone else is always wrong.  Either way lots of Koreans are pissed about this too and it is the government interfering in an unprecidented way into people's personal lives when it is none of thier business.  Total government control. 


  • CO2
  • Waygook Lord

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    • March 02, 2015, 03:41:14 pm
    • Uiwang
Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2022, 07:44:36 am »
what country are you in? it's korea, of course they use the QR code

Between Van and Sagi, I feel like we're in different universes. What is going on?


  • hangook77
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Re: Debate escalates over expanding vaccine pass system
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2022, 07:51:18 am »
At least some came to their senses.

http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20220104000873

A Seoul court on Tuesday afternoon temporarily blocked the vaccine pass mandate at educational facilities, saying the policy ďseriously disadvantages people who are not vaccinated.Ē

Seoulís administrative court has granted local community groupsí request for an injunction against the Ministry of Health and Welfare mandate requiring people to present proof of full vaccination or a recently taken negative PCR test result to enter public places.

Tuesdayís decision suspends the use of vaccine pass at these study places until a judgment on the merits of the case has been reached.