New rules for English education.

get them young and Naive from abroad with minimal Korean skills and knowledge ...
trick them foolish foreign youngsters online with long outdated promises of striking it rich in Korea

It would be nice to see the public school wages raised to 3.2 (just to keep up with inflation) and maintain the overall living conditions of the EPIK teachers
The scale should honestly be revised to fit 3.1 ~ 4.0 (and EPIK should also interview an select the better qualified individuals).

This seems strangely familiar. I can't remember who, but someone definitely wrote the exact same things here before...

Hangook77 as employee: We should be paid 3.2. I need to make money!
Hangook77 as boss: You'll get 2.0 and like it. I need to make money!

Never said that.  I said a living wage must be paid.  2.1 to 2.3 is not a living wage.  Even 2.5 not that great anymore.  Pay a living wage or don't hire them.  As for my friend's wife hogwon, I think it's more a glorified study room that my friend is now hoping to grow and make bigger. 

there seem to be some sneaky assumptions underlying the pay raise proposals. either (a) the funding should be increased to compensate for the 150% higher wages or (b) the number of teachers should be cut. im really curious which one you'd go for. it seems like raising the budget for NETs isnt really in the cards for korea (if anything we're seeing budgets decreasing afaik). and if you think teachers should be cut, what makes you think you won't be one of them? or would that be okay so long as your teacher buddies who don't get cut get their pay raise?

judging from what ive read of the typical foreign teacher eval, i have a sneaking suspicion that the survivors arent gonna necessarily the best, but rather those who go along to get along. (which means ill be fine lol, so bring on the cuts i guess)

there seem to be some sneaky assumptions underlying the pay raise proposals. either (a) the funding should be increased to compensate for the 150% higher wages or (b) the number of teachers should be cut. im really curious which one you'd go for. it seems like raising the budget for NETs isnt really in the cards for korea (if anything we're seeing budgets decreasing afaik). and if you think teachers should be cut, what makes you think you won't be one of them? or would that be okay so long as your teacher buddies who don't get cut get their pay raise?

I think that both should happen.
However, as with everything in Korean culture it would make sense to have a hierarchy and priority of which teacher should be given job security and increased wages

(1) F-Visa holders (F6 marriage/ F4 Gyopos/ Korean heritage with family in the country, and F-2 long term residents) Basically, the teachers that have status showing that they are invested in living in the country long-term,  have dedicated many  years of experience teaching in Korea with great renewal scores, and have proven through KIIP or similar programs that they have been integrating into the country by improving their cultural, social, and linguistic skills, should be automatically protected from getting cut, and 1st in line for the increased wages. Also these teachers should be given the top tier big cities if they have those as their top preference (Seoul, Busan, Daegu, Daejon, incheon ect)


(2)  E-2 Visa holders who have been in the country for 3 plus years, and have great renewal scores and reputation with their schools, have put in some effort into learning the language and culture ect.. should not be on the list to get cut, but not get any of the salary increases past the level 1 + salaryunless they work towards that F-2 (long term resident) visa. (Given a choice of top tier vs 2nd tier small cities)


(3) E-2 visa holders who are not really good at their jobs, have not been able to adapt well, show zero passion for Korean language and culture ( basically the people here on a gap year to party and travel) these should be the ones to not renew.

(4) Newly hired E-2 teachers just comming in with zero experience in teaching should be the ones places in all the rural areas where TaLK Scholars were placed.

Honestly, only F-series visa holders or long term E-2 visa holders who are working towards an F-2 visa should be given the permanent job security and yearly wage increases beyond the capped wage of a 1+ teacher. Going into the future EPIK should either significantly reduce the number of new teachers hired each year, keep the salary capped for anyone continuing to stay on the E-2 visas or follow Japan's JET program model for all new E-2 visa hires and just straight out state that the contract can only be renewed for 5 years.  Once 5 years are up, those still on E-2s who were not willing to transition to the F-2 series can either go the hakwon route or move on with their lives. 

Never said that.  I said a living wage must be paid.  2.1 to 2.3 is not a living wage.  Even 2.5 not that great anymore.  Pay a living wage or don't hire them.  As for my friend's wife hogwon, I think it's more a glorified study room that my friend is now hoping to grow and make bigger. 

The second you're one the other side of the desk, everything looks different.

The people who always bitch about salary/the exchange rate/subway fare/etc. are always the ones that if ever given the chance to do things, do the exact same things they complain about. They only can see things from their perspective and get hung up over money.

Never said that.  I said a living wage must be paid.  2.1 to 2.3 is not a living wage.  Even 2.5 not that great anymore.  Pay a living wage or don't hire them.  As for my friend's wife hogwon, I think it's more a glorified study room that my friend is now hoping to grow and make bigger. 

Study rooms don't make that much money from what I heard, it can be a lot more profitable than working public schools or as a slave worker at a hakwon... if a study room becomes really popular (especially if there is a foreigner on the team -Korean / Western couple) it is possible to pull in as much as 15,000 mill per month. Maybe after taxes and expenses it would work out to about 12 mill a month or 6 mill per person, which is a Korean public school head department teacher would make at the end of his/ her career ( or maybe what a principle would make).

The second you're one the other side of the desk, everything looks different.

The people who always bitch about salary/the exchange rate/subway fare/etc. are always the ones that if ever given the chance to do things, do the exact same things they complain about. They only can see things from their perspective and get hung up over money.

Yes, just accept BS wages and shut your mouth.  The apologist world view according to dee mar teeno. 

Yes, just accept BS wages and shut your mouth.  The apologist world view according to dee mar teeno. 

I think it's funny you don't realize you'd engage in the same things you disparage.

Study rooms don't make that much money from what I heard, it can be a lot more profitable than working public schools or as a slave worker at a hakwon... if a study room becomes really popular (especially if there is a foreigner on the team -Korean / Western couple) it is possible to pull in as much as 15,000 mill per month. Maybe after taxes and expenses it would work out to about 12 mill a month or 6 mill per person, which is a Korean public school head department teacher would make at the end of his/ her career ( or maybe what a principle would make).

I don't know if most are profitable like that?  I had a neighbor who set one up a year and half ago.  It was a Korean woman.  Just this past summer she bailed and new person moved into the apartment.  I think many don't make a good go of it.  I got the new neighbor who had the loud air con in the veranda until recently.  This is an apartment complex.  But one of my old villas had one of those too on an upper floor the other side.  It maybe lasted a few months?  This was quite a few years ago though. 

I think it's funny you don't realize you'd engage in the same things you disparage.

Engage in working for less pay martino.  Maybe 1.5 mil salary and a kick in the teeth for the pleasure to work in Holy Korea is all we need? 

I think it's funny you don't realize you'd engage in the same things you disparage.

Another China information post derailed pages ago.....

I don't know if most are profitable like that?  I had a neighbor who set one up a year and half ago.  It was a Korean woman.  Just this past summer she bailed and new person moved into the apartment.  I think many don't make a good go of it.  I got the new neighbor who had the loud air con in the veranda until recently.  This is an apartment complex.  But one of my old villas had one of those too on an upper floor the other side.  It maybe lasted a few months?  This was quite a few years ago though. 

The 15,000 mill a month gongbu bang is run by a Korean-American married couple. The Korean husband was a public school English teacher and the American wife was actually a licensed teacher in the US (is what my co-teacher told me).  So the husband teaches the kids an hour of grammar and the basics in Korean and then the kids have an hour class with the wife, where they practice what they just learned. Also their gongbu bang is out on the edge of the city with two qualified teachers, so the demand is definitely high for their lessons, and as of recently they were going to expand it to a Hakwon. (My co-teacher's mother in law lives in that part of the city so she knows what's happening.)

But yes, you are right, not all of the gongbu bangs are this profitable. My co-teacher also has a friend (who is a former Korean contract English teacher), who runs her own small gongbu bang, which is not as profitable due to her not having a Native teacher working with her (which is what a lot of parents wants for their kids to have exposure). Another one of her friends, with similar credentials, who runs an actual Hakwon has better profit, due to focusing on exam prep. But she has to deal with unprofessional Korean teachers quitting all the time. However, at the end of the day, both of these teachers basically got tired of their salaries never increasing  (Korean contract teachers face the same wage barriers as us NETS), (I think my co-teacher's salary is still 2.0 mill and she's been working at the same school for 10 years now!) so they took the risk of running their own business. However, they do make better money there than as contract workers at the public school.

Another China information post derailed pages ago.....

To get things back on track....while I am personally not a big fan of Chinese language and culture (I tried)... It just never excited me as much as Korean and Japanese... but here is a youtube channel of an amazing young lady who was able to master Mandarin and shares here language learning journey and tips with others! I think she deserves a lot of respect for the difficult task! It's impressive!

https://youtu.be/WHEvJT5stf0

at this point i genuinely require a mod to confirm whether hangook and hiddeninkorea share an ip address for the sake of my peace of mind

at this point i genuinely require a mod to confirm whether hangook and hiddeninkorea share an ip address for the sake of my peace of mind

hahahaha

I wouldn't say it's LIKELY, but it certainly isn't UNLIKELY either.

They don't. Not even close. 

The 15,000 mill a month gongbu bang is run by a Korean-American married couple. The Korean husband was a public school English teacher and the American wife was actually a licensed teacher in the US (is what my co-teacher told me).  So the husband teaches the kids an hour of grammar and the basics in Korean and then the kids have an hour class with the wife, where they practice what they just learned. Also their gongbu bang is out on the edge of the city with two qualified teachers, so the demand is definitely high for their lessons, and as of recently they were going to expand it to a Hakwon. (My co-teacher's mother in law lives in that part of the city so she knows what's happening.)

But yes, you are right, not all of the gongbu bangs are this profitable. My co-teacher also has a friend (who is a former Korean contract English teacher), who runs her own small gongbu bang, which is not as profitable due to her not having a Native teacher working with her (which is what a lot of parents wants for their kids to have exposure). Another one of her friends, with similar credentials, who runs an actual Hakwon has better profit, due to focusing on exam prep. But she has to deal with unprofessional Korean teachers quitting all the time. However, at the end of the day, both of these teachers basically got tired of their salaries never increasing  (Korean contract teachers face the same wage barriers as us NETS), (I think my co-teacher's salary is still 2.0 mill and she's been working at the same school for 10 years now!) so they took the risk of running their own business. However, they do make better money there than as contract workers at the public school.

They run a hogwon and make good money and can't raise their Korean teacher from 2 million won a month after many years?  I did remember back in 2008ish they made 1.5 or 1.6ish a month.  But I think due to minimum wage, they had to raise their salaries a bit, but not much I see.  The NETS were quite a bit above minimum wage but now are just a bit behind it.    They keep complaining about unprofessional teachers but won't raise the pay?  I mean why not advertise for experienced teachers and demand they do some lesson planning, game activities alongside the classes etc?  But actually pay them so the owners can set it and forget it?  Most Koreans would rather nickle and dime everyone and then complain and deal with the frustration and unprofessionalism.  A lot of stupid greedy people running schools out there.  Bump the Korean teacher up to 2.5 and give them a raise every couple of years.  Bump the foreign teacher up to 3 million and give a raise every year (since the native speakers are still in demand by parents). 

The 15,000 mill a month gongbu bang is run by a Korean-American married couple. The Korean husband was a public school English teacher and the American wife was actually a licensed teacher in the US (is what my co-teacher told me).  So the husband teaches the kids an hour of grammar and the basics in Korean and then the kids have an hour class with the wife, where they practice what they just learned. Also their gongbu bang is out on the edge of the city with two qualified teachers, so the demand is definitely high for their lessons, and as of recently they were going to expand it to a Hakwon. (My co-teacher's mother in law lives in that part of the city so she knows what's happening.)

But yes, you are right, not all of the gongbu bangs are this profitable. My co-teacher also has a friend (who is a former Korean contract English teacher), who runs her own small gongbu bang, which is not as profitable due to her not having a Native teacher working with her (which is what a lot of parents wants for their kids to have exposure). Another one of her friends, with similar credentials, who runs an actual Hakwon has better profit, due to focusing on exam prep. But she has to deal with unprofessional Korean teachers quitting all the time. However, at the end of the day, both of these teachers basically got tired of their salaries never increasing  (Korean contract teachers face the same wage barriers as us NETS), (I think my co-teacher's salary is still 2.0 mill and she's been working at the same school for 10 years now!) so they took the risk of running their own business. However, they do make better money there than as contract workers at the public school.

As for public schools, I think they also go up every year.  They just don't get the pension.  I had contract teachers tell me this.  They have to register with the provincial education office and upload a profile and photo.  But they can only work at one school for 4 years and yet have to re apply for their job every year.  Korea's dumb like that.  With experience they go up a pay level.  But don't cap out like us.  However, there may be a few public schools who try tricks and different titles.  A couple of dick schools used some title to only hire them for the semester and leave them unpaid during the vacations.  Then some belonged to a union who only had to reapply every 4 years and could stay at the same school as long as they got through the interview every 4 years.  Those ones had the best deal.  But most got one year contracts fully paid and then went up a pay level for every year of experience.  But they are registered with the POE and schools hire from there.