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  • T_Rex
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    • April 23, 2019, 08:10:20 am
Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« on: January 13, 2021, 06:45:04 am »
"Crossfire analyzes issues around policing, brutality, race, law and order in a time when America is ablaze and divided. Half the nation rallies to support demoralized officers, and the other half demands reform and even calls for disbanding the police. Indeed, many in the latter group don’t join the debate at all, but instead violently riot in the streets."
https://crossfire.movie/

I found it honest, factual, and well-balanced. Highly recommend if you want to better understand these issues.


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  • Hero of Waygookistan

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Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2021, 07:55:13 am »
"Half the nation rallies to support demoralized officers, and the other half demands reform and even calls for disbanding the police. Indeed, many in the latter group don’t join the debate at all, but instead violently riot in the streets."

I found it honest, factual, and well-balanced. Highly recommend if you want to better understand these issues.
Doubtful

I'm sure this doesn't have to be said for most of you, but please don't waste your time with Lauren Southern lol


  • fka
  • Expert Waygook

    • 742

    • September 05, 2019, 06:37:44 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2021, 09:07:24 am »
Oh cool, Waygook.org is amplifying the voices of self-declared white separatists again. Good news for the English-teaching community in Korea.

T.Rex, the famous white supremacist publication American Renaissance shares your enthusiasm for this documentary.

https://www.amren.com/commentary/2021/01/lauren-southerns-wake-up-call-for-whites/


However, the reviewer does implicitly express a disappointment that film didn't place a stronger focus on the link between crime and genetics.

Quote
Mrs. Southern does not take a race-realist position, but is still generally accurate...

Mrs. Southern explains that it is crime that causes poverty, because businesses and law-abiding residents move out. She also concedes that genetics explain between 40 and 80 percent of antisocial behavior, but Mrs. Southern talks more about environment.

How about you, T. Rex? Do you think she should have gone more race-realist?
« Last Edit: January 13, 2021, 09:14:28 am by fka »


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 4355

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2021, 10:01:58 am »
Still trying to peddle 2014 era arguments...white nationalists need a new playbook  :-[ :-[


  • McTinkle
  • Waygookin

    • 15

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:48 pm
    • Busan, South Korea
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2021, 10:06:19 am »
I wouldn't waste your time with this. Couple of reasons:

1. This film also includes pizza-gate nut case Mike Cernovich as a talking head along with other Alt-lite figures.
2. Fully blames black people for crime whilst fully and unfairly dismissing other factors.
3. Lots of Copaganda
4. Fully doesn't understand Antifa.  Describes it as a "parasite" . So this film is Anti-antifa. So... Fa?
5. Attempts to show multiple murderer Kyle Rittenhouse as innocent, not just self defense innocent but sainthood innocent.
6. Mis-represents defund the police as abolish the police. Also gives no alternatives or discussion. Basically you defund the police and everyon gets murdered.
7. A bit of Soros anti-semetic conspiracy thrown in there as a garnish.
8. Includes one black voice decrying the police as "balance" 95% of the film very much extremely one sided.
9. Massive amount of victim blaming.
10. Attempts to bring in race realism (genetic link etc) but doesn't quite go full nazi.
11. Against critical race theory (which again it doesn't understand) to this film the history of America didn't really happen.

There is a conversation that has to be had about the protests but this film doesn't do that. This is the conservative view point, many would say that viewpoint caused these problems in the first place. Unfortunately this film is so one sided its basically propaganda. An angry, ignorant film.

Lauren Southern was banned from wikipedia for attempting to remove the lines: "She has been described as alt-right and a white nationalist," and that she had ever supported "The Great Replacement Theory." from her page.


  • T_Rex
  • Veteran

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    • April 23, 2019, 08:10:20 am
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2021, 10:37:41 am »
I wouldn't waste your time with this. Couple of reasons:

1. This film also includes pizza-gate nut case Mike Cernovich as a talking head along with other Alt-lite figures.
2. Fully blames black people for crime whilst fully and unfairly dismissing other factors.
3. Lots of Copaganda
4. Fully doesn't understand Antifa.  Describes it as a "parasite" . So this film is Anti-antifa. So... Fa?
5. Attempts to show multiple murderer Kyle Rittenhouse as innocent, not just self defense innocent but sainthood innocent.
6. Mis-represents defund the police as abolish the police. Also gives no alternatives or discussion. Basically you defund the police and everyon gets murdered.
7. A bit of Soros anti-semetic conspiracy thrown in there as a garnish.
8. Includes one black voice decrying the police as "balance" 95% of the film very much extremely one sided.
9. Massive amount of victim blaming.
10. Attempts to bring in race realism (genetic link etc) but doesn't quite go full nazi.
11. Against critical race theory (which again it doesn't understand) to this film the history of America didn't really happen.

There is a conversation that has to be had about the protests but this film doesn't do that. This is the conservative view point, many would say that viewpoint caused these problems in the first place. Unfortunately this film is so one sided its basically propaganda. An angry, ignorant film.

Lauren Southern was banned from wikipedia for attempting to remove the lines: "She has been described as alt-right and a white nationalist," and that she had ever supported "The Great Replacement Theory." from her page.
People should be held responsible for the crimes they commit. Not sure why that's controversial. I don't understand much about Antifa except that they are violent, Marxist, and pro-anarchy.  Is there a difference between defunding and abolishing the police? Do you expect the police to work for free? There's zero race realism in the movie. The documentary merely pointed out that anti-social behavior has a genetic component (most traits do). What's the conservative viewpoint? Back in 1994 Joe Biden, the Clintons, and the Congressional Black Caucus supported a crime bill which resulted in a lot more people being incarcerated. Crime went down a lot after that. Was a law that made black communities much safer racist?


  • McTinkle
  • Waygookin

    • 15

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:48 pm
    • Busan, South Korea
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2021, 10:58:33 am »
People should be held responsible for the crimes they commit. Not sure why that's controversial. I don't understand much about Antifa except that they are violent, Marxist, and pro-anarchy.  Is there a difference between defunding and abolishing the police? Do you expect the police to work for free? There's zero race realism in the movie. The documentary merely pointed out that anti-social behavior has a genetic component (most traits do). What's the conservative viewpoint? Back in 1994 Joe Biden, the Clintons, and the Congressional Black Caucus supported a crime bill which resulted in a lot more people being incarcerated. Crime went down a lot after that. Was a law that made black communities much safer racist?

"People should be held responsible for the crimes they commit. Not sure why that's controversial." - I never said they shouldn't. Literally no one thinks this.
 "I don't understand much about Antifa except that they are violent, Marxist, and pro-anarchy." - Antifa is a reaction against fascism. The film painst them as violent psychos but also pathetic cry babies. If you take any group you find odd members who are problematic. For example police officers are more likely to beat their wive, so they are all wife beaters now by your logic.
"Is there a difference between defunding and abolishing the police? Do you expect the police to work for free?" - Yes, no duh
"There's zero race realism in the movie. The documentary merely pointed out that anti-social behavior has a genetic component (most traits do)." - You've dropped your copy of the Bell Curve on the ground there buddy and your mask is slipping a bit, might want to sort that out.
"What's the conservative viewpoint? Back in 1994 Joe Biden, the Clintons, and the Congressional Black Caucus supported a crime bill which resulted in a lot more people being incarcerated." - This film is the conservative viewpoint especially when it hammers home the "pull yourself up by your boot straps" mentality and buts all the blame on people rather than systems, if you don't understand what conservatism is that's fine, politics are hard and not black and white. Democrats are also bad.
"Crime went down a lot after that. Was a law that made black communities much safer racist?" - Locking up more people generally reduces crime, it also exacerbates other problems. Americas issues with incarceration are well known and not really addressed in the film. This is a more complex issue that is not done well in the movie.

I hope that helps. Please try to watch other movies and viewpoints.

 



  • fka
  • Expert Waygook

    • 742

    • September 05, 2019, 06:37:44 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2021, 11:59:03 am »
"People should be held responsible for the crimes they commit. Not sure why that's controversial." - I never said they shouldn't. Literally no one thinks this.
 "I don't understand much about Antifa except that they are violent, Marxist, and pro-anarchy." - Antifa is a reaction against fascism. The film painst them as violent psychos but also pathetic cry babies. If you take any group you find odd members who are problematic. For example police officers are more likely to beat their wive, so they are all wife beaters now by your logic.
"Is there a difference between defunding and abolishing the police? Do you expect the police to work for free?" - Yes, no duh
"There's zero race realism in the movie. The documentary merely pointed out that anti-social behavior has a genetic component (most traits do)." - You've dropped your copy of the Bell Curve on the ground there buddy and your mask is slipping a bit, might want to sort that out.
"What's the conservative viewpoint? Back in 1994 Joe Biden, the Clintons, and the Congressional Black Caucus supported a crime bill which resulted in a lot more people being incarcerated." - This film is the conservative viewpoint especially when it hammers home the "pull yourself up by your boot straps" mentality and buts all the blame on people rather than systems, if you don't understand what conservatism is that's fine, politics are hard and not black and white. Democrats are also bad.
"Crime went down a lot after that. Was a law that made black communities much safer racist?" - Locking up more people generally reduces crime, it also exacerbates other problems. Americas issues with incarceration are well known and not really addressed in the film. This is a more complex issue that is not done well in the movie.

I hope that helps. Please try to watch other movies and viewpoints.

Generally well said. A couple of additions:

Quote
"I don't understand much about Antifa except that they are violent, Marxist, and pro-anarchy."

Marxism is an economic model. Anti-fascism is not. It's entirely possible to be 100% pro-capitalist and avowedly anti-fascist. Anarchism and Marxism generally have nothing to do with each other, though there has occasionally been mild convergence, such as the early 20th Century Syndicalist movements. Antifa is not a Syndicalist movement. Antifa has nothing to do with economics.

If you want to read a good critique of anarchism, find something written by a Marxist. If you want a good critique of Marxism, anarchists have been at this game for a long time.

Quote
There's zero race realism in the movie. The documentary merely pointed out that anti-social behavior has a genetic component (most traits do)

Society and culture determine what is and isn't "anti-social". Any form of killing may be considered inexcusable by one culture at a given time. However, its neighboring society might believe that capital punishment is just. These two populations might have very strong genetic similarities. Both societies may make exceptions for self-defense or war. Certain religious groups within the larger society may take a different position. There is no fixed definition of anti-social behavior - it varies across time and space. Assigning a number to what proportion of such behavior is genetically influenced is prone to all the error and uncertainty that that should imply.

I tried to find the source of the 80% claim in the white supremacist article and found a study from 2003 which is the most likely candidate: https://acamh.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/1469-7610.00168 However, there are some strong caveats here: 1) Anti-social behavior is poorly defined in this study; 2) The assessment of anti-social behavior is rather subjective ("mothers, teachers, examiner‐observers previously unacquainted with the children, and the children themselves"); and 3) the study - and, importantly, its conclusions - apply only to children under 5. In fact, the authors themselves state: In contrast, genetic risk is known to be relatively modest for adolescent antisocial behaviour, suggesting that the early‐childhood form has a distinct etiology, particularly if it is pervasive across situations.


« Last Edit: January 13, 2021, 12:23:26 pm by fka »


Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2021, 12:16:06 pm »
The only right-leaning figure who ever understood antifa and the Proud Boys was Scott Adams, who correctly identified as something akin to LARPing or soccer hooliganism.


  • fka
  • Expert Waygook

    • 742

    • September 05, 2019, 06:37:44 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2021, 12:20:28 pm »
One more comment about Antifa, which I intend to copy-and-paste in future threads as needed.

Remember several years ago, when Milo Yiannopoulos would appear on a mainstream network news show to be interviewed by some really square anchor, who obviously didn't know who Milo was until 5 minutes before the broadcast, and was likely working from some crappy 3-sentence producer's brief? The news anchor would ask questions like, "So are you the leader of a dangerous Neo-Nazi organization called the alt-right?" and all Milo's fans would be like, "Ha ha! He doesn't know that Milo is gay and Jewish! He's married to a black man! Ha ha! He called the alt-right an organization! Ha ha! Milo owned the media again!"

Well, that news anchor is what right-wingers look like when they talk about Antifa.


  • McTinkle
  • Waygookin

    • 15

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:48 pm
    • Busan, South Korea
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2021, 12:24:03 pm »
One more comment about Antifa, which I intend to copy-and-paste in future threads as needed.

Remember several years ago, when Milo Yiannopoulos would appear on a mainstream network news show to be interviewed by some really square anchor, who obviously didn't know who Milo was until 5 minutes before the broadcast, and was likely working from some crappy 3-sentence producer's brief? The news anchor would ask questions like, "So are you the leader of a dangerous Neo-Nazi organization called the alt-right?" and all Milo's fans would be like, "Ha ha! He doesn't know that Milo is gay and Jewish! He's married to a black man! Ha ha! He called the alt-right an organization! Ha ha! Milo owned the media again!"

Well, that news anchor is what right-wingers look like when they talk about Antifa.

that's a good analogy , I'm stealing it :)


Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2021, 06:27:21 pm »
Lauren Southern is a blatant white supremacist and the fact that Waygook is leaving this topic on the site speaks volumes. T_Rex is just seeing what he can get away with by acting innocent and "just asking questions" while promoting obvious white supremacist propaganda. He has also repeatedly endorsed the deadly Capitol Mob attack without any repercussions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lauren_Southern

Quote
Lauren Cherie Southern (born 16 June[3] 1995) is a Canadian alt-right political activist, white nationalist and YouTuber.[a]

Southern is known for her promotion of the Great Replacement conspiracy theory via a YouTube video of the same name she released in July 2017.[7][8][9] The video is reported to have helped to promote the white nationalist viewpoint with over 600,000 views by March 2019.[7][10]

She has been described as an advocate of the white genocide conspiracy theory for her documentary Farmlands which suggested the imminence of a race war in South Africa.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Replacement

Quote
The Great Replacement (French: grand remplacement), also known as the replacement theory,[1][2] is a white nationalist far-right[3] conspiracy theory[4][5][6] which states that, with the complicity or cooperation of "replacist" elites,[a][4][7] the white French population—as well as white European population at large—is being progressively replaced with non-European peoples—specifically Arab, Berber and sub-Saharan Muslim populations from Africa and the Middle East—through mass migration, demographic growth and a European drop in the birth rate.[4][8

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_genocide_conspiracy_theory

Quote
The white genocide, white extinction,[1] or white replacement conspiracy theory[2][3][4] is a white supremacist[5][6][7][8] belief that there is a deliberate plot, often blamed on Jews,[5][8] to promote reproduction by people considered to be of different races,[9] miscegenation, interracial marriage, mass non-white immigration, racial integration, low fertility rates, abortion, governmental land-confiscation from whites, organised violence,[10] and eliminationism in white-founded countries[5] in order to cause the extinction of whites through forced assimilation[10] and violent genocide.[11][12][13][14] Less frequently, black people,[15] Hispanics,[16] and Muslims[17] are blamed, but merely as more fertile immigrants,[18] invaders,[19] or violent aggressors,[20] rather than the masterminds of a secret plot.[21]

White genocide is a myth,[22][23][15] based on pseudoscience, pseudohistory, and hatred,[24] driven by a psychological panic often termed white extinction anxiety.[25][16] There is no evidence that white people are dying out or facing extermination.[26][27][28][21] The purpose of the conspiracy theory is to scare white people,[26] and justify a commitment to a white nationalist agenda[29] in support of increasingly successful calls to violence.[22][20][19]

The theory was popularized by neo-Nazi David Lane around 1995, and has been leveraged as propaganda in Europe, North America, South Africa, and Australia. Similar conspiracy theories were prevalent in Nazi Germany[30] and have been used in the present-day interchangeably with,[31] and as a broader and more extreme version of, Renaud Camus's 2012 The Great Replacement, focusing on the white Christian population of France.[32][33] Since the 2019 Christchurch and El Paso shootings, of which the shooters' manifestos decried a "white replacement" and have referenced The Great Replacement; author Bat Ye'or's 2002 Eurabia concept,[34] Camus's 2012 Great Replacement fallacy (often called replacement theory or population replacement),[35] and Gerd Honsik's resurgent 1970s myth of a Kalergi plan,[31] have all been used synonymously with "white genocide" and are increasingly referred to as variations of the conspiracy theory.

In August 2018, US President Donald Trump was accused of endorsing the conspiracy theory in a foreign policy tweet instructing Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to investigate South African "land and farm seizures and expropriations and the large scale killing of farmers",[36][37][38] claiming that the "South African government is now seizing land from white farmers".[39] The often critical narrative derived from the South African farm attacks, and land reform in South Africa, is an established subset theme of the broader conspiracy theory,[26] portrayed in media as a form of gateway or proxy issue to "white genocide" within the wider context of the Western world.[40][39] The topic of farm seizures in South Africa and Zimbabwe has been a rallying cry of white nationalists and alt-right groups[41][42] who use it to justify their vision of white supremacy.[43][39]
Quote
Quote from: Mr.DeMartino on Yesterday at 01:40:32
    Trump is a liar and a con man.
Quote
Quote from Mr.DeMartino on June 14, 2019 at 02:28:07
Donald Trump is a lying sack of shit


  • gogators!
  • The Legend

    • 4423

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2021, 12:47:05 am »
People should be held responsible for the crimes they commit.
So you agree trump should be charged and prosecuted for his crimes.


  • T_Rex
  • Veteran

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    • April 23, 2019, 08:10:20 am
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2021, 09:07:16 am »
Lauren Southern is a blatant white supremacist and the fact that Waygook is leaving this topic on the site speaks volumes. T_Rex is just seeing what he can get away with by acting innocent and "just asking questions" while promoting obvious white supremacist propaganda. He has also repeatedly endorsed the deadly Capitol Mob attack without any repercussions.
You were not very open-minded the last time one of her documentaries was discussed.


  • T_Rex
  • Veteran

    • 171

    • April 23, 2019, 08:10:20 am
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2021, 09:52:22 am »
Overall, I think the documentay did a good job of refuting the anti-police narrative peddled by the left. The police are not killing people for racist reasons. People who seem to want to discredit the film focus on peripheral issues and rely a lot on ad hominems.


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 4355

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2021, 09:54:28 am »
Overall, I think the documentay did a good job of refuting the anti-police narrative peddled by the left. The police are not killing people for racist reasons. People who seem to want to discredit the film focus on peripheral issues and rely a lot ad hominems.

Nah, we just prefer to not take anything white supremacists say seriously.

Moreover, almost every single one of her previous beliefs has been debunked...but we're now supposed to believe this one?


Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2021, 11:36:50 am »
Is it really a conspiracy theory for white people from SA to be nervous considering they live right next to Zimbabwe, land of Mugabe and have Julius frickin Malema as a major political figure?

Is it any more of a conspiracy theory than suggesting black people here could end up being systematically targeted for whatever reason?


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 4355

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2021, 12:03:50 pm »
You're really trying to tell us white genocide isn't a conspiracy theory?

And we're supposed to actually take you seriously???


Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2021, 12:24:32 pm »
You're really trying to tell us white genocide isn't a conspiracy theory?

And we're supposed to actually take you seriously???
In Europe? Sure. In SA? Sure. In SA is Mugabeism a conspiracy theory? No. You literally had Mugabe right next door and you have Malema in house.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Malema?wprov=sfla1
Quote
In June 2018, Malema gained additional notoriety when he was asked whether he was responsible for organizing gang members to murder white farmers, and responded "Maybe. Maybe not."
Now to be fair that could well be Malema trolling.

Malema actually is who dumb people think Trump is.


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 4355

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Lauren Southern's "Crossfire" documentary
« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2021, 12:39:01 pm »
Again, you really expect us to take you seriously for believing in the white genocide myth?

Like...you really want us to think it's a legitimate thing?? ?