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Men, Women and pets.
« on: June 18, 2020, 04:28:10 pm »
This thread will likely piss a few people off, but I think it's a topic that needs to be addressed.

Disclaimer, I AM NOT referring to all women or men, simply the majority from what I've seen over the years in various pet forums. There are women who are terrific pet guardians, who have shared expert insight and knowledge.

As an expat, I've made some willing sacrifices to keep 2 cats, a Betta aquarium and a community aquarium. For me, it's worth it and I've made arrangements for the day I decide to leave Korea. I'm going to discuss my experiences as a fishkeeper, cat guardian and general observations.

Fishkeeper

I'm part of a few fishkeeping groups specializing in planted aquariums and Betta fish care. The former is seems to male dominated, about an 80-20 ratio and the latter is the opposite. "High-Tech" planted aquariums require a significant degree of knowledge and can get pretty complicated and nerdy, nevertheless, the vast majority of the guys in these groups go to great lengths to make sure their livestock, and plants, thrive and are cared for; they expand their knowledge, do research, spend money and generally take things seriously as they're aware that they're caring for life forms. The guys are also very open to discussion, critique and criticism. There's a great appreciation for the beauty of the hobby, absolutely, but emotion never seems to override logic, decisions are made based on scientific and biological fact.

In the Betta fishkeeping groups, you have the opposite. As said, the majority of the fishkeepers are female and while their are some extremely knowledgable females in the group, who are as appalled as I am, most are the most moronic idiots alive. First thing most guys seem to do is research. They research the nitrogen cycle, plant species, nutrient requirements etc.
With the majority of females in these groups, they get the "cute" tiny 1gal nano aquarium (animal cruelty to put a Betta in that), stick the Betta in and cram it with neon stones, tacky ornaments and fake plants. They'll post their pictures to the group and other females, too afraid to criticize, will say things like "OMG I love it", "Cute"... as soon as one sensible person tries to suggest they get a bigger tank or "cycle the tank first" or other advice in the best interest of the fish, they'll say things like "But he looks so happy" or complain to admins about being "bullied". This other lady posted a pic of her dead Betta and wanted to know how he died... there was a layer of about 3cm of old food at the bottom of the tank and she responded with "but he seemed so happy". These ladies seem to have this weird belief that they can sense the Betta's mood. The fish could be living in a cup and all scientific, biological and psychological facts would point to them being wrong, but they'll convince themselves that their fish "looks" happy. Most decisions when it comes to what to buy, care, maintenance etc. seem to be made purely on emotional grounds.
The Betta group has about 25k members.

Cats and dogs

In Korea, there are plenty of animal rescue groups, expat adoptions etc. The majority of the time, cats are dogs are being abandoned by female expats. I've read and seen numerous females getting animals as an emotional crutch. Like the Betta fishkeepers, first thing they'll do is get it some "cute" outfits and take a few hundred Instagram pics. When their time in Korea is up, they'll plea for someone to take it or simply abandon it. Along the way, it'll get sick because they fed it whatever shitty food they could conveniently buy around the corner and/or neglect to take it to the vet. With Koreans, I can't tell you how many times I've seen these little dolled up dogs being locked in supermarket lockers or even cars for more than an hour! Get a damn handbag if you want something cute to show off.

Again, I believe men and women are different. When men are going through hard times, they might resort to things like drinking, gambling etc. (many women too). In the case of women, I find that the crutch is to get an animal and "care" for it on some phony emotional level instead of a real business of spending money, cleaning up puke, administering medication, improving one's knowledge, foregoing vacations abroad and if necessary, detaching emotion to make a tough decision in the best interest of the animal etc.

Hopefully, nobody gets too "triggered". I write this for the benefit of animals who can't tell you, "Read a book before adopting me, you damn moron."


  • oglop
  • The Legend

    • 4456

    • August 25, 2011, 07:24:54 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2020, 04:33:37 pm »
people who get a pet and either don't take care of it properly - or end up giving it away/abandoning it - are really, indescribably bad . these are the worst kinds of people








*Edited for language.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 08:30:54 am by kyndo »


  • JNM
  • The Legend

    • 4625

    • January 19, 2015, 10:16:48 am
    • Seoul, South Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2020, 05:12:03 pm »
I think that the maternal instinct drives this somewhat. In our modern life, where women have fewer children later, the instinct to care-give needs to find an outlet.

Unfortunately, many are (often obliviously) as unsuited for pets as they (often knowingly) are for children.

I’ve never heard a man refer to his cats or dogs as “fur-kids”.





Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2020, 05:39:38 pm »
I think that the maternal instinct drives this somewhat. In our modern life, where women have fewer children later, the instinct to care-give needs to find an outlet.

Unfortunately, many are (often obliviously) as unsuited for pets as they (often knowingly) are for children.

I’ve never heard a man refer to his cats or dogs as “fur-kids”.

This was the exact case for a female expat I know well, who now teaches in another country. Her Instagram has about 500+ pics of the 2 cats she adopted in Korea, in various outfits. I have no pictures of my cats on social media, it just seems tacky. During the time she had them, one ran away twice (how you allow a cat to escape from an apartment, without a balcony, is beyond me) One had some medical issues related to poor nutrition and the other was morbidly obese (she seemed happy that her cat was all fat and cute).

After leaving Korea, she went home to dump her cats with a relative, who was struggling financially, before moving teach in another country... where she adopted another cat.


  • JNM
  • The Legend

    • 4625

    • January 19, 2015, 10:16:48 am
    • Seoul, South Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2020, 09:07:31 pm »
... I have no pictures of my cats on social media, it just seems tacky. ...

I know you lift, but do you even cat, bro?

:)

I post dog pics mostly to engage with my female relatives.


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 2116

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • Seogwipo, Jeju Island
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Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2020, 09:15:11 pm »
I haven't seen many acts of kindness toward cats by Korean men. :( Quite the opposite.

All care and attention toward cats I've seen by locals here has been by Korean women.

Expats I have seen all kinds of both genders  over the years.

Back home, we had rabbits, cats, dogs and birds at one point or another and it was my mother and me her son who took care of them, my dad and sister couldn't be bothered.

So, I don't get the gender point regarding cats.

Regarding fish? I dunno. Though the only two people I knew growing up who had big tanks were boys.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2020, 09:56:08 pm by VanIslander »


  • dippedinblush
  • Super Waygook

    • 457

    • November 21, 2013, 11:15:05 am
    • Yangpyeong, South Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2020, 10:54:34 pm »
I once saw a Korean man stomp a cat to death in an alleyway in broad daylight without a care.  I had just gotten off of work and was walking home.  About 50 feet in front of me I saw him stomping something ...and wondered what the hell he was doing...came closer...saw all the cat's brains out, realised that was the stompee.  He just left the carcass there, didn't care at all...

I feel like some men can take their rage out on smaller animals easily, and those, I think are awful people.  My stepfather would often kick our pet cats freely and harshly if they were in his way, pinch their paws too tightly until their paws bust, and try and bend their tails..(we had one really old cat and two kittens).  They were really friendly before he came into town and gradually became meaner and meaner (scratching and biting and hiding).   I think men who hate cats and abuse them see them as women/feminine for some reason and something they can't control.  Men like this need to be lashed, stoned,etc., and then put out to pasture... (and by put out to pasture I mean a shiny bullet shot clean through the brain, just like diseased cattle). 
« Last Edit: June 19, 2020, 12:10:34 am by dippedinblush »


  • VanIslander
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 2116

    • June 02, 2011, 10:12:19 am
    • Seogwipo, Jeju Island
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Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2020, 04:20:54 am »
A man chained his dog behind his pickup truck and as punishment drove it around town until it died. The locals were outraged and the judge gave him an unprecedented six-year jail sentence. When he got out, he and his entire family left town for good. This was back in Canada in the late nineties.


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1364

    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
    • Mouseville
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2020, 05:57:05 am »
people who get a pet and either don't take care of it properly - or end up giving it away/abandoning it - are massive fucking cunts. these are the worst kinds of people

Someone who gives a pet away to another loving, responsible owner, is a member of the group known as "the worst kinds of people"?



  • oglop
  • The Legend

    • 4456

    • August 25, 2011, 07:24:54 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2020, 06:19:25 am »
that's clearly not what i'm saying. clearly


Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2020, 07:28:19 am »
So women are more likely to be bad pet owners because they are women?

In my own personal experience, I can't say I've seen much of a difference in terms of gender when it comes to being a good or bad pet owner. I'd consider myself quite fortunate to have rarely encountered bad pet owners. Maybe men and women care and love for their pets in different ways but I'm not sure that I would agree with the OP that women are more likely to be bad pet owners.


  • Colburnnn
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1183

    • August 10, 2015, 05:52:37 pm
    • South Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2020, 07:40:02 am »
'Cat Guardian' Hahaha...

Aristocrat man, I love you, you have such a way with words.
Haven't you got some pictures of birds to be jacking off to, son?

Colburnnn: Complains a lot, very sassy. Has a loudmouth.


  • stoat
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1803

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:13 pm
    • seoul
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2020, 07:44:31 am »
Yes, 'cat' 'woman' 'Guardian', they kind of naturally go together.  :smiley:


  • 745sticky
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1014

    • March 26, 2020, 01:52:57 pm
    • Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2020, 07:49:44 am »
I don't think its a gendered thing, I think that people who take bad care of themselves typically also take bad care of pets.

"Cat moms" are a good example of this, and animal hoarders are an extreme example.

Then again, there's also people that are just dumb. r/chonkers should probably be shut down for encouraging animal cruelty, there's a lot of people who think it's hilarious that their pet is morbidly obese.


  • Stefaneekaye
  • Veteran

    • 130

    • August 31, 2018, 11:14:30 am
    • Dangjin, South Korea
    more
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2020, 07:58:15 am »
This reeks of some misogynistic crapola.

Quote
Begins by saying not all women. Provides anecdotal stories used to paint women negatively and say they are terrible pet owners. Makes many blanket statements about women as pet owners and their coping mechanisms.

Not "triggered," just honestly kind of astounded at the leaps being made. Here, have another side to it all. All of the most well informed breeders, owners, and herp fans in the herpetology community that I know are women. And the most individuals running rescues for herps that properly take care of each rescue? Women. But my ex-husband treated his 2 snakes terribly, often refused to clean their enclosures, forget to feed them on their regular schedules leaving me to run and get mice for them even before we were married, making sure they had water and their temps were adjusted each season, etc. Obviously my experience means men just get snakes/herps because they think they are cool and don't have intention to properly take care of them/they are just a show piece. #snark

Do you see how that sounds? Has that been my experience as a herp owner? Yes, it has, but I'm not going to make a post as if that is a definitive representation of gender relations with regard to a certain kind of pet owner.

How about we just acknowledge, in general, many people do not know how to properly raise animals. But, and here's the thing, many of those people are going off of the really terribly written materials provided at mega pet stores. "Bearded dragons are easy pets. Feed them these pellets and keep them in this small terrarium." No, absolutely not. They need large spaces, multiple basking spots, and a diet with LOTS of fresh veggies and live protein. "So crickets?" Actually, crickets have a lot chitin and minimal protein. Dubai cockroaches and maintaining your own colony are actually much better feeders. The same reality is applied to betta fish and what many of the pet stores are telling people when they decide to purchase them.

It is not a gender relation that bad pet owners exists everywhere. Grasping at straws just shows your own bias with regard to them.

P.S. the only active pet abusers, I've ever seen were men. Am I going to make leaps to say they are the only ones or that is a solely 'them' coping mechanism? No. Because that is ignorant af. This is solely an outlet for you to woman bash hidden under the guise of interest in the wellbeing of the actual pets.


Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2020, 08:02:50 am »
This thread will likely piss a few people off, but I think it's a topic that needs to be addressed.

Disclaimer, I AM NOT referring to all women or men, simply the majority from what I've seen over the years in various pet forums. There are women who are terrific pet guardians, who have shared expert insight and knowledge.

As an expat, I've made some willing sacrifices to keep 2 cats, a Betta aquarium and a community aquarium. For me, it's worth it and I've made arrangements for the day I decide to leave Korea. I'm going to discuss my experiences as a fishkeeper, cat guardian and general observations.

Fishkeeper

I'm part of a few fishkeeping groups specializing in planted aquariums and Betta fish care. The former is seems to male dominated, about an 80-20 ratio and the latter is the opposite. "High-Tech" planted aquariums require a significant degree of knowledge and can get pretty complicated and nerdy, nevertheless, the vast majority of the guys in these groups go to great lengths to make sure their livestock, and plants, thrive and are cared for; they expand their knowledge, do research, spend money and generally take things seriously as they're aware that they're caring for life forms. The guys are also very open to discussion, critique and criticism. There's a great appreciation for the beauty of the hobby, absolutely, but emotion never seems to override logic, decisions are made based on scientific and biological fact.

In the Betta fishkeeping groups, you have the opposite. As said, the majority of the fishkeepers are female and while their are some extremely knowledgable females in the group, who are as appalled as I am, most are the most moronic idiots alive. First thing most guys seem to do is research. They research the nitrogen cycle, plant species, nutrient requirements etc.
With the majority of females in these groups, they get the "cute" tiny 1gal nano aquarium (animal cruelty to put a Betta in that), stick the Betta in and cram it with neon stones, tacky ornaments and fake plants. They'll post their pictures to the group and other females, too afraid to criticize, will say things like "OMG I love it", "Cute"... as soon as one sensible person tries to suggest they get a bigger tank or "cycle the tank first" or other advice in the best interest of the fish, they'll say things like "But he looks so happy" or complain to admins about being "bullied". This other lady posted a pic of her dead Betta and wanted to know how he died... there was a layer of about 3cm of old food at the bottom of the tank and she responded with "but he seemed so happy". These ladies seem to have this weird belief that they can sense the Betta's mood. The fish could be living in a cup and all scientific, biological and psychological facts would point to them being wrong, but they'll convince themselves that their fish "looks" happy. Most decisions when it comes to what to buy, care, maintenance etc. seem to be made purely on emotional grounds.
The Betta group has about 25k members.

Cats and dogs

In Korea, there are plenty of animal rescue groups, expat adoptions etc. The majority of the time, cats are dogs are being abandoned by female expats. I've read and seen numerous females getting animals as an emotional crutch. Like the Betta fishkeepers, first thing they'll do is get it some "cute" outfits and take a few hundred Instagram pics. When their time in Korea is up, they'll plea for someone to take it or simply abandon it. Along the way, it'll get sick because they fed it whatever shitty food they could conveniently buy around the corner and/or neglect to take it to the vet. With Koreans, I can't tell you how many times I've seen these little dolled up dogs being locked in supermarket lockers or even cars for more than an hour! Get a damn handbag if you want something cute to show off.

Again, I believe men and women are different. When men are going through hard times, they might resort to things like drinking, gambling etc. (many women too). In the case of women, I find that the crutch is to get an animal and "care" for it on some phony emotional level instead of a real business of spending money, cleaning up puke, administering medication, improving one's knowledge, foregoing vacations abroad and if necessary, detaching emotion to make a tough decision in the best interest of the animal etc.

Hopefully, nobody gets too "triggered". I write this for the benefit of animals who can't tell you, "Read a book before adopting me, you damn moron."

I've noticed this as well. Women tend to make the decision to own a pet with more emotion than logic .
More often than not in Korea, women tend to ignore all of the responsibilities, challenges, and  complications that come along with having a pet when making the choice to purchase/ adopt. 
Some do take responsibility and do what needs to be done to raise the animal of choice properly, while others look at it as property, not a living creature.

It's really disappointing to see so little care. It's like adopting a child and then saying, "Well, that was fun for a while. Time for you to go."
Use code CAM7141 get 5% off at iHerb.com


  • 745sticky
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1014

    • March 26, 2020, 01:52:57 pm
    • Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2020, 09:03:16 am »
Sort of on-topic, why are Huskies so popular here? (At least I think I read they were gaining popularity somewhere, idk). They're one of the most difficult breeds to raise, there was a couple who adopted two Huskies back in my old neighborhood (in the US) and they had no clue what they were doing. Constantly getting the leash torn out of their hands and then their dogs would rush at my poor spaniel. Don't adopt difficult breeds if you don't have a clue, goodness gracious.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2020, 09:59:25 am by 745sticky »


  • stoat
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1803

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:13 pm
    • seoul
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2020, 09:12:14 am »
Just on a language issue, isn't 'raising a pet' a form of Asian English like 'taking a rest.? I thought 'raise' could only be used for kids or as a synonym of 'breed.'


  • Colburnnn
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1183

    • August 10, 2015, 05:52:37 pm
    • South Korea
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2020, 09:22:24 am »
Sort of on-topic, why are Huskies so popular here? (At least I think I read they were gaining popularity somewhere, idk). They're one of the most difficult breeds to raise, there was a couple who adopted two Huskies back in my old neighborhood (in the US) and they had no clue what they were doing. Constantly getting the leash teared out of their hands and then their dogs would rush at my poor spaniel. Don't adopt difficult breeds if you don't have a clue, goodness gracious.

Maybe an area thing because in 4 years I've not seen any huskies. Only useless rat dogs, poodles with dodgy haircuts and the occasional lab.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2020, 09:24:28 am by Colburnnn »
Haven't you got some pictures of birds to be jacking off to, son?

Colburnnn: Complains a lot, very sassy. Has a loudmouth.


  • shostager
  • Super Waygook

    • 347

    • November 06, 2012, 06:08:10 am
Re: Men, Women and pets.
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2020, 09:37:20 am »
I wish people in general knew how to take care of the pets that they got. I have 2 guinea pigs, and while I got them sort of spur-of-the-moment, I'd been wanting them for a while, and had done my research. They need a very large space, and hay, not just veggies, and regular exercise time. And a partner, at least - they're social animals and Switzerland even has a law that you can't own just one guinea pig.

When I think about the guinea pigs my family had when I was a kid (and didn't know these things)...makes me a little sad. Also thinking about any guinea pig that gets bought by a kid here (I saw a sign at my local Homeplus that you have to be over 15 or something to buy one). I know that some kids can be responsible, but the fact that they can buy it without a parents' permission is somewhat concerning.