Scapegoating

Quick question.

How do you know, or how will it be regulated, when (for example) a black employer only employs black employees and states this is to repay the black community. When in reality it is because they are racist against all others?

They say it is to help, but in reality it is hate. How do you know that? Blatant racism can be excused using this excuse.

And JEEZ I'm with you on that. But unfortunately it is 2020 and has been shoved in our faces and conversations for a few years now. Glad you are sick of it as much as I am. Would love for everyone to get along but for every one of us there is a race-baiter or an eternal victim.

Quick question.

How do you know, or how will it be regulated, when (for example) a black employer only employs black employees and states this is to repay the black community. When in reality it is because they are racist against all others?

If you have a problem with a successful black man giving back to the black community to help other black people have a chance after
being marginalized, then you are the racist.
When James LeBron (or LeBron James) used his success to build the I Promise School to help mostly black kids who were marginalized
have a brighter future to be what they want to be, President Trump called James LeBron dumb. Why? Because Trump is a racist. You see
it's racist white people that don't want to see black folks be successful or educated. That is one of the reasons why I support black owned
business. Because when black people start up their own business to help out those in the black communities, it gives black people better
hope to rise up and succeed. And you think that's racist? If you think that is racist, then why don't you tell that to the Chinese or the Indians
instead of singling out black people. You think it's OK for Chinese to have their own businesses and hire their own and circulate money in
their own community but when black people advocate it, you call it racist. That is hypocrisy.

They say it is to help, but in reality it is hate. How do you know that? Blatant racism can be excused using this excuse.

And JEEZ I'm with you on that. But unfortunately it is 2020 and has been shoved in our faces and conversations for a few years now. Glad you are sick of it as much as I am. Would love for everyone to get along but for every one of us there is a race-baiter or an eternal victim.

I'm racist because I DONT want people to be discriminated against because of the colour of their skin?

I want EVERYONE to be successful and educated. Black, White, Brown, Yellow, Green, Pink, Orange, Blue and every shade in between. I don't give two flying ones about the thin layer on the outside of your body.

Can you see the difference below?

If you have a problem with a successful black man giving back to the black community to help other black people have a chance after being marginalized,

If you have a problem with a successful man giving back to the community to help other people have a chance after being marginalized,

If you are doing something to help people because they are black, thats wrong. If you are helping them because they are poor, uneducated, need some help in life, fantastic, you're awesome.

So what is wrong with black-owned business?

I'm racist because I DONT want people to be discriminated against because of the colour of their skin?

I want EVERYONE to be successful and educated. Black, White, Brown, Yellow, Green, Pink, Orange, Blue and every shade in between. I don't give two flying ones about the thin layer on the outside of your body.

Can you see the difference below?

If you have a problem with a successful black man giving back to the black community to help other black people have a chance after being marginalized,

If you have a problem with a successful man giving back to the community to help other people have a chance after being marginalized,

If you are doing something to help people because they are black, thats wrong. If you are helping them because they are poor, uneducated, need some help in life, fantastic, you're awesome.

I'm racist because I DONT want people to be discriminated against because of the colour of their skin?

I want EVERYONE to be successful and educated. Black, White, Brown, Yellow, Green, Pink, Orange, Blue and every shade in between. I don't give two flying ones about the thin layer on the outside of your body.

Can you see the difference below?

If you have a problem with a successful black man giving back to the black community to help other black people have a chance after being marginalized,

If you have a problem with a successful man giving back to the community to help other people have a chance after being marginalized,

If you are doing something to help people because they are black, thats wrong. If you are helping them because they are poor, uneducated, need some help in life, fantastic, you're awesome.

So what is wrong with black owned business?
What is wrong with a black community having an economic cushioning to help out members of the black community who are
have been marginalized?
Why would you call it racist for a black community to have its own economic cushioning and you don't call it racist when Chinese
do it?

Nothing. Absolutely nothing is wrong with a black owned business. I've no idea where you have got that from.

If they only provide for, serve, work with other black businesses/clients because they don't like Whites or Asians, then you are being racists. Whom you claim to dislike.

Nothing. Absolutely nothing is wrong with a black owned business. I've no idea where you have got that from.

If they only provide for, serve, work with other black businesses/clients because they don't like Whites or Asians, then you are being racists. Whom you claim to dislike.

I am not advocating segregation.
I am advocating that more black people need to start up businesses to help the black community have an economic
cushioning. But at the same time they cannot serve only black people, but all patrons and be an equal opportunity
employer. Most of all black folks should not spend their money in places were black folks are not respected.

I am not advocating segregation.
I am advocating that more black people need to start up businesses to help the black community have an economic
cushioning. But at the same time they cannot serve only black people, but all patrons and be an equal opportunity
employer. Most of all black folks should not spend their money in places were black folks are not respected.

This is the key thing, IMO.  Money talks. 

Some of my friends will occasionally want to congregate at a certain bar, where the owner was an overtly racist jerk.  I will not go there, because I can choose where I spend my money.

I can understand your frustration, Aristocrat. I'm Irish, so racism and sectarianism are very straightforward to me, given our bloody history of invasion, colonization, and ethno-nationalist conflict. They are bad, don't do 'em. Even if your wives and children have been blown to pieces by the other. Even you are jobless and homeless because of discrimination applied through the other's monopoly of institutional power. There isn't a good enough reason or excuse for discrimination because the consequences can end lives, states, or entire peoples. 

Honestly, I really don't have a structured and formulaic approach to decide whether something or someone is racist or not, I just go by intuition and context.

I'll leave you with this: in many countries in the current year, the charge of racism can be far more damaging to an individual than many criminal charges. If you can't see that "intuition and context' are at best insufficient, at worst extremely dangerous methods of judgement, then the failure to communicate or articulate has been all mine.

and be an equal opportunity
employer.

This is the exact opposite of what you've been arguing for in this thread.

I once came across something that I should have shared from Facebook.
There is a local Chinese restaurant somewhere in Africa (I think it was either in Kenya or
west Africa) that has been established. This Chinese restaurant is a Jim Crow Chinese
restaurant because that restaurant does not serve anyone in the local African population.
And yet these Africans there have not done anything to force this restaurant to stop their
discrimination practice, nor to close it down permanently. How could these Africans let
a Chinese restaurant condone this? If I was the ruler of that particular African country I
would order that Chinese restaurant to be closed permanently and deport the owner(s)
back to China. If that restaurant is still there, then perhaps that would be a good form
of retaliation against some racist Chinese, after their people have wrongfully evicted
Africans in Guangzhou, China for no reason at all all because they are black.

I can understand your frustration, Aristocrat. I'm Irish, so racism and sectarianism are very straightforward to me, given our bloody history of invasion, colonization, and ethno-nationalist conflict. They are bad, don't do 'em. Even if your wives and children have been blown to pieces by the other. Even you are jobless and homeless because of discrimination applied through the other's monopoly of institutional power. There isn't a good enough reason or excuse for discrimination because the consequences can end lives, states, or entire peoples. 

I'll leave you with this: in many countries in the current year, the charge of racism can be far more damaging to an individual than many criminal charges. If you can't see that "intuition and context' are at best insufficient, at worst extremely dangerous methods of judgement, then the failure to communicate or articulate has been all mine.

My job is not in the legal profession nor do I draft laws. There's never been a reason for me to create a watertight definition with 15 clauses.

I'm trying to do my part in giving the bare minimum of my attention the issue. Society is having this problem because everyone is making it a huge deal and either tiptoeing through life or having the race card ready to play at a moments' notice.

Once we all get bored with the racism debate, society will reach the point of seeing a persons' skin colour as nothing more or less than just that, a colour.

 

I once came across something that I should have shared from Facebook.
There is a local Chinese restaurant somewhere in Africa (I think it was either in Kenya or
west Africa) that has been established. This Chinese restaurant is a Jim Crow Chinese
restaurant because that restaurant does not serve anyone in the local African population.
And yet these Africans there have not done anything to force this restaurant to stop their
discrimination practice, nor to close it down permanently. How could these Africans let
a Chinese restaurant condone this? If I was the rule of that particular African country I
would order that Chinese restaurant to be closed permanently and deport the owner(s)
back to China. If that restaurant is still there, then perhaps that would be a good form
of retaliation against some racist Chinese, after their people have wrongfully evicted
Africans in Guangzhou, China for no reason at all all because they are black.

As per my original argument, before Democracy came along, every country was racist to some degree.
China has never been a Democracy, so...

China has always called itself the Middle-Kingdom, they still believe and are taught that they are the promised people and the most superior. Now, yes, many countries had this state sponsored ideology about 200yrs ago. Thing is, China still has it.

Why are the Chinese still in Africa, pillaging resources and poaching? Bribes, plain and simple.
Buy the African dictator a sports car with shinny wheels and he'll sign anything you put in front of him.

What they're doing in China isn't done for "no reason other than they're black", it's carefully planned propaganda:

- The CCP officially declared 0 domestic infections (they lied to placate the people)
- New cases sprung up so either the CCP admits they lied or shifts the blame to foreigners.
- CCP blames blacks and other foreigners for all new cases and escapes blame, as they usually do.

Blacks in China are an easy target.

I'm Irish, so racism and sectarianism are very straightforward to me, given our bloody history of invasion, colonization, and ethno-nationalist conflict. They are bad, don't do 'em

I'm not having a go at you or your personal background, just pointing out that being Irish doesn't automatically confer the status of historical victimhood. Even if you weren't implying that, it's a commonly held belief. My maternal Grandmother was from a protestant family that came over to Ireland in the 17th century and owned land and large houses. There were a lot of familes like that, many of whom fell on bad times, had their houses burned down, inter married with Catholics and joined the ranks of the masses. It'd be a bit weird if her descendents were walking around claiming 800 years of persecution.   

I'm not having a go at you or your personal background, just pointing out that being Irish doesn't automatically confer the status of historical victimhood. Even if you weren't implying that, it's a commonly held belief. My maternal Grandmother was from a protestant family that came over to Ireland in the 17th century and owned land and large houses. There were a lot of familes like that, many of whom fell on bad times or had their houses burned down and joined the ranks of the masses. It'd be a bit weird if her descendents were walking around claiming 800 years of persecution.   

Whoosh

Whoosh

Like I said, not saying you were implying anything, just putting it out there.  Sounding like an Englishman I get the 800 years speech in pubs occasionally over there and it's irritating.

Like I said, not saying you were implying anything, just putting it out there.  Sounding like an Englishman I get the 800 years speech in pubs occasionally over there and it's irritating.

I understand. I'm pretty sure I've posted the following video on this site in response to the usual "Orange men bad! 800 years! yes, we have no potato" cringe. I have no problems with the English, and despise [Irish independence radicals].

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ozEZxOsanY

My job is not in the legal profession nor do I draft laws. There's never been a reason for me to create a watertight definition with 15 clauses.

I'm trying to do my part in giving the bare minimum of my attention the issue. Society is having this problem because everyone is making it a huge deal and either tiptoeing through life or having the race card ready to play at a moments' notice.

Once we all get bored with the racism debate, society will reach the point of seeing a persons' skin colour as nothing more or less than just that, a colour.

I don't know anything about cars, I don't even have a driver's license. You don't see me commenting on any automobile threads for that reason. With respect, if you don't know what you yourself mean by the term "racism", it's probably best to say nothing.

I once came across something that I should have shared from Facebook.
There is a local Chinese restaurant somewhere in Africa (I think it was either in Kenya or
west Africa) that has been established. This Chinese restaurant is a Jim Crow Chinese
restaurant because that restaurant does not serve anyone in the local African population.
And yet these Africans there have not done anything to force this restaurant to stop their
discrimination practice, nor to close it down permanently. How could these Africans let
a Chinese restaurant condone this? If I was the rule of that particular African country I
would order that Chinese restaurant to be closed permanently and deport the owner(s)
back to China. If that restaurant is still there, then perhaps that would be a good form
of retaliation against some racist Chinese, after their people have wrongfully evicted
Africans in Guangzhou, China for no reason at all all because they are black.

Please explain why you continue to format your posts like this.

I once came across something that I should have shared from Facebook. There is a local Chinese restaurant somewhere in Africa (I think it was either in Kenya or west Africa) that has been established. This Chinese restaurant is a Jim Crow Chinese restaurant because that restaurant does not serve anyone in the local African population. And yet these Africans there have not done anything to force this restaurant to stop their discrimination practice, nor to close it down permanently. How could these Africans let a Chinese restaurant condone this? If I was the rule of that particular African country I would order that Chinese restaurant to be closed permanently and deport the owner(s) back to China. If that restaurant is still there, then perhaps that would be a good form of retaliation against some racist Chinese, after their people have wrongfully evicted Africans in Guangzhou, China for no reason at all all because they are black.

This would be perfectly fine.

I don't know anything about cars, I don't even have a driver's license. You don't see me commenting on any automobile threads for that reason. With respect, if you don't know what you yourself mean by the term "racism", it's probably best to say nothing.

It seems you're misunderstanding much of what I'm saying.

I responded to your post which said

I'll leave you with this: in many countries in the current year, the charge of racism can be far more damaging to an individual than many criminal charges. If you can't see that "intuition and context' are at best insufficient, at worst extremely dangerous methods of judgement, then the failure to communicate or articulate has been all mine.

What I got from that is that you're concerned that an objective legal definition of racism needs to be agreed upon and passed into law to prevent people from ruining the lives of others, by taking advantage of the system.

So...I responded to your concerns by stating that I have no legal authority, expertise or need to draft a legal definition of the term racism. You also mentioned "judgement", since you're harping about litigious issues, criminal records etc. I take it the judgement you're referring to as that of a judge or jury. Again, I am neither. Do you have any idea what it takes to draft and pass a law or legal definition?

Furthermore, a charge of racism is HIGHLY dependent on context which is why an objective definition of racism is difficult to create.

Since this thread is 3 pages long already and people are arguing, you can already see that an objective definition is not easy to agree upon, which is why I think my intuitive and contextual judgement of racism works just fine for me. If I'm starting a business and am concerned about doing anything that could invite a lawsuit, I'll first consult a professional.

If you're not satisfied with the answers I give, ask different questions and please, don't say "with respect" and then go on to suggest I don't know what racism is. Every person here is aware of racism, the fact that you're making a bit of a scene because their understanding might differ from yours is somewhat arrogant.