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Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2020, 10:52:55 am »
That's just how they roll hereabouts.

What a screwed up society!!!
That industriousness that leads to some questionable stuff like this is why South Korea was also able to transform itself from a wartorn country, the poorest on Earth, into a developed country with incredible rapidity and uplift its people despite virtually no natural resources. It's why the trains run on time here. It's why your packages are often delivered the next day. It's why you get your driver's license issued within 2 hours of completing the test. It's why taxis are cheap and you can get virtually anything delivered.

Some people here just don't grasp that these things are often linked and they lead to benefits and costs that often tend to balance each other out in comparison to other systems and often make sense given a place's particular situation.


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

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    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
    • Mouseville
Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2020, 10:59:02 am »
That's just how they roll hereabouts.

What a screwed up society!!!
That industriousness that leads to some questionable stuff like this is why South Korea was also able to transform itself from a wartorn country, the poorest on Earth, into a developed country with incredible rapidity and uplift its people despite virtually no natural resources. It's why the trains run on time here. It's why your packages are often delivered the next day. It's why you get your driver's license issued within 2 hours of completing the test. It's why taxis are cheap and you can get virtually anything delivered.

Some people here just don't grasp that these things are often linked and they lead to benefits and costs that often tend to balance each other out in comparison to other systems and often make sense given a place's particular situation.

Trains running, public works.. vs....some little shit-shack private hagwon.

OK, Doc....go on. 



Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2020, 10:59:49 am »
It's probably also why the suicide rate is one of the highest in the world. Also the thousands of people that came here and died and the millions given in aid might also have a little to do with the way things turned out as well. It doesn't diminish the past but it's dishonest to frame things as if Koreans just picked themselves up by sheer will. it's a nice story but history would disagree.  If anything this relentless work culture is what is holding society back from being enjoyable to most people.


  • confusedsafferinkorea
  • Waygook Lord

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Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2020, 11:03:00 am »
That's just how they roll hereabouts.

What a screwed up society!!!
That industriousness that leads to some questionable stuff like this is why South Korea was also able to transform itself from a wartorn country, the poorest on Earth, into a developed country with incredible rapidity and uplift its people despite virtually no natural resources. It's why the trains run on time here. It's why your packages are often delivered the next day. It's why you get your driver's license issued within 2 hours of completing the test. It's why taxis are cheap and you can get virtually anything delivered.

Some people here just don't grasp that these things are often linked and they lead to benefits and costs that often tend to balance each other out in comparison to other systems and often make sense given a place's particular situation.

You can be industrious without being inhumane, DM. Some treatment meted out in Korea is just plain inhumane. I remember a thread here a while back where someone was actually admitted to hospital, broken leg or something (can't remember the exact details, but it warranted a stay in hospital) and teachers pitched up at the hospital and demanded the person leave and come back to work.

This 'I am so busy' nonsense is just for appearances, most of the time they are procrastinating.

By the way, as I understand it, Korea achieved 'the miracle on the Han' with a lot of help from the US, so don't be too quick to blow their trumpet and make it sound like they did all off their own bat.

I guess you are going to get all bent out of shape now, but whatever........... .............
There is no known medical cure for stupidity!


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2020, 11:08:50 am »
It's probably also why the suicide rate is one of the highest in the world. Also the thousands of people that came here and died and the millions given in aid might also have a little to do with the way things turned out as well. It doesn't diminish the past but it's dishonest to frame things as if Koreans just picked themselves up by sheer will. it's a nice story but history would disagree. 
Yup, it has its cost in suicide rate, but also has an incredibly low public violent crime rate and drug OD rate. Yes, lots of people came here and helped. That happened in a lot of countries. Our of all the countries that have received aid, relative to where they began, Korea had tremendous success. I think history would give the overwhelming credit to Korea's success post-War to Koreans themselves.

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If anything this relentless work culture is what is holding society back from being enjoyable to most people.
Spoken like someone who thinks leisure is the most important thing in the world and has never known true scarcity and poverty. Given the lack of natural resources, they really can't afford to ever be laid back. Sure go be more laid back like some other people. And have the problems those laid back societies tend to have in terms of standards of living and instability. Of course to westerners who believe Asia and Asians exist simply to amuse them and make their lives easier, that might be preferable.


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2020, 11:14:28 am »
You can be industrious without being inhumane, DM. Some treatment meted out in Korea is just plain inhumane. I remember a thread here a while back where someone was actually admitted to hospital, broken leg or something (can't remember the exact details, but it warranted a stay in hospital) and teachers pitched up at the hospital and demanded the person leave and come back to work.
Like I said- difference between broken bones and being "sick" or even sick.

However, it's been my experience that those who are told to get to work are those who have shown signs of goldbrickery. Those who people accept as having worked hard and delivered generally are given leave.

Have you ever managed employees before? Have you never dealt with employees who are chronically "sick" and seemingly always having minor injuries which require them to not come into work?

Quote
By the way, as I understand it, Korea achieved 'the miracle on the Han' with a lot of help from the US
Independence with a lot of help from the US. The modernization and development? That was mostly them. US helped with security, which was massive, to be sure. But then again, the same could be said of Western Europe.


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

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Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2020, 11:25:19 am »
Quote
However, it's been my experience that those who are told to get to work are those who have shown signs of goldbrickery. Those who people accept as having worked hard and delivered generally are given leave

Who here, has been talking about the differences between having to be told to work vs knowing when it is time to work and doing so?

How are  youable to create magical crap?  Someone once called you out as being a liar....I am beginning to wonder how much truth there is in that because I have a hard time believing that you, would actually stand by the things you are writing, as of now. 

Can you help us out here? 
« Last Edit: January 16, 2020, 11:29:58 am by NorthStar »


  • Colburnnn
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1183

    • August 10, 2015, 05:52:37 pm
    • South Korea
Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #27 on: January 16, 2020, 11:26:16 am »
Not everyone feels the same way when they get sick. It doesn't bother some people, but others are wiped out for a few days. Unless you have your doctor qualification on hand, I'd suggest we can all decide for ourselves if we are sick or not. We don't need school or Mr.Demartino to sign off on it.
Haven't you got some pictures of birds to be jacking off to, son?

Colburnnn: Complains a lot, very sassy. Has a loudmouth.


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #28 on: January 16, 2020, 11:35:59 am »
Not everyone feels the same way when they get sick. It doesn't bother some people, but others are wiped out for a few days. Unless you have your doctor qualification on hand, I'd suggest we can all decide for ourselves if we are sick or not. We don't need school or Mr.Demartino to sign off on it.
There is some of that. There is also the fact that sometimes those that are "wiped out" are actually lacking motivation. Promise them sex or tons of money and suddenly they aren't so wiped out. But agreed there are those that you could dangle a million dollars across the room and they're so wiped out and in a fevered state that they wouldn't even care. Then again, if that's you, elementary school education might not be the right field for you without a battery of flu shots and other preventative measures.

Quote
Who here, has been talking about the differences between having to be told to work vs knowing when it is time to work and doing so?
Huh? I'm just saying that when you're managing employees, some employees develop a reputation as lazy shirkers who employ constant excuses for missing work and their claims of illness lose credibility. Hence why some employers might demand they get their butts back to work and out of bed/the hospital.


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1364

    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
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Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2020, 11:37:58 am »
Quote
Huh? I'm just saying that when you're managing employees, some employees develop a reputation as lazy shirkers who employ constant excuses for missing work and their claims of illness lose credibility. Hence why some employers might demand they get their butts back to work and out of bed/the hospital.

No, you are purposely infusing irrelevant topics, in order to give yourself something to talk about. 


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2020, 11:43:14 am »
No, you are purposely infusing irrelevant topics, in order to give yourself something to talk about. 
No, I'm saying that one reason an employer MIGHT be strict on sick days and sick policy is because an employee has developed a reputation for sloth. And that's something to consider. We're only getting one side here.

I'm speaking on theoretical grounds. For all we know boss is a dick and the employee is John Henry. But then again the boss could be really nice and the employee could be coming up with constant excuses.

EDIT: I didn't know it was you. All I saw was "Rant Over" and what was obviously a deleted account of something.

I'm just speaking on the phenomenon in general. Without your story I can't comment on specifics.


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1364

    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
    • Mouseville
Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #31 on: January 16, 2020, 11:45:04 am »
No, you are purposely infusing irrelevant topics, in order to give yourself something to talk about. 
No, I'm saying that one reason an employer MIGHT be strict on sick days and sick policy is because an employee has developed a reputation for sloth. And that's something to consider. We're only getting one side here.

I'm speaking on theoretical grounds. For all we know boss is a dick and the employee is John Henry. But then again the boss could be really nice and the employee could be coming up with constant excuses.

EDIT: I didn't know it was you. All I saw was "Rant Over" and what was obviously a deleted account of something.

I'm just speaking on the phenomenon in general. Without your story I can't comment on specifics.

No, Doc...you are infusing nonsense. 


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2020, 11:48:40 am »
No, Doc...you are infusing nonsense. 
Dude, I'm talking about why, using my experience as a former manager, why bosses sometimes tell employees to get to work even if they are sick. Just because it doesn't 100% agree with your view doesn't make it nonsense. It is simply one explanation that may or may not apply in your case.


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #33 on: January 16, 2020, 11:49:56 am »
no point in trying to reason with him. He is suoer conservative and will defend the exploitation of the workers and he thinks money and status is above health and well being. look at the way he downplays leisure time. As if you aren't contributing to profit you are useless. Conservative boomer mentality right there.


  • OnNut81
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1349

    • April 01, 2011, 03:01:41 pm
    • Anyang
Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #34 on: January 16, 2020, 11:56:19 am »
NorthStar, for all that agreeing and backing up of Hangook77 on that thread about standing up to recruiters and our power to change the wages, you certainly caved pretty quickly.  Yes, the wolves were at the door but did you need to take a job that puts us all back decades when you were all over people accepting 2.1 affecting job prospects?  Hangook77 won't be too quick to accept your next endorsement, I bet.  Take your sick day and let us know if there are any fireworks as a result.  46 classes a week?  They'll have trouble getting a live body to replace you.  Use that as leverage if you're thinking of re-signing. 


DeMartino:  Of course to westerners who believe Asia and Asians exist simply to amuse them and make their lives easier, that might be preferable.

And that, in a nutshell, is the mindset that has lead to 7000+ posts. 



Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2020, 12:04:56 pm »
no point in trying to reason with him. He is suoer conservative and will defend the exploitation of the workers and he thinks money and status is above health and well being. look at the way he downplays leisure time. As if you aren't contributing to profit you are useless. Conservative boomer mentality right there.
You know who thinks money and status aren't important? Someone who has never had to worry about them. Someone who has never lived through a true depression. Someone who has never lived in a situation where your level of survival and prosperity literally depends on how much you are capable of working. That's not to say that's an ideal system, just before you go and trash that mentality, stop and think about the fact that this isn't how it's always been and it doesn't apply everywhere.

Have you ever been in charge of employees before in your life? You do realize that they exploit things just as much as the owner tries to. It's a constant back and forth struggle. The owner with their miserliness and chisling. The employees with the theft and laziness and scams.

Have you ever read the story of the Grasshopper and the Ant?


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

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    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
    • Mouseville
Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2020, 12:08:43 pm »
NorthStar, for all that agreeing and backing up of Hangook77 on that thread about standing up to recruiters and our power to change the wages, you certainly caved pretty quickly.  Yes, the wolves were at the door but did you need to take a job that puts us all back decades when you were all over people accepting 2.1 affecting job prospects?  Hangook77 won't be too quick to accept your next endorsement, I bet.  Take your sick day and let us know if there are any fireworks as a result.  46 classes a week?  They'll have trouble getting a live body to replace you.  Use that as leverage if you're thinking of re-signing. 


DeMartino:  Of course to westerners who believe Asia and Asians exist simply to amuse them and make their lives easier, that might be preferable.

And that, in a nutshell, is the mindset that has lead to 7000+ posts. 




It is all about vantage point.  I can roll with what you are saying....and you are justified in calling me out on it.  I do recall though, using the word "desperate" once or twice, when it comes to accepting a job that is....what it is.  My rants and support of Hanngook are geared for those who have a better vantage point, who had/have time to make a solid choice and are not pressed by other circumstances.   

But again, you are right to call me out on that.


Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2020, 12:10:12 pm »
And that, in a nutshell, is the mindset that has lead to 7000+ posts.
Ever notice that the people who so easily accept Korean bigotry and dehumanization as an explanation utterly refuse to accept that such a thing happens the other way around.

Koreans are petty little hobbits..there are experts at the cowards" game of passive aggressiveness. 

Can you imagine if Koreans posted something like this about foreigners? Or someone else here said that about any other ethnic/racial group?

But no, there's no subtly, unconscious prejudice out there amongst us. None at all.


  • confusedsafferinkorea
  • Waygook Lord

    • 5517

    • October 08, 2010, 01:02:32 pm
    • Zhubei, Hsinchu Province, Taiwan
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Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #38 on: January 16, 2020, 12:10:41 pm »
DeMartino:  Of course to westerners who believe Asia and Asians exist simply to amuse them and make their lives easier, that might be preferable.

You have the biggest chip on your shoulder I have ever encountered.  By the way, I have tons of management experience and I was always sympathetic to those who were sick. The ones that acted sick, got called into my office and we sorted the problem out, without having to tar everyone with the same brush.
There is no known medical cure for stupidity!


  • NorthStar
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1364

    • July 05, 2017, 10:54:06 am
    • Mouseville
Re: .."sick day".
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2020, 12:13:45 pm »
And that, in a nutshell, is the mindset that has lead to 7000+ posts.
Ever notice that the people who so easily accept Korean bigotry and dehumanization as an explanation utterly refuse to accept that such a thing happens the other way around.

Koreans are petty little hobbits..there are experts at the cowards" game of passive aggressiveness. 

Can you imagine if Koreans posted something like this about foreigners? Or someone else here said that about any other ethnic/racial group?

But no, there's no subtly, unconscious prejudice out there amongst us. None at all.

Start another thread on that...we can discuss it there.