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  • LIC
  • Super Waygook

    • 468

    • February 15, 2019, 04:39:00 pm
    • NE Hemisphere
Global warming and kids
« on: September 27, 2019, 10:22:40 am »
First, I don't swallow the media's narrative entirely regarding the global warming issue. The world is warming up, that's undeniable. I've seen the differences in winters from my childhood to now. Humans are part of the problem but I don't believe all of it. The planet heats up and cools down and there's plenty of arguments for both sides from folks with all kinds of alphabet soup after their names.

Second, until India and China are fully on-board, all the machinations of the West are moot.

That's not what this is about. This is about all the screamers, the young people going on and demanding change, blaming the older generation for ruining the planet, denigrating the leaders of governments and big business for destroying what we have and killing the world for future generations as well as the their own generation.

And then.....they all get married and have kids who are destined, by their own thoughts and hyperbole, to grow up on a dead and or dying planet.

I don't get that at all.

Here's some advice. Don't have kids! Save yourself the aggravation. No matter what happens, the world ain't dying in the next 100 years and you'll be gone by then.

And believe it or not, one second after you die, you don't care anymore. So, stop pretending it's possible.


Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2019, 10:41:39 am »
oh no! young people demanding change? blaming the older generation, too? this must be the first time in history that anyone has been so brazen! i'm sure your great and proud generation never blamed or complained at all...

but i guess the times, they are a-changin'

my man, you sound like someone who happily has one foot in the grave. cool for you, but the rest of us don't want to deal with what you're leaving behind.


  • zola
  • The Legend

    • 2874

    • September 30, 2012, 06:56:11 am
    • Korea
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2019, 10:44:05 am »
lol

Hoping LIC is a troll and not just the sad, angry old boomer that he comes across as on here.
Kpip! - Martin 2018


  • Datasapien
  • Super Waygook

    • 443

    • February 04, 2012, 09:36:25 pm
    • Chungcheongbuk-do
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Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2019, 10:46:09 am »
I'm sure many will choose to not have kids because of global warming. And Earth does go through periods of climate change but these are over thousands of years, not decades. The evidence points towards man-made climate change and with current trends it looks to be quite catastrophic. But even if climate change isn't entirely man-made, shouldn't we be doing what we can to prevent the climate from deteriorating anyway?
"A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man." - Jebediah Springfield.


  • stoat
  • Super Waygook

    • 423

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:13 pm
    • seoul
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2019, 11:39:04 am »
People generally have kids or don't have kids for selfish reasons. Either to give more meaning to their life in the first case, or to keep more of their freedom and money in the second. I don't buy that there are loads of people going round piously sacrificing their future fulfillment for the sake of the planet. People who don't want to have kids anyway are just using it as an excuse to virtue signal.


  • Aristocrat
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1949

    • November 10, 2014, 01:04:27 pm
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2019, 12:06:54 pm »
First, I don't swallow the media's narrative entirely regarding the global warming issue. The world is warming up, that's undeniable. I've seen the differences in winters from my childhood to now.

I agree, we've only really been measuring Earth's temperature for what? 150yrs. The planet regulates itself in cycles and a few centuries are s tiny part of the cycle's bell-curve. I do believe humans have an impact on the environment necessary for us to survive, but I too am not prepared to swallow all this hysteria without thinking.

Second, until India and China are fully on-board, all the machinations of the West are moot.

India and China don't pollute for fun, they're manufacturing hubs for the rest of the world. If the West was serious about the environment, they'd put restrictions on companies like H&M and Zara for pushing the fast-fashion crisis. Look in any young urbanites women's wardrobe and you'll find 30 dresses, many of which she's worn twice and many of which she'll throw out next year to buy 30 more. At $15 a pop, she can afford it. To sell a dress so cheaply, cotton growth needs to be accelerated and a cheap workforce is required (China and India). Same thing with pretty much everything we own, that $1 'Made in China' pen you bought because you couldn't be bothered to make sure you didn't lose the last one.

It's counter-intuitive, but people need to stop buying cheap crap! Buy a good pen, don't lose the bloody thing, refill it and use it for the next 10yrs. Buy good shoes, resole them, clean them and likewise, wear them for years. All that cheap junk you ultimately throw away will almost certainly find it's way into the ocean.

If you really want someone to blame, blame the Clinton administration for allowing China into the WTO during the 90s and allowing them to sell their crap around the world with reduced tariffs so nobody could compete with their prices.

And then.....they all get married and have kids who are destined, by their own thoughts and hyperbole, to grow up on a dead and or dying planet.

I don't get that at all.

Here's some advice. Don't have kids! Save yourself the aggravation. No matter what happens, the world ain't dying in the next 100 years and you'll be gone by then.

And believe it or not, one second after you die, you don't care anymore. So, stop pretending it's possible.

For a man who claims he won't give a hoot after he's dead, you certainly go out of your way to tell people what to do.

Not everyone shares your beliefs and some people believe life is about more than just making sure your own little patch is clean and pretty while you're alive. Some people actually do believe in leaving a better place for future generations.
Either way, you said
I don't get that at all.

Right... so, you're not really in a position to preach to others when you can only see things from your point of view.

It's only the simple-minded who think the problem lies in too many kids. How much good do you think 1000 new green farmers, teachers, engineers and geologists could do? Every new birth could potentially be the next Mandela, a scientist responsible for a breakthrough in renewable energy or a politician truly devoted to good. Don't be so quick to think of humans as nothing more than consumers. People do not simply possess the power to slow down the damage they've done to the environment, but completely reverse it.

Either way, do you REALLY think there exists an effective way to convince or force 8 billion people to stop having kids?
Force people to stop having kids? Do you want to start The Apocalypse?

Divisiveness is the real problem, nothing will happen as long as people keep splitting themselves into groups and blaming the next cohort. I don't know if humanity will be able to save itself, but I really don't think being bitter, cynical and nihilistic
or negative is going to help anyone or myself during whatever amount of time I and humanity has left on this beautiful planet.


« Last Edit: September 27, 2019, 12:09:38 pm by Aristocrat »


  • Datasapien
  • Super Waygook

    • 443

    • February 04, 2012, 09:36:25 pm
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Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2019, 12:09:53 pm »
People generally have kids or don't have kids for selfish reasons. Either to give more meaning to their life in the first case, or to keep more of their freedom and money in the second. I don't buy that there are loads of people going round piously sacrificing their future fulfillment for the sake of the planet. People who don't want to have kids anyway are just using it as an excuse to virtue signal.

I read that during the Cold War many (some?) young people were reluctant to have kids because of the threat of nuclear war, and I don't think this is any different. The threat of collapsing ecosystems caused by climate change and the potential wars / famines / droughts / mass migrations that can go along with it is enough to make people (myself included tbh) doubt whether having kids is such a good idea or not. The future is looking bleak m8  :-[
"A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man." - Jebediah Springfield.


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5386

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2019, 12:40:34 pm »
First, I don't swallow the media's narrative entirely regarding the global warming issue.
I agree, we've only really been measuring Earth's temperature for what? 150yrs. The planet regulates itself in cycles and a few centuries are s tiny part of the cycle's bell-curve. I do believe humans have an impact on the environment necessary for us to survive, but I too am not prepared to swallow all this hysteria without thinking.

     I majored in Geomorphology and Climatology, and a lot of what we studied (and did out in the field) was how to look at proxies in order to determine past environmental conditions. There is a lot of this proxy info. I mean, there is an absurd amount of it. Tonnes and tonnes and tonnes of it.
     While we've only been directly measuring global climates for about 150 years (and one can argue that we've been doing it for a lot longer: there are some very detailed written meteorological records coming from a multitude of different sources from long long before the mid 1800s), looking at proxies we can make fairly accurate plots of global and even regional climates going back hundreds of millions of years.

    While the planet has been a lot hotter, the current issue is the speed at which things are heating up. Aside from massive cataclysms, global 1 degree temperature shifts in less than 200 years is unprecedented. For context, most of the ice-ages and their interstitial periods involved far more gradual temperature shifts.
    What with our current situation, ecosystems can't self regulate fast enough. The more sensitive ones have already failed. Without some kind of brake on the source of our current climate change, more will fail, and folks are worried about where the resulting failure cascade will take us --  the Venusian atmosphere was once very Earth-like, as was the one in Mars.

    Not to say that we're gonna end up with daily highs of 500C with a moderate chance of hydrogen sulfide showers interrupting our day at the beach (of a supercritical CO2 sea), but... bring an umbrella?  :smiley:


I was all set to argue LIC's post point for point, but Aristocat beat me to most of 'em.  :sad:
 
« Last Edit: September 27, 2019, 01:03:28 pm by kyndo »


Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2019, 12:57:22 pm »
Some right and left climate change points trashed

On the right-
1) Climate scientists aren't measuring/aware that of the sun being hotter. How dumb do you have to be to believe that?
2) It's all a conspiracy to give us one world government! Really? The least prioritized issue by voters is part of a conspiracy? Oh no, they've made my car not have leaded gasoline- conspiracy!
3) It's an academic conspiracy. Have you ever dealt with academia? What a collection of jealous, catty people. They'll gladly tear someone down in a heartbeat and can't wait to trash someone's paper. If there are flaws in a paper, there are 500 scientists who would delight in pointing them out.

On the left (going to be a little longer because there's a massive blind spot here)-
1) Your opinion is scientific. No it isn't. Not for 99.5% of people. If your opinion was scientific I could bombard you with questions about climate patterns and you could give me data points (or at a bare minimum, cite specific studies), and discuss peer-reviewed papers and thoroughly explain them. You can't. Sure you can do some google-fu and pull up one to give some talking points, but that's not science. Your opinion is based off of deference to authority/sources.  Heck, without googling, can any of you even name the most accurate climate model for this century?  Probably not.

It's a lot like Brexit. Remainers constantly say Brexit voters were uninformed or didn't know what they're voting for. Perhaps, but go and ask a Remainer to explain the European Union system of government and how lows are created and passed and 95% of them can't do that. That's just as ignorant.

2) Kids know what they're talking about. Kids and teenagers are the least-experienced, most hormonally-motivated, most-impulsive, most-risk taking, worst-judgment, most responsive to peer-pressure, most influenced by advertising and imagery, least-responsible segment of the population. For every nerd in his garage who goes on to start a tech company there are 10 million idiots.
3) Climate scientists say X, therefore everything about climate must be true and is scientifically backed. The problem with this is that it is such a multi-disciplinary issue. In addition to the climate and geological effects, you also have biological effects. Then you also have economic effects to examine. Then you have to consider engineering questions (nuclear power). And what is engineering but applied physics and chemistry? And with computers doing everything, well computer scientists are going to have to come in.

For both sides-
1) There's one model of climate change. No there isn't and you can't reject or support everything that's on one side or another. For the skeptics- Greta is not every climate change advocate. Don't reject the entire science because of one extremist. And for the climate change advocates- Just because people reject one person, doesn't mean they reject global warming as a whole.

For example, my view is that global warming is real and a significant part is driven by people. I think this will lead to desertification and conflicts over water and migrations and so on. What I don't believe is that an increase of 1.5/2.5/or even 4.5 will be a disaster. Why? Because +4.5 takes us back 20 million years ago to when apes first evolved and megafauna roamed the Earth. Most modern species were already well on their way to reaching their current form. If you believe that people are doomed under such conditions, you're an idiot. Kyndo mentions the speed, but if most florae and faunae have existed through that 4.5 degree shift in one direction, then they can likely handle it in the reverse direction. Granted this was over an extended time, but it suggests that they are robust enough to handle that degree of variation, potentially even in a short period. That's not to say there won't be any severe changes in certain areas, but "End Times" is probably a bit much.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2019, 01:32:29 pm by kyndo »


  • stoat
  • Super Waygook

    • 423

    • March 05, 2019, 06:36:13 pm
    • seoul
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #9 on: September 27, 2019, 01:18:44 pm »
People generally have kids or don't have kids for selfish reasons. Either to give more meaning to their life in the first case, or to keep more of their freedom and money in the second. I don't buy that there are loads of people going round piously sacrificing their future fulfillment for the sake of the planet. People who don't want to have kids anyway are just using it as an excuse to virtue signal.

I read that during the Cold War many (some?) young people were reluctant to have kids because of the threat of nuclear war, and I don't think this is any different. The threat of collapsing ecosystems caused by climate change and the potential wars / famines / droughts / mass migrations that can go along with it is enough to make people (myself included tbh) doubt whether having kids is such a good idea or not. The future is looking bleak m8  :-[

Yes but when in history hasn't there been a potential crisis looming over the horizon that could affect your future kids?  I could understand people saying they didn't want to have kids in the past when there was a 30% infant mortality rate and mothers frequently died in childbirth, but nowadays when standard of living, health and life expectancy are the highest ever?


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5386

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2019, 01:44:58 pm »
Some right and left climate change points trashed

On the right-
1) Climate scientists aren't measuring/aware that of the sun being hotter. How dumb do you have to be to believe that?

     Just FYI:
     The sun *IS* getting hotter. Sol is in its 'main sequence' phase, and is getting about 1% brighter every 100 million years or so. This means that Sol is about 2.5% brighter (and warmer) than it was for our dino buddies, and about 20% brighter (and warmer) than when life first started. I mean, it's not super relevant to our current global warming situation, but...  :smiley:

On the left (going to be a little longer because there's a massive blind spot here)-
1) Your opinion is scientific. No it isn't. Not for 99.5% of people. If your opinion was scientific I could bombard you with questions about climate patterns and you could give me data points (or at a bare minimum, cite specific studies), and discuss peer-reviewed papers and thoroughly explain them. You can't. Sure you can do some google-fu and pull up one to give some talking points, but that's not science. Your opinion is based off of deference to authority/sources.  Heck, without googling, can any of you even name the most accurate climate model for this century?  Probably not.

       Wait, just because I haven't published original research, my opinions are unscientific? Just because I can't answer every question directed to me without referencing the internet they're not valid?
 That's dumb. My opinions are hella scientific! ;D
  As long as one can back their opinions up with credible sources and/or research, then they should be free to call them scientific. But that's just my (scientific) opinion.

   But yeah, definitely do the research before buying into a stance.

What I don't believe is that an increase of 1.5/2.5/or even 4.5 will be a disaster. Why? Because +4.5 takes us back 20 million years ago to when apes first evolved and megafauna roamed the Earth. Most modern species were already well on their way to reaching their current form. If you believe that people are doomed under such conditions, you're an idiot. Kyndo mentions the speed, but if most flora and fauna have existed through that 4.5 degree shift in one direction, then they can likely handle it in the reverse direction. Granted this was over an extended time, but it suggests that they are robust enough to handle that degree of variation, potentially even in a short period. That's not to say there won't be any severe changes in certain areas, but "End Times" is probably a bit much.

   
     Many of those past climate changes resulted in total ecological devastation.
     The Permian–Triassic transition, for example,  involved the extinction of more than 96% of all extant species. Just because life might go on doesn't mean that it'll be in a form that you or I would benefit from... or even recognize. Also, statistically speaking, larger, more complex species (like say, the square-lipped rhinoceros or us talking monkeys) are far likelier to kick the bucket than smaller, less complex species (like, say, blue-green algae or cockroaches).
     
      Ecosystem collapse isn't some nebulous theory.
     Dead zones are popping up due to industrial excess. Desertification due to poorly managed grazing is rampant.  Several important ecosystems are already failing / have already failed: Coral-reefs all across the world are dying due to ocean acidification (caused by, among other things, rapid shifts in atmospheric CO2). Tropical rainforests, estimated to be home for over 50% of all terrestrial species, have diminished from 14% global coverage (100 years ago) to only around 5-6% presently. They continue to disappear at an accelerating rate.
    People might scoff, but they only do so because they just can't internalize the fact that the changes they are seeing are blindingly quick. 200 years is an absolute *blip* when talking about things like ecosystem distribution and changes in climates. Things are a-changin', and they're happening right quick. Too quick.

    When people talk about the "End-times", what they're really talking about is the end of *our* world.
    Life will go on. We might --possibly even probably -- won't.  :undecided:
« Last Edit: September 27, 2019, 02:23:44 pm by kyndo »


Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2019, 01:56:16 pm »
The sun *IS* getting hotter. Sol is in its 'main sequence' phase...

bro bro broooooooooo. you had it right the first time. THE sun is THE star at the center of THE solar system. none of this "sol" business. next you're gonna start calling earth "terra" or some noooooooooooonsense. i'm sorry but i just can't deal with that


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5386

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #12 on: September 27, 2019, 01:59:29 pm »
oooooo. you had it right the first time. THE sun is THE star at the center of THE solar system. none of this "sol" business. next you're gonna start calling earth "terra" or some noooooooooooonsense. i'm sorry but i just can't deal with that


Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #13 on: September 27, 2019, 02:31:27 pm »
Wait, just because I haven't published original research, my opinions are unscientific? Just because I can't answer every question directed to me without referencing the internet they're not valid?
 That's dumb. My opinions are hella scientific! ;D
Not that level, but at least have some relevant data. I mean the average climate change supporter can't even say what average temperature the Earth is now, what the projections are, what past temperatures were, nor cite any relevant studies. It's just a glorified form of the statement "I believe science". That's not an opinion based on science, but on authority. Now we accept things based on authority for all sorts of scientifically-based matters (say, how a car works, or that Malaria can kill you) but we usually aren't advocating for any sort of policy, let alone drastic policy.

Quote
Ecosystem collapse isn't some nebulous theory.
     Dead zones are popping up due to industrial excess. Desertification due to poorly managed grazing is rampant.  Several important ecosystems are already failing / have already failed: Coral-reefs all across the world are dying due to ocean acidification (caused by, among other things, rapid shifts in atmospheric CO2). Tropical rainforests, estimated to be home for over 50% of all terrestrial species, have diminished from 14% global coverage (100 years ago) to only around 5-6% presently. They continue to disappear at an accelerating rate.
I agree on species and ecosystem collapse due to environmental factors caused by human activity, but not all of those are tied specifically to global warming. They are correlated to activity which might well be contributing to global warming, but they themselves don't prove that global warming will result in devastation to life. For example, global warming leading to desertification will devastate those ecosystems, but there will also be stretches of the Earth which are more conducive to a greater variety of life as the planet warms.

This is before we even get to policy on what to do about it and what solutions we may develop through tech.


Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2019, 02:38:42 pm »
When people talk about the "End-times", what they're really talking about is the end of *our* world.
Life will go on. We might --possibly even probably -- won't.  :undecided:

Great, thanks for ruining my weekend Buzz Killington.

  :cry:


  • LIC
  • Super Waygook

    • 468

    • February 15, 2019, 04:39:00 pm
    • NE Hemisphere
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2019, 03:15:48 pm »
Homo Sapiens will become extinct, just like every other species sooner or later has, or will.

There is nothing we can do that will destroy earth, just the infestations living on it. I'm okay with that. I'm not a doomsayer as some suggest. I am older and I am cynical. The only thing I believe without question that comes out of the media is sports scores, and even then there's the chance of rigged games.

My point was simple. If person A is screaming about global warming and how the holocaust is coming then they pump out a bunch of kids, I have to ask why? Why would someone with purposeful aforethought, choose to procreate into a system they are convinced is doomed in the near future?

As to the geomorphology thing. It was my minor in university. I love the subject, geography and geology too. I may not be as on the ball as dude above, but I ain't no dummy!


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5386

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2019, 03:18:11 pm »
We accept things based on authority for all sorts of scientifically-based matters (say, how a car works, or that Malaria can kill you) but we usually aren't advocating for any sort of policy, let alone drastic policy.

   But that's exactly the problem. The people implementing policies aren't even bothering to check with said authorities. Or if they are, they're choosing to ignore the message for political expediency.
   I totally agree that people should do their own research, but how can we direct people's attention to the need for that research? By shotgunning the message everywhere they're liable to look. A lot of the crap on FB is pretty alarmist and I agree that the exaggeration -- or even the misrepresentation -- of facts can really be counter-productive. On the other hand, it does promote awareness, which is the first step in the process of tackling the problems at hand.

   If the only opinions that were shared were well informed, well cited ones, people would get incredibly bored of them. Boring is ineffective. Ineffective gets nothing done.

I agree on species and ecosystem collapse due to environmental factors caused by human activity, but not all of those are tied specifically to global warming. They are correlated to activity which might well be contributing to global warming, but they themselves don't prove that global warming will result in devastation to life. For example, global warming leading to desertification will devastate those ecosystems, but there will also be stretches of the Earth which are more conducive to a greater variety of life as the planet warms.

     Here's a direct example of how increasing temperatures cause ecosystem collapse: rising ocean temperatures (due to global warming) increases carbon dioxide solubility in sea water, which increases carbonic acid levels, which are destroying sensitive marine ecosystems.
   The warming of frozen territory is actually a huge problem. Rising polar temperatures are at the brink of thawing the millions of tonnes of frozen methane cladates locked beneath tundra and ocean floors. Methane bubbles up, and enters the atmosphere, causing a significant increase in the rate of warming, which melts more methane etc etc.

   Even if this wasn't the case, habitats and ecosystems are currently so fragmented by human created deserts (ie urban environments) that efficient migration of ecosystems may not be possible. And given the economic damage that rising sea-levels and loss of arable land will do, all of these ecosystems will face extreme competition from human agriculture, which can spread far faster than, say, a mangrove swamp or a temperate rain-forest.

Great, thanks for ruining my weekend Buzz Killington.
  :cry:
My pleasure.  :azn:


  • JNM
  • The Legend

    • 4158

    • January 19, 2015, 10:16:48 am
    • Seoul, South Korea
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #17 on: September 27, 2019, 03:39:36 pm »
Homo Sapiens will become extinct, just like every other species sooner or later has, or will.

There is nothing we can do that will destroy earth, just the infestations living on it. I'm okay with that. I'm not a doomsayer as some suggest. I am older and I am cynical. The only thing I believe without question that comes out of the media is sports scores, and even then there's the chance of rigged games.

My point was simple. If person A is screaming about global warming and how the holocaust is coming then they pump out a bunch of kids, I have to ask why? Why would someone with purposeful aforethought, choose to procreate into a system they are convinced is doomed in the near future?

As to the geomorphology thing. It was my minor in university. I love the subject, geography and geology too. I may not be as on the ball as dude above, but I ain't no dummy!
The two main reasons for having kids:

1) sex is fun
2) babies are cute


  • LIC
  • Super Waygook

    • 468

    • February 15, 2019, 04:39:00 pm
    • NE Hemisphere
Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #18 on: September 27, 2019, 04:59:49 pm »
Homo Sapiens will become extinct, just like every other species sooner or later has, or will.

There is nothing we can do that will destroy earth, just the infestations living on it. I'm okay with that. I'm not a doomsayer as some suggest. I am older and I am cynical. The only thing I believe without question that comes out of the media is sports scores, and even then there's the chance of rigged games.

My point was simple. If person A is screaming about global warming and how the holocaust is coming then they pump out a bunch of kids, I have to ask why? Why would someone with purposeful aforethought, choose to procreate into a system they are convinced is doomed in the near future?

As to the geomorphology thing. It was my minor in university. I love the subject, geography and geology too. I may not be as on the ball as dude above, but I ain't no dummy!
The two main reasons for having kids:

1) sex is fun
2) babies are cute

1) Yes it is

2) Some are but mostly when they are sleeping


  • Cohort 2019
  • Veteran

    • 157

    • August 17, 2019, 08:09:23 pm
    • 90°S.- 0'E
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Re: Global warming and kids
« Reply #19 on: September 28, 2019, 02:37:58 pm »
I had asked 3 classes of highly gifted Upper Forms to come up with solutions and had given them a wealth of data to comb through, even fed them solutions as geo-engineering or helium-3 mining.

Most of them came to Kyndo's description of a 2nd Permian event and a 6+ degrees temp. rise prediction= no solutions.
incumbo studiis