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  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #140 on: October 08, 2019, 04:14:24 pm »
be best assured there are plenty of schools still scrambling to find their NET for the year come February...a few weeks before the start of term.

Why would they be scrabbling when they knew months ahead of time how many schools would be without a native teacher?

It's not a high priority to find someone.

NETs are being gradually phased out.

Life goes on without them with Korean teachers teaching English.

If there's enough parental pressure to get a NET, or if a principal wants a NET, it can still be many months without one.

And it's no big deal.

No one's losing sleep over it.

And in fact, they've just saved a bunch of money by delaying hiring a NET until the school year is well under way.


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5272

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #141 on: October 08, 2019, 04:54:23 pm »
Why would they be scrabbling when they knew months ahead of time how many schools would be without a native teacher?
Funding, among a myriad other reasons. Occasionally it gets yanked, and occasionally the school gets more of it. If it's the latter, they can hire a NET.

It's not a high priority to find someone.
It is for the English department (if it's a middle or high school). Some principals also prioritize it. A foreign teacher can help raise a school's status, which might help its ranking, or even help a struggling school eke out an extra few students, which can be a big deal.

NETs are being gradually phased out.
Not really relevant to why some schools would be searching for a NET a month before the start of the term.

Life goes on without them with Korean teachers teaching English.
Hopefully!

If there's enough parental pressure to get a NET, or if a principal wants a NET, it can still be many months without one.
Better late than never, but better now than late.

And it's no big deal.
It certainly can be in some cases!

No one's losing sleep over it.
My kiddos are currently studying for one of the more important tests of their academic careers. I walked down the hall today to observe their diligence. Apparently there's no correlation between losing sleep, and the importance of an upcoming event...  :rolleyes:

And in fact, they've just saved a bunch of money by delaying hiring a NET until the school year is well under way.
   The opposite, in fact.
   Without a NET, the school loses the accompanying funding from the POE/MOE, which mean no more skimming funds from their apartment stipend for monthly soju fests!  :sad:


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #142 on: October 08, 2019, 05:31:33 pm »
I have direct experience with education offices hiring NETs. They sure took their time when hiring NETs / setting up interviews. Maybe they forgot about it? But in my opinion it was not on the top of their to do list. Pretty far down in fact. They're not desperate. Not in 2019. Now it's the BTS loving applicants who are desperate.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #143 on: October 08, 2019, 05:40:53 pm »
In 2019 / 2020, schools can afford to be extremely picky. There are way more applicants than position openings. Previous schools are called. A negative reference will eliminate you.

And then BOOM defamtion lawsuit. :p
I thought you couldn't do negative references cause of defamation laws :O

On the application you give permission to be investigated. And even if you didn't the recruiter would call anyways. Previous places of employment are always contacted. If they're in Korea that is. Bad words against you = application binned. Without you ever knowing the reason why.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #144 on: October 08, 2019, 05:49:46 pm »
Without a NET, the school loses the accompanying funding from the POE/MOE, which mean no more skimming funds from their apartment stipend for monthly soju fests!  :sad:

I don't think they're able to do that anymore. Because the federal government doesn't want their money wasted, the recipients have to account for the spending of allocated funds.

If the NET is in crappy housing it's because the education office didn't bother looking for nice housing and is only funded for the amount being spent on it I'm guessing. (Meaning the federal government saves the unspent money.)


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 3939

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #145 on: October 09, 2019, 04:06:15 pm »
Since NETs are somewhere near the education office’s list of priorities...why would they then go on to waste precious resources to ensure NETs are deskwarming during vacation?


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #146 on: October 09, 2019, 04:13:18 pm »
A lot of Koreans have low opinions of NETs. I've heard it too many times. If money is being spent on them, they want to make sure sufficient work is gotten out of that investment. Hence the expectation that they're working during school vacation times.


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 3939

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #147 on: October 09, 2019, 07:19:34 pm »
They want to make sure ‘sufficient work’ is being done by NETs...by sitting at their desks doing absolute feck all.

Moreover, the big wigs at the education office are willing to spend EXTRA money to make sure said NETs are doing that ‘sufficient work’ while doing absolute feck all.

It’s not only NETs that are required to deskwarm during vacation. Korean teachers in contract are also required to...and many of them simply wave their middle finger to the system on their way to ICN airport. At least the ones that have the balls to anyway.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #148 on: October 09, 2019, 07:28:00 pm »
By calling / messaging the head teacher to keep an eye on the NET, they're not wasting any money at all. One phone call / bulk email isn't exactly draining their resources.

Not sure about K teachers, but NETs are being watched more strictly lately.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #149 on: October 09, 2019, 07:37:05 pm »
Almost every day during the vacation when I had to come into school the head teacher said to me, "What did you do today? Show me what you accomplished."


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 3939

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #150 on: October 09, 2019, 08:12:43 pm »
That’s your headteacher.

What happens when you’ve planned out all the lessons for the semester ahead? What are you supposed to “accomplish” after that?

My headteacher (not CoT) knows my every move during term and vacation...because she loves to travel even more than I do. And she knows off the record when I have a “family event” during deskwarming season...I don’t have to mention it to her as we have that implicit understanding.

The first few times I logged my early departure for the airport on NEIS during term time, she was well aware of it (nosy ajumma) and wanted to know how my trip was and gave me tips on places to visit and things to do in the future. She even brings me snacks from her travels.

BTW, the education office can’t call the headteacher to enforce deskwarming rules during vacation...because the overwhelming majority of headteachers (in my guesstimation) aren’t contract teachers. They are licensed teachers and most probably won’t be on school premises.

The education office will call the school office, which they very rarely do, and speak to the admin staff to do a rough roll call.

How much money and time do you think it would cost to regularly call the 8000+ schools where NETs are employed on a regular basis...to make sure said NETs are at their desks doing absolutely nothing?


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #151 on: October 09, 2019, 08:20:28 pm »
Sending an initiative to all schools - a bulk message memo - doesn't cost that much time and money.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #152 on: October 09, 2019, 08:29:52 pm »
You know what became less common as time went by? NETs who would go home for Christmas and come back in March. Now I don't know a single person who can do that. Do you?


  • waygo0k
  • The Legend

    • 3939

    • September 27, 2011, 11:51:01 am
    • Chungnam
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #153 on: October 09, 2019, 09:10:53 pm »
Sending a bulk memo...and then having to sort through the thousands of replies. How much time and money would it cost to do that?

Most NETs can’t go AWOL for 3 months because

a) vacation days (entitled and discretionary) have been cut

b) camps are longer these days...I’ve heard of some poor souls doing 2-3 week camps!

c) noob NETs who are too scared to step out of line just a tiny bit

But...plenty of NETs can take an extra 1-2 weeks off if they’re willing to take the risk at minimal cost. 3-4 weeks would be taking the piss, but if one is brave enough and has a solid plan in place, it can be done.


  • Colburnnn
  • Veteran

    • 112

    • August 10, 2015, 05:52:37 pm
    • South Korea
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #154 on: October 10, 2019, 07:27:27 am »
A lot of Koreans have low opinions of NETs. I've heard it too many times. If money is being spent on them, they want to make sure sufficient work is gotten out of that investment. Hence the expectation that they're working during school vacation times.

Then let us take unpaid vacation. Then there is no expectation. It would actually save money.

Naaa, got to punish those foreigners and make them aware that they are lesser people than us!

P.S Many NET's have low opinions of Korean teachers too.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #155 on: October 10, 2019, 02:10:06 pm »
The NETs' opinions of K-teachers won't impact how much vacation time NETs get because they're not the ones setting policy. Koreans are.


  • L I
  • The Legend

    • 3521

    • October 03, 2011, 01:50:58 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #156 on: October 10, 2019, 02:14:04 pm »
How about asking for more paid vacation; for example, the reinstatement of the 10 days extra vacation re-signing bonus?

Unpaid is too much of a pain to calculate; it would mean extra work, which others don't want to do.

You'd be more likely to be successful lobbying for more across the board vacation time off.


  • Colburnnn
  • Veteran

    • 112

    • August 10, 2015, 05:52:37 pm
    • South Korea
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #157 on: October 11, 2019, 07:32:10 am »
How about asking for more paid vacation; for example, the reinstatement of the 10 days extra vacation re-signing bonus?

Unpaid is too much of a pain to calculate; it would mean extra work, which others don't want to do.

You'd be more likely to be successful lobbying for more across the board vacation time off.

You're arguing that Koreans want more work from us for the money/vacation. How is asking for more paid vacation going to work.

If they don't want to do extra work for unpaid, then just take it as 'sick' leave. Guess they still have to do extra work for that? The whole point of asking for unpaid leave is upfront honesty. You take that away and people are going to play the system, creating more headaches. It's madness.


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5272

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #158 on: October 11, 2019, 12:28:12 pm »
Without a NET, the school loses the accompanying funding from the POE/MOE, which mean no more skimming funds from their apartment stipend for monthly soju fests!  :sad:

I don't think they're able to do that anymore. Because the federal government doesn't want their money wasted, the recipients have to account for the spending of allocated funds.

If the NET is in crappy housing it's because the education office didn't bother looking for nice housing and is only funded for the amount being spent on it I'm guessing. (Meaning the federal government saves the unspent money.)
      Well, I guess that's good to hear!
      Less opportunities for graft means less NETs that get taken advantage of in the future!


Since NETs are somewhere near the education office’s list of priorities...why would they then go on to waste precious resources to ensure NETs are deskwarming during vacation?

From what I hear in the coordinator briefings, one of the reasons why the MOE is cracking down on AWOL NETs is that otherwise the MOE gets inundated with letters, emails and calls from angry NETs.
  Basically, they get a lot of "Why does Anne teacher get to stay home during deskwarming periods while my school makes me stay? That's not fair!!!!1!! Can you please make my school let me stay home for those days too?"

     Eventually the MOE said "Screw it. Everybody has to be at school all the time, everyday, always and forever."
 :undecided:
« Last Edit: October 11, 2019, 12:33:26 pm by kyndo »


  • oglop
  • The Legend

    • 2338

    • August 25, 2011, 07:24:54 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Time off without pay
« Reply #159 on: October 11, 2019, 04:04:10 pm »
so instead of saying, "fine, everyone can stay home when they have nothing to do", they took the other route of, "fine. everyone has to come to school and sit at their desks. for some reason"