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  • Mr C
  • The Legend

    • 3689

    • October 17, 2012, 03:00:40 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2900 on: April 21, 2022, 02:44:16 pm »
Dude, I just trashed Trump on another thread as totally being the kind of person who would find out he's 1/32nd minority and make a huge deal about it, like a douche does.
1) I was against "BUT HER EMAILS!!!!!" remember?
2) This isn't a false equivalence. This is actually an equivalent act. If the firm that was sourcing Clinton with dirt on Trump was also using the Russian agent as a source for dirt on Trump, then she is by definition doing the exact same thing that Trump is accused of.

The Russian Veselnetskaya was not providing dirt on anyone--that's why Trump Tower folks left early.  She kept banging on about Russian orphans, which is what she discussed with Simpson.

The difference is the Trump Tower people were promised dirt on Clinton--see Goldstone's emails--and there is NO EVIDENCE Simpson was, nor indeed that he had much to with the Clinton campaign, other than belonging to a company.

And again:  Can you name ANY Clinton campaign employees (especially ones of similar rank to Manafort, Kushner and Don Jr) present at Veselnitskaya-Simpson meetings?

No?  I didn't think so.  I too am at my DeMabrandolini point.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2022, 02:46:56 pm by Mr C »


Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2901 on: April 21, 2022, 03:41:41 pm »
The Russian Veselnetskaya was not providing dirt on anyone--that's why Trump Tower folks left early.  She kept banging on about Russian orphans, which is what she discussed with Simpson.
Why was it okay for her to discuss this with Simpson but not with Trump?

Quote
The difference is the Trump Tower people were promised dirt on Clinton
Correction- Not "dirt" but evidence of criminal activity

Quote
nd there is NO EVIDENCE Simpson was, nor indeed that he had much to with the Clinton campaign, other than belonging to a company.
Well, other than being the Founder of the opposition research firm responsible for the Trump-Russia dossier, and being retained by the DNC and the Clinton campaign, with Simpson later using his own money to fund the dossier.

But hey that's just coinkey-dink isn't it!

Would you apply the same standard to Trumpco. that you are now applying to Simpson and Fusion GPS?

Quote
Can you name ANY Clinton campaign employees (especially ones of similar rank to Manafort, Kushner and Don Jr) present at Veselnitskaya-Simpson meetings?
Why? Does the lack of a high-ranking or officially-linked person present, rather than someone acting on behalf, mean that there is no link? I mean, it gives plausible deniability.

Again, if the Trump Tower had just involved an opposition firm he hired through his law firm would you say that made things better or that it he wasn't involved?

Your standards are entirely arbitrary. You seem to be constitutionally incapable of being fair to those you disagree with and despise to a degree that we should hope for.


  • Mr C
  • The Legend

    • 3689

    • October 17, 2012, 03:00:40 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2902 on: April 21, 2022, 05:48:30 pm »
Why was it okay for her to discuss this with Simpson but not with Trump?
Correction- Not "dirt" but evidence of criminal activity
Well, other than being the Founder of the opposition research firm responsible for the Trump-Russia dossier, and being retained by the DNC and the Clinton campaign, with Simpson later using his own money to fund the dossier.

But hey that's just coinkey-dink isn't it!

Would you apply the same standard to Trumpco. that you are now applying to Simpson and Fusion GPS?
Why? Does the lack of a high-ranking or officially-linked person present, rather than someone acting on behalf, mean that there is no link? I mean, it gives plausible deniability.

Again, if the Trump Tower had just involved an opposition firm he hired through his law firm would you say that made things better or that it he wasn't involved?

Your standards are entirely arbitrary. You seem to be constitutionally incapable of being fair to those you disagree with and despise to a degree that we should hope for.

Blah-blah-blah.

Unless you have emails with contents similar to shown below, you're full of it, pal.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/11/donald-trump-jr-emails-full-text-russia-rob-goldstone


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2903 on: April 23, 2022, 08:05:24 am »
Corruption seems to be pretty standard fare for the radical right:

"Mark Meadows was registered to vote in three states at the same time.
The former Trump White House chief of staff was booted from North Carolina voter rolls last week.
He's still registered to vote in both South Carolina and Virginia.
Former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows was registered to vote in three states at the same time, a new Washington Post report found on Friday.

According to state records reviewed by The Post's Fact Checker, Meadows was registered to vote in North Carolina, South Carolina, and Virginia — simultaneously — for about three weeks.

Meadows was booted from North Carolina's voter rolls last week during an investigation into potential voter fraud related to his voting record. Meadows was registered to vote in 2020 from a mobile home address in Scaly Mountain, North Carolina, though Meadows did not own the property nor had he lived there, prompting an investigation."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/former-trump-white-house-chief-of-staff-mark-meadows-was-registered-to-vote-in-3-states-at-once/ar-AAWusTe?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=fe0aead9572b42098d3f35dada83cc89


  • gogators!
  • Waygook Lord

    • 6164

    • March 16, 2016, 04:35:48 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2904 on: April 26, 2022, 01:25:47 am »
Quote
The former White House Covid response coordinator, Deborah Birx, has decried the press conference in 2020 during which, in her presence, Donald Trump floated the idea of the injection of disinfectant to treat coronavirus – calling the episode a “tragedy on many levels”.

When asked how she felt during the moment Trump promoted the use of disinfectants to treat the virus, Birx said: “At the beginning, I didn’t even know what was happening.” She said scientists and Trump had a discussion before the press conference about a study on how light and disinfectants could help kill the virus on outer surfaces.

She writes in her book that when Trump looked at her as he was talking about the subject, while she sat to the side, she had wanted to fall through the floor.

“This was a tragedy on many levels,” she told GMA host George Stephanopoulos.

She continued: “I didn’t realize … that scientists went into the Oval Office and they started that discussion there, and they continued it in front of America.”


https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-claim-disinfectant-treat-covid-162340380.html
And rather than correct his mistake, trump claimed it was a joke. Of course, the joke was on those who went out and drank the Kool-aid, I mean bleach.


Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2905 on: April 26, 2022, 12:17:42 pm »
Blah-blah-blah.

Unless you have emails with contents similar to shown below, you're full of it, pal.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/11/donald-trump-jr-emails-full-text-russia-rob-goldstone
We'll see when the Durham investigation concludes.

Probably doesn't guess Hillary, who will proclaim "I had no idea these people were conjuring up this fake Russia-Collusion stuff." but dude, you can't 'blah blah" away the main Russian source meeting directly with the head of the opposition research firm immediately before and after the meeting.

You KNOW that is suspicious. You just don't want to admit and so instead you do "Well, if you don't have the exact same level of stuff that I do, that makes my claim 100% true and yours 100% wrong!!!!" which is completely illogical.


  • Mr C
  • The Legend

    • 3689

    • October 17, 2012, 03:00:40 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2906 on: April 26, 2022, 03:57:38 pm »
We'll see when the Durham investigation concludes.

Probably doesn't guess Hillary, who will proclaim "I had no idea these people were conjuring up this fake Russia-Collusion stuff." but dude, you can't 'blah blah" away the main Russian source meeting directly with the head of the opposition research firm immediately before and after the meeting.

You KNOW that is suspicious. You just don't want to admit and so instead you do "Well, if you don't have the exact same level of stuff that I do, that makes my claim 100% true and yours 100% wrong!!!!" which is completely illogical.

But Veselnitskaya was NOT a Russian "source" on anything.  She was about Russian adoptions, which, again, is why the Trumpies all left the meeting early--she didn't have any dirt, and they weren't interested.

Again, I'll put it in big bold caps if that will help you.


  • Savant
  • The Legend

    • 3481

    • April 07, 2012, 11:35:31 pm
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2907 on: April 26, 2022, 04:59:56 pm »
But Veselnitskaya was NOT a Russian "source" on anything.  She was about Russian adoptions, which, again, is why the Trumpies all left the meeting early--she didn't have any dirt, and they weren't interested.

Again, I'll put it in big bold caps if that will help you.

The Trump camp got played. They went into the meeting expecting some hot information to be used in the campaign but came out looking like fools.


Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2908 on: April 26, 2022, 05:32:29 pm »
But Veselnitskaya was NOT a Russian "source" on anything.  She was about Russian adoptions, which, again, is why the Trumpies all left the meeting early--she didn't have any dirt, and they weren't interested.
You can't have it both ways, you can't say that Veselnetskaya was a Russian source/agent that was being contacted by the Trump campaign for dirt, but then say "but but but" when it comes t Simpson meeting with her to get dirt on Trumpco.

Either BOTH sides used surrogates to meet with a Russian agent OR Veselnetskaya was NOT a Russian agent and nothing was wrong with either one. If it is wrong for Trump to use a Russian agent to try to get dirt on Clinton, then it is wrong for Clinton to use a Russian agent to get dirt on Trump. And her being a Russian agent can't change simply on the basis of whether or she is talking with Trump agents or Clinton agents to fit your agenda of trying to justify accusations against Trump.


  • Mr C
  • The Legend

    • 3689

    • October 17, 2012, 03:00:40 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2909 on: April 26, 2022, 06:12:15 pm »
You can't have it both ways, you can't say that Veselnetskaya was a Russian source/agent that was being contacted by the Trump campaign for dirt, but then say "but but but" when it comes t Simpson meeting with her to get dirt on Trumpco.
 

No, no.  The Trumpies were TOLD by Goldstone she would have dirt on Clinton, but she was just on about adoption.  The fact is they attended on that basis (suggesting an attempt at collusion) but left when they saw they were not getting anything.

Meanwhile, we have no evidence that Simpson thought she had dirt on Trump, and until you can show that evidence, this is a false equivalence and you're full of it.


Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2910 on: April 27, 2022, 09:28:09 am »
Meanwhile, we have no evidence that Simpson thought she had dirt on Trump, and until you can show that evidence, this is a false equivalence and you're full of it.
You mean other than Simpson RUNNING AN OPPOSITION RESEARCH FIRM and meeting with immediately before and after she met with the person his group was doing opposition research on?

Seriously? Dude come on, stop being willfully obtuse.


  • Mr C
  • The Legend

    • 3689

    • October 17, 2012, 03:00:40 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2911 on: April 27, 2022, 09:55:12 am »
You mean other than Simpson RUNNING AN OPPOSITION RESEARCH FIRM and meeting with immediately before and after she met with the person his group was doing opposition research on?

Seriously? Dude come on, stop being willfully obtuse.

"Fusion GPS is a commercial research and strategic intelligence firm based in Washington, D.C. The company conducts open-source investigations and provides research and strategic advice for businesses, law firms and investors, as well as for political inquiries, such as opposition research. The "GPS" initialism is derived from "Global research, Political analysis, Strategic insight"."  IOW, to suggest his only concern is the Clinton campaign is nonsense.

The only thing Veselnitskaya is known for is her concern over the Magnitsky Act particularly as it relates to adoptions.  NO EMAILS, NO TALK.

Why does any conversation with you by anyone spiral down to you name-calling and ignoring the nose on your face? 


Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2912 on: April 27, 2022, 01:35:17 pm »
"Fusion GPS is a commercial research and strategic intelligence firm based in Washington, D.C. The company conducts open-source investigations and provides research and strategic advice for businesses, law firms and investors, as well as for political inquiries, such as opposition research. The "GPS" initialism is derived from "Global research, Political analysis, Strategic insight"."  IOW, to suggest his only concern is the Clinton campaign is nonsense.
Dude, his firm compiled the Trump Dossier that served as evidence for investigations into Trump. This was a major political campaign.

Lets take your claim at face value-

This means that it was more probable that Simpson, while investigating Trump, met with Veselnitskaya twice, NOT because she was going to meet and had met with the Trump campaign but over the Magnitsky Act? Sure, either before or after, but both before AND after?

Quote
Why does any conversation with you by anyone spiral down to you name-calling and ignoring the nose on your face?
Dude, "stop being willfully obtuse" is not name calling.

Look, all I'm asking you to do is be consistent. Have the same level of concern both ways and apply the same standards. If the situation were reversed and senior Clinton campaign officials had met with some Russian agent who said they had evidence of criminal activity by Trump and the meeting involved a Russian agent with links to a Trump opposition research firm, you wouldn't be like "Well, that firm also does other stuff, so how can we suspect it was about Trump?" At the very least acknowledge that it is suspect.


  • Kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • I am a geek!!

    • March 02, 2027, 11:00:00 pm
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Trump will win in 2020
« Reply #2913 on: April 27, 2022, 06:13:34 pm »
Dude, "stop being willfully obtuse" is not name calling.
I wouldn't be so certain:  it got Andy a month in "the hole".  :sad: