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Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2019, 07:01:03 pm »
You guys really need to stop calling people white supremacists when they constantly do and say white supremacist things. They say they are not white supremacists despite constantly doing and saying white supremacist things, and clearly they can be trusted.

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Quote from: Mr.DeMartino on Yesterday at 01:40:32 PM

    Trump is a liar and a con man.


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2019, 07:03:18 pm »
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This is not what Chester Jim argued, although in fairness, linguistic precision is not his strong point. He said that blacks were responsible for 85% of interracial violence. I'm not splitting hairs here. I used Table 1 in the BJS report that I linked to do some calculations. I omitted the data from "Two or more races", just because I think that's a blurry category that doesn't change much either way. If you exclude crimes against blacks, and focus only the interracial crimes committed against whites, Hispanics and "Other", then it seems blacks are responsible for 33%. That's quite a lot less than 85%.

Does it really matter? Whatever the stats are I assume your argument will be that it's primarily down to economic factors or white oppression. The higher the percentage, the worse the economic factors or white oppression must be.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2019, 07:06:17 pm by eggieguffer »


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2019, 07:08:30 pm »
I don't know, does it? CDW made a misleading claim about black crime, and so did Chester Jim. I guess we should never set the record straight on anything because progressives annoy you.


« Last Edit: March 02, 2019, 07:12:46 pm by Andyman »


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2019, 07:14:59 pm »
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I don't know, does it?

I meant does it really matter to you? If you found out that 85% of Blacks were indisputably responsible for interracial violence, would it change your argument? I don't think it would.  You would still be claiming it was down to poverty and white oppression.


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #24 on: March 02, 2019, 07:23:08 pm »
Still be claiming? I've never said anything like that. I would say that it was due to a complex mix of factors, like all violent crime - some social / environmental, some economic, some personal.


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2019, 07:29:39 pm »
Still be claiming? I've never said anything like that. I would say that it was due to a complex mix of factors, like all violent crime - some social / environmental, some economic, some personal.

As I think you know I was referring to explaining away a difference between the black and white crime stats. (hypothetical or not)

E.g. Eggie: Andyman, why do you think black people in the US commit violent crime at a much higher rate than other races?
Andyman: Ummm it's due to a complex mix of factors, like all violent crime - some social / environmental, some economic, some personal.
Eggie: You're not really answering the question.

I think if pressed to answer this particular question, your answer would be economic circumstances and white oppression, would it not?


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2019, 08:35:36 pm »
No, not really. Poverty is a strong predictor of criminality, irrespective of race, and the crime rate is lower among wealthier black populations, so not considering it as a factor would be to wilfully establish a major blind spot. But it's obviously not the only factor. "White oppression" is extremely vague so it's a term I'd never use in this context.

Anyway, there are armies of people studying criminology at universities, think tanks, charities, police departments, government agencies and so on. Insofar as I'm familiar with the subject, I think the general consensus supports my suggestion that the circumstances leading to criminality are a complex mix of factors, some social / environmental, some economic, some personal. If you have some information that contradicts this, you should let everyone know. I'm sure it'll be appreciated by the criminal justice apparatus.


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Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2019, 08:51:32 pm »
Quote
This is not what Chester Jim argued, although in fairness, linguistic precision is not his strong point. He said that blacks were responsible for 85% of interracial violence. I'm not splitting hairs here. I used Table 1 in the BJS report that I linked to do some calculations. I omitted the data from "Two or more races", just because I think that's a blurry category that doesn't change much either way. If you exclude crimes against blacks, and focus only the interracial crimes committed against whites, Hispanics and "Other", then it seems blacks are responsible for 33%. That's quite a lot less than 85%.

Does it really matter? Whatever the stats are I assume your argument will be that it's primarily down to economic factors or white oppression. The higher the percentage, the worse the economic factors or white oppression must be.

Does it really matter that Whites committed more violent crimes than Blacks and Hispanics combined?

Well yes, if you can do basic Math.


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2019, 09:34:04 pm »
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Does it really matter that Whites committed more violent crimes than Blacks and Hispanics combined?

Well yes, if you can do basic Math.

Of course whites commit more violent crimes than blacks and Hispanics combined, they make up around 65% of the population. We were obviously talking about crimes per capita.


Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2019, 09:40:37 pm »
No, not really. Poverty is a strong predictor of criminality, irrespective of race, and the crime rate is lower among wealthier black populations, so not considering it as a factor would be to wilfully establish a major blind spot. But it's obviously not the only factor. "White oppression" is extremely vague so it's a term I'd never use in this context.

Anyway, there are armies of people studying criminology at universities, think tanks, charities, police departments, government agencies and so on. Insofar as I'm familiar with the subject, I think the general consensus supports my suggestion that the circumstances leading to criminality are a complex mix of factors, some social / environmental, some economic, some personal. If you have some information that contradicts this, you should let everyone know. I'm sure it'll be appreciated by the criminal justice apparatus.

You're avoiding the issue again and talking about the causes of crime in general. I asked you why blacks commit crimes at a higher rate than whites in the US and you don't seem to want to answer. The left's take on this has been widely publicised so I'm not sure why you're reluctant to echo it. Blacks commit crime due to poverty and the numbers are increased due to systemic racism in the courts - blacks being sentenced to prison more often by a biased justice system. I assume this is what the main thrust of your argument would be. No need to be coy


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    • April 07, 2012, 11:35:31 pm
Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #30 on: March 02, 2019, 09:45:10 pm »
No, not really. Poverty is a strong predictor of criminality, irrespective of race, and the crime rate is lower among wealthier black populations, so not considering it as a factor would be to wilfully establish a major blind spot. But it's obviously not the only factor. "White oppression" is extremely vague so it's a term I'd never use in this context.

Anyway, there are armies of people studying criminology at universities, think tanks, charities, police departments, government agencies and so on. Insofar as I'm familiar with the subject, I think the general consensus supports my suggestion that the circumstances leading to criminality are a complex mix of factors, some social / environmental, some economic, some personal. If you have some information that contradicts this, you should let everyone know. I'm sure it'll be appreciated by the criminal justice apparatus.

You're avoiding the issue again and talking about the causes of crime in general. I asked you why blacks commit crimes at a higher rate than whites in the US and you don't seem to want to answer. The left's take on this has been widely publicised so I'm not sure why you're reluctant to echo it. Blacks commit crime due to poverty and the numbers are increased due to systemic racism in the courts - blacks being sentenced to prison more often by a biased justice system. I assume this is what the main thrust of your argument would be. No need to be coy

You missed out biased police forces.


  • Savant
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1917

    • April 07, 2012, 11:35:31 pm
Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #31 on: March 02, 2019, 09:48:31 pm »
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Does it really matter that Whites committed more violent crimes than Blacks and Hispanics combined?

Well yes, if you can do basic Math.

Of course whites commit more violent crimes than blacks and Hispanics combined, they make up around 65% of the population. We were obviously talking about crimes per capita.

Neglected black inner cities would have an increased crime rate per capita.

Your thinking is black people commit more crimes because...?


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Re: White supremacy, the remix
« Reply #32 on: March 02, 2019, 10:20:22 pm »
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