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Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #140 on: February 12, 2019, 12:51:59 pm »
Update Re Daejeon not giving the renewal days from the 2018 contract.

I have just had confirmation from the Office of Education that we do not get the 5 renewal days as per the contract.  It was clearly written to me that 'The total number of days of your paid leave is 26 days.'   

So now I guess I have to see if the Labour Board can give any clarification of the issue.

I do notice that when they reduced the 2 calendar weeks of paid leave in 2012 to one calendar week in 2013, they still honoured the 2012 contract.  Hopefully this will help set a precedent!

As I wrote in my earlier post, I find this quite stressful to do but I think it is quite important.  It is good to see Jeollanamdo doing the right thing and honouring their contracts.  But I will not be using that as a point of argument as they are a separate province.  I am just going to try to get them to honour the contract.

I will let you know what happens next!


Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #141 on: February 12, 2019, 02:46:04 pm »
Has anyone heard anything about what the Chungnam POE has said? Have heard people asking around but no solid answers yet


  • hangook77
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1065

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #142 on: February 13, 2019, 09:05:21 am »
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[

That's only 20 days.  Where's the other 6?

to be used throughout the year, i guess?

They sound like a bunch of assholes.  The Korean teachers don't have to give up their vacation for those days.  I mean really, why do that just to have you come in and sit at a desk all day with no classes to teach.  Is it really that hurtful to give you the days off?  That's actually a vacation cut.  You would have gotten 18 days plus 5 for renewal at 23 and now you are at 20?  Remind me never to apply to Busan.  F@k them!


  • kobayashi
  • Expert Waygook

    • 986

    • August 18, 2016, 11:14:47 am
    • Nibiru
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #143 on: February 13, 2019, 05:46:00 pm »
Not just Busan. At least Gangwon-do as well. Probably the whole of EPIK. First Seoul cut the renewal bonus. Now vacation has been cut. Why cut a non-monetary benefit? It costs nothing. Teaching in Korea becomes more and more of a waste of time every year.


  • sleepy
  • Veteran

    • 175

    • April 02, 2013, 03:05:44 pm
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #144 on: February 13, 2019, 06:46:34 pm »
26 paid days leave is a long long time by typical Korean standards.

The powers that be would be unwise to give you more, due to political reasons.

The government changed the law for Korean workers.

I get 16 days per year and struggle to find time to use them all..... I can however use them at any time in the year, with no notice if I wish....


  • debbiem89
  • Super Waygook

    • 484

    • August 30, 2016, 09:42:49 am
    • South Korea
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #145 on: February 14, 2019, 10:01:44 am »
26 paid days leave is a long long time by typical Korean standards.

The powers that be would be unwise to give you more, due to political reasons.

The government changed the law for Korean workers.

I get 16 days per year and struggle to find time to use them all..... I can however use them at any time in the year, with no notice if I wish....

Hm it's not if it's including things like School Birthdays etc.

Also the Korean teachers get WAY more than that, so it's not long at all compared to other educators.


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5033

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #146 on: February 14, 2019, 10:27:08 am »
I went to an orientation for renewing teachers in Gyeongsanbuk-do recently, and the details of the contract changes were explained thusly:

    The old contract was 18 days (10 winter, 8 summer) + 5 days contract renewal.

    The new contract is 23 days vacation for everybody (ir)regardless of whether they are renewing teachers or not, plus 3 holiday days meant to be used for the 3 discretionary holidays that schools are allowed to take per year, for a grand total of 26 days (with no stipulations regarding when they need to be used). Essentially, this means that the average renewing teacher will have no change in the number of vacation days given to them, while the FOBs are lucky SOBs and get an extra 5.  :smiley:

Note: schools are given only 3 discretionary vacation days throughout the year. Some schools take more, but are then required to shorten their winter and/or summer vacation periods. Also, if you're halfway smart, you won't make a big deal about having to use holiday days for these days, and, if you're lucky, may end up not using those extra vacation days for the school holiday.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 10:30:41 am by kyndo »


Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #147 on: February 14, 2019, 10:47:32 am »
For me it's the whole feeling of it.

They were forced to give us all 26 so then they thought "well we'd better take stuff away from them to even it out".  I really don't see why they had to do that.

Saying that we have to take 10 and 10 (summer and winter) with 6 remaining days to be used throughout the year isn't very helpful to NETs who wouldn't mind having a long(er) holiday to see their family. 


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5033

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #148 on: February 14, 2019, 11:13:43 am »
For me it's the whole feeling of it.

They were forced to give us all 26 so then they thought "well we'd better take stuff away from them to even it out".  I really don't see why they had to do that.

Saying that we have to take 10 and 10 (summer and winter) with 6 remaining days to be used throughout the year isn't very helpful to NETs who wouldn't mind having a long(er) holiday to see their family.

   Actually, the new labour laws forced them to change only first year NET contracts. According to the new labour laws, those teachers who have completed their second year or more are actually owed *less* holidays than those who just completed their first (weird, I know, but they read us the relevant passages). But because EPIK doesn't want to deal with endless whinging about how unfair it is that first year teachers get more vacation, they graciously decided not to reduce ours. So very gracious. :rolleyes:

    Also, I'm not sure how things are in your province, but in the POE representative in the Gyeongsangbukdo EPIK orientation thingy specifically stated that there is no 10/10 division. Theoretically, we could take all 23 days of our vacation days at once, so long as our school schedules can accommodate it (the remaining 3 are probably going to be used for the school discretionary holidays).

    JLP is doing things differently, so I can't say this is definitely how things will work in every province, but that's how  it will go in my neck of the woods urban sprawl.  :smiley:
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 11:15:15 am by kyndo »


  • Mister Tim
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1486

    • September 08, 2013, 10:33:54 am
    • SK
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #149 on: February 14, 2019, 11:31:50 am »
    The new contract is 23 days vacation for everybody (ir)regardless of whether they are renewing teachers or not, plus 3 holiday days meant to be used for the 3 discretionary holidays that schools are allowed to take per year, for a grand total of 26 days (with no stipulations regarding when they need to be used). Essentially, this means that the average renewing teacher will have no change in the number of vacation days given to them, while the FOBs are lucky SOBs and get an extra 5.  :smiley:


Yes, that's been understood to be the case for a while now. The problem isn't the total number of days we're given, it's that we aren't being given bonus days that are stipulated in our contracts.

The 2018 contract said that if we renew that contract, we would be given five renewal bonus days to be taken during the renewal contract period (2019). We should get those five bonus days in addition to whatever the baseline number of vacation days is, regardless of whether or not that number has changed. As has been noted above, at least one province actually is honoring that clause of the contract and giving the new number plus the bonus five, which really just makes this doubly frustrating for the rest of us.

Imagine if they increased overall NET salaries across the board for 2019 (hahahaha, I wish!), but then said we wouldn't be getting the renewal bonus as stated in our 2018 contract, because the renewal bonus money was the same as the difference between the old salary and the new salary. People would not be happy, I suspect. Sure, they'd be getting the same amount of money in 2019 as they would've without the change, but it's the principle of the thing.

I dunno. I really should probably stop checking this thread or thinking about this topic at all. It's getting my blood pressure up about something that is most likely out of our hands. We're getting the shaft, and that's the end of it.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 11:34:34 am by Mister Tim »


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5033

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #150 on: February 14, 2019, 12:11:54 pm »
Yes, that's been understood to be the case for a while now. The problem isn't the total number of days we're given, it's that we aren't being given bonus days that are stipulated in our contracts.

The 2018 contract said that if we renew that contract, we would be given five renewal bonus days to be taken during the renewal contract period (2019). We should get those five bonus days in addition to whatever the baseline number of vacation days is, regardless of whether or not that number has changed. As has been noted above, at least one province actually is honoring that clause of the contract and giving the new number plus the bonus five, which really just makes this doubly frustrating for the rest of us.

Imagine if they increased overall NET salaries across the board for 2019 (hahahaha, I wish!), but then said we wouldn't be getting the renewal bonus as stated in our 2018 contract, because the renewal bonus money was the same as the difference between the old salary and the new salary. People would not be happy, I suspect. Sure, they'd be getting the same amount of money in 2019 as they would've without the change, but it's the principle of the thing.

I dunno. I really should probably stop checking this thread or thinking about this topic at all. It's getting my blood pressure up about something that is most likely out of our hands. We're getting the shaft, and that's the end of it.
Just reiterating because not everybody seems to be on the same page.

Thing is, we *are* being given the contract renewal days: it's why we now have 23+3 rather than 18+3. They've just rolled it into one single package rather than keeping  "vacation days" and "renewal bonus vacation days" separate as they've been doing up until now. All they've essentially done is change the  name. The real change is that now *everybody* gets the five bonus days, regardless of whether they've renewed a contract or not. It's not us getting the shaft, it's other people getting a hefty vacation bonus.

I agree that it sucks, but like you say, it is what it is -- which is out of our hands.   :sad:

Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 12:18:58 pm by kyndo »


  • Mister Tim
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1486

    • September 08, 2013, 10:33:54 am
    • SK
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #151 on: February 14, 2019, 12:37:47 pm »
Thing is, we *are* being given the contract renewal days: it's why we now have 23+3 rather than 18+3. They've just rolled it into one single package rather than keeping  "vacation days" and "renewal bonus vacation days" separate as they've been doing up until now. All they've essentially done is change the  name. The real change is that now *everybody* gets the five bonus days, regardless of whether they've renewed a contract or not. It's not us getting the shaft, it's other people getting a hefty vacation bonus.

No, we aren't. I understand that that's how they're justifying their decision to not give us renewal bonus days, but that doesn't jive with the contracts we signed.

Again, think of the hypothetical I gave about renewal bonus cash. If they raised our salary and then said "no renewal bonus" even though we signed a contract saying we'd get it, do you think saying "Thing is, you are getting the renewal bonus, it's just part of your salary now" would fly?


Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all?

Maybe your province is, but mine is still splitting it. So uh... no, no it doesn't mitigate anything, haha.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 12:39:54 pm by Mister Tim »


  • kyndo
  • Moderator LVL 1

    • 5033

    • March 03, 2011, 09:45:24 am
    • Gyeongsangbuk-do
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #152 on: February 14, 2019, 12:58:17 pm »
Thing is, we *are* being given the contract renewal days: it's why we now have 23+3 rather than 18+3. They've just rolled it into one single package rather than keeping  "vacation days" and "renewal bonus vacation days" separate as they've been doing up until now. All they've essentially done is change the  name. The real change is that now *everybody* gets the five bonus days, regardless of whether they've renewed a contract or not. It's not us getting the shaft, it's other people getting a hefty vacation bonus.

No, we aren't. I understand that that's how they're justifying their decision to not give us renewal bonus days, but that doesn't jive with the contracts we signed.

Again, think of the hypothetical I gave about renewal bonus cash. If they raised our salary and then said "no renewal bonus" even though we signed a contract saying we'd get it, do you think saying "Thing is, you are getting the renewal bonus, it's just part of your salary now" would fly?
   It would if they stated that the wage increase was directly in lieu of the renewal cash, which would probably fly if the increase in salary matched the renewal bonus won for won. Anyway, I feel that they could have avoided this whole issue if they had just explicitly explained how the renewal bonus days and our regular vacation days were being rolled into one tidy package and renamed. If I were lord and master of the Korean Ministry of education, I would probably smooth the transition over with a few one-time-only bonus vacation days as well. Although that would probably only delay the whinging until the next year when *those* days aren't included in the new contract.   ;D

Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all?
Maybe your province is, but mine is still splitting it. So uh... no, no it doesn't mitigate anything, haha.
Aw, bummer. I'd say "you can't win 'em all", but it looks like you guys aren't winning any of 'em.  :laugh:

« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 07:47:02 pm by kyndo »


  • Mister Tim
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1486

    • September 08, 2013, 10:33:54 am
    • SK
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #153 on: February 14, 2019, 01:10:11 pm »
   It would if they stated that the wage increase was directly in lieu of the renewal cash, which would probably fly if the increase in salary matched the renewal bonus won for won. Anyway, I feel that they could have avoided this whole issue if they had just explicitly explained how the renewal bonus days and our regular vacation days were being rolled into one tidy package and renamed. If I were lord and master of the Korean Ministry of education, I would probably smooth the transition over with a few one-time-only bonus vacation days as well. Although that would probably only delay the whinging until the next year when *those* days aren't included in the new contract.   ;D


But even people on first-time contracts would be getting the increased pay (or in reality, the increased number of days). It's hard to accept it as including the bonus we signed for when people who aren't on renewal contracts get the "bonus", too.

Again, I understand why they changed. I just think even with the explanation of the new number of days, it's going against the 2018 contracts. It doesn't matter why they raised the number of days, it doesn't matter that they raised the number of days.

They should be doing what you say you'd do (and in fact what Jeolla is doing), and honor the 2018 contracts for those of us who are renewing. I'm not saying we should continue to get +5 every contract year in perpetuity or anything. I'm fine with the number of days stipulated in the new contracts as a general rule, I'm just upset that they're going against the contracts we agreed to.


  • hangook77
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1065

    • September 14, 2017, 09:10:12 am
    • Near Busan
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #154 on: February 14, 2019, 02:53:48 pm »
For me it's the whole feeling of it.

They were forced to give us all 26 so then they thought "well we'd better take stuff away from them to even it out".  I really don't see why they had to do that.

Saying that we have to take 10 and 10 (summer and winter) with 6 remaining days to be used throughout the year isn't very helpful to NETs who wouldn't mind having a long(er) holiday to see their family.

Because they are assholes; that's why.  Any of you try to push back or complain about it where you are?


Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #155 on: February 14, 2019, 11:11:40 pm »


Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:


What POE/MOE are you with?   The thing about getting all your renewal bonus up front...the new Gyeonggi contracts have it split. 


  • alanO
  • Adventurer

    • 32

    • March 07, 2018, 03:57:28 pm
    • Pohang
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #156 on: February 14, 2019, 11:13:10 pm »
Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:

Gyeongsangbuk-do don't get the bonus as stipulated in the email today; they won't receive it until the end of their new contracts.


Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #157 on: February 15, 2019, 08:30:30 am »
Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:

Gyeongsangbuk-do don't get the bonus as stipulated in the email today; they won't receive it until the end of their new contracts.

yes, which is actually incorrect and they (EPIK/the POE) are still trying to figure it out. It states in article 10, section 3 of both the 2018 contract and the 2019 contract that once we have successfully completed the duties of the first contract, we are to be given 1.3mil within the first month of the new term, as part of the Contract Completion Bonus. But article 11, section 2 states that we get the Renewal Bonus and Contract Completion Bonus in 2020.

I think what they are misunderstanding is that there are 2 contract completion bonuses being mentioned, article 11 is referring to completing the second (renewed) contract - that's the one we get in 2020 - but article 10 is referring to completing the first, initial contract. We should still be getting the first contract completion bonus next month. The wording of everything is just too confusing - they should've named the two differently, in my opinion.


Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #158 on: February 15, 2019, 08:58:15 am »
Signed the contract yesterday (Busan) and they're not honouring the bonus days.  They were very clear that we only get 26 days.

From the sound of it they had a lot of problems last year with NETs taking the p*ss with taking time off/asking for extra time off/wanting unpaid leave etc so they decided to really really hammer the point home this time.

They said that they are telling our schools that our vacation time takes precedence over camp which will definitely be good for a lot of us.

The 10 and 10 summer/winter split seems very set in stone and any remaining days should be taken in Spring vacation.  But at the same time the message seemed to be that as long as your school allows it you can be flexible.

Overall I feel that there is a massive disconnect between how the offices of education view the job and what actually happens in our schools.   


  • oglop
  • Hero of Waygookistan

    • 1892

    • August 25, 2011, 07:24:54 pm
    • Seoul
Re: Increased Vacation Days
« Reply #159 on: February 15, 2019, 10:19:16 am »
wanting unpaid leave etc
is this a problem? if you're just sitting at a desk doing nothing, surely it's better for both you and the MOE