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Baby It's Cold Outside
« on: December 07, 2018, 04:23:06 am »
You have all heard the news about a song entitled, "Baby It's Cold Outside." A classic Christmas
song written back in 1944. I always loved listening to old recordings of Christmas songs
including that one. In fact a number of radio stations in North America including Canadian
radio stations owned by Bell Media, Rogers, and CBC have decided to ban this song in the
wake of the #MeToo movement.

To be frank, I am not an ultraconservative or a populist facist supporter, but I think that
the banning of this Christmas song is too politically correct. Why should they ban "Baby
It's Cold Outside," and yet a number of radio stations want to keep playing hip-hop and
rap songs that glorify calling women b*#$%es and hoes? This tells you that the #MeToo
movement is hyprocritical because it has been hijacked by biased white feminists who only
care about their rights and yet they don't give a damn about black women who have been
raped, and they don't give a damn about the numbers of murderd and missing Indigenous
women. Now you see their hypocrisy?

I don't care what anybody says, I will still listen to "Baby It's Cold Outside." If you don't like
the maie role in the song being the aggressor, then damnit change the roles and make
the woman the agressor singing "Baby It's Cold Outside."

I posted it on my Facebook page with two videos. One with the man being the agressor and
the second video with the woman being the aggressor. Make no mistake, I do not condone
sexual harassment nor sexual misconduct. If anyone feels strongly about this song being
inapropriate, that's their opinion. But for me, it's just a classy and cute song that's all.
However as a music educator I still would not risk assigning a song like this for 2 talented
students to sing for a Christmas concert. Other than that, it is still too politically correct
for radio stations to ban this song from being played on the air. If BBC, NPR, or CBC want
to ban it then that's OK because these are public radio networks that always have discussions
on Sexual misconduct. But as for the private broadcasters, if they can get away with playing
rap or hip-hop songs like Niki Minaj's "Anaconda" which encourages the exploitation of women,
then they might as well play "Baby It's Cold Outside."

Merry Christmas
« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 04:27:44 am by Foreverparadise »


  • plan b
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Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2018, 07:47:48 am »

So hip hop songs that say the N word 50 times are okay, but "Baby, it Cold outside is inappropriate?"

Oh boy....


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2018, 08:09:43 am »
You have all heard the news about a song entitled, "Baby It's Cold Outside." A classic Christmas
song written back in 1944. I always loved listening to old recordings of Christmas songs
including that one. In fact a number of radio stations in North America including Canadian
radio stations owned by Bell Media, Rogers, and CBC have decided to ban this song in the
wake of the #MeToo movement.

To be frank, I am not an ultraconservative or a populist facist supporter, but I think that
the banning of this Christmas song is too politically correct. Why should they ban "Baby
It's Cold Outside," and yet a number of radio stations want to keep playing hip-hop and
rap songs that glorify calling women b*#$%es and hoes? This tells you that the #MeToo
movement is hyprocritical because it has been hijacked by biased white feminists who only
care about their rights and yet they don't give a damn about black women who have been
raped, and they don't give a damn about the numbers of murderd and missing Indigenous
women. Now you see their hypocrisy?

I don't care what anybody says, I will still listen to "Baby It's Cold Outside." If you don't like
the maie role in the song being the aggressor, then damnit change the roles and make
the woman the agressor singing "Baby It's Cold Outside."

I posted it on my Facebook page with two videos. One with the man being the agressor and
the second video with the woman being the aggressor. Make no mistake, I do not condone
sexual harassment nor sexual misconduct. If anyone feels strongly about this song being
inapropriate, that's their opinion. But for me, it's just a classy and cute song that's all.
However as a music educator I still would not risk assigning a song like this for 2 talented
students to sing for a Christmas concert. Other than that, it is still too politically correct
for radio stations to ban this song from being played on the air. If BBC, NPR, or CBC want
to ban it then that's OK because these are public radio networks that always have discussions
on Sexual misconduct. But as for the private broadcasters, if they can get away with playing
rap or hip-hop songs like Niki Minaj's "Anaconda" which encourages the exploitation of women,
then they might as well play "Baby It's Cold Outside."

Merry Christmas

I agree with you 100% on all points. Especially with regards to the #metoo movement being about a certain demographic who only care about themselves and don't really give a poop about the women who are really suffering. I would argue that these demographics are defined more by socioeconomic factors rather than strictly racial ones. Not to say that you are wrong, there is obviously a huge overlap between race and socioeconomic status.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2018, 08:12:03 am »
This is the lyric that's bothering everyone as it's triggering to survivors of date rape.

Quote
Say what's in this drink?

I'm guessing the guy put an extra shot of alcohol in the glass (since Rohypnol wasn't available at that time) but the woman sussed him out. In fact nowadays even if she knowingly drank the alcohol, then willingly shagged the guy under the influence, it'd still be considered rape by many, so maybe we should just ban all songs with women and alcohol in them.

Where's Mayorhagar with his top 5 misogynistic Christmas songs, as a follow up to his top 5 racist Aussie snacks?
« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 08:15:30 am by eggieguffer »


  • Woozy Yoyo
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Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2018, 08:23:07 am »
Taken from the internet:

"It’s time to bring an end to the Rape Anthem Masquerading As Christmas Carol

Hi there! Former English nerd/teacher here. Also a big fan of jazz of the 30s and 40s.

So. Here’s the thing. Given a cursory glance and applying today’s worldview to the song, yes, you’re right, it absolutely *sounds* like a rape anthem.

BUT! Let’s look closer!

“Hey what’s in this drink” was a stock joke at the time, and the punchline was invariably that there’s actually pretty much nothing in the drink, not even a significant amount of alcohol.

See, this woman is staying late, unchaperoned, at a dude’s house. In the 1940’s, that’s the kind of thing Good Girls aren’t supposed to do — and she wants people to think she’s a good girl. The woman in the song says outright, multiple times, that what other people will think of her staying is what she’s really concerned about: “the neighbors might think,” “my maiden aunt’s mind is vicious,” “there’s bound to be talk tomorrow.” But she’s having a really good time, and she wants to stay, and so she is excusing her uncharacteristically bold behavior (either to the guy or to herself) by blaming it on the drink — unaware that the drink is actually really weak, maybe not even alcoholic at all. That’s the joke. That is the standard joke that’s going on when a woman in media from the early-to-mid 20th century says “hey, what’s in this drink?” It is not a joke about how she’s drunk and about to be raped. It’s a joke about how she’s perfectly sober and about to have awesome consensual sex and use the drink for plausible deniability because she’s living in a society where women aren’t supposed to have sexual agency.

Basically, the song only makes sense in the context of a society in which women are expected to reject men’s advances whether they actually want to or not, and therefore it’s normal and expected for a lady’s gentleman companion to pressure her despite her protests, because he knows she would have to say that whether or not she meant it, and if she really wants to stay she won’t be able to justify doing so unless he offers her an excuse other than “I’m staying because I want to.” (That’s the main theme of the man’s lines in the song, suggesting excuses she can use when people ask later why she spent the night at his house: it was so cold out, there were no cabs available, he simply insisted because he was concerned about my safety in such awful weather, it was perfectly innocent and definitely not about sex at all!) In this particular case, he’s pretty clearly right, because the woman has a voice, and she’s using it to give all the culturally-understood signals that she actually does want to stay but can’t say so. She states explicitly that she’s resisting because she’s supposed to, not because she wants to: “I ought to say no no no…” She states explicitly that she’s just putting up a token resistance so she’ll be able to claim later that she did what’s expected of a decent woman in this situation: “at least I’m gonna say that I tried.” And at the end of the song they’re singing together, in harmony, because they’re both on the same page and they have been all along.

So it’s not actually a song about rape - in fact it’s a song about a woman finding a way to exercise sexual agency in a patriarchal society designed to stop her from doing so. But it’s also, at the same time, one of the best illustrations of rape culture that pop culture has ever produced. It’s a song about a society where women aren’t allowed to say yes…which happens to mean it’s also a society where women don’t have a clear and unambiguous way to say no."

Either way, song kinda sucks.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2018, 08:31:03 am »
Quote
So it’s not actually a song about rape - in fact it’s a song about a woman finding a way to exercise sexual agency in a patriarchal society designed to stop her from doing so.

So the patriarchal society was designed by men to stop women from getting as much casual sex as they wanted? I guess that's one way of looking at it. Another way would be that men and women mutually agreed to control their sex drives in order try and do the best thing for society. Have and bring up children in married units.


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Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2018, 08:47:14 am »
Quote
So it’s not actually a song about rape - in fact it’s a song about a woman finding a way to exercise sexual agency in a patriarchal society designed to stop her from doing so.

So the patriarchal society was designed by men to stop women from getting as much casual sex as they wanted? I guess that's one way of looking at it. Another way would be that men and women mutually agreed to control their sex drives in order try and do the best thing for society. Have and bring up children in married units.

To the former, yes. The latter, no.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2018, 09:28:11 am »
Remember the good ol days when a thread title like this was about some Canadian poster bragging about how they were still in a tshirt while the locals were in winter clothing or some teacher from Australia or SA thinking school should be canceled and freaking out?

Now it's SJW crap.


  • annataleen
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Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2018, 09:51:01 am »
Years ago when I was a university student, I worked at a home decor store at the local mall. I remember the song playing during the holiday season and thinking it sounded strange because the version our store would play, the male singer sounded much older than the female singer. She sounded like a teenager and he sounded like an old man!

I think some of it has to do with who is singing the song. There are versions of the song where the lyrics are the same, but it is clearly being sung by two adults.

On the other hand, I wouldn't care the song went away. There are plenty of other Christmas songs out there, and it's not like I am listening to other songs from the 40s, so I don't need to listen to this song either!


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2018, 09:53:24 am »
Remember the good ol days when a thread title like this was about some Canadian poster bragging about how they were still in a tshirt while the locals were in winter clothing or some teacher from Australia or SA thinking school should be canceled and freaking out?

Now it's SJW crap.

I remember the good ol days when SJWs were actually more annoying than anti-SJWs. Now THOSE were the days...


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2018, 10:04:31 am »
The most annoying posters on any thread are the ones who go to the trouble of posting comment on a discussion in order to point out that they're above the discussion.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2018, 10:21:31 am »
It's also interesting to note that in the movie when this song was first widely introduced, it was sung twice, with the roles reversed the second time, e.g., the woman being the "predator", if you will. 
"Base eight is just like base ten really, if you're missing two fingers." -Tom Lehrer


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2018, 10:31:21 am »
The most annoying posters on any thread are the ones who go to the trouble of posting comment on a discussion in order to point out that they're above the discussion.

If that was meant for me... I don't think I'm above the discussion? I'd just rather it not turn into an anti-SJW circlejerk that goes off the rails when most of the people on here already agree that the song isn't super problematic in the first place.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2018, 10:39:55 am »
The most annoying posters on any thread are the ones who go to the trouble of posting comment on a discussion in order to point out that they're above the discussion.

If that was meant for me... I don't think I'm above the discussion? I'd just rather it not turn into an anti-SJW circlejerk that goes off the rails when most of the people on here already agree that the song isn't super problematic in the first place.

You implied that the people discussing this on here are annoying. If you find the discussion annoying, don't take part in it. If you want to change the emphasis, post something that will change the emphasis. No need to have a go at anyone.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2018, 10:45:14 am »
The most annoying posters on any thread are the ones who go to the trouble of posting comment on a discussion in order to point out that they're above the discussion.

If that was meant for me... I don't think I'm above the discussion? I'd just rather it not turn into an anti-SJW circlejerk that goes off the rails when most of the people on here already agree that the song isn't super problematic in the first place.

You implied that the people discussing this on here are annoying. If you find the discussion annoying, don't take part in it. If you want to change the emphasis, post something that will change the emphasis. No need to have a go at anyone.

Oh. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that the people posting here were annoying. I see how that was implied by my anti-SJW comment. Originally, I wrote more but cut it down to that (which gave the wrong impression). I was just "having a go" at 'Tino because he was broadening the discussion to be about SJWs and I didn't really want it to go there so I tried to defuse it. Ah well.. It's all fucked now.  :cry:


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Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #15 on: December 07, 2018, 10:49:55 am »
Favourite Christmas song? Good King Wenceslas  or God rest ye merry gentlemen

Don't have a worst. Baby it's cold outside would be somewhere near the bottom though.
What I do hate is the part in "Jingle Bell Rock", I think it's like a bridge or refrain, "what a bright time, it's the right time..." Get rid of it. The rest of the song is fine.
Kpip! - Martin 2018


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #16 on: December 07, 2018, 10:54:17 am »
The most annoying posters on any thread are the ones who go to the trouble of posting comment on a discussion in order to point out that they're above the discussion.

If that was meant for me... I don't think I'm above the discussion? I'd just rather it not turn into an anti-SJW circlejerk that goes off the rails when most of the people on here already agree that the song isn't super problematic in the first place.

You implied that the people discussing this on here are annoying. If you find the discussion annoying, don't take part in it. If you want to change the emphasis, post something that will change the emphasis. No need to have a go at anyone.

Oh. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that the people posting here were annoying. I see how that was implied by my anti-SJW comment. Originally, I wrote more but cut it down to that (which gave the wrong impression). I was just "having a go" at 'Tino because he was broadening the discussion to be about SJWs and I didn't really want it to go there so I tried to defuse it. Ah well.. It's all fucked now.  :cry:

No worries


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #17 on: December 07, 2018, 10:56:34 am »
Favourite Christmas song? Good King Wenceslas  or God rest ye merry gentlemen

Don't have a worst. Baby it's cold outside would be somewhere near the bottom though.
What I do hate is the part in "Jingle Bell Rock", I think it's like a bridge or refrain, "what a bright time, it's the right time..." Get rid of it. The rest of the song is fine.

i think my favorite is "the christmas song" but i don't think i hold a grudge against any in particular...


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2018, 10:59:41 am »
Favourite Christmas song? Good King Wenceslas  or God rest ye merry gentlemen

Don't have a worst. Baby it's cold outside would be somewhere near the bottom though.
What I do hate is the part in "Jingle Bell Rock", I think it's like a bridge or refrain, "what a bright time, it's the right time..." Get rid of it. The rest of the song is fine.

i think my favorite is "the christmas song" but i don't think i hold a grudge against any in particular...

After teaching Christmas carols this week (Read: singing Jingle Bells and Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer at least fifty times), I have decided that my favorite carols are the ones that my students don't want to learn: O Holy Night, Away in a Manger, and The Christmas Song.
"Baby It's Cold Outside" is near the bottom of my list, not because of the message of the lyrics (different times, man, different times), but because it's impossible to sing by yourself without looking like an idiot trying to sing both parts.


Re: Baby It's Cold Outside
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2018, 11:00:20 am »
Favourite Christmas song? Good King Wenceslas  or God rest ye merry gentlemen

Don't have a worst. Baby it's cold outside would be somewhere near the bottom though.
What I do hate is the part in "Jingle Bell Rock", I think it's like a bridge or refrain, "what a bright time, it's the right time..." Get rid of it. The rest of the song is fine.

You don't think Good King Wenceslas is just reinforcing the patriarchal capitalistic systemic oppression of the working classes? Surely the image of the King in his palace looking out at the peasant collecting wood is not appropriate in this day and age