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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uA4ydDUsgJU

I know people are going to say "it's wonderful people are disappearing because we are so bad for the environment"

HOWEVER Elon Musk, in the above video, argues that it will be a very difficult for the few people remaining at the end of this century with most of their time being spent caring for the many elderly.

When we are aged are we going to be happy that we are being cared for by robots that mechanically turn us over to prevent bedsores?

Are we the Peter Pan generation with low birth rates in order to enjoy life actually being irresponsible?

I notice in Asia (Chinese) culture there is a social stigma with not having kids. You are labeled a "dead branch" which is a derogatory term. It at least keeps reproduction at base levels. There is no such stigma in western culture.


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2018, 04:02:30 pm »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uA4ydDUsgJU

I know people are going to say "it's wonderful people are disappearing because we are so bad for the environment"

HOWEVER Elon Musk, in the above video, argues that it will be a very difficult for the few people remaining at the end of this century with most of their time being spent caring for the many elderly.

When we are aged are we going to be happy that we are being cared for by robots that mechanically turn us over to prevent bedsores?

Are we the Peter Pan generation with low birth rates in order to enjoy life actually being irresponsible?

I notice in Asia (Chinese) culture there is a social stigma with not having kids. You are labeled a "dead branch" which is a derogatory term. It at least keeps reproduction at base levels. There is no such stigma in western culture.

I actually know more married couples that don't have or want children than those who do, so it's definitely a trend.


  • JVPrice
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2018, 07:32:28 am »
At least in America, I can see why being that it's becoming harder to make a living. Having children is a big strain on finances and time, both of which are already very limited to begin with. I personally would like a child at some point, but ain't no way in hell it's happening right now  :sad:
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 01:23:21 pm by JVPrice »
The World Ends With You


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2018, 07:47:39 am »
But he did say that (ironically) those with the least means to have children are actually the ones having children.



  • kyndo
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2018, 11:42:19 am »
This is pretty old news: Japan has been worrying about this for several decades now.
At least America has the advantage of being a multi-cultural society that's open and welcoming to immigrants. Immigration is what will offset the lower birthrate trends, and will hopefully help propagate economic growth into the future.


  • Piggydee
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2018, 02:52:26 pm »
At least in America, I can see why being that it's becoming harder to make a living. Having children is a big strain on finances and time, both of which are already very limited to begin with. I personally would like a child at some point, but ain't no way in hell it's happening right now  :sad:

Not to mention affordable housing, jobs that pay well, etc.  It seems bringing on more people might have them struggling to make ends meet in the future.


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2018, 03:21:41 pm »
Presumably house prices will come down if there is a lack of demand. And food prices as well. There are fewer people so less need for these resources.

The whole money thing is an excuse. The truly poor have no qualms about having kids. They have them and just trust God will provide or some other aphorism.


  • Kayos
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2018, 03:22:06 pm »
I think, having children is the most selfish thing people can do.
As, parent's may want to birth a child, but does that child want to be birthed? :O
Until technology catches up, and we can ask a fetus. I consider it a selfish act. One that is needed to keep our species going, but still selfish none-the-less. :P
Consent matters, and all that!

(I do say this in jest, even if I do think this way, however, no judgment from me towards those who have, or want, children)


  • Kayos
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2018, 03:23:37 pm »
This is pretty old news: Japan has been worrying about this for several decades now.
At least America has the advantage of being a multi-cultural society that's open and welcoming to immigrants. Immigration is what will offset the lower birthrate trends, and will hopefully help propagate economic growth into the future.

But, a certain, higher up person, in the US government, is trying hard to prevent and stop immigrants. :P


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2018, 03:30:40 pm »
I think, having children is the most selfish thing people can do.
As, parent's may want to birth a child, but does that child want to be birthed? :O
Until technology catches up, and we can ask a fetus. I consider it a selfish act. One that is needed to keep our species going, but still selfish none-the-less. :P
Consent matters, and all that!

(I do say this in jest, even if I do think this way, however, no judgment from me towards those who have, or want, children)

You writing me that reminded me of this skit. Pretty funny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcx-nf3kH_M


  • Kolao
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2018, 08:42:48 am »
I think anyone who would tell someone they are selfish for not having kids is in the running for the most ignorant person in human history.

I don't have kids because of three primary reasons: (1) I simply don't like kids. I don't like being around them and I don't like them being around me because at some point there will be whining and drama and I hate that (2) I wanted my life to be free. Free to do what I wanted when I wanted with no baggage holding me back (3) When I was a young boy my favourite uncle was a confirmed childless bachelor who taught me much wisdom and many valuable lessons about life and how to live it. Most importantly, he taught me the vital importance of having an adult you could talk to about any and all issues plaguing a young developing mind and personality without restraint or inhibition. From drugs to sex, everything we talked about was easy and amiable because he didn't have the built in child filter that parents have. He talked to me like a friend despite our age difference.

Because of Ralph it was confirmed in my mind I wouldn't have kids but would be free and would be the coolest uncle around. I am. It has, ironically, made me a much better teacher as well. I am very fortunate to teach highly motivated and extremely capable students. I did my time in Korea teaching the opposite! We have a rapport unobtainable for most in the ESL business in my opinion. In part due to their intelligence and quest for more coupled with a deep seated mutual respect which stems from my having no kids. They ask me questions and we discuss things they would be too shy or wary of discussing or asking another adult. I talk to them like they're people, not students. I speak to them the exact same way I speak to the friends and colleagues I hang out with.

Of the 18 students I taught last year, 4 have gone to university abroad: Australia, USA,  2 to Canada. All got scholarships and 1 had a full ride. 17 wrote the IGCSE exam and all passed. The only teacher who can claim that. 

There are situations where not having kids is the most responsible thing a person can do. Such is mine.
When the wicked are confounded, and consigned to flames of woe, call me.


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2018, 10:10:06 am »
Quote
I think anyone who would tell someone they are selfish for not having kids is in the running for the most ignorant person in human history.

People who say this are probably those who had kids and didn't like it. I'm sure there are quite a few of those around. People who have kids and find the experience rewarding don't see it as a burden to shoulder. They tend to annoy people in other ways by banging on about how wonderful it is.   

However,

Quote
I don't have kids because of three primary reasons: (1) I simply don't like kids. I don't like being around them and I don't like them being around me because at some point there will be whining and drama and I hate that (2) I wanted my life to be free. Free to do what I wanted when I wanted with no baggage holding me back

People like you in the west are fast becoming the norm, not the exception. If this continues we will have to accept our countries will change demographically and culturally. For many people this isn't an issue, or even a positive thing, though a recent survey about homosexuality in the UK found that attitudes were much less tolerant in the London area - due to the high Muslim population there. This is how European civilization will gradually change as a result of low birth rates in some demographics. . 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2018, 10:42:05 am by eggieguffer »


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2018, 10:53:05 am »
It's sad that kids are seen as a resource for mopping up the messes and fixing the mistakes of the previous generation.

10 years down the line:

"Daddy, why aren't we in the EU?"

"Because your grandfather and his cronies were racist, short sighted, naive, gullible and selfish."

"Daddy is it true that healthcare used to be free?"

"Yes, but now it isn't,  so cook some meth so we can treat your cancer"



Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2018, 11:49:41 am »
It's sad that kids are seen as a resource for mopping up the messes and fixing the mistakes of the previous generation.

10 years down the line:

"Daddy, why aren't we in the EU?"

"Because your grandfather and his cronies were racist, short sighted, naive, gullible and selfish."

"Daddy is it true that healthcare used to be free?"

"Yes, but now it isn't,  so cook some meth so we can treat your cancer"

Daddy, Daddy, why did previous generations leave us 1.8 trillion pounds in debt?

Because the politicians  spunked a load of money they didn't have on 'free' stuff to make us vote for them. And we all went along with it.'


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2018, 12:57:40 pm »

Of the 18 students I taught last year, 4 have gone to university abroad: Australia, USA,  2 to Canada. All got scholarships and 1 had a full ride. 17 wrote the IGCSE exam and all passed. The only teacher who can claim that. 

There are situations where not having kids is the most responsible thing a person can do. Such is mine.

Okay so you posted this to demonstrate the feeling of accomplishment of educating the next generation. The point is SOMEBODY decided to have kids. Somebody decided to produce new human beings for you to teach. The same with you being an uncle. Your brother or sister decided to have kids. Therefore you have the chance to be a great uncle.

I'm not saying your attitude is wrong (i as a teacher get super frustrated with idiotic behavior) but if everyone makes choices similar to yours then that is when civilization begins to collapse.

It really is as simple as this - no children no future.


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2018, 12:58:57 pm »
People laugh, but robots.



Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2018, 10:15:14 pm »
I think, having children is the most selfish thing people can do.
As, parent's may want to birth a child, but does that child want to be birthed? :O
Until technology catches up, and we can ask a fetus. I consider it a selfish act. One that is needed to keep our species going, but still selfish none-the-less. :P
Consent matters, and all that!

(I do say this in jest, even if I do think this way, however, no judgment from me towards those who have, or want, children)

It can be,  but it mostly depends on the parents' attitudes towards their future role as parents.

  If a person/couple is/are willing to be  good parents and to take on the responsibility of rearing a child into this chaotic world,  I salute them.  If on the other hand, they simply are going to ignore their responsibilities and then blame society for their own failure ...
well, I think you know where I'm going with this.   There are far too many that fall into the latter category in my
overly self-aggrandizing opinion.   :wink:
« Last Edit: August 15, 2018, 10:43:58 pm by some waygug-in »


  • kyndo
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Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2018, 09:30:28 am »
People laugh, but robots.

Not at all! Just go to Google and type in the keywords "Japan Robots Care" and there will be oodles of hits about how robots are the future of elderly care, the potential saviour of the coming employment crisis etc etc.

For example, this.


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #18 on: August 16, 2018, 09:44:52 am »
People laugh, but robots.

Not at all! Just go to Google and type in the keywords "Japan Robots Care" and there will be oodles of hits about how robots are the future of elderly care, the potential saviour of the coming employment crisis etc etc.

For example, this.

Yeah, pretty soon "Chappie" is going to be a reality.

And this is how machines REALLY take over the world -- by peacefully waiting out the decline of the human population.


Re: Is remaining childless irresponsible? Elon Musk on Demographics
« Reply #19 on: August 16, 2018, 10:09:11 am »
People laugh, but robots.

Not at all! Just go to Google and type in the keywords "Japan Robots Care" and there will be oodles of hits about how robots are the future of elderly care, the potential saviour of the coming employment crisis etc etc.

For example, this.

No doubt they're going to put prostitutes out of a job as well before very long.