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International => North America => USA => Topic started by: PaulineMacLeod on January 09, 2021, 12:17:10 pm

Title: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: PaulineMacLeod on January 09, 2021, 12:17:10 pm
Although I'm Canadian, I must say that I am absolutely delighted with this long-overdue decision. One of my American friends was crying because some people in Korea poke fun at her for belonging to a nation led by a racist who incites violence. But now, I think the healing will begin for her and similarly situated Americans in Korea.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 09, 2021, 12:35:40 pm
I don't like to bandy the word 'snowflake' around too much these days due to its overuse but I reckon your friend would definitely qualify under the original definition.  :smiley:
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: PaulineMacLeod on January 09, 2021, 12:46:06 pm
Well, even if my friend were to qualify under the original definition of a snowflake, I suspect that the more important snowflake to consider is Donald Trump himself. This twitter permanent suspension is perhaps one of the rare moments in which he's been told "no" for like the first time in his life. (The other times being the divorces of his previous wives.)

But I shudder when I think about how he might reply to this ban. Fortunately, extremist right-wing messaging boards like Parler have been removed from Google Play too.

I definitely do NOT want to bash the Republican Party of the United States; there are many good Republicans in the party. And the United States needs an ideological Republican Party of thoughtful people who respect the rule of law, and not a Trump social media cult. It wouldn't be healthy for American democracy to have two wildly different political parties, with one favoring the use of facts and the other one living in a (to put it euphemistically) fantasy-land of "alternative facts." The US-ROK alliance depends on a sound and fact-based consensus of both the Republican and Democratic parties of the United States.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 09, 2021, 01:17:41 pm

https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html (https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html)

It looks like a very sensible and well reasoned position, if not a little overdue.

Quote
Plans for future armed protests have already begun proliferating on and off-Twitter, including a proposed secondary attack on the US Capitol and state capitol buildings on January 17, 2021.

The potential for more violence still exists and they have to act responsibly.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 09, 2021, 04:09:34 pm
I don't like to bandy the word 'snowflake' around too much these days due to its overuse but I reckon your friend would definitely qualify under the original definition.  :smiley:

(https://i.imgur.com/CqafOFx.jpg)
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 09, 2021, 04:48:15 pm
Not sure what your airship pictures are all about, but I can assure you I am 100% certain that under no circumstances would I ever burst into tears over someone having a go at Boris Johnson.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 09, 2021, 06:05:34 pm
You get butthurt about black Americans wanting to be treated like human beings despite being a Brit living in Korea. Also you got butthurt about Trump's "freedom of speech" after he got banned by Twitter (a private company) for inciting domestic terrorism.

Quit being a snowflake.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 09, 2021, 06:21:37 pm
You get butthurt about black Americans wanting to be treated like human beings despite being a Brit living in Korea. Also you got butthurt about Trump's "freedom of speech" after he got banned by Twitter (a private company) for inciting domestic terrorism.

Quit being a snowflake.

Yeah, you see you're using the more recent definition of 'snowflake' which is someone who expresses an opinion about something you disagree with. I was referring to the original meaning  of 'snowflake' which is someone who gets emotionally upset about something to the extent that they can't deal with it.  It's useful to make the distinction, otherwise I can just accuse you of being butt hurt for complaining about things Trump says or moaning about me talking about BLM (the language you use e.g. 'black Americans wanting to be treated like human beings ' is far more indicative of this) and being a snowflake for objecting to me raising the question of freedom of speech and it can go round and round and get rather tedious. Do you see what I mean?  No, probably not.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 09, 2021, 09:35:01 pm
A sexual predator, a traitor and a conman walk into a bar.



The bartender says, "What can I get you, Mr. President?"
 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: PaulineMacLeod on January 10, 2021, 02:04:23 am
In these very difficult times, I would hesitate to casually toss the label of "snowflake" to American expats like my friend in South Korea who honestly cry when they are mocked (in Korea) for coming from a country represented by Donald Trump.

And it's important to remember that the extreme fringes of Trump's most fervent supporters have a little too many uncomfortably awkward (and that's me trying to put a "positive spin" on this) connections to ill-informed (and that's again my frail attempt to euphemistically describe it!) groups like QAnon, One America News Network, and other white nationalists.

In a recently published New York Times article ("Confederate Battle Flag an Unnerving Sight in Capitol, 1/9/2021"), we are told that a Muslim-American student CRIED upon the sight of a Confederate Battle Flag in the capitol. Banning Trump on Twitter should serve as a warning to people who traffic in sedition, treason, and insurrection. People are free to disagree with the laws of the former British colonies of North America, but people are NOT free to disobey those laws.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on January 10, 2021, 06:19:44 am
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErQPCESVoAImbsZ.jpg)

He has a point.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: confusedsafferinkorea on January 10, 2021, 06:23:30 am
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErQPCESVoAImbsZ.jpg)

He has a point.

Yes, I guess Xi can tweet too.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 06:38:21 am
Yes, I guess Xi can tweet too.

Neither the Ayatollah nor Xi incited an insurrection at the Capitol building last Wednesday where five people lost their lives, including a police officer. If they had their way that mob would've lynched the vice president. A lot of the perpetrators were stupid enough to stream it live on social media.
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/reuters-photographer-says-pro-trump-rioters-wanted-to-hang-pence-2021-1?r=US&IR=T (https://www.businessinsider.com.au/reuters-photographer-says-pro-trump-rioters-wanted-to-hang-pence-2021-1?r=US&IR=T)
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2021/01/trump-rioters-wanted-more-violence-worse/617614 (https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2021/01/trump-rioters-wanted-more-violence-worse/617614)
There is evidence to suggest that this mob was looking to take hostages.
https://lenexweb.com/insurrectionists-didnt-just-come-to-invade-the-capitol-some-were-planning-to-take-hostages/ (https://lenexweb.com/insurrectionists-didnt-just-come-to-invade-the-capitol-some-were-planning-to-take-hostages/)

I guess Twitter believes Trump is a greater threat to National security at present based on the available evidence.
Does this help to alleviate the confusion?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on January 10, 2021, 07:49:50 am
Thank you GOP for your supreme Court decision dictating religious nutcases can refuse to bake cakes for gay weddings.

As always, when it comes to Conservatives...it's "free speech for me...none for thee!“
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 10, 2021, 08:18:53 am
I think you need to read up on what freedom of speech entails. Having freedom of speech does not enable you to force someone to make a cake.  As Jordan Peterson had to explain again and again to people who were too stupid or unwilling to get it, he was arguing against enforced speech not the government telling him what he couldn't say (cue some inane comment from someone like Mayorhaggar at this point about lobsters/tidying your room) Telling people they have to do something against their religious beliefs goes against liberal democracy and I'm pretty sure if a government tried to force Muslim shop owners to sell pork or something, you'd be up in arms against it.

A freedom of speech issue would be something like this

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2593217/Christian-preacher-wins-13-000-wrongful-arrest-telling-gay-couple-Bible-says-homosexuality-sin.html

when a preacher was arrested for quoting the bible (which was later overturned) I'm guessing you and several others on this site would agree with the police action on this occasion, I personally wouldn't (no Mayorhaggar that doesn't mean I'm homophobic)

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 08:27:43 am
Quote
Pretty bad day for freedom of speech too. No matter what you think about Trump.

I think you need to read up on what freedom of speech entails. Having freedom of speech does not entail the freedom to incite violence.  Many Supreme Court cases upholding restrictions on speech believed to be subversive have relied on the idea that such speech is forbidden because it incites, or is likely to lead to, violence or illegal actions.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 10, 2021, 08:31:22 am

I think you need to read up on what freedom of speech entails. Having freedom of speech does not entail the freedom to incite violence.  Many Supreme Court cases upholding restrictions on speech believed to be subversive have relied on the idea that such speech is forbidden because it incites, or is likely to lead to, violence or illegal actions.

True, freedom of speech does not entail incitement to violence and if Trump did this he should be taken to task. My issue,was whether Twitter should be acting as a publisher or a platform as someone else I think DM pointed out. The incitement to violence definition is growing wider and wider every day and nowadays often just includes opinions that go against the orthodoxy. E.g. Google removing videos containing lockdown skepticism from a regulated UK news outlet.  If Twitter is going to keep banning people under this umbrella heading, it's a bad thing for freedom of speech IMO.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: oglop on January 10, 2021, 08:44:18 am
yeah i agree with stoat. since when did social media websites become arbiters of what is deemed okay or not? seems to becoming a trend
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 09:08:11 am
True freedom of speech does not entail incitement to violence and if Trump did this he should be taken to task. My issue,was whether Twitter should be acting as a publisher or a platform as someone else I think DM pointed out.

What about just acting as a responsible corporate citizen rather than yet another complicit enabler? It's not as though he wasn't warned. 

Nonetheless, perhaps you should clarify your position though because it appears a little contradictory. If you would prefer that laws are passed that deprive tech companies of liable protections for third-party comments, ie. removal of section 230 protections, as Trump has threatened to do,  then are you in favour the potential for more subversion of free speech not less.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 10, 2021, 11:29:20 am
Neither the Ayatollah nor Xi incited an insurrection at the Capitol building last Wednesday where five people lost their lives, including a police officer.
I guess Twitter believes Trump is a greater threat to National security at present based on the available evidence.
Does this help to alleviate the confusion?
The fact that you think that what happened at the capitol is worse than a government pledged to eradicate the nation of Israel or the CCP and its genocide, says all we need to know about your thought process and to what degree it's controlled by the media.

If you and twitter think Trump and what happened is a graver threat, I don't know what to say.

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 10, 2021, 11:31:56 am
What about just acting as a responsible corporate citizen rather than yet another complicit enabler?
How about platform vs. publisher? That's the standard we use because it's objective, not subjective.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 10, 2021, 11:50:44 am
Yeah, you see you're using the more recent definition of 'snowflake' which is someone who expresses an opinion about something you disagree with. I was referring to the original meaning  of 'snowflake' which is someone who gets emotionally upset about something to the extent that they can't deal with it.  It's useful to make the distinction, otherwise I can just accuse you of being butt hurt for complaining about things Trump says or moaning about me talking about BLM (the language you use e.g. 'black Americans wanting to be treated like human beings ' is far more indicative of this) and being a snowflake for objecting to me raising the question of freedom of speech and it can go round and round and get rather tedious. Do you see what I mean?  No, probably not.

ok boomer
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 10, 2021, 11:51:34 am
(Lindsay Graham posting disingenuous crap to distract people)

He has a point.

Ok so let's ban Trump, the Ayatollah and Xi from Twitter. Great idea, thanks, I completely agree with you.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 10, 2021, 11:54:27 am
Well, even if my friend were to qualify under the original definition of a snowflake, I suspect that the more important snowflake to consider is Donald Trump himself. This twitter permanent suspension is perhaps one of the rare moments in which he's been told "no" for like the first time in his life. (The other times being the divorces of his previous wives.)

But I shudder when I think about how he might reply to this ban. Fortunately, extremist right-wing messaging boards like Parler have been removed from Google Play too.

I definitely do NOT want to bash the Republican Party of the United States; there are many good Republicans in the party. And the United States needs an ideological Republican Party of thoughtful people who respect the rule of law, and not a Trump social media cult. It wouldn't be healthy for American democracy to have two wildly different political parties, with one favoring the use of facts and the other one living in a (to put it euphemistically) fantasy-land of "alternative facts." The US-ROK alliance depends on a sound and fact-based consensus of both the Republican and Democratic parties of the United States.
A series of questions for you-
1) Do you believe that fraudulent elections take place in other countries around the world?
2) Do you believe our technology is substantively different compared to those other countries?
3) If it IS different, is that because it is based on computers? Old-style scan ballots? Different ones? In either case are they tamper proof based on world history?
4) Who gets to decide if an election has vote fraud taking place in other countries? Is it twitter? Is it only Western countries (who rigged plenty of elections around the world in the Cold War and happens to be the job of one of Trump's biggest foes- The CIA)?
5) Given twitters global reach, as well as its use during various civil protests, do you think having twitter as that arbiter is a good thing?
6) Given the points above, is it completely illegitimate for people to have questions about the election?
7) Doesn't banning dispute of the election results and any talk about them only further deepen the suspicion that its illegitimate?

"The right-wing authoritarian and nationalist Gen. Krull won a narrow election victory, defeating the hopeful progressive, President Sunshine. Although Sunshine lead throughout much of the night, a late surge in ballots counted at 2AM came in overwhelmingly for Krull. Experts have explained that this is due to the way mail-in ballots are counted and the unreported precincts being Krull's strongest base of support- the slums of the big cities. President Sunshine has called for a full audit, but various states are refusing. The media has denounced President Sunshine's claims of potential fraud as "baseless". Twitter pledged to flag or delete tweets challenging the legitimacy of the election and many are calling for President Sunshine to be banned from twitter so that General Krull may peacefully take over.

Krull has called on Sunshine to accept the results and embrace the voice of the people as they demand a return to normal and strength, order, booming business, speech codes and proper authority.

Do you think twitter stepping in and flagging tweets and issuing bans would be appropriate here?

This is your position at its logical conclusion.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 10, 2021, 11:57:11 am
You get butthurt about black Americans wanting to be treated like human beings despite being a Brit living in Korea. Also you got butthurt about Trump's "freedom of speech" after he got banned by Twitter (a private company) for inciting domestic terrorism.

Quit being a snowflake.
MayorHaggar, you're the last person on this board to lecture anyone about bigotry.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 10, 2021, 12:00:52 pm
I think you need to read up on what freedom of speech entails.

The first amendment blocks the federal government from controlling or censoring the speech of private individuals.

The first amendment does not prevent a private company like Twitter from enforcing its own terms of service and controlling or censoring the speech of users.

Anyone crying about "freedom of speech" is completely wrong when it comes to Twitter or other companies banning users like Trump for violating their terms of service.

You can argue about the terms of service but that is a contractual matter, and is absoluetely not a first amendment free speech issue. For instance we can't talk about religion here because the site admins have decreed it so. The US government does not run waygook.org and has no control over its user content.

An actual freedom of speech issue would be if a US state or the US Congress passed a law banning certain speech on Twitter. Or if a politician asked Twitter to ban certain users. (pretty sure Trump has done this but I could be wrong, he certainly tells his chud army to attack journalists all the time)

Just wanted to clear that up because we have a lot of uneducated people and non-Americans who don't understand what "free speech" means in the USA.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 10, 2021, 12:01:27 pm
MayorHaggar, you're the last person on this board to lecture anyone about bigotry.

ok boomer, so basically you have no argument
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 12:38:26 pm
Quote
I guess Twitter believes Trump is a greater threat to National security at present based on the available evidence.

https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html (https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html)

The fact that you think that what happened at the capitol is worse than a government pledged to eradicate the nation of Israel or the CCP and its genocide.



You do love making sh*t up don't you or is it a literacy issue ?  :laugh: Is it any wonder why so few people take you seriously.

Do you still think the events of last Wednesday will be forgotten by the super bowl?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Savant on January 10, 2021, 01:22:41 pm
https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html (https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html)

You do love making sh*t up don't you or is it a literacy issue ?  :laugh: Is it any wonder why so few people take you seriously.

I've always considered it as a mental issue with Marty.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 10, 2021, 01:27:07 pm

If you and twitter think Trump and what happened is a graver threat, I don't know what to say.



Then how abouts clamming up and going away?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 10, 2021, 02:22:43 pm
How about platform vs. publisher? That's the standard we use because it's objective, not subjective.

I'm curious as to whether you're aware that the idiot you've been defending for four years wants to abolish the legal provisions allowing social media platforms to avoid liability, thus making it likely that they would become far more interventionist in content moderation in order to avoid lawsuits.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: PaulineMacLeod on January 10, 2021, 03:55:45 pm
As Mr. DeMartino has directly replied to our last post, we wish to answer some of his questions, but we feel scared of a TL/DR reaction. We will therefore only answer the individual's hypothetical question, a question that concerns a hypothetical victory of conservative "General Krull" against a progressive "President Sunshine."

Assuming that your question pertains solely to a Western-style democracy, then we must insist on consistency. If "President Sunshine" seemed completely unhinged from reality and if "President Sunshine" offered baseless tweets contesting the legitimacy of a fair election, then yes---Twitter should flag the tweets of "President Sunshine" as divorced from the facts.

But Hillary Clinton (a rough analogue for "President Sunshine" here) never called for insurrection against the Capitol building. And neither did Al Gore.

We understand that right-leaning people in the former American colonies sense a bias against media perceived as left-leaning. But we suspect that these perceptions partly relate to a phenomenon known as "asymmetric polarization," a concept carefully vetted in peer-reviewed academic research. To make a (very) long story short, Republicans have become more ideologically extreme than Democrats in the United States because of the phenomenon of "asymmetric polarization." And so Republicans (justifiably or unjustifiably) will feel ignored by journalists and other vessels for the dissemination of information.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on January 10, 2021, 03:58:26 pm
I think you need to read up on what freedom of speech entails. Having freedom of speech does not enable you to force someone to make a cake.  As Jordan Peterson had to explain again and again to people who were too stupid or unwilling to get it, he was arguing against enforced speech not the government telling him what he couldn't say (cue some inane comment from someone like Mayorhaggar at this point about lobsters/tidying your room) Telling people they have to do something against their religious beliefs goes against liberal democracy and I'm pretty sure if a government tried to force Muslim shop owners to sell pork or something, you'd be up in arms against it.

A freedom of speech issue would be something like this

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2593217/Christian-preacher-wins-13-000-wrongful-arrest-telling-gay-couple-Bible-says-homosexuality-sin.html

when a preacher was arrested for quoting the bible (which was later overturned) I'm guessing you and several others on this site would agree with the police action on this occasion, I personally wouldn't (no Mayorhaggar that doesn't mean I'm homophobic)



As always, you deliberately or unwittingly missed the point of the post.

Carry on with your fear!
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: confusedsafferinkorea on January 10, 2021, 04:33:46 pm
Neither the Ayatollah nor Xi incited an insurrection at the Capitol building last Wednesday where five people lost their lives

Yeah, I guess murdering Falun Gong, Christians and Muslims, putting 2 million Uyghurs in concentration camps, forced sterilization of Uyghur women, forced organ harvesting by Xi, pales in comparison to what Trump did.    :undecided: :undecided: :undecided:

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 04:41:03 pm
Neither the Ayatollah nor Xi incited an insurrection at the Capitol building last Wednesday where five people lost their lives
I guess Twitter believes Trump is a greater threat to National security at present based on the available evidence.


Yeah, I guess murdering Falun Gong, Christians and Muslims, putting 2 million Uyghurs in concentration camps, forced sterilization of Uyghur women, forced organ harvesting by Xi, pales in comparison to what Trump did.    :undecided: :undecided: :undecided:
 A red herring
(https://www.comedy.co.uk/images/library/fringe/2019/250x250/red_herring.jpg)



I guess you're not an American? How is this an immediate  threat to their national security? 
Do you think  the CCP give a rat arse  about twitter? Ever heard of WeChat?
How many Chinese people do you know?  :-*
Ever watch Geoffrey Robertson's Hypotheticals? :laugh:
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: confusedsafferinkorea on January 10, 2021, 06:22:25 pm

I guess you're not an American? How is this an immediate  threat to their national security? 
Do you think  the CCP give a rat arse  about twitter? Ever heard of WeChat?
How many Chinese people do you know?  :-*
Ever watch Geoffrey Robertson's Hypotheticals? :laugh:

Well to answer your question about how many Chinese I know, a lot, I lived there for more than 2 years and still have many Chinese friends. Whether or not the CCP gives a rats ass about Twitter, see their latest Tweet about Uyghur women now no longer being baby making machines since they are now in concentration camps.

You can laugh all you want, but though the CCP isn't a direct threat YET, they most certainly are becoming more and more of a threat. Your point is moot by the way, we are talking about principles here, ban Trump because some people rioted but allow the CCP to tweet despite their human rights abuses.
Then again I have principles about human rights abuses, perhaps you don't??
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: confusedsafferinkorea on January 10, 2021, 06:30:20 pm
DM, this is one of the occasions where you and I really agree, Adel is living in a bubble (la-la land) where she thinks the whole of America is irreversibly damaged by last Wednesday and nothing else in the world matters.

This too shall pass. Am I condoning what happened? Of course not, Adel, but it's not the end of the world and Trump is certainly NOT in the league of the people under discussion.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 07:04:15 pm
Well to answer your question about how many Chinese I know, a lot, I lived there for more than 2 years and still have many Chinese friends. Whether or not the CCP gives a rats ass about Twitter, see their latest Tweet about Uyghur women now no longer being baby making machines since they are now in concentration camps.

You can laugh all you want, but though the CCP isn't a direct threat YET, they most certainly are becoming more and more of a threat. Your point is moot by the way, we are talking about principles here, ban Trump because some people rioted but allow the CCP to tweet despite their human rights abuses.
Then again I have principles about human rights abuses, perhaps you don't??

Dude, I've been teaching Chinese students for the last eight years. I have a lot of Chinese friends who regularly visit my home. A lot of them share my concerns regarding  Uyghurs and their cultural genocide but very few of them use twitter. They often ask me to engage with them via WeChat but I decline.

Nonetheless all of this is beside the point with regard to the immediate security threat that twitter, a private company , has decided that Trump has become to the United States. I agree that the CCP are an evil bunch of c**ts but their are infinite number evil c**ts in the world. Whether they are better or worse is than Donald Trump would make for an an interesting debating topic but it isn't the relevant to the topic at hand. Ie should Trump be banned from twitter after inciting his followers to commit an insurrection and prevented from committing any further seditiously violent acts.

Perhaps you are privy to greater logistical intel than twitter and better informed to make such judgments regarding the likelihood of further violence . I don't pretend to be better informed than twitter so I'll respect their judgment on this one.
 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 10, 2021, 07:56:23 pm
DM, this is one of the occasions where you and I really agree, Adel is living in a bubble (la-la land) where she thinks the whole of America is irreversibly damaged by last Wednesday and nothing else in the world matters.

This too shall pass. Am I condoning what happened? Of course not, Adel, but it's not the end of the world and Trump is certainly NOT in the league of the people under discussion.

But perhaps that's because 1) the US has a much better set of firewalls against totalitarianism, and 2) Trump is just so crap at everything he turns his hand to, except whipping up uneducated people (the ones he loves)  with ad baculum arguments.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Aristocrat on January 10, 2021, 08:15:45 pm
Why does Twitter ban Trump and not CCP propaganda? It's simply a question of money, it always has been.

Trump was the leader of a Democratic nation. Before, during and after is term he amasses a sizeable following as well as a sizeable opposition and companies have decided and concluded that
they make more money by pandering to Trump's opposition than his support base. Trump and his support base are also not particularly harmful to said companies image meaning Twitter can do what they please.

Enter the CCP...

Leaders, groups and people from Democratic nations can, for the most part, handle criticism and discourse. The CCP can not and they will brutally fight back at any hint of criticism and cause significant financial damage
to companies like Twitter should they get on the CCP's bad side.

Twitter will ban Trump because they'll make more money, they wont touch the CCP because they'll lose a sh*t ton of money. Not politics, economics.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: L I on January 10, 2021, 08:29:08 pm
Twitter has removed more than 170,000 accounts it says were tied to an operation to spread pro-China messages.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-53018455

Twitter also revealed it has shut down more than a thousand Russia-based misinformation accounts.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 10, 2021, 08:48:55 pm
* spoiler alert for onlookers.

We all know Twitter is already blocked in China and to use it requires paying for a VPN but I vote we change the name of this thread to Geoffrey Robertson's Hypotheticals and be done with it because it's completely relevant for a Twitter addict like Trump to know if he's more evil than Xi.

 :laugh:

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on January 10, 2021, 10:36:17 pm
That two tech billionaires in California are the ones to finally shut trump down tells you a lot about the US.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on January 10, 2021, 11:47:30 pm
"Trump wins title of Americans’ most admired man in annual survey"
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/12/29/trump-gallup-most-admired-452126

And now he's a free-speech martyr too.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on January 11, 2021, 01:57:40 am
"Trump wins title of Americans’ most admired man in annual survey"
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/12/29/trump-gallup-most-admired-452126

And now he's a free-speech martyr too.
Only in the eyes of the deluded.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 11, 2021, 06:16:45 am
"Trump wins title of Americans’ most admired man in annual survey"
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/12/29/trump-gallup-most-admired-452126

And now he's a free-speech martyr too.
With the blood of this police officer on his hands

(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS5fSzG-Z37B4tztE_FZxUziY8m2IdvslKm5A&usqp=CAU)
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: confusedsafferinkorea on January 11, 2021, 08:16:02 am
Adel, we get it, you hate Trump. I am not suggesting they shouldn't have banned him, I am just  saying what is sauce  for the goose is sauce for the ganda.

Aristocat is right, it's all about money and that is why the EU is negotiating with a government that  is worse than Hitler.

By the way, having Chinese students is  not the same as living in China.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 11, 2021, 08:38:24 am
In case you missed it, Twitter did remove that post from the Chinese Embassy. Twitter and other platforms don't make these decisions based on a person's character, but whether a person violates terms of service and how this is likely to reflect on the companies.

Regarding Trump, Twitter obviously made the calculation that the censorship blowback would be less severe than the blowback from allowing him to continue propagating lies about election fraud and possibly inciting another riot. A simple business decision. That's it. When you agree to their Ts & Cs you relinquish the expectation that you are operating with an absolute right to free speech. I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand.

A message for conservatives: The way this stuff works is exactly how it's supposed to in the economic system that you lionize. A private company makes its own decisions with a minimum of government interference. If you don't like one product (i.e., Twitter), you are free to choose another.

I know that the stock response to this is "But they're monopolies!" Well, that's an antitrust issue, not a free speech one. It's also a legal definition which hasn't been determined in court. Until then, they're not monopolies just because you say so. There's a case to be made against companies like Google, Facebook and Amazon for engaging in anti-competitive practices, such as buying up and then dissolving competitors. In Twitter's case, it's simply a very popular app.

Trump continued using Twitter to lie about his election "victory" even after the riot at the Capitol. Five people are dead because of his fool's errand election fraud nonsense. If you support someone's right to refuse to bake a wedding cake for a gay couple, you should also support Twitter's right to quit hosting Trump's dangerous bullshit. No shirt, no shoes, no service.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 11, 2021, 08:50:40 am
In case you missed it, Twitter did remove that post from the Chinese Embassy. Twitter and other platforms don't make these decisions based on a person's character, but whether a person violates terms of service and how this is likely to reflect on the companies.

Regarding Trump, Twitter obviously made the calculation that the censorship blowback would be less severe than the blowback from allowing him to continue propagating lies about election fraud and possibly inciting another riot. A simple business decision. That's it. When you agree to their Ts & Cs you relinquish the expectation that you are operating with an absolute right to free speech. I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand.

A message for conservatives: The way this stuff works is exactly how it's supposed to in the economic system that you lionize. A private company makes its own decisions with a minimum of government interference. If you don't like one product (i.e., Twitter), you are free to choose another.

I know that the stock response to this is "But they're monopolies!" Well, that's an antitrust issue, not a free speech one. It's also a legal definition which hasn't been determined in court. Until then, they're not monopolies just because you say so. There's a case to be made against companies like Google, Facebook and Amazon for engaging in anti-competitive practices, such as buying up and then dissolving competitors. In Twitter's case, it's simply a very popular app.

Trump continued using Twitter to lie about his election "victory" even after the riot at the Capitol. If you support someone's right to refuse to bake a wedding cake for a gay couple, you should also support Twitter's right to quit hosting Trump's dangerous bullshit. No shirt, no shoes, no service.

I agree with everything you've put here except that one last bit.

It's not like refusing to bake a gay wedding cake--that's discrimination.

What it's like is a bartender kicking out a drunk guy who is trying pick fights with other patrons.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 11, 2021, 11:35:27 am
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErQPCESVoAImbsZ.jpg)

He has a point.

"Twitter may ban me for this..."

A commonplace delusion of grandeur held by professional victims. File next to "YouTube tried to ban this video!"
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on January 11, 2021, 12:09:20 pm
1984. 

What is it that they are so desperate to hide and to prevent being put out?  What is it behind this fake smoke screen that the elites are so afraid of that they must shut down and silence any speech that is not theirs? 

Trump saying he won't go to a Biden inauguration?  Inciting a riot that comment is?  Really?  If I say I am not going to Seoul this weekend, am I inciting a riot too?  No, it means I am letting folks know what I am doing in advance as a courtesy.  Either the woke pussies at Twitter are wearing tin foil hats and imagining words that were never said or this is a deliberate excuse to shut people up to cover up what is about to come out. 

Trump will still be President and many corrupt people will be going to jail for this. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on January 11, 2021, 12:17:30 pm
Trump will still be President

i wonder what it's like to live so deeply in delusion
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on January 11, 2021, 12:28:07 pm
i wonder what it's like to live so deeply in delusion

I'll remind you at the end of the month and invite you back to reality. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on January 11, 2021, 12:43:16 pm
get a load of this guy! :laugh: but yeah sure yeah remind me in 9 days
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 11, 2021, 01:17:07 pm
1984. 

What is it that they are so desperate to hide and to prevent being put out?  What is it behind this fake smoke screen that the elites are so afraid of that they must shut down and silence any speech that is not theirs?   

Turns out Americans are fed up with conspiracy theorists like you who just tried to assassinate members of Congress and the vp.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 11, 2021, 01:22:57 pm
I'll remind you at the end of the month and invite you back to reality. 
Dude, you are the type of deluded that's going to make me happily vote Democrat in 2024 because you and the right will be as hysterical as the left was during Trump's time.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 11, 2021, 01:25:00 pm
The first amendment blocks the federal government from controlling or censoring the speech of private individuals.

The first amendment does not prevent a private company like Twitter from enforcing its own terms of service and controlling or censoring the speech of users.

Anyone crying about "freedom of speech" is completely wrong when it comes to Twitter or other companies banning users like Trump for violating their terms of service.

You can argue about the terms of service but that is a contractual matter, and is absoluetely not a first amendment free speech issue. For instance we can't talk about religion here because the site admins have decreed it so. The US government does not run waygook.org and has no control over its user content.

An actual freedom of speech issue would be if a US state or the US Congress passed a law banning certain speech on Twitter. Or if a politician asked Twitter to ban certain users. (pretty sure Trump has done this but I could be wrong, he certainly tells his chud army to attack journalists all the time)

Just wanted to clear that up because we have a lot of uneducated people and non-Americans who don't understand what "free speech" means in the USA.
I think the most remarkable thing about this thread is MayorHaggar actually writing a well-thought out and lucid post, rather than resorting to simple-minded insults and drive-by comments.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 11, 2021, 01:29:05 pm
ok boomer, so basically you have no argument
1) If by Boomer, you mean grew up during the 90s (as music, video game, TV, and movie references throughout my years of posting all make painfully clear), then sure.
2)  "You get butthurt about black Americans wanting to be treated like human beings despite being a Brit living in Korea. Also you got butthurt about Trump's "freedom of speech" after he got banned by Twitter (a private company) for inciting domestic terrorism" is not an argument.
3) The point still stands- Given your history of offensive statements and views regarding Koreans, which by the way if you changed the word 'Korean' and replaced it with 'black' or 'Mexican' and had Trump tweet it, would be condemned as racism, you are the LAST person to lecture people on this site about bigotry, given you being an ignorant bigot yourself.

As I keep on saying- If you think this isn't the case, go over to some Democratic Party facility and start making your views on Koreans known. I'm sure your progressive brethren would totally embrace you and not kick you out. /s
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 11, 2021, 01:36:55 pm
DM, this is one of the occasions where you and I really agree, Adel is living in a bubble (la-la land) where she thinks the whole of America is irreversibly damaged by last Wednesday and nothing else in the world matters.

This too shall pass. Am I condoning what happened? Of course not, Adel, but it's not the end of the world and Trump is certainly NOT in the league of the people under discussion.
Thank you and agreed. This whole thing should have been subjected to intense and vicious mockery. Instead it's being treated as some sort of serious attempt to overthrow the government. Now Trump is being compared to the Ayatollah and Xi  :rolleyes: Like, seriously just get some perspective. Have a laugh at Trump's loser crew. And condemn and punish the thugs that murdered that cop. But ffs, stop treating this like a mortal threat to the Republic. 200 years from now this will be one of those minor stories you read about like "That one time some gang of colonists, ticked off about the tax on horsehoes, stormed the hall, shot dead one redcoat, raised a flag, then slunk of into a drunken stupor."

We're one Jussie Smollet away from this being totally forgotten.

Perhaps you are privy to greater logistical intel than twitter and better informed to make such judgments regarding the likelihood of further violence . I don't pretend to be better informed than twitter so I'll respect their judgment on this one.
Twitter is simply covering their butts on any liability issues and blowing with the wind.  However, I think underneath Jack's "Don't let this company get Buzzfeed'd" view is a core of left-leaning people who probably, think Trump is worse than Hitler and feel justified in doing whatever.

Then how abouts clamming up and going away?
How about addressing whether you truly think Trump is on the level of Xi and various other world leaders (I actually kind of think the Ayatollah gets a bad rap, given the situation in Iran, not that he's a good guy, but it's more complicated than that)

But perhaps that's because 1) the US has a much better set of firewalls against totalitarianism, and 2) Trump is just so crap at everything he turns his hand to, except whipping up uneducated people (the ones he loves)  with ad baculum arguments.
Pretty much. Ya'll-Qaeda/Redtifa made a pretty poor showing overall.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 11, 2021, 02:15:30 pm
Assuming that your question pertains solely to a Western-style democracy, then we must insist on consistency. If "President Sunshine" seemed completely unhinged from reality and if "President Sunshine" offered baseless tweets contesting the legitimacy of a fair election, then yes---Twitter should flag the tweets of "President Sunshine" as divorced from the facts.
What if President Sunshine seemed completely wedded to reality by their supporters? What if

Also, what exactly makes our elections impeccable, but not those in the third world? Is it technology? Seems not because the same kind of tech is used around the world, including in corrupt countries. Is it the safegauards? What are those? Observers? Those exist in other countries with illegitimate elections. Is it the fact that our people are somehow incorruptible?

Quote
But Hillary Clinton (a rough analogue for "President Sunshine" here) never called for insurrection against the Capitol building. And neither did Al Gore.
No, she simply weaponized the intel community for political purposes and the media to create a fake Russia scandal that was dumped on the public to undermine the legitimacy of Trump from the get go.

Quote
"asymmetric polarization," a concept carefully vetted in peer-reviewed academic research. To make a (very) long story short, Republicans have become more ideologically extreme than Democrats in the United States because of the phenomenon of "asymmetric polarization." And so Republicans (justifiably or unjustifiably) will feel ignored by journalists and other vessels for the dissemination of information.

While the Republican base has certainly gotten more polarized in voting and views, policy-wise, it is much more mainstream.  If you look at Trump's actual policies, it pretty much reads like a Democratic Party platform circa 1996-2004.

What issue is Trump perceived as most extreme on? Immigration. The thing is, all the facilities he is accused of using were funded and built under Clinton-Bush-Obama. They didn't just magically appear at the border overnight. They took time to build and the funding to be approved. The general legal infrastructure in place wasn't created by Trump. It was already existing, just not as rigorously enforced.

Now, an impartial news media would note such things, and an informed public would be aware of that and take such things into account. They didn't. Why is that? Who is extreme and deceptive in this case?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: L I on January 11, 2021, 03:51:01 pm
a fake Russia scandal that was dumped on the public to undermine the legitimacy of Trump from the get go

Not fake. Russia supported Trump.

Between January 2015 and August 2017, Facebook linked 80,000 publications to the Russian company Internet Research Agency through more than 470 different accounts. At the same time, a total of 50,258 Twitter accounts were linked to Russian bots – fake accounts programmed to share false information – during the 2016 election period. The bots are responsible for more than 3.8 million tweets, about 19% of the total tweets related to the 2016 US presidential election.

https://theconversation.com/fact-check-us-what-is-the-impact-of-russian-interference-in-the-us-presidential-election-146711
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 11, 2021, 06:04:08 pm
Not fake. Russia supported Trump.

Between January 2015 and August 2017, Facebook linked 80,000 publications to the Russian company Internet Research Agency through more than 470 different accounts. At the same time, a total of 50,258 Twitter accounts were linked to Russian bots – fake accounts programmed to share false information – during the 2016 election period. The bots are responsible for more than 3.8 million tweets, about 19% of the total tweets related to the 2016 US presidential election.

https://theconversation.com/fact-check-us-what-is-the-impact-of-russian-interference-in-the-us-presidential-election-146711
The issue wasn't whether Russia favored Trump, but whether there was any criminal conduct linking the Trump campaign and Russia. There wasn't and the evidence suggesting was flimsy and in some cases was outright manufactured using circular evidence (i.e. a person in the investigation would leak a story to a reporter, the reporter would write about it, then the investigator would use that article as justification for warrants.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 11, 2021, 09:01:04 pm
The issue wasn't whether Russia favored Trump, but whether there was any criminal conduct linking the Trump campaign and Russia.

No, that's what you want the issue to be.  Most Americans don't like the idea of foreign countries poking their noses in American elections, especially if they try to sway the results, which is exactly and indisputably what Russia did.  As Republican-led Senate investigations found.  Period.

And the fact is, as far as criminal collusion, the jury is out on that, because there was so much obstruction, the investigation could never get to the bottom of it. 

But you don't really care about trying to overturn American democracy, whether its the Russian fascists or the Trump fascists. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tony tony tony on January 11, 2021, 09:54:58 pm
Say what you like about RED CHINA, but they wouldn't ban their own leader from communicating with his loyal subjects.

A storm is brewing...
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: PaulineMacLeod on January 12, 2021, 01:33:08 am
As we started this thread on the topic of Trump permanently banned from Twitter, we will try to keep our replies to Mr. DeMartino confined to this theme.

Even non-partisan agencies agree that Russia interfered in the 2016 election and that Russia interfered to some extent in events after the 2016 election. The extent of that interference remains a matter of debate among individuals of the right and left in the former colonies of North America, but the fact of interference remains without a doubt. Twitter exercised solid judgment in keeping Trump's Twitter account alive at this time, mainly because the falseness of Trump's statements during his impeachment trial did not immediately and intensely endanger the survival of democracy in the former colonies of North America.

We agree with your assessment regarding the erosion of seriousness received by the right in mainstream media, and we find that proclivity unfortunate. But if the right-wing media remained anchored to facts (facts usually vetted by the Associated Press, a news organization so universally well-regarded that the institution actually gets strong access to North Korea), then perhaps conservative political discourse could appropriately and justifiably become restored in the eyes of the residents of the former North American colonies. We think that conservatism should follow the example of enlightening programs such as William Buckley's Firing Line, and not the foam-at-the-mouth excuse of discourse launched by today's generation of right-wing pundits. In that way, conservative spokespersons will not find themselves smashed up in Twitter as Donald Trump has (appropriately) been.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 03:30:24 am
Fine, if you're ok with the idea of unelected, tax avoiding tech billionaires deciding what should or shouldn't get said in the public square. Just hope that next time it's not someone you agree with that gets silenced.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 12, 2021, 04:52:12 am
Fine, if you're ok with the idea of unelected, tax avoiding tech billionaires deciding what should or shouldn't get said in the public square. Just hope that next time it's not someone you agree with that gets silenced.

The First amendment of the US Constitution:

Quote
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Twitter and other tech companies are not Congress. Get over it.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on January 12, 2021, 06:46:13 am
They still haven't gotten the basic fact that they gave twitter the power to do this when they celebrated and supported the homophobic Baker's challenge.

That, or they just only want the free speech to be POS assholes...but don't you dare hold them accountable for their words
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 07:28:36 am
Quote
They still haven't gotten the basic fact

Quote
We agree with your assessment

Who's 'they', who's 'we'? Guys can we bit a bit clearer about the pronouns we'd like to use?

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 12, 2021, 07:45:43 am
Fine, if you're ok with the idea of unelected, tax avoiding tech billionaires deciding what should or shouldn't get said in the public square. Just hope that next time it's not someone you agree with that gets silenced.

By the "public square" you of course mean a non-governmental micro-blogging website.

"Gets silenced".  Craven horrible person Devin Nunes was complaining only last night that now Republicans now have no way to communicate with each other.  How do I know this?  He said it on Fox News, where millions of Republicans were watching him.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on January 12, 2021, 07:51:22 am
I mean, there does come a point where certain tech giants have such a monopoly it may as well be the public square. Not necessarily saying we're at that point yet.  The natural solution to this of course would be to make alternatives to Twitter/Facebook/etc. The right has already done this with Parlor. I'd be interested to see a leftist version (I guess maybe Tumblr sort of covers that?)

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 12, 2021, 07:56:56 am
I mean, there does come a point where certain tech giants have such a monopoly it may as well be the public square. Not necessarily saying we're at that point yet.  The natural solution to this of course would be to make alternatives to Twitter/Facebook/etc. The right has already done this with Parlor. I'd be interested to see a leftist version (I guess maybe Tumblr sort of covers that?)



It's Parler, ironically from French, to speak.  But as has been pointed out, this narrowing of options is simply the market system at work, which conservatives are always so damn fixated on.

Of course, you could argue about antitrust, monopoly, etc, but that hasn't gotten anywhere yet. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 07:58:19 am
Quote
By the "public square" you of course mean a non-governmental micro-blogging website.

"Gets silenced".  Craven horrible person Devin Nunes was complaining only last night that now Republicans now have no way to communicate with each other.  How do I know this?  He said it on Fox News, where millions of Republicans were watching him.

OK I'll try to tell myself that people are not really getting silenced next time those techies decide a a youtube video of a UK radio show needs to be taken down. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on January 12, 2021, 08:01:27 am
So consequence-free speech is what you want then...which ironically is a direct violation of the free speech you're preaching to support.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on January 12, 2021, 08:04:37 am
It's Parler, ironically from French, to speak.  But as has been pointed out, this narrowing of options is simply the market system at work, which conservatives are always so damn fixated on.

Of course, you could argue about antitrust, monopoly, etc, but that hasn't gotten anywhere yet.

It definitely is ironic. But although it is funny to watch mainstream conservatives cry about it from Fox or whatever, tech giants don't exactly like the left either. I'm not for extending the Overton window to include Nazism or anything, but I'd hate for it to be shrunk to Tucker Carlson vs. Rachel Maddow.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 12, 2021, 08:11:05 am
OK I'll try to tell myself that people are not really getting silenced next time those techies decide a a youtube video of a UK radio show needs to be taken down. 
Well, I like to watch British stuff on YT as well, but it doesn't get taken down for a political ideology.  99% it's because of IP/copyright issues.  And the "techies" don't take stuff down, usually, its algorithms that do that.  Except in a few rare cases where violence and insurrection are being directly incited.

But perhaps a few examples would be good.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 08:12:03 am
So consequence-free speech is what you want then...which ironically is a direct violation of the free speech you're preaching to support.

I want to be able to watch and listen to people who have opinions that may go against the orthodoxy and even offend people. With obvious limits such as people who incite violence. These cases would be decided by laws and regulated by accountable officials.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 08:13:50 am
Well, I like to watch British stuff on YT as well, but it doesn't get taken down for a political ideology.  99% it's because of IP/copyright issues.  And the "techies" don't take stuff down, usually, its algorithms that do that.  Except in a few rare cases where violence and insurrection are being directly incited.

But perhaps a few examples would be good.

https://www.reuters.com/article/britain-talkradio-youtube/uk-broadcaster-talkradio-removed-from-youtube-idINL8N2JG34K

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-55544205

Youtube admitted it was taken down for the ideas it was discussing.

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on January 12, 2021, 08:18:49 am
https://www.reuters.com/article/britain-talkradio-youtube/uk-broadcaster-talkradio-removed-from-youtube-idINL8N2JG34K

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-55544205

Youtube admitted it was taken down for the ideas it was discussing.



Hmm, best to wait to hear the reason, I suppose, before commenting. (As the Radio station said it had not been given a full explanation.

In the meantime, you can get your fix here:  https://talkradio.co.uk/podcasts
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 08:20:32 am
They revealed the reason in the BBC article

Quote
YouTube has reinstated TalkRadio's channel on its platform hours after saying it had been "terminated" for breaking the tech firm's rules.

It said the broadcaster had posted material that contradicted expert advice about the coronavirus pandemic.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 12, 2021, 08:43:37 am
stoat I've explained the first amendment twice to you. You still don't get it. Private websites are not "the public square" and they can do whatever they want. You clearly have a problem with private websites enforcing their terms of service which users agree to. These websites allowed right-wingers to organize acts of violence for years, but have finally had enough after it led to further violence. Even you agree that this incitement to terrorism is wrong, yet you still insist on being disingenuous and salty about Trump being punished for contractual terms of service violations on a private website. Again, Twitter is not the US Congress.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: thunderlips on January 12, 2021, 08:49:38 am
It's like when a private forum for teachers started banning users who disagreed with their policies.... right?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on January 12, 2021, 09:55:10 am
The move by Internet giants Facebook Inc. and Twitter Inc. to suspend President Donald Trump’s access to social media accounts is a “bad omen,” according to Mexican President Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador.

Having private companies decide who can be silenced and censored goes against freedom of speech, Lopez Obrador said on Friday during his daily press briefing.

It’s like a a censorship court is being created, like the Holy Inquisition, for the management of public opinion,” he said.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-08/facebook-ban-on-trump-is-holy-inquisition-mexico-s-amlo-says

Trump has been kicked off Twitter,  Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat, Shopify, and PayPal. His recent videos have been taken down by YouTube.

Others are getting the axe too after the rioting- including Steve Bannon (just for communicating with Rudy Giuliani) and former National Security Adviser General Michael Flynn.

In our day, the actions of Big Tech can have a far more chilling effect on free speech than any government regulation.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on January 12, 2021, 10:12:42 am
Don't like how companies run their business? Start your own!

Capitalism 101...free market etc. You've made your bed.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 12, 2021, 10:32:47 am
They revealed the reason in the BBC article
Quote
YouTube has reinstated TalkRadio's channel on its platform hours after saying it had been "terminated" for breaking the tech firm's rules.

It said the broadcaster had posted material that contradicted expert advice about the coronavirus pandemic.

This, and so many of these examples, are results of the following:

1) Content flagged by user
2) Automated program scans for offending content
3) If offending content is detected, automated program imposes warning or refers to human operator
4) Low-ranking, human operator on low(ish) pay reviews content (among dozens of other videos / tweets / posts in a single day), checking it against company policies
5) Human operator makes decision about whether to issue warning, remove video / tweet / FB post, or refer to another human for further review
6) After contestation and further review, penalty is upheld or withdrawn
7) If the penalty is upheld (i.e., video permanently removed, user banned), a written explanation is provided
8 If the penalty is not upheld, the content is restored, account reinstated, etc. 

This is a very different scenario to "Tech overlords are deciding what we can and can't see!"

Try understand how the content moderation process works before deciding that you know what's going on behind closed doors. And maybe also give a bit of thought to the complexities of running a large business with all manner of extremist groups, government intelligence ops, hackers, trolls and disinformation distributors trying to hijack your product.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 10:41:03 am
Try to understand our unique situation?

I'm sure running a country involves many complexities as well. Maybe we should all lay off criticising governments
 In recognition of this.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: L I on January 12, 2021, 10:55:16 am
they make more money by pandering to Trump's opposition

The opposite is true. Twitter lost money following the Trump ban. Believe it or not, some people care about doing what is right, even if it’ll cost them money. (See Jack Dorsey’s $1 billion donation to help in the fight against COVID-19.)

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/twitter-stock-price-president-donald-trump-permanently-banned-tweeting-2021-1-1029946778
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 12, 2021, 10:56:21 am
Quote
Try to understand our unique situation?

I'm sure running a country involves many complexities as well. Maybe we should all lay off criticising governments
 In recognition of this.
Okay, you're right. We should assume that any content moderation decision that seems poorly reasoned is a result of Orwellian thought control exercises perpetrated by "the left".
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 10:59:08 am
The opposite is true. Twitter lost money following the Trump ban. Believe it or not, some people care about doing what is right, even if it’ll cost them money. (See Jack Dorsey’s $1 billion donation to help in the fight against COVID-19.)

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/twitter-stock-price-president-donald-trump-permanently-banned-tweeting-2021-1-1029946778

If they're that philanthropic, maybe they can start paying their taxes as well.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: L I on January 12, 2021, 11:04:41 am
They do pay taxes. A LOT. A hell of a lot more than you do.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 11:07:11 am
They do pay taxes. A LOT. A hell of a lot more than you do.

That made me laugh out loud.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: L I on January 12, 2021, 11:15:45 am
You’re making a stupid claim that Twitter / Jack Dorsey doesn’t pay taxes. That is very false. Guess you’ll have to make your own “public square” platform to spread fake news if you don’t like the current options available.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: stoat on January 12, 2021, 11:17:29 am
https://www.standard.co.uk/business/twitter-pays-just-ps41-000-uk-tax-on-revenues-of-ps100m-a4236381.html
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: L I on January 12, 2021, 11:22:47 am
I read the article.

“In its accounts Twitter UK, which is not paying a dividend, revealed that the lower level of tax was due to the timing of deferred tax credits and higher share- based payments to staff.“

Twitter paid 41,000 pounds in a certain kind of UK tax that year; the year before was more than 50 times higher. That’s not nothing. If Brits don’t like it they can make their own company. And/or change the tax laws.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 12, 2021, 11:47:35 am
Try to understand our unique situation?

I'm sure running a country involves many complexities as well. Maybe we should all lay off criticising governments
 In recognition of this.

Nobody thinks you're being clever. Nobody.  All you've done in this topic is show that you don't understand American free speech laws, and that you immediately change the subject when you have nothing useful to say.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on January 12, 2021, 11:58:32 am
(https://i.imgur.com/7Do2sbM.jpg)
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on January 12, 2021, 12:15:22 pm
Don't like how companies run their business? Start your own!

Capitalism 101...free market etc. You've made your bed.

They did.  It was called Parler.  But anti competitive collusion monopolistic business practices are conspiring to block that too.  True capitalism wouldn't allow collusion and monopolistic business practices.  There's no free market here.  Corporatism. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 12, 2021, 12:17:11 pm
I think its hilarious both conservatives and liberals have completely flipped their positions on this thanks to Trump. No principles whatsoever, just pure Team.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 12, 2021, 12:22:18 pm
I think its hilarious both conservatives and liberals have completely flipped their positions on this thanks to Trump. No principles whatsoever, just pure Team.

This from a guy whose spent the last four years defending a cult leader devoid of any real conservative ideological consistency!  :laugh:
Any idea why the Lincoln Project was formed?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on January 12, 2021, 12:30:59 pm
They did.  It was called Parler.  But anti competitive collusion monopolistic business practices are conspiring to block that too.  True capitalism wouldn't allow collusion and monopolistic business practices.  There's no free market here.  Corporatism.

This is true. Regardless of whether Trump deserves to be banned or not, America is definitely more corporatist than capitalist. Gov't has been slacking on breaking up monopolies as they should. Amazon got richer this year while continuing to kill small businesses at an accelerated rate due to covid.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on January 12, 2021, 12:32:40 pm
idk i think a lot of lefties still see the danger in allowing silicon valley (and others) to have so much power. when i look at what amazon web services (et al.) is doing to parler, i see how easily it could be a website/app that i care about. that said, it's really hard not to rub it in when you see conservatives crying about being "oppressed" by these kinds of ("free market") monsters they've created. it's a kind of "this is what we were talking about with the cakes. i guess you didn't realize someone might not want to serve you a cake someday"
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 12, 2021, 12:34:30 pm
This from a guy whose spent the last four years defending a cult leader devoid of any real conservative ideological consistency!  :laugh:
Any idea why the Lincoln Project was formed?
His lack of conservative ideology was a feature in my book. I was willing to vote for him or Bernie. Whoever would seriously challenge the system and hopefully stand up to War, Inc.

Congrats on embracing the Neocons, the intel community, the cast of characters that gave us Iraq and the Patriot Act, and embracing corporate primacy all to get rid of Orange Man.

Great long-term thinking skills there.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on January 12, 2021, 12:37:15 pm
idk i think a lot of lefties still see the danger in allowing silicon valley (and others) to have so much power. when i look at what amazon web services (et al.) is doing to parler, i see how easily it could be a website/app that i care about. that said, it's really hard not to rub it in when you see conservatives crying about being "oppressed" by these kinds of ("free market") monsters they've created. it's a kind of "this is what we were talking about with the cakes. i guess you didn't realize someone might not want to serve you a cake someday"

I see your point, but there isn't exactly an amazon of cake stores lol
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Foreverparadise on January 12, 2021, 12:58:00 pm
He damned well deserves to get banned from Twitter. And after January 20th he should get banned from entering Washington DC.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 12, 2021, 01:04:56 pm
I think it speaks volumes that people are more obsessed with Trump being banned from twitter than civil liability.

A little Black Mirrorish.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on January 12, 2021, 01:59:00 pm
This is true. Regardless of whether Trump deserves to be banned or not, America is definitely more corporatist than capitalist. Gov't has been slacking on breaking up monopolies as they should. Amazon got richer this year while continuing to kill small businesses at an accelerated rate due to covid.

How about corporations over a certain market value or capitalization (market value) move into a different tax bracket.  A higher corporate tax rate and more anti competitive regulations to follow once over a certain size nationally or internationally and perhaps a lower threshold if holding a monopoly in a small local region.  Incentivize breaking up into smaller entities.  No more of this too big to fail and no more of entire monopolies.  Perhaps excepts may still be allowed with some utilities, but everything else break up or just tax them much more to encourage volunatry break ups.  Corporations below a certain market value can pay a lower corporate tax rate.  (Though some joint ventures between smaller corporations could still be approved for a 5 or 10 year period if economies of scale are necessary to get a project off the ground.)  Also, higher tax rate for incomes over 5 million dollars, instead of proposed for 250,000 or 400,000 dollars or whatever it is nowadays.  The real rich, the millionaires and billionaires can pay a bit more since they seem to have money to spend on corruption and financing total government and corporate fascism.  Some traditional liberals and some new libertarian populists can forge a new ideology and a new party going forward.  Low taxes and simple regulations for the working guy (including upper middle class) and the small to medium sized companies.  Difficulty for too large of companies and monopolies. 

It seems big tech and big banks are conspiring together with the deep state to silence any voices of disagreement and to cancel people's lives.  It is a complete takeover and it is dangerous.  And to all the SJWs applauding this, don't be surprised once they turn on you too once your "useful idiot" status is no longer needed.  Once freedom is gone, it is hard to get it back. 

NO one should be banned including those for Trump and those against Trump. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 12, 2021, 02:11:43 pm
No, that's what you want the issue to be.  Most Americans don't like the idea of foreign countries poking their noses in American elections, especially if they try to sway the results, which is exactly and indisputably what Russia did.  As Republican-led Senate investigations found.  Period.
Most Americans are blissfully ignorant of the extent to which America has interfered in elections across the globe since the 1950s. They're also blissfully unaware to the extent we interfered in Russia's domestic politics. Finally they are unaware as to how ineffectual the Russian "interference" was, as are they blissfully unaware of the extent of Chinese, Saudi, and Israeli interference, which was surprisingly never addressed.

Any comments on that lack of interest in Chinese, Saudi, and Israeli interference Mr. C?

Quote
And the fact is, as far as criminal collusion, the jury is out on that, because there was so much obstruction, the investigation could never get to the bottom of it.
Or you can just use common sense. Common sense such as-
1) The lack of serious response by our allies. If Trump truly was in league with Russia, there would have been massive sanctions against Russia, a direct attempt to remove Trump, military alerts, etc. None of that happened.
2) The fact that American companies haven't embraced Russian firms for advertising.

But I understand how the easily duped would believe it was real. "Look this FBI big wig says its real. He says they spent MILLIONS OF DOLLARS! That makes it real and effective!"

Also, it was drummed up by the same crew involved in the Iraq War and domestic spying. Definitely a trustworthy cast of characters.

Quote
But you don't really care about trying to overturn American democracy, whether its the Russian fascists or the Trump fascists.
Wrong. I believe that not ******** myself in fear and panic and falling for propaganda only the stupid would believe is safeguarding American democracy.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 12, 2021, 02:42:49 pm
I think its hilarious both conservatives and liberals have completely flipped their positions on this thanks to Trump. No principles whatsoever, just pure Team.

Flipped how, exactly? Like Tyler said, a lot of us on the left do have concerns about monopolistic corporate power. Conversatives aren't offering constructive solutions to that by selectively complaining about censorship. I know it might look like we approve of such censorship if we don't speak out against it every time, but as I said, I have no expectation that a private enterprise is going elevate an abstract principle like free speech above what it perceives to be its own interests. Add that to the fact that erroneous content moderation accounts for a lot of this censorship, and basically you have a problem, but not the problem that conservatives have invented for their grievance strategy.

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 12, 2021, 02:48:41 pm
Flipped how, exactly? Like Tyler said, a lot of us on the left do have concerns about monopolistic corporate power. Conversatives aren't offering constructive solutions to that by selectively complaining about censorship. I know it might look like we approve of such censorship if we don't speak out against it every time, but as I said, I have no expectation that a private enterprise is going elevate an abstract principle like free speech above what it perceives to be its own interests. Add that to the fact that erroneous content moderation accounts for a lot of this censorship, and basically you have a problem, but not the problem that conservatives have invented for their grievance strategy.
That's fine and I do think there are principled liberals on this board and you're absolutely right in your view of them as well as your critique of conservatives.

I also think a number of so-called liberals on this board are little more than tribalists and might as well be the other side of the hangook77 coin.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 12, 2021, 03:07:10 pm
I would totally collect hangook77 coins.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on January 12, 2021, 05:00:29 pm
Let's do a little thought experiment.

Imagine we're talking about, say, Sudan. Or Venezuela. Or Pakistan.

President X is a notorious blowhard who uses Twitter as his main mouthpiece for bragging and lying. His style gets under a lot of people's skin, but his supporters think he's a refreshing alternative to establishment politics. For months he's been saying that if he wins an upcoming election, it will be legitimate but if he loses it will be because the other side cheated. Most people expect him to lose, complain about it on TV, then shuffle away. He does, in fact, lose the election and his inevitable fraud claims prove beyond credibility. Still, he persists, using every media outlet available to propagate this falsehood, bringing numerous sympathetic TV reporters, commentators and parasitic politicians along for the ride. People still assume that he'll eventually go away.

He starts advertising a big rally for the day of his opponent's electoral certification by the country's Parliament, generally an uneventful bureaucratic affair. Twitter seems to his favorite tool for spreading misinformation about the integrity of the country's election. By this point, people are starting to get nervous about the fact he won't concede and appears to be actively undermining the country's democratic structure. His rally attracts tens of thousands of people and, as expected, he whips them up into a collective rage with his falsehoods about the "stolen" election. Not longer after he encourages his supporters to descend on the Parliament building, they do exactly as instructed, and it soon becomes a riot. His supporters invade the building, beat a police officer to death, vandalize the parliamentary chambers and chant about murdering politicians who "betrayed" President X by following the country's electoral laws.  In addition to the police officer, four more people die in the melee.

President X describes the vandals and murderers as "beautiful people" some hours before offering a token statement against violence. The next day, he is back on Twitter, making more false statements about the election. Twitter suspends his account.

Does anyone really think that the reaction of T.Rex, stoat, hangook77, etc. would be: "The real travesty here is Twitter's affront to freedom of speech"?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on January 12, 2021, 05:04:25 pm
Sounds pretty run of the mill. The kind of story we yawn a.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on January 12, 2021, 05:14:44 pm
That's fine and I do think there are principled liberals on this board and you're absolutely right in your view of them as well as your critique of conservatives.

I also think a number of so-called liberals on this board are little more than tribalists and might as well be the other side of the hangook77 coin.
That's fine and I do think there are principled liberals on this board and you're absolutely right in your view of them as well as your critique of conservatives.



Ah yes!  What liberal amongst us  could possibly turn our backs on that well cited principle of allowing one the  freedom to incite violence and insurrection!

 :laugh:

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/67/Confederacy_of_dunces_cover.jpg/200px-Confederacy_of_dunces_cover.jpg)



Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: PaulineMacLeod on January 13, 2021, 12:16:20 am
To Mr. C: As a stereotypically polite Canadian, we did not make any attempt to tell others what to post---do not worry! The sentence "As we started this thread on the topic of Trump permanently banned from Twitter, we will try to keep our replies to Mr. DeMartino confined to this theme" actually only uses the highly formal "we," but the pronoun "we" doesn't refer to the entire community posting on this website. We use the pronoun "we" in the royal sense, as we are the very distant cousin of a margrave. The status doesn't do anything practical for us, but when we sit at some auction house tea gathering, the host will usually allow us to sit to his/her right---even if we are dressed in horrible clothing. This situation has happened a few times, and some rich and stuck-up people get upset because of that.

Now, moving to Dr. DeMartino's reply to our last post---if Russian interference seemed ineffective, then the argument could be made that only the sheer incompetence of actors on the side of the former North American colonies made it so. It reminds us of how the worst crime (from a humorous standpoint) of the Capitol insurrectionists was their utter stupidity in getting photographed while not wearing masks (and thus becoming more easily identifiable by law enforcement agencies). Anyway, just a question from our end to yours (just so that we can honestly discern the thought processes on your side): which punishment seems more detrimental to Trump's hopes of representing his followers---the suffocation of his media megaphones (Twitter, and so forth), or the second impeachment that may come his way this week?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on January 13, 2021, 01:42:17 am
I think its hilarious both conservatives and liberals have completely flipped their positions on this thanks to Trump. No principles whatsoever, just pure Team.
So it wasn't Elizabeth Warren going after Facebook?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on January 19, 2021, 07:33:31 am
"The tech giants essentially blamed Parler for the sickening attack on the United States Capitol and destroyed the entire platform as punishment. But anyone with a Facebook or Twitter account could tell you that Parler — social media’s new kid on the block — could not have been the sole facilitator of communication between rioters....

"Amazon, Apple and Google have long hosted websites and apps that exploit children, give dictators a platform, and allow other harmful, criminal behavior to go unchecked while arguing it’s not their job to edit the internet.

"Yet they ripped Parler from the face of the internet for failing to meet a standard to which no one else is held. Not only is this unfair, but it won't change anything....

"The rise and fall of Parler is a chilling lesson for small businesses everywhere: Amazon, Apple, and Google control access to the internet."
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/opinion/2021/01/16/opinion-big-tech-parler-trick-pretend-content-moderation-matters/4178474001/

Is this a free market? It's certainly not a fair one.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Savant on January 19, 2021, 07:49:42 am
"The tech giants essentially blamed Parler for the sickening attack on the United States Capitol and destroyed the entire platform as punishment. But anyone with a Facebook or Twitter account could tell you that Parler — social media’s new kid on the block — could not have been the sole facilitator of communication between rioters....

"Amazon, Apple and Google have long hosted websites and apps that exploit children, give dictators a platform, and allow other harmful, criminal behavior to go unchecked while arguing it’s not their job to edit the internet.

"Yet they ripped Parler from the face of the internet for failing to meet a standard to which no one else is held. Not only is this unfair, but it won't change anything....

"The rise and fall of Parler is a chilling lesson for small businesses everywhere: Amazon, Apple, and Google control access to the internet."
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/opinion/2021/01/16/opinion-big-tech-parler-trick-pretend-content-moderation-matters/4178474001/

Is this a free market? It's certainly not a fair one.

Parler has re-surfaced again on Russian servers. Enjoy your freedom, comrade!
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on January 19, 2021, 08:04:50 am
Parler has re-surfaced again on Russian servers. Enjoy your freedom, comrade!
Will it be reappearing in the Android and Apple app stores? I don't think so. It gets discriminated against for leaning libertarian and not being on board with the left wing agenda of the Dems, the tech giants, and the msm.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on January 19, 2021, 08:17:36 am
I thought it was removed from those platforms for refusing to censor its content in the same way FB et al are required to?

Could you provide a link to a reputable source that cites different reasons? Because if the above is not the case, that would be something to be genuinely upset about.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on January 19, 2021, 08:24:04 am
I thought it was removed from those platforms for refusing to censor its content in the same way FB et al are required to?
Knowing Parler, this is pretty likely to be the case
I think the more interesting question is why are they only dropping it now, seeing as the apps always been like that

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on March 22, 2021, 09:48:39 am
"Trump to redefine social media as he plans his return"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_8t9l6izbQ

Wow, the decision to ban Trump could end up really backfiring on leftists. Imagine millions leaving Twitter to join Trump's social media site. I wonder what he'll call it.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 22, 2021, 10:06:12 am
"Twitterer"
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: OnNut81 on March 22, 2021, 11:21:57 am
I think it's a safe bet that it will feature the name Trump name prominently, whatever it's called.  In fact, he could just call it Trumpeting.  Perfect. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on March 22, 2021, 11:27:40 am
I vote for "Wow!"

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: plan b on March 22, 2021, 11:40:14 am
Best news of the day!

Can't wait, I'll be on it as soon as it goes online.
Many millions of liberal clowns will be on as well to try and troll people.

Finally, we can hear more conservative voice on big tech.
Unfortunately this could hurt Parler, but we need more voices.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on March 22, 2021, 12:18:07 pm
Parler version 2.

Totally NOT a place for white supremacist terrorists to congregate and share their hateful views/terrorist plans under the guise of freeze peach...thereby totally NOT being a goldmine for the FBI, CIA, NSA and other intelligence agencies.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on March 22, 2021, 12:20:48 pm
My suggestions for a name:
SewerMouth or ShitSpeak - a "tweet" on either of these could be called a turd
Covfefe
RussiaIfYoureListen ing
TheWhine
FactFreeZone

But this one ... seriously, is a goer:
BullyPulpit
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 22, 2021, 01:14:58 pm
That's alright.  We have seen folks true colors now and they'll be kicked out of the house soon enough.  Twitter will become a has been set of losers as other media rises up to challenge them.  I hope they lose their whole paper fortune (market capitalization).
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 22, 2021, 01:27:31 pm
i figure this prediction will go about as well as your "trump will reclaim the presidency" prediction went a few months ago
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 22, 2021, 01:31:24 pm
i figure this prediction will go about as well as your "trump will reclaim the presidency" prediction went a few months ago

I am still waiting on that.  Cases are still being fought and winding their way through.  Lin Wood, Syndney Powell, and Mike Lindell amongst others haven't gone anywhere.  It was fraud and it was stolen.  Justice will come to the evil doers soon enough. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 22, 2021, 01:39:45 pm
I am still waiting on that. 
yeeeeeeeesh
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on March 23, 2021, 08:00:39 am
"Trump to redefine social media as he plans his return"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_8t9l6izbQ

Wow, the decision to ban Trump could end up really backfiring on leftists. Imagine millions leaving Twitter to join Trump's social media site. I wonder what he'll call it.

it cant possibly worse than parler/gab so carry on i guess
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 23, 2021, 11:22:24 am
Parler version 2.

Totally NOT a place for white supremacist terrorists to congregate and share their hateful views/terrorist plans under the guise of freeze peach...thereby totally NOT being a goldmine for the FBI, CIA, NSA and other intelligence agencies.
While your broader point is z valid one, I think your characterization as the place being a place for hateful views is based on a VERY subjective and politicized definition of hate, and the "planning for terrorism" is silly. No, millions of Americans won't be planning terrorism. That's like saying tik tokers are all Chinese agents or some shit. Unhinged.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 23, 2021, 11:42:07 am
ill be pretty impressed if it gets millions of american users
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 23, 2021, 11:42:33 am
I think your characterization as the place being a place for hateful views is based on a VERY subjective and politicized definition of hate, and the "planning for terrorism" is silly. No, millions of Americans won't be planning terrorism. That's like saying tik tokers are all Chinese agents or some shit. Unhinged.
I have no idea what you're going on about.   :huh: He was saying the exact opposite of that. He even capitalized the "nots"! /s
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on March 23, 2021, 12:04:17 pm
While your broader point is z valid one, I think your characterization as the place being a place for hateful views is based on a VERY subjective and politicized definition of hate, and the "planning for terrorism" is silly. No, millions of Americans won't be planning terrorism. That's like saying tik tokers are all Chinese agents or some shit. Unhinged.

There, fixed it for ya  :wink:
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 23, 2021, 12:07:30 pm
You crossed half of it out, bolded the other half, left a comment, but left the typo in?
Triggered!
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: thunderlips on March 23, 2021, 12:13:21 pm
You crossed half of it out, bolded the other half, left a comment, but left the typo in?
Triggered!

If you read it with a german accent it makes sense.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 23, 2021, 12:32:51 pm
I have no idea what you're going on about.   :huh: He was saying the exact opposite of that. He even capitalized the "nots"! /s
Is this sarcasm in response to his sarcasm?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 23, 2021, 01:01:53 pm
I love how leftists and their media buddies were freiking out over a tiny minority of people who supported Trump went into the Capitol, but said nothing last summer when the far left tried to break into the White House and Trump was put in the bunker.  They burned a church and some other buildings nearby.  Yet, nothing was said and I don't remember Pelosi or Schumer being impeached.  But of course hypocrisy and double standards always come easy to them.  Remove Trump because he said some mean things to some women, but when their own Bill Clinton rapes women, nothing is said.  I don't recall any of them saying anything when He was actually the President.  When Meryl Streep and others in Hollywood knew about Harvey Weinstien's rapes they said nothing and called him a "god" but yet Trump had some locker room talk and of course they were all over that.  Of course Hillary Clinton was a friend of Weinstien's too.  The elites protect their own and the left is only against sexism or racism when it's from the opposing team. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 23, 2021, 01:22:46 pm
ah yes who could forget! the church they cleared with tear gas to set up for trump's photo op. that one is a classic
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 23, 2021, 01:33:30 pm
I'm of mixed feelings on it. On the one hand, Trump's photo op was awful and a utterly shameless.

On the other hand, the man should be able to walk to the Church without being set upon by a mob.

And also, yeah, you can't go "100% completely innocent protesters" to one group and then "COUP!!! INSURRECTION!!!" to the other. That's just blatant partisanship. To be fair, the right does it just as much. "ANTIFA is a bunch of terrorists trying to overthrow the government! and then calling people storming state houses in violation of protest permits "patriots". How about, I don't know moving in both ways. The protesters need to be civil and not lose their shit at the site of Trump, but they also shouldn't be gassed for a shameless photo op, even if Trump has the right to go to the church. And no, the people who stormed the Capitol were not part of any serious coup effort or an organized insurrection. It was a political protest that turned into a riot.

It's just everyone tries to go all out and declare the other side to be completely evil. Fing A, calm the F down (not you, the country I mean).
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: OnNut81 on March 23, 2021, 01:41:10 pm
I love how leftists and their media buddies were freiking out over a tiny minority of people who supported Trump went into the Capitol, but said nothing last summer when the far left tried to break into the White House and Trump was put in the bunker.  They burned a church and some other buildings nearby.  Yet, nothing was said and I don't remember Pelosi or Schumer being impeached.  But of course hypocrisy and double standards always come easy to them.  Remove Trump because he said some mean things to some women, but when their own Bill Clinton rapes women, nothing is said.  I don't recall any of them saying anything when He was actually the President.  When Meryl Streep and others in Hollywood knew about Harvey Weinstien's rapes they said nothing and called him a "god" but yet Trump had some locker room talk and of course they were all over that.  Of course Hillary Clinton was a friend of Weinstien's too.  The elites protect their own and the left is only against sexism or racism when it's from the opposing team. 

Holy sh*t!  I agree completely with Hangook77 on something.  What about that lady who said all women should be believed when they accuse a man of something sexually inappropriate, but when speaking of Biden's accuser said that particular woman couldn't be believed?  I don't think the hypocrisy even registered with her. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 23, 2021, 01:43:14 pm
yeah they should just like nonviolently protest (jk that's also ultra unacceptable because they might like slightly inconvenience traffic or both me while i'm watching muh football)

but seriously i dont have anything against civil disobedience ore nonviolent protests by anyone (no matter how repulsive the people are. remember when the westboro baptist church was like the worst it could get? ha!). but all it takes is kneeling at football to get a large portion of the right's base frothing at the mouth
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 23, 2021, 01:43:19 pm
Holy sh*t!  I agree completely with Hangook77 on something.  What about that lady who said all women should be believed when they accuse a man of something sexually inappropriate, but when speaking of Biden's accuser said that particular woman couldn't be believed?  I don't think the hypocrisy even registered with her. 

Biden's too clueless outside his sniffing, kissing, and fondling of your women.  But you know, the women's groups have to follow the funding and shut up when it's their candidate lest they risk getting the money taps turned off. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on March 23, 2021, 01:58:43 pm
Not that there's really any point in arguing this, but...

Quote
I love how leftists and their media buddies were freiking out over a tiny minority of people who supported Trump went into the Capitol, but said nothing last summer when the far left tried to break into the White House and Trump was put in the bunker.  They burned a church and some other buildings nearby.  Yet, nothing was said and I don't remember Pelosi or Schumer being impeached.

Are you aware that Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer didn't stand on a podium, whipping up a crowd with phony election fraud grievances, and then encourage everyone to go march on a church that subsequently got burned. If they had, you could probably make a like-for-like comparison. Since they didn't, you sound like a crackpot.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on March 23, 2021, 02:35:16 pm
You crossed half of it out, bolded the other half, left a comment, but left the typo in?
Triggered!

I didn't want to be accused of revisionism!

Plus I crossed about 90% of it out ;P
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 23, 2021, 02:50:15 pm
Not that there's really any point in arguing this, but...

Are you aware that Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer didn't stand on a podium, whipping up a crowd with phony election fraud grievances, and then encourage everyone to go march on a church that subsequently got burned. If they had, you could probably make a like-for-like comparison. Since they didn't, you sound like a crackpot.
 

I do realize that they and other players like crazy Maxine were using divisive rhetoric for years demonizing Trump and his supporters including calls to harass them wherever they call and to 'impeach 45' from day one.  So, who is responsible for what?  Each individual is responsible for their own actions period. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 23, 2021, 02:55:03 pm
I know this'll trigger a bunch of you.  But here goes.

www.bitchute.com/video/FwX3oxjHqhE2/
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 23, 2021, 02:59:24 pm
 
I know this'll trigger a bunch of you.  But here goes.
www.bitchute.com/video/FwX3oxjHqhE2/
How dare you post a link without providing any kind of context! And you didn't even comment on what *your* opinion of the video is, or what it is that you'd have us discuss! What kind of savage are you??????  >:(  I can't even!!!!1!!  >:( >:( >:(
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 23, 2021, 03:11:42 pm
wtf is bitchute

[edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitChute holy shit hangook you really are way off the ****** deep end dude]
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on March 23, 2021, 03:44:51 pm
wtf is bitchute

[edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitChute holy shit hangook you really are way off the ****** deep end dude]

BitChute is a video hosting service known for accommodating far-right individuals and conspiracy theorists, and for hosting hateful content.

*DeMartino has entered the chat*
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 23, 2021, 04:45:24 pm
BitChute is a video hosting service known for accommodating far-right individuals and conspiracy theorists, and for hosting hateful content.

*DeMartino has entered the chat*
I would only say that tyler, you are free to check out BitChute and make your own call as to whether that description is accurate. Maybe you will think so, maybe you won't. Up to you. I'd only ask that before you decide someone is promoting hate or not, listen to what they have to say. Don't rely on a single quote, taken out of context (or even not a direct quote) written by a journalist making a smear piece. I think that is fair.

I have only two people I sub to on BitChute, but both are also established YouTubers. Neither supports hate.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 23, 2021, 04:52:23 pm
Not that there's really any point in arguing this, but...

Are you aware that Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer didn't stand on a podium, whipping up a crowd with phony election fraud grievances, and then encourage everyone to go march on a church that subsequently got burned. If they had, you could probably make a like-for-like comparison. Since they didn't, you sound like a crackpot.
No, but they did do the stupid Kente Cloth stunt.

Well "Hands up, don't shoot" is based on something that has been demonstrably proven to be false be the Obama's own DoJ under Eric Holder, yet is still presented as an example of an unjust killing. The people didn't even wait for the full autopsy with George Floyd before declaring it a murder (and same with the cop that died after the Capitol Riot).

Sorry, but people have to at least wait for an ME's report before declaring something wrong. And if you whip people up and declare something "unjust" without waiting for facts, then well, you're playing smart politics. And I wouldn't necessarily blame you or say it's totally wrong. I mean, Trump supporters don't really have a leg to stand on when it comes to complaining about that tactic. But spare the "our side is good, your side is bad" nonsense.

If you can't see that kind of stuff and realize how across the board it is, you're basically a sports fan playing at a politics. And not a sophisticated sports fan, one of those dumb ones that paints themselves team colors and insists every call should go their way and they never commit penalties. And when it's blatant, they praise the guy for "sending the other team a message."
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on March 24, 2021, 02:37:28 am
Nothing wrong with sending the other team a message. Just ask Kevin McHale.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 24, 2021, 07:38:19 am
I would only say that tyler, you are free to check out BitChute and make your own call

why would i support a platform that supports hate though? i'm sure there are normal people who post there for... reasons(?), but i'm not going to give traffic to a site that has holocaust denial/holocaust glorification or anything like that. i mean... the website's raison d'etre is promoting stuff that got flagged as hate speech on other sites. whether or not you think any specific video (or creator) qualifies as promoting hate speech doesn't make the site's overall mission any less despicable.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: CO4 on March 24, 2021, 07:55:35 am
Lol so you didn't even know what Bitchute is but now you're an expert after a quick glance at Wikipedia and Waygook's resident Louis Farrakhan telling you what your opinion should be.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 24, 2021, 08:55:32 am
i dont know what in my post leads you to believe i think i'm an expert. but i've read enough after a quick google search to decide i don't want to use the site
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on March 24, 2021, 09:31:32 am
Lol so you didn't even know what Bitchute is but now you're an expert after a quick glance at Wikipedia and Waygook's resident Louis Farrakhan telling you what your opinion should be.

Did someone trigger the....*snowflake*?  :P

(https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-23-2018/P2zDeJ.gif)
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 24, 2021, 10:31:51 am
The people didn't even wait for the full autopsy with George Floyd before declaring it a murder.

Sorry, but people have to at least wait for an ME's report before declaring something wrong. And if you whip people up and declare something "unjust" without waiting for facts, then well, you're playing smart politics. And I wouldn't necessarily blame you or say it's totally wrong. I mean, Trump supporters don't really have a leg to stand on when it comes to complaining about that tactic. But spare the "our side is good, your side is bad" nonsense.
I agree with your point, but I think you could've chosen a *much* better example. Like any other example at all.

The guy died with a police officer using an illegal hold on him. Even if he had died from a heart attack or something, clearly the officer sitting on his throat would have had something to do with it.
One doesn't need an autopsy to be 99.9% sure that that was what killed the man, one way or another.
Of course, getting the autopsy removed any vestiges of doubt, which is why autopsies should be done whenever possible. But either way, I don't think people were wrong to call it murder before the autopsy reports came back.

I mean, what was the alternative? That Mr. Floyd died of cancer during the 7 minutes and 45 seconds he was being restrained? Not entirely impossible, but nonetheless unlikely to the point of being absurd.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on March 24, 2021, 10:52:30 am
I am still waiting on that.  Cases are still being fought and winding their way through.  Lin Wood, Syndney Powell, and Mike Lindell amongst others haven't gone anywhere.  It was fraud and it was stolen.  Justice will come to the evil doers soon enough. 

Clearly you're not a reasonable person as Powell's defence team has argued in her defamation defence against Dominion Voting Systems 
Quote
“No reasonable person would conclude that the statements were truly statements of fact,”
  :laugh:

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/sidney-powell-s-legal-defense-reasonable-people-wouldn-t-believe-n1261809



Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on March 24, 2021, 10:59:35 am
No, but they did do the stupid Kente Cloth stunt.

Yeah, I can see how the photo session on June 8 inspired someone to set fire in a basement on May 31. hangook77, consider your viewpoint validated.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 24, 2021, 11:36:19 am
I agree with your point, but I think you could've chosen a *much* better example. Like any other example at all.

The guy died with a police officer using an illegal hold on him. Even if he had died from a heart attack or something, clearly the officer sitting on his throat would have had something to do with it.
One doesn't need an autopsy to be 99.9% sure that that was what killed the man, one way or another.
Of course, getting the autopsy removed any vestiges of doubt, which is why autopsies should be done whenever possible. But either way, I don't think people were wrong to call it murder before the autopsy reports came back.

I mean, what was the alternative? That Mr. Floyd died of cancer during the 7 minutes and 45 seconds he was being restrained? Not entirely impossible, but nonetheless unlikely to the point of being absurd.
They ruled it a homicide and that he wasn't strangled or asphyxiated. Now, that doesn't mean Chauvin is innocent because the issue is his failure to render aid and indifference to the man's condition and to do so for a sustained period, regardless of cause of death. During that time it went from negligence, to manslaughter, to 2nd degree murder over those minutes.

But it wasn't the knee that killed him. It was the decision not to render age and to continue to restrain.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 24, 2021, 11:50:24 am
why would i support a platform that supports hate though? i'm sure there are normal people who post there for... reasons(?), but i'm not going to give traffic to a site that has holocaust denial/holocaust glorification or anything like that. i mean... the website's raison d'etre is promoting stuff that got flagged as hate speech on other sites. whether or not you think any specific video (or creator) qualifies as promoting hate speech doesn't make the site's overall mission any less despicable.
Actually, it's just open. It's going to attract all kinds of stuff, including hate. But if you follow who gets youtube strikes for what, there's stuff that is awful, but also stuff that probably should have remained as part of free discourse. Anyways, being an open platform is not supporting.

I mean, it's awfully hard to draw the lines on conspiracy theories. The standards weren't impartially held when it came to Trump. You could spread any theory, no matter how baseless and it wouldn't attract the same ire. You could say stuff about whites or Christians that if it was said about other groups, would get you banned. The lack of consistency in youtube enforcing its own rules would naturally lead to this.

Anyways, I'm more of a wide-open platform, let anyone say whatever person. Let some black guy rant about why he thinks white are demons and have Nazis as long as they don't actually promote violence. Same free speech standard as the public square. As long as you let anyone speak and only regulate time, place and manner, then you're content-neutral and NOT platforming hate anymore than the City of San Francisco.

Regardless, up to you. I would say, it's a little unfair to declare someone platforming and promoting hate without taking a look for yourself, especially these days with how those accusations get tossed around so...liberally.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 24, 2021, 11:54:36 am
Nothing wrong with sending the other team a message. Just ask Kevin McHale.
And if you have that kind of view regarding politics, same as your sports, fine. But don't expect to be taken seriously as far as analysis goes and at that point you're at the state of mindless tribalism and have reverted us to humanity at 5000 B.C., with votes as your weapon, not clubs.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 24, 2021, 12:09:41 pm
They ruled it a homicide and that he wasn't strangled or asphyxiated. Now, that doesn't mean Chauvin is innocent because the issue is his failure to render aid and indifference to the man's condition and to do so for a sustained period, regardless of cause of death. During that time it went from negligence, to manslaughter, to 2nd degree murder over those minutes.

But it wasn't the knee that killed him. It was the decision not to render age and to continue to restrain.

The original autopsies agree that he died due to neck compression.

Some secondary autopsies indicate that it was actually asphyxia that killed him.
 
Either way, the knee killed him. All the sources I've seen agree on this.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: waygo0k on March 24, 2021, 12:15:29 pm
The original autopsies agree that he died due to neck compression.

Some secondary autopsies indicate that it was actually asphyxia that killed him.
 
Either way, the knee killed him. All the sources I've seen agree on this.

Your honour the explosion from the bomb I set off did not kill those people.

It's the force from the tissues and bones in their bodies being ripped apart that killed them!
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 24, 2021, 12:18:12 pm
The original autopsies agree that he died due to neck compression.
Actually due to "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression."

Also, multiple autopsies disagreeing is NOT good for the prosecution in this. Also, what isn't mentioned in these is the level of fentanyl in his system would be considered grounds for overdose. That autopsy is in for a grueling haul. That's why I say it is better to focus on Chauvin failing to render aid and to continue as the man went through increasing states of distress and his eventual death.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 24, 2021, 12:22:16 pm
I was simplifying the terminology for you troglodytes. :)

However you parse it, it was the knee that ultimately killed him.
To what end are you arguing against this?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 24, 2021, 01:16:18 pm
I was simplifying the terminology for you troglodytes. :)

However you parse it, it was the knee that ultimately killed him.
To what end are you arguing against this?
Alright, lets go with Michael Brown instead. And not just that, the whole cops shooting unarmed black people. Question- Without googling, how many unarmed black men were shot by cops last year?

There's been polling done on this and unsurprisingly, the numbers are divorced from reality. Also, there is a partisan slant to them.

And since we were talking about politicians pushing dangerous hoaxes, again- Russia and that Trump called Nazis "fine people". The number of people who believe those things is enormous, and that had a massive effect on division in the country. So yes, Pelosi and Schumer have done as much as Trump to be responsible for riots and violence, which is to say, in my view, nothing. They all flirted with stuff and did politician stuff, but ultimately neither are responsible for what happened.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on March 24, 2021, 03:41:50 pm
Partisanship sucks. But, I mean, what else can one expect with only 2 parties?  :sad:
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 25, 2021, 02:12:21 pm
Alright, lets go with Michael Brown instead. And not just that, the whole cops shooting unarmed black people. Question- Without googling, how many unarmed black men were shot by cops last year?

There's been polling done on this and unsurprisingly, the numbers are divorced from reality. Also, there is a partisan slant to them.

And since we were talking about politicians pushing dangerous hoaxes, again- Russia and that Trump called Nazis "fine people". The number of people who believe those things is enormous, and that had a massive effect on division in the country. So yes, Pelosi and Schumer have done as much as Trump to be responsible for riots and violence, which is to say, in my view, nothing. They all flirted with stuff and did politician stuff, but ultimately neither are responsible for what happened.

I believe Trump was speaking to moderates on both sides and not the extremists.  But gaffy Biden gets a free pass because he's a leftist.  Trump gets his words twisted around used against him as a weapon.  Anyone who's not an idiot knows he wasn't praising the extremists on either side, the nazis or the marxists.  But, whatever can help advance their agenda including lots of character assasination is par the course for lots of these clowns.  A lot of folks today just have no honor or integrety.  They don't care who they destroy or whose lives they ruin so long as they can advance their selfish causes.  This is the new batshit crazy breed of leftists.  For the record, communists and nazis both suck and in their extremes breed their forms of hatred and pitting people against eahc other.  They both resulted in the murders of millions of people in the 20th century all in the name of bullshit purity tests and ideological stupidity.  I dislike Hitler as much as Mao or Stalin. 

But, of course facts never matter to leftists.  Biden gaffs all the time and even Obama lied but they never got fact checked due to being fellow leftists. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on March 28, 2021, 01:14:21 am
I believe Trump was speaking to moderates on both sides and not the extremists.  But gaffy Biden gets a free pass because he's a leftist.  Trump gets his words twisted around used against him as a weapon.  Anyone who's not an idiot knows he wasn't praising the extremists on either side, the nazis or the marxists.  But, whatever can help advance their agenda including lots of character assasination is par the course for lots of these clowns.  A lot of folks today just have no honor or integrety.  They don't care who they destroy or whose lives they ruin so long as they can advance their selfish causes.  This is the new batshit crazy breed of leftists.  For the record, communists and nazis both suck and in their extremes breed their forms of hatred and pitting people against eahc other.  They both resulted in the murders of millions of people in the 20th century all in the name of bullshit purity tests and ideological stupidity.  I dislike Hitler as much as Mao or Stalin. 

But, of course facts never matter to leftists.  Biden gaffs all the time and even Obama lied but they never got fact checked due to being fellow leftists. 
That is some wickedly strong right-wing koolaid you've been drinking. You might want to cut it with a pinch of skepticism and an ounce of reason. and leave out the bitters.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on March 28, 2021, 11:18:19 am
Every hangook77 post about politics ever:

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Unholy_three.png/300px-Unholy_three.png)
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 29, 2021, 07:53:44 am
That is some wickedly strong right-wing koolaid you've been drinking. You might want to cut it with a pinch of skepticism and an ounce of reason. and leave out the bitters.

As long as you denouce antifa and blm far left violence....
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on March 29, 2021, 10:18:44 pm
As long as you denouce antifa and blm far left violence....
BLM is not far left unless you think justice for all is a Marxist credo.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on March 30, 2021, 01:30:07 pm
BLM is not far left unless you think justice for all is a Marxist credo.

Yeah actually it is a Marxist organization and it did say so on the site though they may have scrubbed it.  But instead of class warfare to divide people, they use race warfare.  Divide and conquer in order to rule as the old saying goes.  All of their policies on redistribution and more government control and ownership are Marxist policies.  I can be nice to people of other races without bowing down on my knees to worship that group.  Also the violence and looting and burning of cities by antifa and blm does get glossed over by the media and on here too. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on March 30, 2021, 02:50:23 pm
Yeah actually it is a Marxist organization and it did say so on the site though they may have scrubbed it. 
BLM is not a unified organization. Elements of it are far-left marxist nutjobs, but then again, elements of the gun-rights group are far-right racist nutjobs. I don't define either group by their crazies.

BLM is way to big of a tent to lump everyone together. Maybe if you were talking BLM Chapter 697: University of Toledo then you could make that claim. But we're talking normal people. Suburbanites and retirees and church folk claim BLM. Heck, at the broadest level of their message, I agree with their message- Black Lives DO Matter. Now, I may disagree with specific recommendations or certain cases they choose to emphasize or whatever, but if I am at that level, then there are tons of normal people who support BLM to a greater degree than me and they certainly aren't Marxist nuts.

You're doing the same crap as the nutjob left- lumping everyone who isn't supporting Trump into the category of far-left nutjob and predicting doom and gloom while spewing conspiracy theories and seeing bogeymen everywhere.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: MayorHaggar on March 30, 2021, 06:04:37 pm
rest of waygook while Martin and han-kook argue with one another:

(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/029/190/monkey.jpg)
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on March 31, 2021, 04:39:50 am
rest of waygook while Martin and han-kook argue with one another:

(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/029/190/monkey.jpg)
Post of the year!
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: DocH on March 31, 2021, 07:36:09 am
Post of the year!

That is pretty darn good, whomever they are.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on July 08, 2021, 12:45:19 pm
"Former President Trump announces lawsuit against Facebook, Twitter and Google"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZkG7iK38Co
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Kyndo on July 08, 2021, 01:03:28 pm
"... unfortunately, nobody will know about it because the former President of the USA has been banned from all forms of media."
 Such a shame.  :sad:

But seriously, are these lawsuits potentially winnable, or are they pro forma fishing expeditions like the vote challenges made near the end of the election period?
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on July 08, 2021, 01:38:17 pm
"... unfortunately, nobody will know about it because the former President of the USA has been banned from all forms of media."
 Such a shame.  :sad:

But seriously, are these lawsuits potentially winnable, or are they pro forma fishing expeditions like the vote challenges made near the end of the election period?

To think a First Amendment censorship violation has occurred, you have to agree that Facebook, Twitter, et al are governmental authorities.

And they were government actors censoring the President while he was in charge of the government they were part of. 

It seems ... questionable.

Oh, and when Trump blocked people he didn't like from his twitter feed, he said his Twitter account is not subject to the First Amendment.  He can't have it both ways. 
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: tylerthegloob on July 08, 2021, 02:12:42 pm
But seriously, are these lawsuits potentially winnable, or are they pro forma fishing expeditions like the vote challenges made near the end of the election period?
what do you mean? according to some of waygook's sharpest political minds those lawsuits are making their way up the courts and trump is gonna be our president again very very soon
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: CO2 on July 08, 2021, 02:29:20 pm
those lawsuits are making their way up the courts and trump is gonna be our president again very very soon
big if tru
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: 745sticky on July 08, 2021, 02:37:33 pm
But seriously, are these lawsuits potentially winnable,

nope.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: gogators! on July 09, 2021, 12:06:52 am
It's another trump money grab--he's using it as a vehicle to solicit contributions.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Savant on July 09, 2021, 08:13:21 am
It's another trump money grab--he's using it as a vehicle to solicit contributions.

Guess his lawyers are working pro-bono because he ain't paying them.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: fka on July 09, 2021, 09:28:58 am
It's a publicity stunt and fundraising scam. As others have pointed out, there is absolutely no legal basis for a First Amendment claim. It would be like The 2 Live Crew suing record shops for choosing not to stock their albums, or Robert Mapplethorpe suing bookstores for not carrying his books, or pornographers suing TV stations for not broadcasting their productions.

Trump's stunt will succeed in exciting imbeciles though.

(Apologies to the youth of Waygook for grounding my analogies in the 1990s.)


EDIT: I should add that it would be like suing those record shops, bookstores and TV stations after signing a contract which explicitly gives those entities the power to not stock or broadcast your products.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: T_Rex on September 12, 2021, 10:30:44 pm
"Former President Donald Trump’s team quietly launched a new social media platform on Thursday, billing it as an alternative to Big Tech sites."
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/07/01/gettr-trump-social-media-platform-497606

https://www.gettr.com/

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on September 12, 2021, 10:52:23 pm
"Former President Donald Trump’s team quietly launched a new social media platform on Thursday, billing it as an alternative to Big Tech sites."
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/07/01/gettr-trump-social-media-platform-497606

https://www.gettr.com/



Two months ago.  And already down to about eight nutjobs.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Adel on September 13, 2021, 02:40:28 am
"Former President Donald Trump’s team quietly launched a new social media platform on Thursday, billing it as an alternative to Big Tech sites."
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/07/01/gettr-trump-social-media-platform-497606

https://www.gettr.com/


Quote
Whether GETTR will succeed is dubious at best. Their last attempt to replicate his twitter feed, a site called “From The Desk of Donald Trump”, was widely derided as nothing more than a blog, barely received any web traffic, and shut down less than a month later.
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/07/01/gettr-trump-social-media-platform-497606

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on September 13, 2021, 11:51:41 am
Nature abhors a vacuum. Something will emerge if RW content is clamped down on.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: hangook77 on September 13, 2021, 11:55:09 am
Nature abhors a vacuum. Something will emerge if RW content is clamped down on.

The cool kids will just go to Rumble. 

Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr C on September 13, 2021, 01:27:28 pm
Nature abhors a vacuum. Something will emerge if RW content is clamped down on.

This is not true.  99.99% of nature is a vacuum.
Title: Re: Trump permanently banned from twitter
Post by: Mr.DeMartino on September 13, 2021, 01:37:37 pm
This is not true.  99.99% of nature is a vacuum.
(https://c.tenor.com/0GfM33yDAuAAAAAC/nathan-fillion-uhm.gif)