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Career Venue => Contract, and Job Related Issues => Topic started by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 08:28:07 am

Title: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 08:28:07 am
Last week I went to the contract renewal orientation for Busan only to find that we weren't actually signing the contracts because they weren't yet finalised.  They told us that "Paid Leaves" are going to be changed but they couldn't tell us any more details.

This popped up on Reddit today (https://www.reddit.com/r/teachinginkorea/comments/a9lg72/korean_public_schools_increasing_vacation_days/)

Fingers crossed!!  ;D
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 27, 2018, 08:40:19 am
yeah, i saw this too. i wonder how this will change the extra days you get for renewal...
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 08:48:42 am
yeah, i saw this too. i wonder how this will change the extra days you get for renewal...

Yeah I thought the same thing.  I would imagine they'll get rid of that because arguably the renewal bonus we already get is pretty good.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 08:50:55 am
Also I wonder how this would affect camps.  From what I read here, people have enough difficulty squeezing in their vacation days as it is without adding even more lol.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 27, 2018, 08:54:02 am
yeah, i saw this too. i wonder how this will change the extra days you get for renewal...

Yeah I thought the same thing.  I would imagine they'll get rid of that because arguably the renewal bonus we already get is pretty good.

that would be a little upsetting but i guess i wouldn't be too salty. if they cut it in half or something, i think that's fair. but, i guess i don't care too much.

Also I wonder how this would affect camps.  From what I read here, people have enough difficulty squeezing in their vacation days as it is without adding even more lol.

yeah i had a really hard time fitting in my vacation this year (i'm at 1 middle and 1 elementary and their schedules don't align well). there's also that time before march where we can take vacation but i think that's technically at the beginning of the next contract (not the end of this one) and so it wouldn't be part of "winter" break...
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 09:37:41 am
Do you think they will get rid of the one week renewal vacation though?  I guess we'd still have extra days though slightly.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Vee94 on December 27, 2018, 09:52:12 am
Do you think they will get rid of the one week renewal vacation though?  I guess we'd still have extra days though slightly.

A teacher renewing with GOE had a chance to discuss the new contract (not  sure who with but someone official) and was told that the one week renewal was being removed from the new contracts.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 09:54:16 am
Do you think they will get rid of the one week renewal vacation though?  I guess we'd still have extra days though slightly.

A teacher renewing with GOE had a chance to discuss the new contract (not  sure who with but someone official) and was told that the one week renewal was being removed from the new contracts.

It figures.  But, we still end up with an extra 3 days net, I guess.  (The one week was 5 days.)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: SeoulAlone on December 27, 2018, 10:20:21 am
okay, I'm lost.  (Which isn't out of the norm)  So, those who came in Spring in-take 2018 (and any others after) are being given an extra week vacation effective immediately?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: bluehermione on December 27, 2018, 10:44:31 am
We used to get 23 total days (8 summer, 10 winter, 5 renewal), and now we're getting 26 days.

BUT, at least in my MOE, they removed the part in the contract about getting paid on discretionary holidays. So for example, if Buddha's birthday is on Tuesday and the principal decides to close the school on Monday as well, we have to use one of our 26 paid vacation days for that Monday.

So if your school has fewer than 3 discretionary holidays per year, you're getting up to 3 more vacation days than before. If your school has exactly 3 discretionary holidays, you'll get the same total number of vacation days (23). If your school has more than 3 discretionary holidays, you'll get fewer vacation days than before.

I don't know if the discretionary holiday thing applies to all POEs/MOEs, though.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 10:45:16 am
Do you think they will get rid of the one week renewal vacation though?  I guess we'd still have extra days though slightly.

A teacher renewing with GOE had a chance to discuss the new contract (not  sure who with but someone official) and was told that the one week renewal was being removed from the new contracts.

It figures.  But, we still end up with an extra 3 days net, I guess.  (The one week was 5 days.)

Sort of. Part of the new laws that forced this contract change stipulate that NETs will have to either use their vacation days for any non-red days off their school has, or come in and deskwarm. That means those three discretionary holidays your principal has the authority to add throughout the year (usually things like the school's birthday, bridge/gap days when a red day falls on a Tuesday/Thursday, or extra days for Chuseok) will either cost you a vacation day or require you to come in.

Some teachers already had to make that choice at some schools, while others have been allowed to take those days off without losing a vacation day. If you're one of the former, then this change is a net benefit of three vacation days. If you're one of the latter, then there's no real change in the number of days off you'll have. The only real change in that case is you have one fewer incentive to renew when the time comes.

EDIT: Ninja'd by bluehermione.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 27, 2018, 10:46:33 am
Do you think they will get rid of the one week renewal vacation though?  I guess we'd still have extra days though slightly.

A teacher renewing with GOE had a chance to discuss the new contract (not  sure who with but someone official) and was told that the one week renewal was being removed from the new contracts.

It figures.  But, we still end up with an extra 3 days net, I guess.  (The one week was 5 days.)

Yeah. I'm disappointed that it's being scrapped, but I guess  it's not the end of the world. Doing the whole "humans compare themselves" thing, I guess I'm a bit salty that the new people will have the same vacation time as me...

edit: saw the posts above and my salt is intensifying...
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 10:56:08 am

Yeah. I'm disappointed that it's being scrapped, but I guess  it's not the end of the world. Doing the whole "humans compare themselves" thing, I guess I'm a bit salty that the new people will have the same vacation time as me...

It's shitty. Getting the extra days was a nice incentive for renewal and/or a bonus for loyalty, of sorts. Scrapping it without replacing it with a new incentive is a disappointing decision. The main reason I came here instead of Japan and stayed as long as I have is that the benefits and cost of living in Korea were favorable. However, CoL is steadily going up, taxes have increased, I've hit the top of the pay scale, and now they're apparently going to start chipping away at the benefits and incentives to stay. It's getting to where it's harder to look at Korea and Japan side-by-side and think "Korea is definitely the better choice. Might as well stay."

I mean, if they don't want to give experienced teachers any reason to say, fair play. There's no rule saying they have to. If they're fine with slowly losing any appeal Korea has for non-Koreaboos and losing potential and/or experienced teachers to other countries, then this change is okay.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: MaximusPrime on December 27, 2018, 11:02:25 am
I can one up you in salty tyler. I signed a 1yr 8 mo contract (ending in a month) and did not get the 5+ vacation days (after getting it the previous yr). Then now they will have to give it to everyone no matter if they sign back up or not. Net bonus I guess (that I used to have that they took away) but feeling salty. 

Also because of the extended contract and using regular vacation days. I only have 5 winter vacation days.. Great time to go see my family that I haven't seen in 1.5yrs. I should just go play LOL to release the salt, only place the concentration is high enough that it will just leave me to reach equilibrium.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Colburnnn on December 27, 2018, 11:03:22 am
We used to get 23 total days (8 summer, 10 winter, 5 renewal), and now we're getting 26 days.

BUT, at least in my MOE, they removed the part in the contract about getting paid on discretionary holidays. So for example, if Buddha's birthday is on Tuesday and the principal decides to close the school on Monday as well, we have to use one of our 26 paid vacation days for that Monday.

So if your school has fewer than 3 discretionary holidays per year, you're getting up to 3 more vacation days than before. If your school has exactly 3 discretionary holidays, you'll get the same total number of vacation days (23). If your school has more than 3 discretionary holidays, you'll get fewer vacation days than before.

I don't know if the discretionary holiday thing applies to all POEs/MOEs, though.

Can't we just choose to take it unpaid? As in an 8 hour period deducted from the months pay? And keep the 26 days?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 27, 2018, 11:33:32 am
I can one up you in salty tyler. I signed a 1yr 8 mo contract (ending in a month) and did not get the 5+ vacation days (after getting it the previous yr). Then now they will have to give it to everyone no matter if they sign back up or not. Net bonus I guess (that I used to have that they took away) but feeling salty. 

Also because of the extended contract and using regular vacation days. I only have 5 winter vacation days.. Great time to go see my family that I haven't seen in 1.5yrs. I should just go play LOL to release the salt, only place the concentration is high enough that it will just leave me to reach equilibrium.

yeah im only at the end of my first year so i guess i shouldn't complain too much... i was just excited to get the extra days for the first time. what's that in the reddit post about it possibly applying to this winter though? that seems too good to be true.

edit: "that part" = "obviously, the paid leave increase may affect the upcoming winter camp..."
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Renma on December 27, 2018, 11:51:23 am
okay, I'm lost.  (Which isn't out of the norm)  So, those who came in Spring in-take 2018 (and any others after) are being given an extra week vacation effective immediately?

It will take effect if you renew for the 2019 contract, not for the current one.

I've got a copy of the new contract for my province and what bluehermione and Mister Tim said covers pretty much everything.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 27, 2018, 11:59:47 am
okay, I'm lost.  (Which isn't out of the norm)  So, those who came in Spring in-take 2018 (and any others after) are being given an extra week vacation effective immediately?

It will take effect if you renew for the 2019 contract, not for the current one.

I've got a copy of the new contract for my province and what bluehermione and Mister Tim said covers pretty much everything.

so the part of the reddit post that says it may affect our upcoming winter is wrong? well.. it was worth hoping for
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 12:00:25 pm
okay, I'm lost.  (Which isn't out of the norm)  So, those who came in Spring in-take 2018 (and any others after) are being given an extra week vacation effective immediately?

It will take effect if you renew for the 2019 contract, not for the current one.

I've got a copy of the new contract for my province and what bluehermione and Mister Tim said covers pretty much everything.

Of course it will!  Why would anyone try to get the 26 vacations days now :rolleyes: :laugh: :laugh:  I'm so glad we are getting ADDITIONAL DAYS.  Seriously give the kids a break from these camps and give the principal and vice principal a break from coming in to baby sit us or the school.   I'M SOOOO LOOKING FORWARD TO IT!  Plus it also looks like the renewal bonus went up by 100,000Won.  I'm looking and I'm liking  8)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 12:01:37 pm
Do you think they will get rid of the one week renewal vacation though?  I guess we'd still have extra days though slightly.

I just got my contract and I didn't see anything about "renewal" days. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 12:31:36 pm
  I'm so glad we are getting ADDITIONAL DAYS.  Seriously give the kids a break from these camps

There will still be camps. Maybe not two or three weeks of camp per break, like some people have had to do, but 13 days of vacation per break leaves more than enough time for at least a week of camp each break.

...and it's worth reiterating that, if you include the renewal days you'd have gotten before, you'll only have three additional vacation days to use during breaks, and even those come at the expense of days that you might have otherwise gotten off during the school year without having to use a vacation day.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: belocean11 on December 27, 2018, 12:48:41 pm
These are the contract and contract adjustments from the Gyeonsangbuk-do and Daegu 2019 February EPIK contracts.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 12:56:37 pm
My contract always said 18 days and can be taken whenever summer or winter.  I always bulked them up along with the 5 day renewal and took a lot of time off during winter when I didn't go back to North America.  I gave my schools two weeks first of January for camps then took at least a week to a week and a half in later January before the school came back for a week or so.  Then, after that I went back out for 3 weeks or so for the rest of February until March 2nd.  Was sweet. 

I hope they don't enforce this leave to go to the bank crap and make us actually count that as a vacation.  It's a BS clause which thankfully most don't enforce.  Also I hope they don't really enforce those 2 or 3 extra school days the principal gives now and make us count them as a our holiday.  Hopefully will have a co teacher next year who doesn't read the rulebook too closely.  Sucks to give us some extra time off then to claw it all back to bring to the exact the same or even less than before.  I don't understand when some of us just sit at a desk doing nothing just can't stay home.  Heaven forbid they actually want to be nice or anything.  (I guess we'll see what happens.)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 12:58:30 pm
okay, I'm lost.  (Which isn't out of the norm)  So, those who came in Spring in-take 2018 (and any others after) are being given an extra week vacation effective immediately?

It will take effect if you renew for the 2019 contract, not for the current one.

I've got a copy of the new contract for my province and what bluehermione and Mister Tim said covers pretty much everything.

Of course it will!  Why would anyone try to get the 26 vacations days now :rolleyes: :laugh: :laugh:  I'm so glad we are getting ADDITIONAL DAYS.  Seriously give the kids a break from these camps and give the principal and vice principal a break from coming in to baby sit us or the school.   I'M SOOOO LOOKING FORWARD TO IT!  Plus it also looks like the renewal bonus went up by 100,000Won.  I'm looking and I'm liking  8)

We get another 100,000 won for renewal allowance?  So, now 2.1 million instead of 2 million won?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 01:06:04 pm
These are the contract and contract adjustments from the Gyeonsangbuk-do and Daegu 2019 February EPIK contracts.

Thanks for posting that.

So the renewal days have been taken away as we guessed but we end up with more than before anyway.  Good result!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 01:30:27 pm
My contract always said 18 days and can be taken whenever summer or winter.  I always bulked them up along with the 5 day renewal and took a lot of time off during winter when I didn't go back to North America.  I gave my schools two weeks first of January for camps then took at least a week to a week and a half in later January before the school came back for a week or so.  Then, after that I went back out for 3 weeks or so for the rest of February until March 2nd.  Was sweet. 

I hope they don't enforce this leave to go to the bank crap and make us actually count that as a vacation.  It's a BS clause which thankfully most don't enforce.  Also I hope they don't really enforce those 2 or 3 extra school days the principal gives now and make us count them as a our holiday.  Hopefully will have a co teacher next year who doesn't read the rulebook too closely.  Sucks to give us some extra time off then to claw it all back to bring to the exact the same or even less than before.  I don't understand when some of us just sit at a desk doing nothing just can't stay home.  Heaven forbid they actually want to be nice or anything.  (I guess we'll see what happens.)

You are allowed 8 free hours per contract year to have free time outside of school.  Those don't count against your vacation.  Unless you use up those free hours.  My co-teacher this year allowed me to use "sick days" for personal things I had to do.  Which actually was for going to the doctor so she applied it as a "sick day."  But I still did my class but checked out early when I was done teaching for the day. 

There will still be camps. Maybe not two or three weeks of camp per break, like some people have had to do, but 13 days of vacation per break leaves more than enough time for at least a week of camp each break.


Yeah I'm that person that had to do 3 weeks worth of camp for usually the entire month of January, while other people at other schools only had to do one week long camp.  So yes being one of those people that only has camp for a week or so rather than close to an entire month is a much welcomed relief. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: theman3285 on December 27, 2018, 01:31:51 pm
Wait, so EPIK contracts have been amended to 26 days total vacation per year?

I'm with JLP and I'm pretty sure we've always gotten 8 days in summer and 24 days in winter? Sounds like EPIK's been screwing you guys
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 01:44:46 pm
20 days have always been standard for me when I was with GEPIK and even though my EPIK contract this year said 18 days, my school let me have 20.   So..... I don't know where people are getting 28 days.  Maybe different province I guess otherwise I'm looking forward to this!   8)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: belocean11 on December 27, 2018, 01:45:00 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 01:56:57 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.

I'm not sure about that.  I read my contract and it didn't say it would be counting public holidays or school holidays as part of our paid leave.  Because unlike hakwons, my school has never combined red days and counted them towards my vacation (ex. three red days off for Lunar New Year + 6 of your contact vacation days= equals 9 days)  That's never been my case.  For me this year I used 7 days for my summer vacation in August and this year I will use my remaining 13 days for February.  Lunar New Year is Feb. 4-6.  Added on to the 13 remaining days I have left I will have 16 paid days of vacation!  Which means I need to be back to my school Feb. 25th.  If those Lunar New Year days would be counted as my vacation then that means I'd have to return to school Feb. 19th.  SO GLAD I DON'T WORK AT HAKWON ANYMORE, because they are the ones to pull that mess.  Do I don't know what anyone is saying as far as the school using public holidays or school holidays as paid holidays. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 02:08:40 pm
I suddenly thought about this...

The contract I signed a year ago gives me five extra days if I renew that contract (which I'm now doing).  The new contract I'm going to sign in 2019 is going to give me 26 days.

So do I get 31 days vacation for 2019/2020?  What happens to the five days renewal bonus we get for renewing our 2018/2019 contracts?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 02:11:25 pm
I suddenly thought about this...

The contract I signed a year ago gives me five extra days if I renew that contract (which I'm now doing).  The new contract I'm going to sign in 2019 is going to give me 26 days.

So do I get 31 days vacation for 2019/2020?  What happens to the five days renewal bonus we get for renewing our 2018/2019 contracts?

Some people were telling me about that but I think as for the people who were GEPIK to EPIK people they didn't see this year's contract as a "renewal" despite the fact that most of us stayed at the same school.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 02:17:17 pm
My contract always said 18 days and can be taken whenever summer or winter.  I always bulked them up along with the 5 day renewal and took a lot of time off during winter when I didn't go back to North America.  I gave my schools two weeks first of January for camps then took at least a week to a week and a half in later January before the school came back for a week or so.  Then, after that I went back out for 3 weeks or so for the rest of February until March 2nd.  Was sweet. 

I hope they don't enforce this leave to go to the bank crap and make us actually count that as a vacation.  It's a BS clause which thankfully most don't enforce.  Also I hope they don't really enforce those 2 or 3 extra school days the principal gives now and make us count them as a our holiday.  Hopefully will have a co teacher next year who doesn't read the rulebook too closely.  Sucks to give us some extra time off then to claw it all back to bring to the exact the same or even less than before.  I don't understand when some of us just sit at a desk doing nothing just can't stay home.  Heaven forbid they actually want to be nice or anything.  (I guess we'll see what happens.)

You are allowed 8 free hours per contract year to have free time outside of school.  Those don't count against your vacation.  Unless you use up those free hours.  My co-teacher this year allowed me to use "sick days" for personal things I had to do.  Which actually was for going to the doctor so she applied it as a "sick day."  But I still did my class but checked out early when I was done teaching for the day. 

There will still be camps. Maybe not two or three weeks of camp per break, like some people have had to do, but 13 days of vacation per break leaves more than enough time for at least a week of camp each break.


Yeah I'm that person that had to do 3 weeks worth of camp for usually the entire month of January, while other people at other schools only had to do one week long camp.  So yes being one of those people that only has camp for a week or so rather than close to an entire month is a much welcomed relief.

Pretty lame.  Most of my schools never enforced that.  It's dumb.  It's a new thing within the past 5 or 6 years.  Never had that initially.  But I have this one teacher this year who's super retarded on that.  (No other schools ever cared as long as I came right back.)  I'm not suppose to go to the bank or give up a vacation day?  Some shit can't be done in English.  The machines don't give me an English option for certain bills.  Thankfully my other schools let me go and come back no problem.  Over a year 15 or 20 minutes here and there will add up quickly.  Bunch of idiots.  I don't think Korean teachers have to give up their vacation days to do things though because they speak Korean they can do it anytime.  I guess if all my schools went full retard like this, I'd make my main school teacher go with me to the bank to translate what the machine says after 4 30 to pay those then. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 02:17:56 pm
Wait, so EPIK contracts have been amended to 26 days total vacation per year?

I'm with JLP and I'm pretty sure we've always gotten 8 days in summer and 24 days in winter? Sounds like EPIK's been screwing you guys

I think it's total days with you guys including weekends?  With us it is work days excluding weekends and holidays.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 02:19:08 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.

Heaven forbid they could actually just do something to be nice instead of being @holes. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 02:25:50 pm
Weekends don't count as paid vacation days. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: belocean11 on December 27, 2018, 02:26:03 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.

I'm not sure about that.  I read my contract and it didn't say it would be counting public holidays or school holidays as part of our paid leave.  Because unlike hakwons, my school has never combined red days and counted them towards my vacation (ex. three red days off for Lunar New Year + 6 of your contact vacation days= equals 9 days)  That's never been my case.  For me this year I used 7 days for my summer vacation in August and this year I will use my remaining 13 days for February.  Lunar New Year is Feb. 4-6.  Added on to the 13 remaining days I have left I will have 16 paid days of vacation!  Which means I need to be back to my school Feb. 25th.  If those Lunar New Year days would be counted as my vacation then that means I'd have to return to school Feb. 19th.  SO GLAD I DON'T WORK AT HAKWON ANYMORE, because they are the ones to pull that mess.  Do I don't know what anyone is saying as far as the school using public holidays or school holidays as paid holidays. 


School holidays and public holidays are different. While they may all be listed as red days in our calendar they are not the same. Previously in most contracts it was up to the discretion of the principal or vp to allow NETs to have the day off and they weren't counted as paid leave. However, under the new contracts at least the Daegu contract school holidays (재량휴업일) are now counted as paid leave. If you look at the final box in the Daegu contract adjustments picture you will see that the old clause has been deleted. My friend who just signed their new contract yesterday said that during the resigning it was stressed that school holidays will now be counted as paid holidays if they are taken off.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on December 27, 2018, 02:33:58 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.

I'm not sure about that.  I read my contract and it didn't say it would be counting public holidays or school holidays as part of our paid leave.  Because unlike hakwons, my school has never combined red days and counted them towards my vacation (ex. three red days off for Lunar New Year + 6 of your contact vacation days= equals 9 days)  That's never been my case.  For me this year I used 7 days for my summer vacation in August and this year I will use my remaining 13 days for February.  Lunar New Year is Feb. 4-6.  Added on to the 13 remaining days I have left I will have 16 paid days of vacation!  Which means I need to be back to my school Feb. 25th.  If those Lunar New Year days would be counted as my vacation then that means I'd have to return to school Feb. 19th.  SO GLAD I DON'T WORK AT HAKWON ANYMORE, because they are the ones to pull that mess.  Do I don't know what anyone is saying as far as the school using public holidays or school holidays as paid holidays. 


School holidays and public holidays are different. While they may all be listed as red days in our calendar they are not the same. Previously in most contracts it was up to the discretion of the principal or vp to allow NETs to have the day off and they weren't counted as paid leave. However, under the new contracts at least the Daegu contract school holidays (재량휴업일) are now counted as paid leave. If you look at the final box in the Daegu contract adjustments picture you will see that the old clause has been deleted. My friend who just signed their new contract yesterday said that during the resigning it was stressed that school holidays will now be counted as paid holidays if they are taken off.

Like I said, heaven forbid they could just be nice.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 02:34:33 pm
Well I don't work for Daegu and that's never been my case.  If the principal made a  school holiday he would never tell me to apply that as one of my vacation days.  He'd just give everybody the extra day off.  This year he did that with the Chuseok Holiday.  He randomly gave us the Friday before Chuseok off when the rest of the following week off as well.  I didn't have to use a vacation day for that random Friday. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 02:43:02 pm
Well I don't work for Daegu and that's never been my case.  If the principal made a  school holiday he would never tell me to apply that as one of my vacation days.  He'd just give everybody the extra day off.  This year he did that with the Chuseok Holiday.  He randomly gave us the Friday before Chuseok off when the rest of the following week off as well.  I didn't have to use a vacation day for that random Friday.

That's what people are talking about here. In the past, the school could apparently choose whether or not you have to use a vacation day for those days, or even require you to come in and deskwarm. The new rules seem to be that the school doesn't have a choice whether or not you have to take a vacation day. Your choices will be 1) take a vacation day and have the day off, or 2) don't take a vacation day & go deskwarm. It doesn't matter whether that's "never been the case," because the rules have changed.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 02:45:43 pm
I suddenly thought about this...

The contract I signed a year ago gives me five extra days if I renew that contract (which I'm now doing).  The new contract I'm going to sign in 2019 is going to give me 26 days.

So do I get 31 days vacation for 2019/2020?  What happens to the five days renewal bonus we get for renewing our 2018/2019 contracts?

No. That clause of the contract applied to people who were renewing for that period. If they were, then they would be given five extra days, generally to be taken within six months of signing the contract. If it was your first time signing a contract, that didn't apply to you, and has no bearing on future contracts you may or may not sign.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: daelight on December 27, 2018, 02:47:30 pm
Weekends don't count as paid vacation days.

In JLP they are counted if you are not working on the Friday and Monday that sandwiches the weekend.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 02:50:51 pm
Well I don't work for Daegu and that's never been my case.  If the principal made a  school holiday he would never tell me to apply that as one of my vacation days.  He'd just give everybody the extra day off.  This year he did that with the Chuseok Holiday.  He randomly gave us the Friday before Chuseok off when the rest of the following week off as well.  I didn't have to use a vacation day for that random Friday.

That's what people are talking about here. In the past, the school could apparently choose whether or not you have to use a vacation day for those days, or even require you to come in and deskwarm. The new rules seem to be that the school doesn't have a choice whether or not you have to take a vacation day. Your choices will be 1) take a vacation day and have the day off, or 2) don't take a vacation day & go deskwarm. It doesn't matter whether that's "never been the case," because the rules have changed.

Okay I think my last co-teacher, (before the one I had now) gave me that option.  I usually just came in and desk warmed because I was not about to sacrifice a vacation day for some random day off in September.  Either way I wasn't really bothered by it.  I'd only be bothered if I was forced to use a vacation day for some random day in the year.  Forget that!   
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 02:54:32 pm

Okay I think my last co-teacher, (before the one I had now) gave me that option.  I usually just came in and desk warmed because I was not about to sacrifice a vacation day for some random day off in September.  Either way I wasn't really bothered by it.  I'd only be bothered if I was forced to use a vacation day for some random day in the year.  Forget that!

Yeah, I'll definitely be taking the deskwarming option. I suspect there are going to be some schools that are annoyed by this change, because it's going to force them to have someone come in on holidays, open the school, turn on the power etc, then close it again at the end of the day. All because the NET can't just stay home without using a vacation day anymore.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 02:57:00 pm
...Or it's entirely possible you'll have a "Just stay home anyway," *wink wink, nudge nudge*, type of CoTeacher who will let you stay home without putting into NEIS that you did.

If anyone here does have a CoT like that, for the love of all that is holy, keep it to yourself. Don't ruin it for everyone by bragging about it and causing a crackdown.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 03:00:57 pm
I suddenly thought about this...

The contract I signed a year ago gives me five extra days if I renew that contract (which I'm now doing).  The new contract I'm going to sign in 2019 is going to give me 26 days.

So do I get 31 days vacation for 2019/2020?  What happens to the five days renewal bonus we get for renewing our 2018/2019 contracts?

No. That clause of the contract applied to people who were renewing for that period. If they were, then they would be given five extra days, generally to be taken within six months of signing the contract. If it was your first time signing a contract, that didn't apply to you, and has no bearing on future contracts you may or may not sign.

I thought it always works like this:

Sign contract A.  Contract A says that if you renew Contract A in a year's time you will receive five extra vacation days during the period of Contract B.  So that's why I think that next year (period March 2019 to March 2020), those five days should be honoured because they were promised when I signed the contract (March 2018 to March 2019).

That's why during my first contract with EPIK I had 18 days but every contract since I've had 18 + 5.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tanis62458 on December 27, 2018, 03:08:41 pm
is this only going to apply to public/government schools or will private institutions also get the extra days?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 27, 2018, 03:12:06 pm
I suddenly thought about this...

The contract I signed a year ago gives me five extra days if I renew that contract (which I'm now doing).  The new contract I'm going to sign in 2019 is going to give me 26 days.

So do I get 31 days vacation for 2019/2020?  What happens to the five days renewal bonus we get for renewing our 2018/2019 contracts?

No. That clause of the contract applied to people who were renewing for that period. If they were, then they would be given five extra days, generally to be taken within six months of signing the contract. If it was your first time signing a contract, that didn't apply to you, and has no bearing on future contracts you may or may not sign.

I thought it always works like this:

Sign contract A.  Contract A says that if you renew Contract A in a year's time you will receive five extra vacation days during the period of Contract B.  So that's why I think that next year (period March 2019 to March 2020), those five days should be honoured because they were promised when I signed the contract (March 2018 to March 2019).

That's why during my first contract with EPIK I had 18 days but every contract since I've had 18 + 5.

You know, looking over one of my old contracts now, it seems like your interpretation is the more accurate one. Mine says:

 "In the case of renewal of this contract* pursuant to the foregoing clause, the Employee shall be given five working days paid leave which shall take place during the nearest school vacation of the renewal contract."

(*emphasis mine)

So yeah, it kinda seems like we should be given an extra five days on top of whatever standard vacation days the new contract states. If we aren't given those days, wouldn't it be breach of contract?

And here I was, fully expecting to read my contract and find the clause to show you how you're wrong.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 27, 2018, 03:13:02 pm
is this only going to apply to public/government schools or will private institutions also get the extra days?

LOL Ummm This is just public school we are talking about.   
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 27, 2018, 03:17:44 pm

So yeah, it kinda seems like we should be given an extra five days on top of whatever standard vacation days the new contract states. If we aren't given those days, wouldn't it be breach of contract?

And here I was, fully expecting to read my contract and find the clause to show you how you're wrong.  :laugh:

This is exactly what I wanted to hear (read?). I can feel the salt receding and the hope rising. 31 days vacation would be mossssst excellent my dudes.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 27, 2018, 03:24:43 pm

So yeah, it kinda seems like we should be given an extra five days on top of whatever standard vacation days the new contract states. If we aren't given those days, wouldn't it be breach of contract?

And here I was, fully expecting to read my contract and find the clause to show you how you're wrong.  :laugh:

This is exactly what I wanted to hear (read?). I can feel the salt receding and the hope rising. 31 days vacation would be mossssst excellent my dudes.

Lol same!  It suddenly hit me haha.  Three weeks in summer, three weeks in winter with a day to spare  8)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on December 27, 2018, 03:25:05 pm
Wait, so EPIK contracts have been amended to 26 days total vacation per year?

I'm with JLP and I'm pretty sure we've always gotten 8 days in summer and 24 days in winter? Sounds like EPIK's been screwing you guys

I'm with JLP too, and worked with EPIK in the past.
JLP's includes weekends and red days during your vacation time though. EPIK's didn't (from what I remember; or my school at the time didn't care if I worked around it).
They end up being roughly the same, with JLP getting a couple days extra, but with EPIKs extra, it'll be the same, or JLP will be a day behind.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on December 27, 2018, 03:26:59 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.

I'm not sure about that.  I read my contract and it didn't say it would be counting public holidays or school holidays as part of our paid leave.  Because unlike hakwons, my school has never combined red days and counted them towards my vacation (ex. three red days off for Lunar New Year + 6 of your contact vacation days= equals 9 days)  That's never been my case.  For me this year I used 7 days for my summer vacation in August and this year I will use my remaining 13 days for February.  Lunar New Year is Feb. 4-6.  Added on to the 13 remaining days I have left I will have 16 paid days of vacation!  Which means I need to be back to my school Feb. 25th.  If those Lunar New Year days would be counted as my vacation then that means I'd have to return to school Feb. 19th.  SO GLAD I DON'T WORK AT HAKWON ANYMORE, because they are the ones to pull that mess.  Do I don't know what anyone is saying as far as the school using public holidays or school holidays as paid holidays.

JLP includes holidays and weekends too, but usually offered a few extra days vacation than EPIK (24 winter, 8 summer)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tanis62458 on December 27, 2018, 03:35:30 pm
is this only going to apply to public/government schools or will private institutions also get the extra days?

LOL Ummm This is just public school we are talking about.

cool so lol.  anway, so will this also apply to private institutions as well.  when amendments are made to the klsl aren't the usually covered for all of those employed in korea?  seeing as how those laws will supersede any contracts written by private institutions.  for example, no penalty clauses in contracts etc.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: lelsasser on December 27, 2018, 03:37:39 pm
GEPIK currently has 21 days and 5 day with a renewal bonus. So GEPIK doesn't gain too much, and if they don't those 'sandwich'/discretionary holidays, it would actually be at a loss for us.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: belocean11 on December 27, 2018, 04:04:55 pm
I suddenly thought about this...

The contract I signed a year ago gives me five extra days if I renew that contract (which I'm now doing).  The new contract I'm going to sign in 2019 is going to give me 26 days.

So do I get 31 days vacation for 2019/2020?  What happens to the five days renewal bonus we get for renewing our 2018/2019 contracts?

No. That clause of the contract applied to people who were renewing for that period. If they were, then they would be given five extra days, generally to be taken within six months of signing the contract. If it was your first time signing a contract, that didn't apply to you, and has no bearing on future contracts you may or may not sign.

I thought it always works like this:

Sign contract A.  Contract A says that if you renew Contract A in a year's time you will receive five extra vacation days during the period of Contract B.  So that's why I think that next year (period March 2019 to March 2020), those five days should be honoured because they were promised when I signed the contract (March 2018 to March 2019).

That's why during my first contract with EPIK I had 18 days but every contract since I've had 18 + 5.

You know, looking over one of my old contracts now, it seems like your interpretation is the more accurate one. Mine says:

 "In the case of renewal of this contract* pursuant to the foregoing clause, the Employee shall be given five working days paid leave which shall take place during the nearest school vacation of the renewal contract."

(*emphasis mine)

So yeah, it kinda seems like we should be given an extra five days on top of whatever standard vacation days the new contract states. If we aren't given those days, wouldn't it be breach of contract?

And here I was, fully expecting to read my contract and find the clause to show you how you're wrong.  :laugh:


According to the Daegu renewal, they get 26 + the 5 renewal days for the 2018 (current) contract. The renewal bonus days clause has been removed from the 2019 contract. So if the other POE and MOE contracts are the same, only this year will we get 31 vacation days after that we will go back to 26 days.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Sasstiel on December 27, 2018, 07:53:21 pm
Letter from DMOE to all teachers.

Not sure where theyíre getting their math, but this feels like a huge go f yourself to teachers whoíve worked for several years and are just now leaving-  our renewal counted for less time off than 1st year teachers are getting. There are a lot of seriously pissed off teachers in Daegu right now....

ďGood afternoon,

This email intends to provide some explanation about the recent change in the Labor Standards Act of the Korean Labor Law, which directly affected some of our NETs, namely whose 1st contract is finishing this upcoming spring or fall. The schools with the affected NETs have been provided with the explanation and directions on how the change is, should be, incorporated to their NETs. Only the 1st year NETs are affected by the change because the specific change in Labor Standards Act incorporated the change's purpose to improve benefits for short-term employees. Information found below includes the purpose of the change in the Labor Standards Act and how it's related to our NETs. We hope you find the information helpful.

We'd like to begin by explaining what the labor law required employers to provide, in terms of paid leave days, before the change. Before the change, an employee who completes her 12-month employment would be eligible for paid leave days of 15 days. But because she gains this 15 days of paid leave upon completing the full year, she would be able to use it during the 2nd year of employment. In the case she needs to use some days off during her 1st year, she would have been using them "in advance" of the 15 that she'd be gaining upon completing the full year. If this same employee maintained the employment for 2 years, she would have a total of 30 days, 15 days for each year of employment, to be used during her 1st and 2nd year of employment. You can see that in this system, there is not much compensation in terms of paid leave for employees with a short-term contract, especially those whose contract does not last a full year. This is why the Ministry of Labor recently pursued a change in the law for paid leave for employees with short-term employment. Before the change, the law did not conflict with the policies found in the current EPIK-DMOE contract as the contract provides 18 paid leave days per year which exceeds the 15 required by the law.

After the change, an employee with a 12-month contract are eligible for an additional 11 days of paid leave on top of the 15 days that existed previously. So if an employee works for an employer for 1 year only and quits, she would be eligible for 26 days, 15+11, of paid leave. This is why, the NETs who are finishing their 1st year, are being offered an additional 8 paid leave days to fulfill the minimum of 26 paid leave days.(18+8=26) Usually, a change in the contract will be applied only in the case where the change was applied and found in the contract the NET actually signed. However, this change occurred in the very basic labor law, and all employers have the obligation to have it applied to all those applicable right away.

The change is not applicable for teachers who are finishing their second (or more years of) contract because the number of paid leave days provided under the current contract meets the law's new requirement. The new law requires that 26 days of paid leave is provided for Year 1, and 15 days for Year 2(26+15=41). Under the current EPIK-DMOE contract, our NETs receive 18 paid leave days for Year 1, 5 renewal vacation days for renewing, and 18 paid leave days for Year 2 (18+5+18=41).

Even though some of you may be disappointed on not being provided with additional paid leave days as some others are, the change affects NETs who stay with the DMOE for 1 year only. The 16 POEs with NET program and EPIK had a long discussion for weeks on the matter, how it should be incorporated into the contract. As the change in the contract is occurring as a direct result of the change in the labor law, intended to improve benefits for short-term employees, it was applied to NETs on their 1st contract only.

I hope this email helps you understand the situation better. Also, you may find some helpful information about finishing your time in Korea on the DMOE-NET information page.


Best regards,
DMOE Coordinators
--
Program CoordinatorĒ
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on December 27, 2018, 11:16:00 pm
For the Daegu MOE they were told that school holidays would be counted as vacation days. So if your school has three school holidays during the year, then you lose three paid vacation days. Before it was up to the discretion of the principal or vice principal to allow NETs to take those days off without penalty, but with the updated contracts we lose that clause. My school typically has three school holidays, so it looks like I won't be getting any extra vacation days if my POE's contract is the same as the Feb contract in August.

Heaven forbid they could actually just do something to be nice instead of being @holes.
Wouldn't Article 7.2 be a work around to this issue?
something about... Work Hours maybe be adjusted by the Employer as he/she deems appropriate...

Also, those discretionary days, aren't usually logged in the system anyways since everyone gets it off, and officially scheduled at the beginning of the year. It's the half days off you get on test days that may pose an issue.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 28, 2018, 07:16:00 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 28, 2018, 07:34:42 am
Welp, word about the "choose between deskwarming or using a vacation day" thing must've already been disseminated to school administrators. I had previously been told I get a 4 day weekend for New Years, but was just told that I know have to choose to either come in or use one of my vacation days. I've been at this school for three and a half years now, and I've never had to make that choice, so I assume this new regulation has prompted it. I wasn't expecting that change until next school/contract year, but I suppose no sh!tty surprise is actually surprising anymore.

I know, those who already had to come in are thinking "Boo-f*cking-hoo," but it sucks to be told one thing, look forward to it, and have it taken away at the last minute.

Luckily I'm boring and hadn't made any plans for the weekend, I guess.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 28, 2018, 07:36:35 am
Welp, word about the "choose between deskwarming or using a vacation day" thing must've already been disseminated to school administrators. I had previously been told I get a 4 day weekend for New Years, but was just told that I know have to choose to either come in or use one of my vacation days. I've been at this school for three and a half years now, and I've never had to make that choice, so I assume this new regulation has prompted it. I wasn't expecting that change until next school/contract year, but I suppose no sh!tty surprise is actually surprising anymore.

I know, those who already had to come in are thinking "Boo-f*cking-hoo," but it sucks to be told one thing, look forward to it, and have it taken away at the last minute.

Luckily I'm boring and hadn't made any plans for the weekend, I guess.

yeah that definitely sucks. i dont get any extra days for new years but just hearing your situation bummed me out. it's interesting that THAT part of the change is making its way through the schools before the next contract... but i'm sure no one will be getting any extra vacation days until the next contract starts.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 28, 2018, 07:39:02 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Haha same.  Renewing teachers won't get 26?

Welp, word about the "choose between deskwarming or using a vacation day" thing must've already been disseminated to school administrators. I had previously been told I get a 4 day weekend for New Years, but was just told that I know have to choose to either come in or use one of my vacation days. I've been at this school for three and a half years now, and I've never had to make that choice, so I assume this new regulation has prompted it. I wasn't expecting that change until next school/contract year, but I suppose no sh!tty surprise is actually surprising anymore.

I know, those who already had to come in are thinking "Boo-f*cking-hoo," but it sucks to be told one thing, look forward to it, and have it taken away at the last minute.

Luckily I'm boring and hadn't made any plans for the weekend, I guess.

Damn, I'd be pretty frosty about that. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: stoot on December 28, 2018, 07:54:05 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.

All renewing teachers currently meet labor law standards for required vacation. So the 26 days will only be in effect in the new contracts. Starting from this year there will no longer be any renewal vacation bonus and everyone will receive 26 days. So for those renewing, they will receive the renewal bonus promised to them in the previous contract (5 extra days) and 26 days in their new contract.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Periwinkle on December 28, 2018, 09:04:29 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.

All renewing teachers currently meet labor law standards for required vacation. So the 26 days will only be in effect in the new contracts. Starting from this year there will no longer be any renewal vacation bonus and everyone will receive 26 days. So for those renewing, they will receive the renewal bonus promised to them in the previous contract (5 extra days) and 26 days in their new contract.

I was told by school official that the 26 days included the 5 days renewal. Not 26+5 additional.  This is all so confusing. :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 28, 2018, 09:21:19 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.

All renewing teachers currently meet labor law standards for required vacation. So the 26 days will only be in effect in the new contracts. Starting from this year there will no longer be any renewal vacation bonus and everyone will receive 26 days. So for those renewing, they will receive the renewal bonus promised to them in the previous contract (5 extra days) and 26 days in their new contract.

I was told by school official that the 26 days included the 5 days renewal. Not 26+5 additional.  This is all so confusing. :rolleyes:

Did you show them your contract?  Those 5 bonus days promised in the last contract we signed can't just be disregarded.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: purpleparrot on December 28, 2018, 09:33:06 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.

All renewing teachers currently meet labor law standards for required vacation. So the 26 days will only be in effect in the new contracts. Starting from this year there will no longer be any renewal vacation bonus and everyone will receive 26 days. So for those renewing, they will receive the renewal bonus promised to them in the previous contract (5 extra days) and 26 days in their new contract.

I was told by school official that the 26 days included the 5 days renewal. Not 26+5 additional.  This is all so confusing. :rolleyes:

Did you show them your contract?  Those 5 bonus days promised in the last contract we signed can't just be disregarded.

Actually this happened to me in 2017.  My first contract was the 2016 one, where it said renewal vacation days were 12 days.  So when I signed the 2017 contract, I was expecting to get 12 vacation days for 2017, because the 2016 contract promised them.  However, in the 2017 contract, renewal days were changed to 5 days.  I was thinking, well the 2016 contract promised 12 days if I renew so I should get 12 days in 2017.  Nope.  They said they had to follow the new contract of 5 days.  Really sucked. So I would expect that since the 2019 contract doesn't mention any renewal vacation days, that we don't get any next year.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on December 28, 2018, 09:35:23 am
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.

All renewing teachers currently meet labor law standards for required vacation. So the 26 days will only be in effect in the new contracts. Starting from this year there will no longer be any renewal vacation bonus and everyone will receive 26 days. So for those renewing, they will receive the renewal bonus promised to them in the previous contract (5 extra days) and 26 days in their new contract.

stoot you hero! this makes the most sense. thank you
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Sasstiel on December 28, 2018, 10:02:00 am
I donít really understand the wording of the letter sent out, and Iím just a bit annoyed that I worked here for so long (and was forced to use my renewal during my last contract, plus Iím deskwarming all of January, so a few extra days wouldíve helped with packing and all).

I think they should have applied the extra 8 days to all leaving teachers, but thatís just my opinion and itís also what sick days are for, should it come to that. Not going to stay up all night cleaning/packing when first year teachers are off and Iíve been here for four years.

In the end it doesnít matter. Iím out at the end of February. Those who signed on for an extra year, enjoy those 26 days! And if youíre a first-year leaving, holy crap did you get lucky! Again, enjoy it, and donít let us salty 3rd or 4th year teachers make you feel guilty. You got lucky!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 28, 2018, 10:06:12 am
Teachers in Chungcheongbuk-do are also being told we won't be getting the 5 renewal days in addition to the new 26 days. I suppose the question is, do I want to fight that and risk not being renewed again because I caused problems?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 28, 2018, 11:21:21 am
Teachers in Chungcheongbuk-do are also being told we won't be getting the 5 renewal days in addition to the new 26 days. I suppose the question is, do I want to fight that and risk not being renewed again because I caused problems?

In your situation I would probably kick up a fuss because your school didn't hang around in enforcing the new "choose between deskwarming or using a vacation day" as you said.

If they're following the contact exactly then I think it's only fair that you do the same and get those promised 5 days.

But I understand the feeling of not wanting to rock the boat too much.  Tricky situation.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: sh9wntm on December 28, 2018, 12:00:59 pm
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.


Soooo, the administration ought to say something fairly soon then. My POE hasn't said anything, but I'm sure they're juggling a lot of moving pieces.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: MaximusPrime on December 28, 2018, 12:01:20 pm
I didn't understand any of that above posted letter.  What so only first year teachers get the 26 days???

Only first year teachers who will not be renewing their contracts are being given the extra days this winter vacation period. They are only staying for one year and labor law requires them to be given 26 days. The 18 in the EPIK contract doesn't meet this so they need to be given the 8 days before their contracts finish.

All renewing teachers currently meet labor law standards for required vacation. So the 26 days will only be in effect in the new contracts. Starting from this year there will no longer be any renewal vacation bonus and everyone will receive 26 days. So for those renewing, they will receive the renewal bonus promised to them in the previous contract (5 extra days) and 26 days in their new contract.

I was told by school official that the 26 days included the 5 days renewal. Not 26+5 additional.  This is all so confusing. :rolleyes:

Did you show them your contract?  Those 5 bonus days promised in the last contract we signed can't just be disregarded.

Actually this happened to me in 2017.  My first contract was the 2016 one, where it said renewal vacation days were 12 days.  So when I signed the 2017 contract, I was expecting to get 12 vacation days for 2017, because the 2016 contract promised them.  However, in the 2017 contract, renewal days were changed to 5 days.  I was thinking, well the 2016 contract promised 12 days if I renew so I should get 12 days in 2017.  Nope.  They said they had to follow the new contract of 5 days.  Really sucked. So I would expect that since the 2019 contract doesn't mention any renewal vacation days, that we don't get any next year.

That really sucks... My 2016 contract had in it that I got 5 extra days if I renew. Sadly my 2017 contract did not. I still got those 5 days because it was rollover from the previous contract and there is no reason they could take it away from you. Should always stick to your guns on things in your contract.
 Before I have just said " Oh really? I will have to ask a lawyer about it." Fixed the problem the one time I used it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Piggydee on December 28, 2018, 02:52:31 pm
I DON'T KNOW but the contract I signed yesterday to renew with the same school I've been at, reads that I will get 26 days.  If 26 days didn't apply to me then it shouldn't have been in my contract.  And if I'm given the choice between come into school or sacrifice a vacation day for some random month in the year, I will come in and meditate.  NO BIGGIE TO ME.  Plus my contract wasn't the generic contract, it was typed out with me specifically in mind, name, school name, my salary, and all. 

I don't know why anyone keeps debating this like it's heresay. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 28, 2018, 07:18:02 pm
I DON'T KNOW but the contract I signed yesterday to renew with the same school I've been at, reads that I will get 26 days.  If 26 days didn't apply to me then it shouldn't have been in my contract.  And if I'm given the choice between come into school or sacrifice a vacation day for some random month in the year, I will come in and meditate.  NO BIGGIE TO ME.  Plus my contract wasn't the generic contract, it was typed out with me specifically in mind, name, school name, my salary, and all. 

I don't know why anyone keeps debating this like it's heresay.

Literally nobody here is still debating whether or not the number of days has been increased to 26. That's been being treated as a given. The issue now is whether or not people are still entitled to their renewal bonus 5 days in addition to the 26 days outlined in the new contract. The wording in the 2018 contracts seems to be saying we should still be entitled to 5 bonus days in 2019, but some POEs are saying we aren't.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Periwinkle on December 28, 2018, 08:45:23 pm
I DON'T KNOW but the contract I signed yesterday to renew with the same school I've been at, reads that I will get 26 days.  If 26 days didn't apply to me then it shouldn't have been in my contract.  And if I'm given the choice between come into school or sacrifice a vacation day for some random month in the year, I will come in and meditate.  NO BIGGIE TO ME.  Plus my contract wasn't the generic contract, it was typed out with me specifically in mind, name, school name, my salary, and all. 

I don't know why anyone keeps debating this like it's heresay.

Literally nobody here is still debating whether or not the number of days has been increased to 26. That's been being treated as a given. The issue now is whether or not people are still entitled to their renewal bonus 5 days in addition to the 26 days outlined in the new contract. The wording in the 2018 contracts seems to be saying we should still be entitled to 5 bonus days in 2019, but some POEs are saying we aren't.

EXACTLY! Thank YOU, Mister Tim
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: CypherSoul on December 31, 2018, 08:28:24 am
I have a problem. Just talked to my co-teacher. The co has no idea about the new renewal changes (nothing new). I myself am a bit confused. I am with the DMOE. I started with EPIK in May 2018. I believe I do get the 5 renewal days for this year right? And from next year, I have no renewal days and just a the 26 days instead of the 18 holidays?

Someone clarify please. Because now I'm doubting whether I understand what's going on!  :laugh: :cry:


Well I don't work for Daegu and that's never been my case.  If the principal made a  school holiday he would never tell me to apply that as one of my vacation days.  He'd just give everybody the extra day off.  This year he did that with the Chuseok Holiday.  He randomly gave us the Friday before Chuseok off when the rest of the following week off as well.  I didn't have to use a vacation day for that random Friday.

That's lucky! This year I didn't have to use my holidays either but now I might need to if my school decides to have days off. But I don't want to use my vacation days for the days off the school gives. I have no problem coming in and sitting at my desk all day! I think its unfair to make us take a day off when we didn't agree to it since it affects our holiday!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 31, 2018, 09:33:12 am
I have a problem. Just talked to my co-teacher. The co has no idea about the new renewal changes (nothing new). I myself am a bit confused. I am with the DMOE. I started with EPIK in May 2018. I believe I do get the 5 renewal days for this year right? And from next year, I have no renewal days and just a the 26 days instead of the 18 holidays?

Someone clarify please. Because now I'm doubting whether I understand what's going on!  :laugh: :cry:

The best thing to do is have a look at the contract you signed when you started in May 2018 and look for this:

In the case of renewal of this Contract pursuant to the forgoing clause, the Employee shall be given five (5) working days paid leave which shall take place during the nearest school vacation after the start of the renewal contract...

If you see this (it's Article 10 I think) then you are due those five days to be taken in the next contract period (2019 to 2020).
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: ISHKABIBBLE on December 31, 2018, 11:31:08 am
Does anyone know how this will effect Seoul?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hayleebb87 on December 31, 2018, 11:35:27 am
You have to take your renewal vacation within 6 months as well. Maybe the new policy is just to get rid of that, but keep the same days. Fingers crossed for 26 days + renewal, but probably not, lol.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on December 31, 2018, 11:51:41 am
I have a problem. Just talked to my co-teacher. The co has no idea about the new renewal changes (nothing new). I myself am a bit confused. I am with the DMOE. I started with EPIK in May 2018. I believe I do get the 5 renewal days for this year right? And from next year, I have no renewal days and just a the 26 days instead of the 18 holidays?

Someone clarify please. Because now I'm doubting whether I understand what's going on!  :laugh: :cry:

The best thing to do is have a look at the contract you signed when you started in May 2018 and look for this:

In the case of renewal of this Contract pursuant to the forgoing clause, the Employee shall be given five (5) working days paid leave which shall take place during the nearest school vacation after the start of the renewal contract...

If you see this (it's Article 10 I think) then you are due those five days to be taken in the next contract period (2019 to 2020).

The same wording is in the Chungcheongbuk-do PoE's contracts, and the line they're taking is "That only applies to the current contract period; a contract can't guarantee anything outside of its contract period (ie a 2018 contract can't promise rewards for a 2019 period)." I tried pointing out that the language of the contract (the English and the Korean) states the renewal days are for the next year and not giving them seems like breach of contract, and was pretty much told "It's out of our hands. If you still have a problem, file a formal complaint with EPIK."
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: CypherSoul on December 31, 2018, 11:55:14 am
"It's out of our hands. If you still have a problem, file a formal complaint with EPIK."

Excellent way to deal with everything!  :rolleyes: :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on December 31, 2018, 02:59:40 pm
I have a problem. Just talked to my co-teacher. The co has no idea about the new renewal changes (nothing new). I myself am a bit confused. I am with the DMOE. I started with EPIK in May 2018. I believe I do get the 5 renewal days for this year right? And from next year, I have no renewal days and just a the 26 days instead of the 18 holidays?

Someone clarify please. Because now I'm doubting whether I understand what's going on!  :laugh: :cry:

The best thing to do is have a look at the contract you signed when you started in May 2018 and look for this:

In the case of renewal of this Contract pursuant to the forgoing clause, the Employee shall be given five (5) working days paid leave which shall take place during the nearest school vacation after the start of the renewal contract...

If you see this (it's Article 10 I think) then you are due those five days to be taken in the next contract period (2019 to 2020).

The same wording is in the Chungcheongbuk-do PoE's contracts, and the line they're taking is "That only applies to the current contract period; a contract can't guarantee anything outside of its contract period (ie a 2018 contract can't promise rewards for a 2019 period)." I tried pointing out that the language of the contract (the English and the Korean) states the renewal days are for the next year and not giving them seems like breach of contract, and was pretty much told "It's out of our hands. If you still have a problem, file a formal complaint with EPIK."


Ah so their respsonse is "tough sh*t" in essence.  Classic.

It's funny because the renwal bonus (money) is given to us outside of its contract period so why not those days as well.  Why bother signing contracts if they can pick and choose what we receive haha  :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pizzaman on December 31, 2018, 03:24:20 pm
Take it to the labor board or something legal. You people with the bonus days being declined seem to have a strong case I would say. Of course it would be about the cost and effort of bring up a case/complaint versus any potential benefit gained.

The bonus days and renewal bonus were guaranteed to you upon renewal. Renewal is dictated by the old contract.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on January 02, 2019, 02:52:04 pm
The bonus days and renewal bonus were guaranteed to you upon renewal. Renewal is dictated by the old contract.

I was just thinking about this. If the reason we're being told we won't receive our renewal days next school year is because a contract can't guarantee benefits/rewards to be granted in a separate contract period, should we be worried about our cash bonus, too? Technically that's a reward to be granted during the next contract period, but that's apparently something they're not standing by anymore.

Ugh. I hate making a fuss. I don't want to have to deal with this nonsense.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: purpleparrot on January 02, 2019, 09:24:46 pm
The bonus days and renewal bonus were guaranteed to you upon renewal. Renewal is dictated by the old contract.

I was just thinking about this. If the reason we're being told we won't receive our renewal days next school year is because a contract can't guarantee benefits/rewards to be granted in a separate contract period, should we be worried about our cash bonus, too? Technically that's a reward to be granted during the next contract period, but that's apparently something they're not standing by anymore.

Ugh. I hate making a fuss. I don't want to have to deal with this nonsense.


I was actually thinking about this too, especially because they split up the payment.   I think we will get the 1,300,000 won the first month of our new contract (March 2019).  However we don't get the rest (700,000 won) until we complete the renewal contract, so for most of us that would be March 2020.  However what if the 2020 contract comes out (at the end of this year) and it changes the renewal bonus to less than 2 mil?  What if it's only 1,300,000 won (for example).  Now by the wording of the 2019 contract we should still get the 700,000...but seeing as they've disregarded old contracts before, what's to stop them from saying, oh well we are going by the 2020 contract rules...

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on January 03, 2019, 01:06:52 pm
I think in Seoul, they don't even get the renewal allowance.  So, I guess they don't have to worry about it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: ISHKABIBBLE on January 08, 2019, 01:25:21 pm
Does anyone have access to information on this new law that spurred the changes?
Iíll take Korean, English or both.


Also, I saw the GPOE contract as well as the DMOE contract. Does anyone else have contracts from other regions that they would be willing to share?

Thank you!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on January 09, 2019, 07:48:16 am
has anyone in busan heard any more news about this?
(paging user alexisalex)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Dweebs1 on January 09, 2019, 08:20:28 am
How about sharing some of your information of the canges on GPOE and DMOE contracts!





Does anyone have access to information on this new law that spurred the changes?
Iíll take Korean, English or both.


Also, I saw the GPOE contract as well as the DMOE contract. Does anyone else have contracts from other regions that they would be willing to share?

Thank you!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on January 09, 2019, 08:31:15 am
has anyone in busan heard any more news about this?
(paging user alexisalex)

Nothing yet  :sad:

I'm really really hoping for the 31 vacation days haha.

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: SeoulAlone on January 09, 2019, 10:04:59 am
Was just talking to my main teacher and this subject was brought up.  According to her, the PoE said that "those who do not re-sign, have an extra 8 days vacation."  Now this is my PoE, so as for other M/PoE's, I wouldn't know. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on January 09, 2019, 01:00:17 pm
Has anyone's POE/MOE actually confirmed that renewing teachers will get 26 + 5 for the new school year?  I just had a quick look back through the thread and can only see that Chungcheongbuk-do has refused it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: ISHKABIBBLE on January 09, 2019, 01:03:38 pm
They were posted in this thread.


How about sharing some of your information of the canges on GPOE and DMOE contracts!





Does anyone have access to information on this new law that spurred the changes?
Iíll take Korean, English or both.


Also, I saw the GPOE contract as well as the DMOE contract. Does anyone else have contracts from other regions that they would be willing to share?

Thank you!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on January 09, 2019, 03:17:21 pm
I'd really like to know whether or not any provinces are definitely giving their teachers the 26 days and the 5 renewal bonus days promised in the 2018 contracts. I'm still not sure whether or not I'd like to make an official fuss about not being given them, and being able to point to another province that is giving them might help my case a bit.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: StillInKorea on January 09, 2019, 05:48:43 pm
I'd really like to know whether or not any provinces are definitely giving their teachers the 26 days and the 5 renewal bonus days promised in the 2018 contracts. I'm still not sure whether or not I'd like to make an official fuss about not being given them, and being able to point to another province that is giving them might help my case a bit.

That's not how it works. The government is mandating 26 days. Your contract stipulated 23 days. You don't get to add extra on top of the 26 days if your contract offered less than 26, but you do have to receive a minimum of 26 because that is now a legal requirement.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on January 09, 2019, 06:35:02 pm
I'd really like to know whether or not any provinces are definitely giving their teachers the 26 days and the 5 renewal bonus days promised in the 2018 contracts. I'm still not sure whether or not I'd like to make an official fuss about not being given them, and being able to point to another province that is giving them might help my case a bit.

That's not how it works. The government is mandating 26 days. Your contract stipulated 23 days. You don't get to add extra on top of the 26 days if your contract offered less than 26, but you do have to receive a minimum of 26 because that is now a legal requirement.

No, my contract stipulated a baseline of 18 days during the contract period, and that if I renewed, I would be given five additional vacation days during the renewal period (ie the next contract period). The reason people got 23 was because they got the base 18, plus the bonus 5 guaranteed for renewal in the previous contract. That's why people on their first contract were only getting 18.

I understand why they increased the standard amount to 26 across the board due to the new government mandate. What I fail to see, however, is how a baseline increase across the board justifies not granting renewal bonus days stipulated in a contract. I don't see why it matters how many days the 5 are being added to, or what the new government mandated minimum is. Unless there's also a government mandated maximum amount saying we can't have over 26, it just seems like an arbitrary decision on the part of the PoEs to not give the bonus days. It can't really be said that the 26 days include bonus renewal days if brand new teachers who aren't on renewed contracts are also getting 26.

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hightowerra on January 10, 2019, 08:01:03 am
I'm in my 2nd year working in Gyeonggi right now so I had 25 days to use for this school year (20+5 renewal). I've been talking with my coteachers about the changes for the last week, and we're all on the same page that for this next year it should be 26+5 renewal days. Then any subsequent years I stay would just be the 26. However, when they called the EPIK office or the GOE (not sure which), whoever they called is insisting that the renewal days stipulated in the current contract are just "deleted". That's what they keep saying. "Just delete." My cos called 4 different times and that's the only answer they ever get. "Just delete." It's mind-numbingly frustrating.

You can't "just delete" things from a contract without all parties agreement. I'm not even sure what I would do with 31 days of vacation, not even sure I'd have enough time to take it all. But it still isn't right to not follow the contract now just because they have the convenience of saying "oh, it's just deleted because it's not in the new contract" and they know there's not much we can actually do about it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on January 10, 2019, 08:25:40 am
I'm in my 2nd year working in Gyeonggi right now so I had 25 days to use for this school year (20+5 renewal). I've been talking with my coteachers about the changes for the last week, and we're all on the same page that for this next year it should be 26+5 renewal days. Then any subsequent years I stay would just be the 26. However, when they called the EPIK office or the GOE (not sure which), whoever they called is insisting that the renewal days stipulated in the current contract are just "deleted". That's what they keep saying. "Just delete." My cos called 4 different times and that's the only answer they ever get. "Just delete." It's mind-numbingly frustrating.

You can't "just delete" things from a contract without all parties agreement. I'm not even sure what I would do with 31 days of vacation, not even sure I'd have enough time to take it all. But it still isn't right to not follow the contract now just because they have the convenience of saying "oh, it's just deleted because it's not in the new contract" and they know there's not much we can actually do about it.

Yeah it's ridiculous that they're doing this.

Seeing as your school agrees with you, do you think they would give you the five days but keep it "off the books"?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on January 10, 2019, 08:50:17 am
I'm in my 2nd year working in Gyeonggi right now so I had 25 days to use for this school year (20+5 renewal). I've been talking with my coteachers about the changes for the last week, and we're all on the same page that for this next year it should be 26+5 renewal days. Then any subsequent years I stay would just be the 26. However, when they called the EPIK office or the GOE (not sure which), whoever they called is insisting that the renewal days stipulated in the current contract are just "deleted". That's what they keep saying. "Just delete." My cos called 4 different times and that's the only answer they ever get. "Just delete." It's mind-numbingly frustrating.

You can't "just delete" things from a contract without all parties agreement. I'm not even sure what I would do with 31 days of vacation, not even sure I'd have enough time to take it all. But it still isn't right to not follow the contract now just because they have the convenience of saying "oh, it's just deleted because it's not in the new contract" and they know there's not much we can actually do about it.

Yeah it's ridiculous that they're doing this.

Seeing as your school agrees with you, do you think they would give you the five days but keep it "off the books"?

I've had to CoTs read the contracts, too, to make sure the Korean didn't say something different from the English. They both agree with how I'm interpreting it and think we should be getting 26+5 according to the language in the contract. However, they're both also taking the "Oh well, whaddaya gonna do, amirite?" approach. I mentioned the possibility of lodging a formal complaint, but said I was worried about how that would affect my chances for renewal in the future, and they both just raised their eyebrows for a second, nodded a little, and said "Yes."

Sooooo yeah. This is all so disappointing. One of the main reasons I wanted to go the public school route vs hagwon was that I was under the impression that people on government contracts would be less likely to be screwed out of contractual benefits. Now I feel like that's no longer the case, and I can trust my Office of Education.

Sigh. I wish I hadn't spent so much money on a fancy guitar & helping parents with medical bills. I need to get a way for a while, but I've spent quite enough money this past year.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hightowerra on January 10, 2019, 09:08:48 am
I'm in my 2nd year working in Gyeonggi right now so I had 25 days to use for this school year (20+5 renewal). I've been talking with my coteachers about the changes for the last week, and we're all on the same page that for this next year it should be 26+5 renewal days. Then any subsequent years I stay would just be the 26. However, when they called the EPIK office or the GOE (not sure which), whoever they called is insisting that the renewal days stipulated in the current contract are just "deleted". That's what they keep saying. "Just delete." My cos called 4 different times and that's the only answer they ever get. "Just delete." It's mind-numbingly frustrating.

You can't "just delete" things from a contract without all parties agreement. I'm not even sure what I would do with 31 days of vacation, not even sure I'd have enough time to take it all. But it still isn't right to not follow the contract now just because they have the convenience of saying "oh, it's just deleted because it's not in the new contract" and they know there's not much we can actually do about it.

Yeah it's ridiculous that they're doing this.

Seeing as your school agrees with you, do you think they would give you the five days but keep it "off the books"?

I've thought about asking about that as well, but I don't think there's any way my VP would let that slide. For whatever reason, she has it out for me and my co. She already wasn't sure about wanting to renew me this year even though everyone else was 100% on board. If I do decide to stay a fourth year, I wouldn't want that to come back to bite me.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hightowerra on January 10, 2019, 09:14:59 am

I've had to CoTs read the contracts, too, to make sure the Korean didn't say something different from the English. They both agree with how I'm interpreting it and think we should be getting 26+5 according to the language in the contract.

Exactly! I checked this too just to be sure, since the contract itself even says that it's only the Korean parts that are binding. My cos confirmed it says the same thing in English and Korean. Makes absolutely no sense.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: oglop on January 10, 2019, 10:02:43 am
"please sign this legally binding contract which is in a language you can't understand"
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: belocean11 on January 10, 2019, 10:28:38 am
Has anyone's POE/MOE actually confirmed that renewing teachers will get 26 + 5 for the new school year?  I just had a quick look back through the thread and can only see that Chungcheongbuk-do has refused it.

According to my friend in the DMOE February renewals were given 26 (new contract)+5 (renewal). They had to use those 5 days within the first 6 months or they lost them. However, because of the removal of school holidays clause, those 5 days will most likely be put towards school red days (not national red days) during the first semester.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Colburnnn on January 10, 2019, 10:37:52 am
...those 5 days will most likely be put towards school red days (not national red days) during the first semester.

Who is making that decision? School or us? I would come in to desk warm instead of making my actual vacation shorter. If they don't want me to come in, I would ask for it unpaid.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: TeacherJames29 on January 11, 2019, 09:50:36 am
Hello all.

I just looked at my contract from the Gwangju MOE and it appears that school discretionary days will not count against our vacation days. Well, if I am reading this statement correctly:

"During the school semester, the Employer may allow the Employee to not come to work on the  day(s) when the school s closed for in-semester school holiday(s), school anniversary day(s), etc., and these days will not be considered part of the Paid Leave set forth in the foregoing clause."
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on January 11, 2019, 10:02:12 am
In my province all the ct's got this file, and it says this in Korean (no translation provided)...

나. 연차유급휴가(26일): 교육과정에 지장이 없는 방학 및 재량휴업일, 개교기념일 등 휴무일에 사용할 수 있도록 안내(※ 휴가 일수가 남지 않도록 유의)

So I don't think school holidays, and discretionary days, won't be taken away from the 26 vacation days. However, nothing mentioned about the 5 extra days for renewal in that file.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on January 11, 2019, 10:03:59 am
Hello all.

I just looked at my contract from the Gwangju MOE and it appears that school discretionary days will not count against our vacation days. Well, if I am reading this statement correctly:

"During the school semester, the Employer may allow the Employee to not come to work on the  day(s) when the school s closed for in-semester school holiday(s), school anniversary day(s), etc., and these days will not be considered part of the Paid Leave set forth in the foregoing clause."

That's the old contract, in the new contract that was taken out, which is a cause for concern.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: elsbethm on January 15, 2019, 08:14:03 am
Gangwondo just sent out it's memo about the vacation day changes:
"1. From 2019 on-wards, paid leave will be 26 days for both new and renewing teachers per year
 2. Renewal bonus days of 5 days no longer applies. It's just 26 days each year for everyone.
 3. The changes will be made effective for all teachers who signed their current contracts AFTER May 29th 2018. So, all Fall EPIK teachers (Aug, Sept, Oct) regardless of whether they are new or renewing, will have 26 days of paid leave for their current contract term. Example) Bob renewed his August contract in 2018. He used up 10 days so far. He has 16 more days to use up before his current term of employment ends in August 2019.
 4. The changes will apply to Spring Intake teachers AFTER they renew their contracts in February/March 2019. Non-renewing Spring teachers do not get additional paid leave vacations unfortunately.
 5. From now on, NETs will have to use their paid vacations for total school closure days: like school anniversaries."

I'm hoping my school just forgets about #5.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on January 16, 2019, 05:58:45 am
Let's wait and see how spring hiring goes.  Some posters had said they heard EPIK had a shortage of teachers.  If it happens again this spring, I'd say you'd have more power to begin pushing back against some of the more ridiculous clauses.  But, we'll see what happens there.  I guess we won't know until April or May or so?  It would be great if it were true and not just a rumor.  It would put the ball back into the English teachers court for the first time since the Great Recession gobsmacked and ruined everything flooding the market.  I'm still not holding out hope.  Things are probably changed forever.  But, if it were true, it'd be easier for a lot more of you to start pushing back. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on January 16, 2019, 09:21:12 am
Gangwondo just sent out it's memo about the vacation day changes:
"1. From 2019 on-wards, paid leave will be 26 days for both new and renewing teachers per year
 2. Renewal bonus days of 5 days no longer applies. It's just 26 days each year for everyone.
 3. The changes will be made effective for all teachers who signed their current contracts AFTER May 29th 2018. So, all Fall EPIK teachers (Aug, Sept, Oct) regardless of whether they are new or renewing, will have 26 days of paid leave for their current contract term. Example) Bob renewed his August contract in 2018. He used up 10 days so far. He has 16 more days to use up before his current term of employment ends in August 2019.
 4. The changes will apply to Spring Intake teachers AFTER they renew their contracts in February/March 2019. Non-renewing Spring teachers do not get additional paid leave vacations unfortunately.
 5. From now on, NETs will have to use their paid vacations for total school closure days: like school anniversaries."

I'm hoping my school just forgets about #5.

So were you told that renewing teachers won't be getting their promised 5 bonus renewal days?  Has anyone questioned the Gangwondo office of education about it?

Quote
5. From now on, NETs will have to use their paid vacations for total school closure days: like school anniversaries."

If my school follows this new rule then I'm pretty sure I'm going to have less vacation days than before lol.   
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: elsbethm on January 16, 2019, 09:46:36 am

So were you told that renewing teachers won't be getting their promised 5 bonus renewal days?  Has anyone questioned the Gangwondo office of education about it?

Quote
5. From now on, NETs will have to use their paid vacations for total school closure days: like school anniversaries."

If my school follows this new rule then I'm pretty sure I'm going to have less vacation days than before lol.

I'm not renewing so I don't really care, but if I was renewing I'd probably be kicking up a stink.  I don't get how they can just pretend a part of the contract no longer exists.

As for #5, we did get a bit of an update from the POE, it "only applies after contract renewal, so August contracts should not be affected by it next semester."   But I can just see that turning into a clusterfork of confused admins/cots.
(Edited because I can't count) Based on how my schools' schedules worked out this year I only had two days of discretionary holidays, that would have left me with 24 days of vacation under the new system (Yay, bonus day!). But I can definitely see people being left with less than 23 if they're unlucky.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: eldudebros on January 16, 2019, 02:08:10 pm
This is my first time posting so sorry if I make any mistakes! I'm currently finishing up a contract in Gyeonggi-do but will be moving to Seoul (with EPIK) from March 1st.

I'm really confused about this vacation day thing because people say it's a labour law thing but I just got my Seoul contract today in the post and it says 21 days vacation. How can that be if the law has changed to make it 26? Anyone else working in Seoul know anything about this?

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: DaStrongOne on January 16, 2019, 02:21:28 pm
GOE sent a memo similar to the Gangwon-Do one posted earlier.

The +5 renewal is included in the 26.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on January 16, 2019, 02:59:50 pm
GOE sent a memo similar to the Gangwon-Do one posted earlier.

The +5 renewal is included in the 26.

That's what Chungcheongbuk-do saying, too, and that's the contentious bit. Both renewing and brand new teachers get the 26, so it doesn't quite make sense to say that contracted renewal bonus days are included in that amount. I don't think it's ultimately going to do any good to complain about it, though.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on January 16, 2019, 03:05:20 pm
If we had a contract that said we'd get a 2.7 mil a month plus a one-time 1.2 mil KRW bonus the next year if we renewed, but then everyone got a 100k KRW a month raise across the board the next year so the POE said "You're not getting the renewal bonus, because it's included in the new 2.8 mil a month," how would people be reacting? That's what's happening here but with vacation days rather than monetary compensation, and there's pretty much f*ck all we can do about it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: L I on January 16, 2019, 05:38:19 pm
Some posters had said they heard EPIK had a shortage of teachers.

ONE poster wrote that. In a thread about a guy who had just been rejected by EPIK.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on January 17, 2019, 08:42:43 am
The funny side of this for me is that if I think about all the days I come to school and I have no classes (all cancelled for one reason or another) there are probably 20 per year.  Maybe more.  That's not even including deskwarming during holidays.

So I don't know what the offices of education think they're losing if they let us have those five days.  Because they're not missing out on us teaching for five days, trust me  :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: sh9wntm on January 17, 2019, 11:52:39 am
Some posters had said they heard EPIK had a shortage of teachers.

ONE poster wrote that. In a thread about a guy who had just been rejected by EPIK.

I'm leaving and my co-teacher tried to persuade me to stay. He is worried and convinced that they won't have a new NET next cycle, which makes me think there is a shortage, but the program will continue to shrink and wages will stagnate. They've made it pretty clear that they would rather see good NET's walk instead of incentivizing people to stay (with contract upgrades). I suppose they feel they have enough "fluent" KET's to fill the gap.

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: L I on January 17, 2019, 11:55:15 am
https://www.reddit.com/r/teachinginkorea/comments/afug1u/epik_positions_tentatively_full_for_spring_2019/
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: TeacherJames29 on January 17, 2019, 12:55:22 pm
That's the old contract, in the new contract that was taken out, which is a cause for concern.
[/quote]

No, this is the contract starting at the end of February 2019. Read Article 14 section 5 (Page 7). This is specifically the Gwangju contract, not all contracts.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 08, 2019, 10:46:20 am
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on February 08, 2019, 11:02:21 am
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[

Wait... so we're gonna get 20 vacation days to use in the summer and winter (combined). So we have to find 6 random days throughout the years to use the others?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 08, 2019, 12:53:03 pm
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[

Wait... so we're gonna get 20 vacation days to use in the summer and winter (combined). So we have to find 6 random days throughout the years to use the others?

Yeah it sounds like it.  I've attached it so you can have a look.  That feeling of bitterness is rising in me again because if they refuse the five day bonus, I'm actually worse off than before.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on February 08, 2019, 01:29:22 pm
Yeah it sounds like it.  I've attached it so you can have a look.  That feeling of bitterness is rising in me again because if they refuse the five day bonus, I'm actually worse off than before.

Yeah... so we have to go in again for a contract-related meeting next week, right? Maybe someone will ask...
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 08, 2019, 01:36:56 pm
Yeah it sounds like it.  I've attached it so you can have a look.  That feeling of bitterness is rising in me again because if they refuse the five day bonus, I'm actually worse off than before.

Yeah... so we have to go in again for a contract-related meeting next week, right? Maybe someone will ask...

Next week yeah.  Tuesday and Wednesday Elementary teachers, Thursday for Middle and High.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: JenniferNZ1 on February 08, 2019, 01:42:13 pm
Hi
I went to get my replacement contract in Daejeon yesterday and we have the same clause.  I raised it with the person I spoke with and she just didn't seem to understand me when I said I was losing the 5 renewal days.  It seems the NETS all understand it!!!

Back in the day (ie a few years ago - 2012 and earlier) we used to get 'two (2) calendar weeks paid leave which shall take place during the nearest school vacation to the first day of the renewal contract with the condition of the days not conflicting with the school schedule.  This two-week leave will be counted as part of the contract term, and, accordingly, salary will be paid as normal for these two weeks.  The period of this renewal vacation may be negotiated with the school to be held in the next school vacation which is within six months from the first day of the contract if necessary.'

As I recall it, those with the end of February finish/start were expected to take their renewal leave during the spring vacation.  There was some difficulty for those starting end of August as the summer vacation wasn't long enough - hence the 'within six months' clause. 

In the Spring 2013 contract the two weeks were reduced to one calander week for renewal days. 

[I do recall being told that if we changed school we should take the renewal days with the school we had been with for the previous 12 months as the new school was not obliged to grant those renewal days.  This was verbal at a re-signing session.  Not too sure what year that was - and as it wasn't in writing I guess it isn't binding!]

Up to (and including) the 2017 Spring Contract the wording was 'during the nearest school vacation TO the first day of the renewal contract' (captilization is mine).  The 2018 Spring Contract the wording changed to 'during the nearest schol vacation FROM the first day of the renewal contract.  This wording seems to make it less ambiguous but also harder to take the leave as a solid block of time.

All contracts had 'The period of this renewal vacation may be negotiated with the school to be held in the next school vacation wich is within six months from the first day of the contract if necessary.'  This indicates that it may not be necessary!

If we do not receive these 5 renewal days for the 2018 contract I will have 'lost' those days.  I think the 26 days is simpler and I have no problems with not having the renewal days in the 2019 contract - but I do think the 2018 contract should be honoured.

I am not happy with this situation and this is just a 'blurt' (and has not been thought out that clearly).   I do plan to seek clarification, in writing, from the Daejeon Office of Education.  If they don't plan to allow the 5 days renewal leave I do plan to see if I can go further with this.  I am guessing it might be best to check with the Labour Board to make sure there is not some Government ruling which has nullified this clause in our contracts. 

I don't really like the idea of doing this.  I don't like  having to fight for what is in the contract but it affects a lot of people not just me. 

Anyway that is just my side of the story (to add to the other entries on here).

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 08, 2019, 02:34:54 pm
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on February 08, 2019, 04:46:34 pm
With these new vacation rules, just hope that your main handler is a full-time teacher. And not one of those English Conversation teachers (they have similar contracts as NET's), since the convo teacher will probably feel you'd have to suffer the same fate, and follow the contract exactly as stated.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: kobayashi on February 11, 2019, 03:41:51 am
Gangwondo just sent out it's memo about the vacation day changes:
"1. From 2019 on-wards, paid leave will be 26 days for both new and renewing teachers per year
 2. Renewal bonus days of 5 days no longer applies. It's just 26 days each year for everyone.
 3. The changes will be made effective for all teachers who signed their current contracts AFTER May 29th 2018. So, all Fall EPIK teachers (Aug, Sept, Oct) regardless of whether they are new or renewing, will have 26 days of paid leave for their current contract term. Example) Bob renewed his August contract in 2018. He used up 10 days so far. He has 16 more days to use up before his current term of employment ends in August 2019.
 4. The changes will apply to Spring Intake teachers AFTER they renew their contracts in February/March 2019. Non-renewing Spring teachers do not get additional paid leave vacations unfortunately.
 5. From now on, NETs will have to use their paid vacations for total school closure days: like school anniversaries."

I'm hoping my school just forgets about #5.
I'm so glad i left korea. So they increased basic vacation due to a government law - which was already at minimum anyway - but stripped away renewal vacation and now you have to use vacation days for school anniversary, bridge days, etc. So at best you come out even, but most people who are in their 2nd contract onwards are going to come out worse. And if you refuse to use a vacation day for bridge days etc? You are going to come in and be literally the only person there? How are you even going to get into the school if it's all locked up?

Meanwhile I'm over here in China enjoying one of my 3 weeks of fully paid winter vacation. Got 6 weeks last summer. And 1 week for Autumn Harvest Festival. You guys are wasting your time in Korea.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on February 12, 2019, 08:03:49 am
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[

That's only 20 days.  Where's the other 6?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on February 12, 2019, 08:21:33 am
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[

That's only 20 days.  Where's the other 6?

to be used throughout the year, i guess?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on February 12, 2019, 08:35:49 am
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.

The Jeolla education office is honoring the 5 renewal days when switching over to this new contract. As it is in the current contract, that when you renew, you are granted 5 extra vacation days to use at will.
New teachers will get the 26, and people who are renewing this year, will get 26+5 renewal, but from next year, everyone will go back to 26 days vacation.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 12, 2019, 09:29:31 am
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.

The Jeolla education office is honoring the 5 renewal days when switching over to this new contract. As it is in the current contract, that when you renew, you are granted 5 extra vacation days to use at will.
New teachers will get the 26, and people who are renewing this year, will get 26+5 renewal, but from next year, everyone will go back to 26 days vacation.

That's what I like to hear! 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on February 12, 2019, 09:37:46 am
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.

The Jeolla education office is honoring the 5 renewal days when switching over to this new contract. As it is in the current contract, that when you renew, you are granted 5 extra vacation days to use at will.
New teachers will get the 26, and people who are renewing this year, will get 26+5 renewal, but from next year, everyone will go back to 26 days vacation.

That's what I like to hear!

We also liked to hear that.
They are also going to be making sure the principal's of schools here, will provide a way for foreign teachers to come to school if they don't want to use a vacation day on the bridge days / school anniversary days, without causing issues with the school.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 12, 2019, 09:43:46 am
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.

The Jeolla education office is honoring the 5 renewal days when switching over to this new contract. As it is in the current contract, that when you renew, you are granted 5 extra vacation days to use at will.
New teachers will get the 26, and people who are renewing this year, will get 26+5 renewal, but from next year, everyone will go back to 26 days vacation.

That's what I like to hear!

We also liked to hear that.
They are also going to be making sure the principal's of schools here, will provide a way for foreign teachers to come to school if they don't want to use a vacation day on the bridge days / school anniversary days, without causing issues with the school.

It gets better and better!  Glad to hear it  :smiley:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on February 12, 2019, 09:47:13 am
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.

The Jeolla education office is honoring the 5 renewal days when switching over to this new contract. As it is in the current contract, that when you renew, you are granted 5 extra vacation days to use at will.
New teachers will get the 26, and people who are renewing this year, will get 26+5 renewal, but from next year, everyone will go back to 26 days vacation.

That's what I like to hear!

We also liked to hear that.
They are also going to be making sure the principal's of schools here, will provide a way for foreign teachers to come to school if they don't want to use a vacation day on the bridge days / school anniversary days, without causing issues with the school.

It gets better and better!  Glad to hear it  :smiley:

Yeah! The Jeolla education office seems really great! And the English co-ordinator is really good at relaying info to us, and to the office on our behalves!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on February 12, 2019, 10:50:25 am
Thanks for the detailed post about your experience, JenniferNZ1.

It really feels like they're playing dumb and hoping we just accept and drop it.  You'll have to let us know what you hear from your office of education about it.

I can't understand how they think that removing it from the new contract magically voids it from the previous contract.

The Jeolla education office is honoring the 5 renewal days when switching over to this new contract. As it is in the current contract, that when you renew, you are granted 5 extra vacation days to use at will.
New teachers will get the 26, and people who are renewing this year, will get 26+5 renewal, but from next year, everyone will go back to 26 days vacation.

That's what I like to hear!

We also liked to hear that.
They are also going to be making sure the principal's of schools here, will provide a way for foreign teachers to come to school if they don't want to use a vacation day on the bridge days / school anniversary days, without causing issues with the school.

It gets better and better!  Glad to hear it  :smiley:

Yeah! The Jeolla education office seems really great! And the English co-ordinator is really good at relaying info to us, and to the office on our behalves!

The important question is, how can those of us from... erm... less great PoEs use this as leverage to get ours to be more like yours? Seeing that some provinces are still giving the +5 but knowing mine isn't is making my dweskwarming time a bit more grumbly.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: theman3285 on February 12, 2019, 11:53:42 am
Yeah! The Jeolla education office seems really great! And the English co-ordinator is really good at relaying info to us, and to the office on our behalves!
+1

I haven't worked with any other co-ordinators in Korea, but I'd imagine Devi's as good as they come.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 12, 2019, 12:15:03 pm
The important question is, how can those of us from... erm... less great PoEs use this as leverage to get ours to be more like yours? Seeing that some provinces are still giving the +5 but knowing mine isn't is making my dweskwarming time a bit more grumbly.
   I'm not sure, but I DO know that complaining to the POEs about how Jeollaian teachers get extra days is not the way to do it. As it's easier to nerf the contracts of a few teachers in a single province than buff the contracts of everybody else in the country, what'll happen is that their POE will eventually say something like "Sorry guys, but the guv is getting too many complaints from the other teachers, so we need to take away your extra days. :undecided: ". This will be followed closely by JLP teachers stealthily entering our one room apartments in the dead of night and bludgeoning us to death with rolled up copies of their contracts.

   If you don't believe me, go look at the reasons why deskwarming is now mandatory across all POEs.  :sad:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on February 12, 2019, 12:37:12 pm
The important question is, how can those of us from... erm... less great PoEs use this as leverage to get ours to be more like yours? Seeing that some provinces are still giving the +5 but knowing mine isn't is making my dweskwarming time a bit more grumbly.
   I'm not sure, but I DO know that complaining to the POEs about how Jeollaian teachers get extra days is not the way to do it. As it's easier to nerf the contracts of a few teachers in a single province than buff the contracts of everybody else in the country, what'll happen is that their POE will eventually say something like "Sorry guys, but the guv is getting too many complaints from the other teachers, so we need to take away your extra days. :undecided: ". This will be followed closely by JLP teachers stealthily entering our one room apartments in the dead of night and bludgeoning us to death with rolled up copies of their contracts.

   If you don't believe me, go look at the reasons why deskwarming is now mandatory across all POEs.  :sad:

Yeah, I had considered that very thing. I've been here long enough to know better, haha. I suspect this is just going to end up another "You're f*cked and there's nothing you can do about it" sort of situations.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: JenniferNZ1 on February 12, 2019, 12:51:59 pm
Update Re Daejeon not giving the renewal days from the 2018 contract.

I have just had confirmation from the Office of Education that we do not get the 5 renewal days as per the contract.  It was clearly written to me that 'The total number of days of your paid leave is 26 days.'   

So now I guess I have to see if the Labour Board can give any clarification of the issue.

I do notice that when they reduced the 2 calendar weeks of paid leave in 2012 to one calendar week in 2013, they still honoured the 2012 contract.  Hopefully this will help set a precedent!

As I wrote in my earlier post, I find this quite stressful to do but I think it is quite important.  It is good to see Jeollanamdo doing the right thing and honouring their contracts.  But I will not be using that as a point of argument as they are a separate province.  I am just going to try to get them to honour the contract.

I will let you know what happens next!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: sabooyah on February 12, 2019, 02:46:04 pm
Has anyone heard anything about what the Chungnam POE has said? Have heard people asking around but no solid answers yet
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on February 13, 2019, 09:05:21 am
I got the contract for Busan.  It's the same as the others.

School birthdays etc will mean we must use a vacation day.
Five day renewal bonus removed.

The contract says this about summer and winter vacation:

Quote
For the smooth operation of the programming of the school, the Employee shall have vacation for 10 days in summer and 10 days in winter.

So it looks like they're actually capping the vacation days we can use in summer and winter.  Hurrah!

Orientation is next week so I guess we'll find out about the disappearing five day bonus then  :-[

That's only 20 days.  Where's the other 6?

to be used throughout the year, i guess?

They sound like a bunch of assholes.  The Korean teachers don't have to give up their vacation for those days.  I mean really, why do that just to have you come in and sit at a desk all day with no classes to teach.  Is it really that hurtful to give you the days off?  That's actually a vacation cut.  You would have gotten 18 days plus 5 for renewal at 23 and now you are at 20?  Remind me never to apply to Busan.  F@k them!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: kobayashi on February 13, 2019, 05:46:00 pm
Not just Busan. At least Gangwon-do as well. Probably the whole of EPIK. First Seoul cut the renewal bonus. Now vacation has been cut. Why cut a non-monetary benefit? It costs nothing. Teaching in Korea becomes more and more of a waste of time every year.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: sleepy on February 13, 2019, 06:46:34 pm
26 paid days leave is a long long time by typical Korean standards.

The powers that be would be unwise to give you more, due to political reasons.

The government changed the law for Korean workers.

I get 16 days per year and struggle to find time to use them all..... I can however use them at any time in the year, with no notice if I wish....
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on February 14, 2019, 10:01:44 am
26 paid days leave is a long long time by typical Korean standards.

The powers that be would be unwise to give you more, due to political reasons.

The government changed the law for Korean workers.

I get 16 days per year and struggle to find time to use them all..... I can however use them at any time in the year, with no notice if I wish....

Hm it's not if it's including things like School Birthdays etc.

Also the Korean teachers get WAY more than that, so it's not long at all compared to other educators.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 14, 2019, 10:27:08 am
I went to an orientation for renewing teachers in Gyeongsanbuk-do recently, and the details of the contract changes were explained thusly:

    The old contract was 18 days (10 winter, 8 summer) + 5 days contract renewal.

    The new contract is 23 days vacation for everybody (ir)regardless of whether they are renewing teachers or not, plus 3 holiday days meant to be used for the 3 discretionary holidays that schools are allowed to take per year, for a grand total of 26 days (with no stipulations regarding when they need to be used). Essentially, this means that the average renewing teacher will have no change in the number of vacation days given to them, while the FOBs are lucky SOBs and get an extra 5.  :smiley:

Note: schools are given only 3 discretionary vacation days throughout the year. Some schools take more, but are then required to shorten their winter and/or summer vacation periods. Also, if you're halfway smart, you won't make a big deal about having to use holiday days for these days, and, if you're lucky, may end up not using those extra vacation days for the school holiday.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 14, 2019, 10:47:32 am
For me it's the whole feeling of it.

They were forced to give us all 26 so then they thought "well we'd better take stuff away from them to even it out".  I really don't see why they had to do that.

Saying that we have to take 10 and 10 (summer and winter) with 6 remaining days to be used throughout the year isn't very helpful to NETs who wouldn't mind having a long(er) holiday to see their family. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 14, 2019, 11:13:43 am
For me it's the whole feeling of it.

They were forced to give us all 26 so then they thought "well we'd better take stuff away from them to even it out".  I really don't see why they had to do that.

Saying that we have to take 10 and 10 (summer and winter) with 6 remaining days to be used throughout the year isn't very helpful to NETs who wouldn't mind having a long(er) holiday to see their family.

   Actually, the new labour laws forced them to change only first year NET contracts. According to the new labour laws, those teachers who have completed their second year or more are actually owed *less* holidays than those who just completed their first (weird, I know, but they read us the relevant passages). But because EPIK doesn't want to deal with endless whinging about how unfair it is that first year teachers get more vacation, they graciously decided not to reduce ours. So very gracious. :rolleyes:

    Also, I'm not sure how things are in your province, but in the POE representative in the Gyeongsangbukdo EPIK orientation thingy specifically stated that there is no 10/10 division. Theoretically, we could take all 23 days of our vacation days at once, so long as our school schedules can accommodate it (the remaining 3 are probably going to be used for the school discretionary holidays).

    JLP is doing things differently, so I can't say this is definitely how things will work in every province, but that's how  it will go in my neck of the woods urban sprawl.  :smiley:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on February 14, 2019, 11:31:50 am
    The new contract is 23 days vacation for everybody (ir)regardless of whether they are renewing teachers or not, plus 3 holiday days meant to be used for the 3 discretionary holidays that schools are allowed to take per year, for a grand total of 26 days (with no stipulations regarding when they need to be used). Essentially, this means that the average renewing teacher will have no change in the number of vacation days given to them, while the FOBs are lucky SOBs and get an extra 5.  :smiley:


Yes, that's been understood to be the case for a while now. The problem isn't the total number of days we're given, it's that we aren't being given bonus days that are stipulated in our contracts.

The 2018 contract said that if we renew that contract, we would be given five renewal bonus days to be taken during the renewal contract period (2019). We should get those five bonus days in addition to whatever the baseline number of vacation days is, regardless of whether or not that number has changed. As has been noted above, at least one province actually is honoring that clause of the contract and giving the new number plus the bonus five, which really just makes this doubly frustrating for the rest of us.

Imagine if they increased overall NET salaries across the board for 2019 (hahahaha, I wish!), but then said we wouldn't be getting the renewal bonus as stated in our 2018 contract, because the renewal bonus money was the same as the difference between the old salary and the new salary. People would not be happy, I suspect. Sure, they'd be getting the same amount of money in 2019 as they would've without the change, but it's the principle of the thing.

I dunno. I really should probably stop checking this thread or thinking about this topic at all. It's getting my blood pressure up about something that is most likely out of our hands. We're getting the shaft, and that's the end of it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 14, 2019, 12:11:54 pm
Yes, that's been understood to be the case for a while now. The problem isn't the total number of days we're given, it's that we aren't being given bonus days that are stipulated in our contracts.

The 2018 contract said that if we renew that contract, we would be given five renewal bonus days to be taken during the renewal contract period (2019). We should get those five bonus days in addition to whatever the baseline number of vacation days is, regardless of whether or not that number has changed. As has been noted above, at least one province actually is honoring that clause of the contract and giving the new number plus the bonus five, which really just makes this doubly frustrating for the rest of us.

Imagine if they increased overall NET salaries across the board for 2019 (hahahaha, I wish!), but then said we wouldn't be getting the renewal bonus as stated in our 2018 contract, because the renewal bonus money was the same as the difference between the old salary and the new salary. People would not be happy, I suspect. Sure, they'd be getting the same amount of money in 2019 as they would've without the change, but it's the principle of the thing.

I dunno. I really should probably stop checking this thread or thinking about this topic at all. It's getting my blood pressure up about something that is most likely out of our hands. We're getting the shaft, and that's the end of it.
Just reiterating because not everybody seems to be on the same page.

Thing is, we *are* being given the contract renewal days: it's why we now have 23+3 rather than 18+3. They've just rolled it into one single package rather than keeping  "vacation days" and "renewal bonus vacation days" separate as they've been doing up until now. All they've essentially done is change the  name. The real change is that now *everybody* gets the five bonus days, regardless of whether they've renewed a contract or not. It's not us getting the shaft, it's other people getting a hefty vacation bonus.

I agree that it sucks, but like you say, it is what it is -- which is out of our hands.   :sad:

Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on February 14, 2019, 12:37:47 pm
Thing is, we *are* being given the contract renewal days: it's why we now have 23+3 rather than 18+3. They've just rolled it into one single package rather than keeping  "vacation days" and "renewal bonus vacation days" separate as they've been doing up until now. All they've essentially done is change the  name. The real change is that now *everybody* gets the five bonus days, regardless of whether they've renewed a contract or not. It's not us getting the shaft, it's other people getting a hefty vacation bonus.

No, we aren't. I understand that that's how they're justifying their decision to not give us renewal bonus days, but that doesn't jive with the contracts we signed.

Again, think of the hypothetical I gave about renewal bonus cash. If they raised our salary and then said "no renewal bonus" even though we signed a contract saying we'd get it, do you think saying "Thing is, you are getting the renewal bonus, it's just part of your salary now" would fly?


Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all?

Maybe your province is, but mine is still splitting it. So uh... no, no it doesn't mitigate anything, haha.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 14, 2019, 12:58:17 pm
Thing is, we *are* being given the contract renewal days: it's why we now have 23+3 rather than 18+3. They've just rolled it into one single package rather than keeping  "vacation days" and "renewal bonus vacation days" separate as they've been doing up until now. All they've essentially done is change the  name. The real change is that now *everybody* gets the five bonus days, regardless of whether they've renewed a contract or not. It's not us getting the shaft, it's other people getting a hefty vacation bonus.

No, we aren't. I understand that that's how they're justifying their decision to not give us renewal bonus days, but that doesn't jive with the contracts we signed.

Again, think of the hypothetical I gave about renewal bonus cash. If they raised our salary and then said "no renewal bonus" even though we signed a contract saying we'd get it, do you think saying "Thing is, you are getting the renewal bonus, it's just part of your salary now" would fly?
   It would if they stated that the wage increase was directly in lieu of the renewal cash, which would probably fly if the increase in salary matched the renewal bonus won for won. Anyway, I feel that they could have avoided this whole issue if they had just explicitly explained how the renewal bonus days and our regular vacation days were being rolled into one tidy package and renamed. If I were lord and master of the Korean Ministry of education, I would probably smooth the transition over with a few one-time-only bonus vacation days as well. Although that would probably only delay the whinging until the next year when *those* days aren't included in the new contract.   ;D

Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all?
Maybe your province is, but mine is still splitting it. So uh... no, no it doesn't mitigate anything, haha.
Aw, bummer. I'd say "you can't win 'em all", but it looks like you guys aren't winning any of 'em.  :laugh:

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Mister Tim on February 14, 2019, 01:10:11 pm
   It would if they stated that the wage increase was directly in lieu of the renewal cash, which would probably fly if the increase in salary matched the renewal bonus won for won. Anyway, I feel that they could have avoided this whole issue if they had just explicitly explained how the renewal bonus days and our regular vacation days were being rolled into one tidy package and renamed. If I were lord and master of the Korean Ministry of education, I would probably smooth the transition over with a few one-time-only bonus vacation days as well. Although that would probably only delay the whinging until the next year when *those* days aren't included in the new contract.   ;D


But even people on first-time contracts would be getting the increased pay (or in reality, the increased number of days). It's hard to accept it as including the bonus we signed for when people who aren't on renewal contracts get the "bonus", too.

Again, I understand why they changed. I just think even with the explanation of the new number of days, it's going against the 2018 contracts. It doesn't matter why they raised the number of days, it doesn't matter that they raised the number of days.

They should be doing what you say you'd do (and in fact what Jeolla is doing), and honor the 2018 contracts for those of us who are renewing. I'm not saying we should continue to get +5 every contract year in perpetuity or anything. I'm fine with the number of days stipulated in the new contracts as a general rule, I'm just upset that they're going against the contracts we agreed to.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on February 14, 2019, 02:53:48 pm
For me it's the whole feeling of it.

They were forced to give us all 26 so then they thought "well we'd better take stuff away from them to even it out".  I really don't see why they had to do that.

Saying that we have to take 10 and 10 (summer and winter) with 6 remaining days to be used throughout the year isn't very helpful to NETs who wouldn't mind having a long(er) holiday to see their family.

Because they are assholes; that's why.  Any of you try to push back or complain about it where you are?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: purpleparrot on February 14, 2019, 11:11:40 pm


Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:


What POE/MOE are you with?   The thing about getting all your renewal bonus up front...the new Gyeonggi contracts have it split. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alanO on February 14, 2019, 11:13:10 pm
Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:

Gyeongsangbuk-do don't get the bonus as stipulated in the email today; they won't receive it until the end of their new contracts.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: bfarrell1987 on February 15, 2019, 08:30:30 am
Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:

Gyeongsangbuk-do don't get the bonus as stipulated in the email today; they won't receive it until the end of their new contracts.

yes, which is actually incorrect and they (EPIK/the POE) are still trying to figure it out. It states in article 10, section 3 of both the 2018 contract and the 2019 contract that once we have successfully completed the duties of the first contract, we are to be given 1.3mil within the first month of the new term, as part of the Contract Completion Bonus. But article 11, section 2 states that we get the Renewal Bonus and Contract Completion Bonus in 2020.

I think what they are misunderstanding is that there are 2 contract completion bonuses being mentioned, article 11 is referring to completing the second (renewed) contract - that's the one we get in 2020 - but article 10 is referring to completing the first, initial contract. We should still be getting the first contract completion bonus next month. The wording of everything is just too confusing - they should've named the two differently, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 15, 2019, 08:58:15 am
Signed the contract yesterday (Busan) and they're not honouring the bonus days.  They were very clear that we only get 26 days.

From the sound of it they had a lot of problems last year with NETs taking the p*ss with taking time off/asking for extra time off/wanting unpaid leave etc so they decided to really really hammer the point home this time.

They said that they are telling our schools that our vacation time takes precedence over camp which will definitely be good for a lot of us.

The 10 and 10 summer/winter split seems very set in stone and any remaining days should be taken in Spring vacation.  But at the same time the message seemed to be that as long as your school allows it you can be flexible.

Overall I feel that there is a massive disconnect between how the offices of education view the job and what actually happens in our schools.   
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: oglop on February 15, 2019, 10:19:16 am
wanting unpaid leave etc
is this a problem? if you're just sitting at a desk doing nothing, surely it's better for both you and the MOE
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 15, 2019, 10:36:49 am
wanting unpaid leave etc
is this a problem? if you're just sitting at a desk doing nothing, surely it's better for both you and the MOE

Yeah that's why I was really confused when they were talking about this like it was the worst thing ever.  The coordinator was basically saying unpaid leave isn't fair because you get time off but you still have your vacation days as well.

But like you say, the amount of days I'm at school but not actually doing anything is remarkable.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: kobayashi on February 15, 2019, 11:12:33 am
From the sound of it they had a lot of problems last year with NETs taking the p*ss with taking time off/asking for extra time off/wanting unpaid leave etc so they decided to really really hammer the point home this time.

oh no, how dare people want to have time off instead of being the only person sitting in a blazing hot/freezing cold school with no work to do! the cheek of people wanting to go home and see their families! gotta put them in their place!

what a joke EPIK is.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: L I on February 15, 2019, 11:40:03 am
the amount of days I'm at school but not actually doing anything is remarkable.

You're supposed to be preparing materials for the following semester.

That is the expectation anyways.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 15, 2019, 01:13:23 pm
Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:

Gyeongsangbuk-do don't get the bonus as stipulated in the email today; they won't receive it until the end of their new contracts.
   Bloody ****** hell.
   I noticed that this morning too.
   Man, that sucks. Too bad I'm aiming to get renewed again next year else I would make a big fuss over it (as it does say in the contract that we get it now).
  Ah well, it's still money in my pocket eventually.  :undecided:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on February 15, 2019, 01:31:24 pm
Does the fact that we now get the entirety of our contract renewal bonus cash up front mitigate the vacation day brewhaha at all? Many of us will be seeing 2.7 million won extra on March 25th.  :smiley:

Gyeongsangbuk-do don't get the bonus as stipulated in the email today; they won't receive it until the end of their new contracts.
   Bloody ****** hell.
   I noticed that this morning too.
   Man, that sucks. Too bad I'm aiming to get renewed again next year else I would make a big fuss over it (as it does say in the contract that we get it now).
  Ah well, it's still money in my pocket eventually.  :undecided:
In some schools I've gotten that money all at the end, in others it was split. Either way, I get the money, so to me it doesn't matter when I get it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: L I on February 15, 2019, 02:55:48 pm
Either way, I get the money, so to me it doesn't matter when I get it.

You don't care about inflation, interest on student loans/credit card loans, or the fact stocks increase in value at almost 10% a year on average.

The sooner one gets money, the more it is worth.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on February 15, 2019, 03:19:28 pm
Either way, I get the money, so to me it doesn't matter when I get it.

You don't care about inflation, interest on student loans/credit card loans, or the fact stocks increase in value at almost 10% a year on average.

The sooner one gets money, the more it is worth.
$2000, 12 months later really isn't going to effect my bottom line. Inflation in one year, in a developed economy is no more than 2-ish%. And if you quit before 6 months, you're supposed to return $700 of it. Makes sense for them to delay it until after at least 6 months.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on February 18, 2019, 09:14:37 am
Signed the contract yesterday (Busan) and they're not honouring the bonus days.  They were very clear that we only get 26 days.

From the sound of it they had a lot of problems last year with NETs taking the p*ss with taking time off/asking for extra time off/wanting unpaid leave etc so they decided to really really hammer the point home this time.

They said that they are telling our schools that our vacation time takes precedence over camp which will definitely be good for a lot of us.

The 10 and 10 summer/winter split seems very set in stone and any remaining days should be taken in Spring vacation.  But at the same time the message seemed to be that as long as your school allows it you can be flexible.

Overall I feel that there is a massive disconnect between how the offices of education view the job and what actually happens in our schools.

This is such crap. They LOVE this line. Why do they ALWAYS blame the NETs for everything? Such a cop out.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on February 18, 2019, 10:05:23 am
Signed the contract yesterday (Busan) and they're not honouring the bonus days.  They were very clear that we only get 26 days.

From the sound of it they had a lot of problems last year with NETs taking the p*ss with taking time off/asking for extra time off/wanting unpaid leave etc so they decided to really really hammer the point home this time.

They said that they are telling our schools that our vacation time takes precedence over camp which will definitely be good for a lot of us.

The 10 and 10 summer/winter split seems very set in stone and any remaining days should be taken in Spring vacation.  But at the same time the message seemed to be that as long as your school allows it you can be flexible.

Overall I feel that there is a massive disconnect between how the offices of education view the job and what actually happens in our schools.

This is such crap. They LOVE this line. Why do they ALWAYS blame the NETs for everything? Such a cop out.

It is frustrating to be treated like children yeah.  Totally agree.

But from what I read on Facebook/Reddit/Waygook etc they must get pretty frustrated when native teachers say things like "Can I have a few days off, my best friend's getting married" or "I need to go home for a week, my 100 year old grandmother died and we were really close".
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on February 18, 2019, 10:32:22 am
Signed the contract yesterday (Busan) and they're not honouring the bonus days.  They were very clear that we only get 26 days.

From the sound of it they had a lot of problems last year with NETs taking the p*ss with taking time off/asking for extra time off/wanting unpaid leave etc so they decided to really really hammer the point home this time.

They said that they are telling our schools that our vacation time takes precedence over camp which will definitely be good for a lot of us.

The 10 and 10 summer/winter split seems very set in stone and any remaining days should be taken in Spring vacation.  But at the same time the message seemed to be that as long as your school allows it you can be flexible.

Overall I feel that there is a massive disconnect between how the offices of education view the job and what actually happens in our schools.

This is such crap. They LOVE this line. Why do they ALWAYS blame the NETs for everything? Such a cop out.

It is frustrating to be treated like children yeah.  Totally agree.

But from what I read on Facebook/Reddit/Waygook etc they must get pretty frustrated when native teachers say things like "Can I have a few days off, my best friend's getting married" or "I need to go home for a week, my 100 year old grandmother died and we were really close".

But how does the new arrangement change that? I'm guessing it's when weddings etc fall outside of the summer/winter vacation time that these requests are made.

They just like to have a scapegoat for crappy decisions..
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: busanite on February 19, 2019, 07:20:11 pm
Below is the note that was given to me and I work in Gyeongsangnam-do. Has anyone asked about whether Labor Day (May 1st) or replacement red days (Ex. Children's Day on a Sunday with the following Monday a holiday) count as part of paid leave?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: m.corless on February 19, 2019, 10:52:43 pm
Below is the note that was given to me and I work in Gyeongsangnam-do. Has anyone asked about whether Labor Day (May 1st) or replacement red days (Ex. Children's Day on a Sunday with the following Monday a holiday) count as part of paid leave?

A government-substituted red day (Children's Day being celebrated on the 6th this year) won't count as a vacation day. Just if (for example) Children's Day was a Tuesday and your principal wanted the Monday in between to be a holiday, that Monday would be considered part of your 26. Labor Day is a holiday specific to contract workers per labor law so it's not part of the 26 either :)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on February 20, 2019, 08:22:08 am
Below is the note that was given to me and I work in Gyeongsangnam-do. Has anyone asked about whether Labor Day (May 1st) or replacement red days (Ex. Children's Day on a Sunday with the following Monday a holiday) count as part of paid leave?

If you're an EPIK teacher, look in your contract, Article 7 - Clause 1:
    "The Employee shall... not work on Saturdays, Sundays, Labor Day (May 1st and any national holidays of the Republic of Korea."

   It's pretty specific in ruling out May 1st. Schools can ask you to work on that day, but if you agree to, then they must pay you overtime.  :smiley:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Jayson1979 on March 12, 2019, 01:00:25 pm
Got a question for everyone...

After combing through my school schedule for both of my schools, it looks like taking a total of 26 (or 18 even) vacation days is going to be nearly impossible.  Does anyone know what happens to any vacation days that are not used?  As a side note, it's not a case where I can just take more half days or early leaves on days I am not teaching classes either.  Both of my schools have mentioned that they don't really like when we do that.  Any idea?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on March 12, 2019, 01:06:11 pm
Got a question for everyone...

After combing through my school schedule for both of my schools, it looks like taking a total of 26 (or 18 even) vacation days is going to be nearly impossible.  Does anyone know what happens to any vacation days that are not used?  As a side note, it's not a case where I can just take more half days or early leaves on days I am not teaching classes either.  Both of my schools have mentioned that they don't really like when we do that.  Any idea?

I mean I would just be insisting they give me what they are contractually obliged to.

There's no way in hell I wouldn't use my vacation days.

If they aren't budging you need to speak to your coordinator. They don't get the choice to simply not honour your contract.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on March 12, 2019, 01:10:10 pm
Got a question for everyone...

After combing through my school schedule for both of my schools, it looks like taking a total of 26 (or 18 even) vacation days is going to be nearly impossible.  Does anyone know what happens to any vacation days that are not used?  As a side note, it's not a case where I can just take more half days or early leaves on days I am not teaching classes either.  Both of my schools have mentioned that they don't really like when we do that.  Any idea?

Pretty sure, your vacation trumps travel school camps, and your main school can't give you a camp so long, you can't use your vacation time.
Also, I don't think you get paid for unused vacation, you'll get told you have to use it, or lose it, pretty much (I could be wrong on this)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: stoot on March 12, 2019, 01:20:33 pm
Got a question for everyone...

After combing through my school schedule for both of my schools, it looks like taking a total of 26 (or 18 even) vacation days is going to be nearly impossible.  Does anyone know what happens to any vacation days that are not used?  As a side note, it's not a case where I can just take more half days or early leaves on days I am not teaching classes either.  Both of my schools have mentioned that they don't really like when we do that.  Any idea?

Pretty sure, your vacation trumps travel school camps, and your main school can't give you a camp so long, you can't use your vacation time.
Also, I don't think you get paid for unused vacation, you'll get told you have to use it, or lose it, pretty much (I could be wrong on this)

http://www.koreanlaborlaw.com/annual-leave-based-on-the-korean-labor-law/

"An employer does not have to pay wages for unused days of leave if he takes steps of ďpromotion for use of annual leaveĒ.

If an employee does not use up annual leave for one year, remaining days of unused annual leave do not roll over to the next year. They just expire. However, the employer should pay wages to the employee for the unused leave. But if the employer gives a written notice to the worker requesting to use up all the remaining days of leave until the end of the year and if the employee does not use the leave in spite of such request, the employer is exempted from the obligation to compensate for the unused annual leave."
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: waygo0k on March 13, 2019, 05:36:34 am
They are contractually and legally obliged to give you your 26 days. Doesnít matter how much they protest it or donít like it...not your problem.

Youíll need to be very firm with this if you really want it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Ronnie Omelettes on March 13, 2019, 07:10:16 am
legally, by labour law, 'paid leave' is only a day off.  it is not some long holiday, like people get in their public school contracts.  if you work for a month, you get a paid day off.  it stops employers from making employees work every day.  think about how inefficiently Koreans work, they'd work every day if they got more money.  labour law in Korea is developing and has come a long way, but I doubt Koreans really kick up a fuss about Labour Law because they are happy to have a job.  what they have got now is Brits and other nationalities coming over who've experience of not being exploited or worked to death and pointing out to employers, legally they can make them work in a certain illegal fashion, and we know how some hagwon owners/schools react to these things.

labour law is to preserve basic human rights for all workers in Korea: for Koreans, Australians, Indonesian workers etc.  in that sense, public school contracts are way above the labour law in what they offer to native teachers.  think about some hagwon contracts that make Saturdays mandatory for teaching, it is not illegal because they give their teacher Sunday off, which is entirely within Labour Law, crap as it is.  i have a Korean friend who works for an insurance company, he is expected to work Monday-Saturday, and he gets Sunday off (in line with Labour Law) but apart from that he only had another 3 paid leave days which he could take during one year.  only three.  he got national holidays off, but he was expected to work for some of them.  that kind of job is well paid but it's on the limit of what Labour Law allows.  but like I said, he is Korean, so is less likely to kick up a fuss because he has a job. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: thunderlips on March 13, 2019, 11:10:26 am
They are contractually and legally obliged to give you your 26 days. Doesnít matter how much they protest it or donít like it...not your problem.

Youíll need to be very firm with this if you really want it.

Check the contract for specific wording along the lines of "as long is it does not interfere with normal school operations." 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on March 13, 2019, 11:58:32 am
They are contractually and legally obliged to give you your 26 days. Doesnít matter how much they protest it or donít like it...not your problem.

Youíll need to be very firm with this if you really want it.

Check the contract for specific wording along the lines of "as long is it does not interfere with normal school operations." 
The applies to the scheduling of holidays, not to whether you get them or not.
Schools *must* give you the contractually allotted number of days off, but they don't necessarily have to give them to you according to your whims. Makes sense, I guess. :undecided:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: robin_teacher on March 14, 2019, 11:39:39 am
They are contractually and legally obliged to give you your 26 days. Doesnít matter how much they protest it or donít like it...not your problem.

Youíll need to be very firm with this if you really want it.

Check the contract for specific wording along the lines of "as long is it does not interfere with normal school operations." 
The applies to the scheduling of holidays, not to whether you get them or not.
Schools *must* give you the contractually allotted number of days off, but they don't necessarily have to give them to you according to your whims. Makes sense, I guess. :undecided:

As always, remember that labor law trumps whatever is written in your contract.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on March 14, 2019, 11:48:51 am
The applies to the scheduling of holidays, not to whether you get them or not.
Schools *must* give you the contractually allotted number of days off, but they don't necessarily have to give them to you according to your whims. Makes sense, I guess. :undecided:

As always, remember that labor law trumps whatever is written in your contract.
Yeah, good point. let me rephrase:

The applies to the scheduling of holidays, not to whether you get them or not.
Schools *must* give you the contractually allotted number of days off (where the number of contract days are equal to or higher than the minimum described in Korean labour laws), but they don't necessarily have to schedule them to you according to your whims.

(this now sounds very lawyerese.  :sad: )
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Ronnie Omelettes on March 14, 2019, 11:59:06 am
They are contractually and legally obliged to give you your 26 days. Doesnít matter how much they protest it or donít like it...not your problem.

Youíll need to be very firm with this if you really want it.

Check the contract for specific wording along the lines of "as long is it does not interfere with normal school operations." 
The applies to the scheduling of holidays, not to whether you get them or not.
Schools *must* give you the contractually allotted number of days off, but they don't necessarily have to give them to you according to your whims. Makes sense, I guess. :undecided:

As always, remember that labor law trumps whatever is written in your contract.

yes, but almost all of the time our contracts are way more generous than what Labour Law says.  like I said in the previous page, Labour Law covers everyone here from the hired builders to the directors.  so we have it quite cushty  in public school. 

if your hagwon wrote in the contract that you can have 'ten days paid leave', they could give you the national holidays off (bar May 1st) and the weekends (barring them not mentioning working at weekends)  and then if you went to Labour to complain that you got no actual holiday (like five days in the summer), you'd lose because they did technically give you paid leave during the year.  It's an extreme example but could happen.  wouldn't be a very popular school and they'd not get many teachers after, but they could do that. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: waygo0k on March 15, 2019, 08:02:22 am

Check the contract for specific wording along the lines of "as long is it does not interfere with normal school operations." 

That refers to school operations during term time. Anything outside of the school term period is extracurricular, so your contractually and legally entitled vacation trumps any plans the school might have for you during this period.

So yes, as long as your paid leave does not interfere with regular classes during term time, you can take them.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on March 15, 2019, 08:23:00 am
Yeah your vacation time takes precedence over camps.  If there isn't enough time to take your vacation days then the school will have to either shorten the camp or not have it altogether.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on March 15, 2019, 12:07:57 pm
Yeah your vacation time takes precedence over camps.  If there isn't enough time to take your vacation days then the school will have to either shorten the camp or not have it altogether.

Just to be clear: the fact that you get your allotted holiday days take precedence over camps.
Camp scheduling takes precedence over your vacation scheduling.  :sad:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: tylerthegloob on March 15, 2019, 12:20:11 pm
Yeah your vacation time takes precedence over camps.  If there isn't enough time to take your vacation days then the school will have to either shorten the camp or not have it altogether.

Just to be clear: the fact that you get your allotted holiday days take precedence over camps.
Camp scheduling takes precedence over your vacation scheduling.  :sad:

i'm not sure how much it really means, but this year busan MOE told us that they told the schools to schedule camps around our vacation, not vice versa (as it was in the past).
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on March 15, 2019, 12:21:46 pm
i'm not sure how much it really means, but this year busan MOE told us that they told the schools to schedule camps around our vacation, not vice versa (as it was in the past).

Jealous!
Good weather *and* an accommodating MOE!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: waygo0k on March 17, 2019, 12:23:00 pm
Something has to give...either the school violates the law by not giving you your legally and contractually allocated 26 days, or they break which rules/laws exactly by missing a few days of camp?

Letís not forget, many schools donít schedule camp dates at the start of term, those dates are pencilled in over the course of the semester based on teacher availability and plans. So if your school gives you crappy dates, itís probably because the other teachers have booked their holidays for the most convenient dates and youíre stuck with whateverís left on babysitting duty.

Even if your school did allocate camp dates before the start of term, you most probably werenít involved in the planning process (these things get very heated, with some teachers throwing fits and outright refusing to play ball)...so again, most people would have gotten what they want, with you left with the crumbs.

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on March 18, 2019, 08:05:34 am
Something has to give...either the school violates the law by not giving you your legally and contractually allocated 26 days, or they break which rules/laws exactly by missing a few days of camp?

Letís not forget, many schools donít schedule camp dates at the start of term, those dates are pencilled in over the course of the semester based on teacher availability and plans. So if your school gives you crappy dates, itís probably because the other teachers have booked their holidays for the most convenient dates and youíre stuck with whateverís left on babysitting duty.

Even if your school did allocate camp dates before the start of term, you most probably werenít involved in the planning process (these things get very heated, with some teachers throwing fits and outright refusing to play ball)...so again, most people would have gotten what they want, with you left with the crumbs.

My current school will schedule camp around my vacation no problem.
The head teacher, or my co-T, will be at school during the camp week. Both speak good English, so it doesn't really matter which one is there.
However, we only do 5 days, so it's easy to fit around each vacation period. Usually I just do it the first full week once vacation starts, to get it over with, but it depends on my plans.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on April 04, 2019, 01:45:02 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on April 04, 2019, 02:09:07 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

I actually ended up telling them about the school holiday vacation day rule.  I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have realised if I hadn't told them.  The reason I told them is because the Office of Education can see whatever is reported on NEIS so I thought I'd better just be honest  :undecided:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on April 04, 2019, 02:09:49 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

Mine probably will, but my contract doesn't switch over until the end of August.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on April 04, 2019, 02:45:44 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

I actually ended up telling them about the school holiday vacation day rule.  I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have realised if I hadn't told them.  The reason I told them is because the Office of Education can see whatever is reported on NEIS so I thought I'd better just be honest  :undecided:
I have a 2nd school, and low and behold, the only day I do have a discretionary day at my main school, my other school is working that day. So I guess I can use all 26 days during the holiday period.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Colburnnn on April 04, 2019, 03:08:37 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

I actually ended up telling them about the school holiday vacation day rule.  I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have realised if I hadn't told them.  The reason I told them is because the Office of Education can see whatever is reported on NEIS so I thought I'd better just be honest  :undecided:
I have a 2nd school, and low and behold, the only day I do have a discretionary day at my main school, my other school is working that day. So I guess I can use all 26 days during the holiday period.

On the discretionary day at your main school, are you at your 2nd school? Like, are you normally at the 2nd school or the 1st?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on April 04, 2019, 08:16:26 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

I actually ended up telling them about the school holiday vacation day rule.  I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have realised if I hadn't told them.  The reason I told them is because the Office of Education can see whatever is reported on NEIS so I thought I'd better just be honest  :undecided:
I have a 2nd school, and low and behold, the only day I do have a discretionary day at my main school, my other school is working that day. So I guess I can use all 26 days during the holiday period.

On the discretionary day at your main school, are you at your 2nd school? Like, are you normally at the 2nd school or the 1st?
On that day I'm at my 2nd school.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: busanite on April 08, 2019, 05:25:25 pm
PS teacher here. According to one of my coworkers, I can no longer have May 1st as a holiday due to the change in labor laws. She told me after the weekly teacher's meeting and that my handler will explain more to me tomorrow. If I still want it off, I must use a vacation day. I just wanted to pass this along and see if anyone here has received such news as well.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: m.corless on April 08, 2019, 10:01:02 pm
PS teacher here. According to one of my coworkers, I can no longer have May 1st as a holiday due to the change in labor laws. She told me after the weekly teacher's meeting and that my handler will explain more to me tomorrow. If I still want it off, I must use a vacation day. I just wanted to pass this along and see if anyone here has received such news as well.

Nope, this one you can definitely argue. May 1st is a federal appointed day off for contract workers. It may apply to no one else at your school depending on what kind of positions the Korean staff have, but it applies to you!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Colburnnn on April 09, 2019, 07:28:20 am
PS teacher here. According to one of my coworkers, I can no longer have May 1st as a holiday due to the change in labor laws. She told me after the weekly teacher's meeting and that my handler will explain more to me tomorrow. If I still want it off, I must use a vacation day. I just wanted to pass this along and see if anyone here has received such news as well.

Yeah, thats BS. It will state in your contract that labor day is not discretional. It's a day off for EPIK workers and should state that in your contract.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hulme187 on April 09, 2019, 07:43:04 am
I was just told that if I come into school on May 1st I will get an extra vacation day off in Summer or Winter. That doesn't sound bad.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: theman3285 on April 09, 2019, 07:55:12 am
I was just told that if I come into school on May 1st I will get an extra vacation day off in Summer or Winter. That doesn't sound bad.
Lol. I don't think they meant it like that. They probably meant that if you decide to stay home May 1st then you'll have a day deducted from your summer/winter vacation, but if you come in to work you'll get an 'extra' day (i.e. the original alottment.)   

Does that make sense?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hulme187 on April 09, 2019, 09:26:45 am
I was just told that if I come into school on May 1st I will get an extra vacation day off in Summer or Winter. That doesn't sound bad.
Lol. I don't think they meant it like that. They probably meant that if you decide to stay home May 1st then you'll have a day deducted from your summer/winter vacation, but if you come in to work you'll get an 'extra' day (i.e. the original alottment.)   

Does that make sense?

Yeah it makes sense and I specified to my co very slowly to make sure she understood and she said I would get an extra day in Summer or Winter. I'll check the contract anyway.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on April 09, 2019, 10:41:22 am
I was just told that if I come into school on May 1st I will get an extra vacation day off in Summer or Winter. That doesn't sound bad.
Lol. I don't think they meant it like that. They probably meant that if you decide to stay home May 1st then you'll have a day deducted from your summer/winter vacation, but if you come in to work you'll get an 'extra' day (i.e. the original alottment.)   

Does that make sense?

Yeah it makes sense and I specified to my co very slowly to make sure she understood and she said I would get an extra day in Summer or Winter. I'll check the contract anyway.

Nothing your coworker says today will help you when it comes to collect that "bonus" holiday day come vacation period.
Get it in writing, or be prepared to kiss it goodbye.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on April 09, 2019, 03:18:58 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

I actually ended up telling them about the school holiday vacation day rule.  I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have realised if I hadn't told them.  The reason I told them is because the Office of Education can see whatever is reported on NEIS so I thought I'd better just be honest  :undecided:

My schools have always used an attendance sheet for signing in and out if I leave early or have a sick day or something.  I don't use any computer system.  So, not sure about that.  But bureaucrats probably don't go through your file with a fine tooth comb.  But pricks always abound.  So, you never know. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on April 09, 2019, 03:23:27 pm
PS teacher here. According to one of my coworkers, I can no longer have May 1st as a holiday due to the change in labor laws. She told me after the weekly teacher's meeting and that my handler will explain more to me tomorrow. If I still want it off, I must use a vacation day. I just wanted to pass this along and see if anyone here has received such news as well.

What does your new contract say?  I'm on the old contract for another month or so.  My 2018 contract allows me to have that day.  I am curious what the 2019 contract will say about the May 1st holiday.  I would volunteer to take a week off in May and another in October if I could due to the better weather here.  Winter and Summer here the weather sucks, but is obviously good for travel.  Staying in Korea during that time means staying in with the heating or staying in with the air conditioning. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on April 09, 2019, 03:55:01 pm
Anyone's school going to enforce the 26 days including school holidays now?  I get my new contract later this month and I am hoping my schools won't enforce it.  Also, my 5 days I get for renewing this contract I can't take in the middle of the semester so I always have to take it the following summer vacation when the new contract is in effect.  But the folks who renewed on March first got to take theirs before their contract ended in February.  I don't know if they will be assholes about this or not.

I actually ended up telling them about the school holiday vacation day rule.  I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have realised if I hadn't told them.  The reason I told them is because the Office of Education can see whatever is reported on NEIS so I thought I'd better just be honest  :undecided:

My schools have always used an attendance sheet for signing in and out if I leave early or have a sick day or something.  I don't use any computer system.  So, not sure about that.  But bureaucrats probably don't go through your file with a fine tooth comb.  But pricks always abound.  So, you never know. 

I was really surprised when one day the MOE co-ordinator called me at work to talk about some "problems" with the information that had been submitted to NEIS by my coteacher.  So since then I've assumed that our MOEs can see everything.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: m.corless on April 09, 2019, 09:35:34 pm
I was just told that if I come into school on May 1st I will get an extra vacation day off in Summer or Winter. That doesn't sound bad.
Lol. I don't think they meant it like that. They probably meant that if you decide to stay home May 1st then you'll have a day deducted from your summer/winter vacation, but if you come in to work you'll get an 'extra' day (i.e. the original alottment.)   

Does that make sense?

Yeah it makes sense and I specified to my co very slowly to make sure she understood and she said I would get an extra day in Summer or Winter. I'll check the contract anyway.

Nothing your coworker says today will help you when it comes to collect that "bonus" holiday day come vacation period.
Get it in writing, or be prepared to kiss it goodbye.

Yup. The promise of an extra day later is a big risk. Vacation days and May 1st are written separately in the contracts. If you deviate from that now in the hopes of it being "repaid" to you later on, buyer beware.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: busanite on April 12, 2019, 01:17:10 pm
I had my Co-teacher phone the education office and the official sided with my school on this issue.  Therefore, if I wanted to take May 1st off, I'd need to use my paid holiday for that. I work in the southern Gyeongsang province, fyi (GOE).
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on April 12, 2019, 01:51:24 pm
I had my Co-teacher phone the education office and the official sided with my school on this issue.  Therefore, if I wanted to take May 1st off, I'd need to use my paid holiday for that. I work in the southern Gyeongsang province, fyi (GOE).

This an unwelcome surprise then.  So even though it says in our contracts that we don't work on May 1st, we have to use a vacation day?  I'm stunned that the office of education said that.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: busanite on April 12, 2019, 02:17:19 pm
I texted with the coordinator who works at the education office and he texted to me that the change in labor law and the Labor Day holiday were separate but somebody else my coteacher spoke to said otherwise. I relayed the info back to him. I'll reply when I get a response from him. I like to think it's a mixup but I'm not hopeful it is. Also, maybe this is a provincial dilemma and other offices interpret it differently.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on April 12, 2019, 02:22:08 pm
I'm guessing some idiot at the education office doesn't want to know what they are talking about.  You never ask your coteacher to call the education office and seek clarification.  You just do it.  No one in Korea ever wants to take responsibility and most will err on extreme caution even if it means taking too strict of an interpretation for you.  Call the labor board instead and have them clarify to your school or the education office. 

As for me, I'm still on the old contract (2018) till just as couple of weeks after that day.  So, we'll see if I have to argue with them or not this year. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: robin_teacher on April 15, 2019, 08:40:15 am
No one in Korea ever wants to take responsibility and most will err on extreme caution even if it means taking too strict of an interpretation for you.

I wouldn't go so far as to say 'no one in Korea ever', but it is often true.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on April 15, 2019, 08:52:29 am
I texted with the coordinator who works at the education office and he texted to me that the change in labor law and the Labor Day holiday were separate but somebody else my coteacher spoke to said otherwise. I relayed the info back to him. I'll reply when I get a response from him. I like to think it's a mixup but I'm not hopeful it is. Also, maybe this is a provincial dilemma and other offices interpret it differently.

In Jeollanamdo, the co-ordinator has already begun saying, that May 1st, by law, requires ALL contract workers in Korea to have the day off. The problems often stem from, Korean teachers not being contract workers, while we are all contract workers, and they (the school / co-T) want you to come to school on that day.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kyndo on April 15, 2019, 08:58:21 am
I texted with the coordinator who works at the education office and he texted to me that the change in labor law and the Labor Day holiday were separate but somebody else my coteacher spoke to said otherwise. I relayed the info back to him. I'll reply when I get a response from him. I like to think it's a mixup but I'm not hopeful it is. Also, maybe this is a provincial dilemma and other offices interpret it differently.

In Jeollanamdo, the co-ordinator has already begun saying, that May 1st, by law, requires ALL contract workers in Korea to have the day off. The problems often stem from, Korean teachers not being contract workers, while we are all contract workers, and they (the school / co-T) want you to come to school on that day.
Likewise in Gyeongsanbuk-do. It's essentially a red day for contract workers. Just like Buddha's b-day, Chuseok, Seolnal, etc. We don't use up our vacation days for it because it is a statuary holiday, not a discretionary holiday.
   I hope that you can get things worked out!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on April 15, 2019, 09:11:51 am
I texted with the coordinator who works at the education office and he texted to me that the change in labor law and the Labor Day holiday were separate but somebody else my coteacher spoke to said otherwise. I relayed the info back to him. I'll reply when I get a response from him. I like to think it's a mixup but I'm not hopeful it is. Also, maybe this is a provincial dilemma and other offices interpret it differently.

In Jeollanamdo, the co-ordinator has already begun saying, that May 1st, by law, requires ALL contract workers in Korea to have the day off. The problems often stem from, Korean teachers not being contract workers, while we are all contract workers, and they (the school / co-T) want you to come to school on that day.
Likewise in Gyeongsanbuk-do. It's essentially a red day for contract workers. Just like Buddha's b-day, Chuseok, Seolnal, etc. We don't use up our vacation days for it because it is a statuary holiday, not a discretionary holiday.
   I hope that you can get things worked out!

I also forgot to add, we're being told not to accept a change of date for it too, as the weekend after is a long weekend, the schools could use a discretionary day to make it a bit longer, and chances are, it'll just be moved to that day.

Yeah, I also hope it gets worked out.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: busanite on April 17, 2019, 03:31:59 pm
Update: There was a misunderstanding between the school and education office which has been cleared up. I will not come to school on May 1st.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on April 19, 2019, 01:16:15 pm
Update: There was a misunderstanding between the school and education office which has been cleared up. I will not come to school on May 1st.

Big surprise.  Many folks here don't know their head from their ass.  Instead of letting something be simple everyone panics and makes a big deal and creates drama out of nothing.  Honestly, most here are so fearful of taking any risk or responsibility.  I try to do without asking and beg forgiveness later as much as possible.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Ronnie Omelettes on April 26, 2019, 01:44:48 pm
nicely done.  my school has their test period from 1st May to the 3rd.  as I will invigilate one or two tests in the morning, I get paid extra, and then can go home in the afternoon without any other paperwork being done.  so I get a half day off as well as get paid extra for the time I do come to school.   :laugh:
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on April 26, 2019, 02:38:28 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: belocean11 on April 26, 2019, 02:58:22 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on April 26, 2019, 03:08:28 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!

Yes! that was definitely a plus! I guess we have to use vacation days for the birthdays now anyway so at least I won't have to do that (or sit by myself in school all day!)
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: elsbethm on April 26, 2019, 03:20:32 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!

Considering the new vacation day rules make sure they don't ding you a 연가 (annual leave) day for it!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: debbiem89 on April 26, 2019, 03:23:06 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!

Considering the new vacation day rules make sure they don't ding you a 연가 (annual leave) day for it!

That's a very good point.

I think my co teacher knows....but I'd better just casually mention it aha
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: pkjh on April 26, 2019, 03:24:33 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!

Considering the new vacation day rules make sure they don't ding you a 연가 (annual leave) day for it!
Supposedly some school are putting it under 연수 (research), so Korean teacher don't get dinged too.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: OnNut81 on April 30, 2019, 02:16:22 pm
Just had my new co-t show me some document forwarded from Gepik about me having to take vacation days for the Thursday and Friday that the principal has closed the school.  I explained that we're a city hall funded school and my contract doesn't give me 26 days and explicitly states that any special days the school is closed will NOT count as vacation days.  She phoned the education office and so far they have agreed that the signed contract supersedes any later changes.  Hopefully, that'll be the end of it.  She's explaining it to the V-P, who has never worked with a NET before, and was the one who forwarded the document in the first place. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: DMZabductee on April 30, 2019, 03:03:17 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!

Considering the new vacation day rules make sure they don't ding you a 연가 (annual leave) day for it!
Supposedly some school are putting it under 연수 (research), so Korean teacher don't get dinged too.

I log it as 기타 and in the 사유 또는 용무 field write 근로자의 날. CT does the same. Never been a problem.

Also it's in our contract  (7.1 work hours) that Labor Day is a holiday for us akin to weekends and national holidays so it's pretty obvious that we shouldn't have to use a 연가 day.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Ronnie Omelettes on April 30, 2019, 03:09:16 pm
My school made May 1st the school birthday this year (yep they changed it!), so everyone gets it off.  Jammy buggers. This was my ONE chance to be all smug and not working when they are aha.
My school did the exact same thing!! At least it means this year, that I don't have to bring out my contract and explain that I get the day off!

Considering the new vacation day rules make sure they don't ding you a 연가 (annual leave) day for it!
Supposedly some school are putting it under 연수 (research), so Korean teacher don't get dinged too.

I log it as 기타 and in the 사유 또는 용무 field write 근로자의 날. CT does the same. Never been a problem.

Also it's in our contract  (7.1 work hours) that Labor Day is a holiday for us akin to weekends and national holidays so it's pretty obvious that we shouldn't have to use a 연가 day.

Like I wrote earlier, as it is test time, I get paid overtime for invigilating in the morning and then can go home at lunch.  I do the fingerprint thing in the morning at 8am then out at 12:30.  It's 4 hours plus a thirty minute break as per Labour Law.  But when I asked about the NEIS for the afternoon, I don't need to do anything apparently.  I'm just not there. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on May 10, 2019, 07:51:21 pm
Starting new contract soon.  Looks like they are also trying to steal our school holidays after all.  RIdiculous.  I don't know why they can't just let us have the three extra days.  Seems very miserly and spiteful on their part.  I am wondering if the Korean teachers are forfeiting their vacation for school birthdays, filler days, etc.

I sure wish Korea could get a shortage of teachers again like 10 years ago, just so they'd back off and be desperate again.  WOuld be nice for them to get a dose of humility instead of doing things just because they can.  @h0les!!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: NorthStar on May 10, 2019, 10:05:00 pm
Starting new contract soon.  Looks like they are also trying to steal our school holidays after all.  RIdiculous.  I don't know why they can't just let us have the three extra days.  Seems very miserly and spiteful on their part.  I am wondering if the Korean teachers are forfeiting their vacation for school birthdays, filler days, etc.

I sure wish Korea could get a shortage of teachers again like 10 years ago, just so they'd back off and be desperate again.  WOuld be nice for them to get a dose of humility instead of doing things just because they can.  @h0les!!

Actually...Korea IS short on teachers.  Folks are going to China (for whatever reasons) and Vietnam.  This act of pretending there are more jobs than applicants is a myth that keeps on going, so salaries can keep dropping. 



Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on May 15, 2019, 09:38:51 am
Starting new contract soon.  Looks like they are also trying to steal our school holidays after all.  RIdiculous.  I don't know why they can't just let us have the three extra days.  Seems very miserly and spiteful on their part.  I am wondering if the Korean teachers are forfeiting their vacation for school birthdays, filler days, etc.

I sure wish Korea could get a shortage of teachers again like 10 years ago, just so they'd back off and be desperate again.  WOuld be nice for them to get a dose of humility instead of doing things just because they can.  @h0les!!

Actually...Korea IS short on teachers.  Folks are going to China (for whatever reasons) and Vietnam.  This act of pretending there are more jobs than applicants is a myth that keeps on going, so salaries can keep dropping. 





Let EPIK start improving the contracts and hakwons to increase the pay.  Rural EPIK is ok, but a raise will be needed here soon too.  City EPIK definately needs a raise.  Do you hear for sure there are shortages now?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: NorthStar on May 15, 2019, 10:24:19 am
Starting new contract soon.  Looks like they are also trying to steal our school holidays after all.  RIdiculous.  I don't know why they can't just let us have the three extra days.  Seems very miserly and spiteful on their part.  I am wondering if the Korean teachers are forfeiting their vacation for school birthdays, filler days, etc.

I sure wish Korea could get a shortage of teachers again like 10 years ago, just so they'd back off and be desperate again.  WOuld be nice for them to get a dose of humility instead of doing things just because they can.  @h0les!!

Actually...Korea IS short on teachers.  Folks are going to China (for whatever reasons) and Vietnam.  This act of pretending there are more jobs than applicants is a myth that keeps on going, so salaries can keep dropping. 





Let EPIK start improving the contracts and hakwons to increase the pay.  Rural EPIK is ok, but a raise will be needed here soon too.  City EPIK definately needs a raise.  Do you hear for sure there are shortages now?

Perhaps not with the public schools...but, across the board with private academies....yes.  THAT, or there are simply not that many jobs (as agencies like to post).  Fact is, folks ARE going elsewhere...making the same salary in Vietnam for a lower cost of living....making MORE in China for a lower cost of living.  I have a few folks on the "inside" that have admitted this...
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: ClaireHughese21 on May 15, 2019, 11:45:27 am
Does anyone have the Korean Labour Law that stipulates that we get 26 vacation days a year if we signed after May 2018?
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on May 15, 2019, 12:04:35 pm
Starting new contract soon.  Looks like they are also trying to steal our school holidays after all.  RIdiculous.  I don't know why they can't just let us have the three extra days.  Seems very miserly and spiteful on their part.  I am wondering if the Korean teachers are forfeiting their vacation for school birthdays, filler days, etc.

I sure wish Korea could get a shortage of teachers again like 10 years ago, just so they'd back off and be desperate again.  WOuld be nice for them to get a dose of humility instead of doing things just because they can.  @h0les!!

Actually...Korea IS short on teachers.  Folks are going to China (for whatever reasons) and Vietnam.  This act of pretending there are more jobs than applicants is a myth that keeps on going, so salaries can keep dropping. 





Let EPIK start improving the contracts and hakwons to increase the pay.  Rural EPIK is ok, but a raise will be needed here soon too.  City EPIK definately needs a raise.  Do you hear for sure there are shortages now?

Perhaps not with the public schools...but, across the board with private academies....yes.  THAT, or there are simply not that many jobs (as agencies like to post).  Fact is, folks ARE going elsewhere...making the same salary in Vietnam for a lower cost of living....making MORE in China for a lower cost of living.  I have a few folks on the "inside" that have admitted this...

Inside are recruiters and hiring managers at academies?  Good to know then.  With student loans and other things to pay off, young folks would be better off going to Vietnam or China then.  (China is tricky sending money home, but sometimes you can get someone at your school to do it for a bit and then do western union if you have relatives for a bit you trust to deposit the funds in your account back home.  Also, with proper visa, bank of China will give you 500 US a day to transfer.) 

I do see many facebook groups offering 2.4 to 2.7 for a standard 2 to 10ish mon to fri hakwon gig.  Sometimes more for the old 9 to 6 gigs with kindys.  Not sure why waygook and daves still have so many lowball offers.  I guess folks had better insist on 2.4 or so if new and 2.5 and up with more experience.  Either that or go teach in another country.  Tell them to go pound sand.  I would be curious if EPIK will start having shortages.  Was nice over 10 years ago when they did in the countryside. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: hangook77 on May 15, 2019, 12:07:14 pm
Of course if EPIK gets desperate they will loosen up on some of these ridiculous rules (which hadn't been enforced out here till more recently). 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: alexisalex on May 15, 2019, 12:40:49 pm
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: NorthStar on May 15, 2019, 06:17:35 pm
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

I don't recall anyone saying that a new, inexperienced teacher should be earning what you mentioned.....did that sneak in somewhere?

I am seeing more and more jobs on the FB groups....2.0 for 2-9, 2.0 for 9-6...I even saw some rad-tag recruiter posting 1.8 for a 1-7:30.

It is just ridiculous...and these greenhorns that think it is the norm, is even more astounding.  But sadly, the 2005-2007 salaries are becoming the norm again. 

Way to keep up a competitive fight, Korea.  Folks are going elsewhere, jumping ship and what do schools do?  They start offering less.....
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: kobayashi on May 15, 2019, 09:38:10 pm
at the start of next semester i'm moving to a new school in China (from my current one in China).
nice pay bump up to 4.3 million Won per month from my current 3.2 mil.
2-3 months paid vacation. 12 x 45 minute class period per week (this is about the same at my current school).

meanwhile people in korea are busy fighting over 1 or 200,000 Won extra a month.
Korea is finished as a destination for EFL teaching. move to China or Vietnam, or do some online training that will allow you to get a job back home.

Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: NorthStar on May 15, 2019, 10:02:34 pm
Quote
at the start of next semester i'm moving to a new school in China (from my current one in China).
nice pay bump up to 4.3 million Won per month from my current 3.2 mil.
2-3 months paid vacation. 12 x 45 minute class period per week (this is about the same at my current school).

meanwhile people in korea are busy fighting over 1 or 200,000 Won extra a month.
Korea is finished as a destination for EFL teaching. move to China or Vietnam, or do some online training that will allow you to get a job back home.

I would not say that....there will always be those who don't know any better.  However, for those who want to make more money which makes the hassles seem like less of a burden, yes....folks are going elsewhere. 

Japan even seems like a more desirable place...granted, wages have been the same since 2007 (perhaps longer) but you still have more employment mobility with the visa and still receive at least 4 weeks of paid personal vacation with private language schools. 

Yet...Korea just digs its heals in....bottom line, they don't want foreign teachers. 
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Colburnnn on May 16, 2019, 07:30:28 am
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

It equates to around £9.25 an hour on a 40 hour week, which isn't that great at all. £7.70 is the current minimum wage (£8.21 if you are 25) Considering the sacrifice of being away from home, cost for documentation etc. I think thats acceptable.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: eggieguffer on May 16, 2019, 10:03:17 am
Depends how you do the numb
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

It equates to around £9.25 an hour on a 40 hour week, which isn't that great at all. £7.70 is the current minimum wage (£8.21 if you are 25) Considering the sacrifice of being away from home, cost for documentation etc. I think thats acceptable.
ers.
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

It equates to around £9.25 an hour on a 40 hour week, which isn't that great at all. £7.70 is the current minimum wage (£8.21 if you are 25) Considering the sacrifice of being away from home, cost for documentation etc. I think thats acceptable.

Depends how you do the numbers. 25 teaching hours a week at 2.8 mil would be 18.36 pounds a teaching hour.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Colburnnn on May 16, 2019, 11:04:39 am
Depends how you do the numb
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

It equates to around £9.25 an hour on a 40 hour week, which isn't that great at all. £7.70 is the current minimum wage (£8.21 if you are 25) Considering the sacrifice of being away from home, cost for documentation etc. I think thats acceptable.
ers.
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

It equates to around £9.25 an hour on a 40 hour week, which isn't that great at all. £7.70 is the current minimum wage (£8.21 if you are 25) Considering the sacrifice of being away from home, cost for documentation etc. I think thats acceptable.

Depends how you do the numbers. 25 teaching hours a week at 2.8 mil would be 18.36 pounds a teaching hour.

Right, but you're in the office for 40 hours. (commonly) Plus are you doing your planning for free? 2.4 mil divided by 4.2 (Weeks in a month 570,000) divided by 40 (hours per week 14,250) £9.30 per hour ish

Regardless, it is better than you'd get sat at the till in Sainsbury's
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: sojuadventurer on May 23, 2019, 01:48:56 pm
I'm on an August contract, so my contract still has the standard 18 days of paid vacation leave, yet we were told today that the principal has decided to close the school on the 7th of June due to the holiday on the 6th (Thursday). I'm being told I have to use a vacation day due to having this day off due to the law change. I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Kayos on May 23, 2019, 01:58:11 pm
I'm on an August contract, so my contract still has the standard 18 days of paid vacation leave, yet we were told today that the principal has decided to close the school on the 7th of June due to the holiday on the 6th (Thursday). I'm being told I have to use a vacation day due to having this day off due to the law change. I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!

It shouldn't cost you a vacation day until you are on the new contract.
I don't have anything official on that but, at least that is how it's being handled in JLP.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: lhelena on May 23, 2019, 02:41:08 pm
I'm on an August contract, so my contract still has the standard 18 days of paid vacation leave, yet we were told today that the principal has decided to close the school on the 7th of June due to the holiday on the 6th (Thursday). I'm being told I have to use a vacation day due to having this day off due to the law change. I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!

It shouldn't cost you a vacation day until you are on the new contract.
I don't have anything official on that but, at least that is how it's being handled in JLP.

Yeah the rule they're using to tell you that is only on the newest revision of the contract and only Spring people have that one. I would just show them your contract and not budge on it because that shouldn't be happening. They can't take stuff from a contract you haven't signed yet and make you adhere to it.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: Vee94 on May 23, 2019, 03:13:55 pm
I'm on an August contract,.....I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!

What MOE/POE are you with? I'm under Gyeongsangnam-do and they decided that any teachers who signed their contract after June 1st 2018 would now have the new contract applied to them. I'm a November contract, and even though I still haven't actually signed the new contract the new rules now apply to me.

I'd double check if the new rules apply to you despite being an August contract, since you'll also be entitled to extra vacation even if some of those day will be used for discretionary holidays like the one you mentioned.

Otherwise try to get it in writing that the new contract doesn't apply to you yet and show your principal your contract to support your point.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: L I on May 23, 2019, 04:54:09 pm
A completely new person with no experience expecting or asking for 2.4 (which is 2.8 - 2.9 when you factor in housing) is still mad in my opinion.

Is it?
___________________ __
Paper Box Factory
Location: Cheonan
Need only 1 man
Salary: KRW2.8m
Visa: G1 over 6months
House: free
Food: free
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: StillInKorea on May 24, 2019, 09:43:26 am
I'm on an August contract,.....I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!

What MOE/POE are you with? I'm under Gyeongsangnam-do and they decided that any teachers who signed their contract after June 1st 2018 would now have the new contract applied to them. I'm a November contract, and even though I still haven't actually signed the new contract the new rules now apply to me.

I'd double check if the new rules apply to you despite being an August contract, since you'll also be entitled to extra vacation even if some of those day will be used for discretionary holidays like the one you mentioned.

Otherwise try to get it in writing that the new contract doesn't apply to you yet and show your principal your contract to support your point.

They cannot legally revoke terms from a contract you signed without your consent. The new contract does not apply to you yet. Having said that, the contract you're still under does say that the day off is at the discretion of the principal. They could use that to screw you.

I don't know if it's the same person, but the woman in charge of the Gyeongnam NET program in 2015 was not a nice woman. If the same piece of work is still in charge, I'm not surprised that they're doing this.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: sojuadventurer on May 24, 2019, 09:57:54 am
I'm on an August contract,.....I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!

What MOE/POE are you with? I'm under Gyeongsangnam-do and they decided that any teachers who signed their contract after June 1st 2018 would now have the new contract applied to them. I'm a November contract, and even though I still haven't actually signed the new contract the new rules now apply to me.

I'd double check if the new rules apply to you despite being an August contract, since you'll also be entitled to extra vacation even if some of those day will be used for discretionary holidays like the one you mentioned.

Otherwise try to get it in writing that the new contract doesn't apply to you yet and show your principal your contract to support your point.

They cannot legally revoke terms from a contract you signed without your consent. The new contract does not apply to you yet. Having said that, the contract you're still under does say that the day off is at the discretion of the principal. They could use that to screw you.

I don't know if it's the same person, but the woman in charge of the Gyeongnam NET program in 2015 was not a nice woman. If the same piece of work is still in charge, I'm not surprised that they're doing this.

Honestly, if they wanna be petty and make me come and deskwarm because I wanted them to follow my contract, I'd be totally okay with that. I'd just rather not give up a vacation day when I already planned things in advance.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: StillInKorea on May 24, 2019, 10:37:57 am
I'm on an August contract,.....I was under the impression that this law change didn't apply to me until I sign my new contract in August. Can anyone clarify this for me? Thanks!

What MOE/POE are you with? I'm under Gyeongsangnam-do and they decided that any teachers who signed their contract after June 1st 2018 would now have the new contract applied to them. I'm a November contract, and even though I still haven't actually signed the new contract the new rules now apply to me.

I'd double check if the new rules apply to you despite being an August contract, since you'll also be entitled to extra vacation even if some of those day will be used for discretionary holidays like the one you mentioned.

Otherwise try to get it in writing that the new contract doesn't apply to you yet and show your principal your contract to support your point.

They cannot legally revoke terms from a contract you signed without your consent. The new contract does not apply to you yet. Having said that, the contract you're still under does say that the day off is at the discretion of the principal. They could use that to screw you.

I don't know if it's the same person, but the woman in charge of the Gyeongnam NET program in 2015 was not a nice woman. If the same piece of work is still in charge, I'm not surprised that they're doing this.

Honestly, if they wanna be petty and make me come and deskwarm because I wanted them to follow my contract, I'd be totally okay with that. I'd just rather not give up a vacation day when I already planned things in advance.

I'd make an issue out of it. Your old contract applies. The principal has always had a veto, however.

Most people are just idiots when it comes to interpreting contracts and such. I doubt your school is even being malicious at this point, so go and talk to the principal with your contract in hand.
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: JenniferNZ1 on May 24, 2019, 11:52:23 am
If they really want you to use a vacation day - because of the new law - then surely you should be getting 26 days vacation - because of the new law!  You could try this approach.  Surely the new law can't be used sometimes but not others!

They may not agree to this - in which case I would prefer to sit at school on my own rather than lose one of my vacation days - especially if I am planning on being out of the country (as I usually am).
Title: Re: Increased Vacation Days
Post by: StillInKorea on May 24, 2019, 12:21:34 pm
If they really want you to use a vacation day - because of the new law -

Another person who does not understand.

There is no new law which requires people to use a vacation day on these special days off.

Public school contracts simply removed a clause that allowed contract teachers a day off on such days, as part of a petty response to a new law which requires 26 paid vacation days.

Some education offices are now attempting to apply the terms of the new contract to teachers who are not yet working under the new contract.

They are not following the law. They are breaking contract law and need to be told so. However, the principal still has the power to say no to the day off according to the original contract.