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Author Topic: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.  (Read 41245 times)

Offline draco888

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #200 on: August 11, 2016, 03:08:52 PM »

No bikes belong on the road, where they are legally supposed to ride. Drivers just need to learn to be more dam respectful of them

Bikes belong on bike lanes, and baring that either on the sidewalk or at the extreme edge of the road and they can enjoy whatever scraps of it they get. The road is not designed for bikes, it is designed for cars. That's why lanes are as wide as they are and speed limits are what they are. Bikes interfere with the efficiency of automobile traffic flow and automobile safety.

Cars should have primary domain over the road and the cyclists, who are primarily using that form of transportation as recreation or for lack of urgent travel, should defer to them. If you want to exercise, go to an exercise facility. If you want to get to work, use public transportation or drive (although I know there are a fair number of exceptions and a bicycle is faster and/or cheaper and those people are fine). But riding your bike for fun or because you want to get a workout in with your daily commute? Sorry but get off the damn road and make way for people who have business to do.

If a bike and a pedestrian get in a serious accident it can result in serious injury but very rarely death. If a bike is in a serious accident with a motor vehicle there is a decent chance of death and if its a big vehicle, the cyclist is getting picked up with a mop.
Should trucks have domain over cars? Trucks have commercial business to be getting on with, cars need to yield and stop all this unnecessary recreational travel nonsense.

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #201 on: August 11, 2016, 03:21:42 PM »

No bikes belong on the road, where they are legally supposed to ride. Drivers just need to learn to be more dam respectful of them

Bikes belong on bike lanes, and baring that either on the sidewalk or at the extreme edge of the road and they can enjoy whatever scraps of it they get. The road is not designed for bikes, it is designed for cars. That's why lanes are as wide as they are and speed limits are what they are. Bikes interfere with the efficiency of automobile traffic flow and automobile safety.

Cars should have primary domain over the road and the cyclists, who are primarily using that form of transportation as recreation or for lack of urgent travel, should defer to them. If you want to exercise, go to an exercise facility. If you want to get to work, use public transportation or drive (although I know there are a fair number of exceptions and a bicycle is faster and/or cheaper and those people are fine). But riding your bike for fun or because you want to get a workout in with your daily commute? Sorry but get off the damn road and make way for people who have business to do.

If a bike and a pedestrian get in a serious accident it can result in serious injury but very rarely death. If a bike is in a serious accident with a motor vehicle there is a decent chance of death and if its a big vehicle, the cyclist is getting picked up with a mop.
Does that apply to all the Koreans who use their bikes for business? What about those carts of OCC and other recyclables that clog the streets? Do they have to go too? What if a bike is the best way for someone to get to work? Is that another no go?

And what exactly is this automobile safety you refer to? You're not talking about in South Korea, are you?

Offline JeffGang

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #202 on: August 11, 2016, 04:16:21 PM »
It is a knee jerk reflex sometimes, to try to define all anomalous behavior in cultural terms. And there may be some cultural factors involved in Korean walking practices. For example, it seems that many Asian cultures do not fear traffic as much as we have been taught to do in the West. I also see parents who grab the hand of their little kids and dash out into oncoming traffic, dragging the little ones behind them.

Another interesting behavior is when the older Korean guys, actually walk deliberately out in the road way. They seem to believe in some Confucian code of honor and respect that just because they are old, they can impose inconvenience on others in that way.

I find that when I am walking with Korean friends, although there is a huge modern sidewalk right there, I am often the only one using it. Usually, the Koreans will walk along right out in the roadway without really even thinking about it.

As far as 'heel walking', parking out in the middle of the road, cutting in front of you in line, elevator etiquette, hawking up giant lugers and spitting big oysters on the street, and many other behaviors of this type, all cultures have families who educate their kids in basic niceties of social etiquette, and families who don't. We just call it basic home training, and there are families here who have it, and ones that don't.

I wrote an article on this subject, and these are just a few points I made in it. Check it out if you want too.

http://iexperiencekorea.com/blog/Gangneung/2018WinterOlympics/korean-people-need-walking-lessons/

Offline Mr.DeMartino

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #203 on: August 11, 2016, 04:36:50 PM »

No bikes belong on the road, where they are legally supposed to ride. Drivers just need to learn to be more dam respectful of them

Bikes belong on bike lanes, and baring that either on the sidewalk or at the extreme edge of the road and they can enjoy whatever scraps of it they get. The road is not designed for bikes, it is designed for cars. That's why lanes are as wide as they are and speed limits are what they are. Bikes interfere with the efficiency of automobile traffic flow and automobile safety.

Cars should have primary domain over the road and the cyclists, who are primarily using that form of transportation as recreation or for lack of urgent travel, should defer to them. If you want to exercise, go to an exercise facility. If you want to get to work, use public transportation or drive (although I know there are a fair number of exceptions and a bicycle is faster and/or cheaper and those people are fine). But riding your bike for fun or because you want to get a workout in with your daily commute? Sorry but get off the damn road and make way for people who have business to do.

If a bike and a pedestrian get in a serious accident it can result in serious injury but very rarely death. If a bike is in a serious accident with a motor vehicle there is a decent chance of death and if its a big vehicle, the cyclist is getting picked up with a mop.
Does that apply to all the Koreans who use their bikes for business? What about those carts of OCC and other recyclables that clog the streets? Do they have to go too? What if a bike is the best way for someone to get to work? Is that another no go?

And what exactly is this automobile safety you refer to? You're not talking about in South Korea, are you?

If you're using your bike for business it's one thing, but if it's some dumb ajosshi just drifting aimlessly while intoxicated or a wannabe Lance Armstrong, get out of my way.

I say if cyclists want to drive on the road, get a license, registration, a plate, and follow the same rules. If not, stick to bike lanes and the sidewalk.

The lack of safety in Korea is exactly why the cyclists need to get off the road. They only make a crappy situation worse.

Offline PedrotheSaja

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #204 on: August 12, 2016, 08:50:25 AM »
Quote
The lack of safety in Korea is exactly why the cyclists need to get off the road. They only make a crappy situation worse.

Not easy being a cyclist in Korea for sure. I'm amazed by the variety of answers here on what's right. Get off the sidewalk and bike on the road. Don't bike on the road, bike on the bike lanes. They don't exist, bike on the sidewalk. Bike lanes might be a thing in Seoul, but I've rarely seen them outside of the capital area and I don't live in Seoul.

I bike based on the situation and safety mechanisms in the area. I commute in a rich area with huge roads, huge sidewalks, small roads, small sidewalks, and large apartments. For the most part, cycling on the road is a no-no given the speed of the cars and just how stupidly dangerous drivers are in general. There are very large sidewalk areas where you can literally get cars driving on both sides so it seems the most sensible place to cycle. When that ends, I cycle on the road because there aren't many cars and the sidewalk in that area barely has space for even one person. Crossing the street from there, I have to go back on the sidewalk because the cars behind me will honk/do something dangerous/just plain hit me. It's a dangerous intersection. Then when those cars pass I can cycle on the narrowing road ahead because the sidewalks again become a one person ordeal.

Basically, it's impossible to follow any law of sorts here given the traffic. Also even the "cycle on the bike path" doesn't work because when the bike paths do show up all the pedestrians walk on it because it's better quality path. In my area though, there's a lot of cyclist/pedestrian road and we share it pretty well usually, we just don't follow procedure. It's a play by ear thing, you can't just orthodoxically follow traffic / bike / pedestrian rules here.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2016, 02:01:46 PM by PedrotheSaja »

Offline JahMoo

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #205 on: August 12, 2016, 12:57:28 PM »
Quote
The lack of safety in Korea is exactly why the cyclists need to get off the road. They only make a crappy situation worse.

Not easy being a cyclist in Korea for sure. I'm amazed by the variety of answers here on what's right. Get off the sidewalk and bike on the road. Don't bike on the road, bike on the bike lanes. They don't exist, bike on the sidewalk. Bike lanes might be a thing in Seoul, but I've rarely seen them outside of the capital area and I don't live in Seoul.

I bike based on the situation and safety mechanisms in the area. I commute in a rich area with huge roads, huge sidewalks, small roads, small sidewalks, and large apartments. For the most part, cycling on the road is a no-no given the speed of the cars and just how stupidly dangerous drivers are in general. There are very large sidewalk areas where you can literally get cars driving on both sides so it seems the most sensible place to cycle. When that ends, I cycle on the road because there aren't many cars and the sidewalk in that area barely has space for even one person. Crossing the street from there, I have to go back on the sidewalk because the cars behind me will honk/do something dangerous/just plain hit me. It's a dangerous intersection. Then when those cars pass I can cycle on the narrowing road ahead because the sidewalks again become a one person ordeal.

Basically,  it's impossible to follow any law of sorts here given the traffic. Also even the "cycle on the bike path" doesn't work because when the bath paths do show up all the pedestrians walk on it because it's better quality path. In my area though, there's a lot of cyclist/pedestrian road and we share it pretty well usually, we just don't follow procedure. It's a play by ear thing, you can't just orthodoxically follow traffic / bike / pedestrian rules here.

Exactly this. The areas near my home have no sidewalks at all. Bikers, cars, pedestrians all have to use the road together.

There are other areas I've seen where there is a bike rack on every corner, but no bike lanes, yet the signs say bikes are not allowed on the sidewalk.

Transportation in Korea is just go wherever you can go.

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #206 on: August 13, 2016, 06:53:02 AM »

No bikes belong on the road, where they are legally supposed to ride. Drivers just need to learn to be more dam respectful of them

Bikes belong on bike lanes, and baring that either on the sidewalk or at the extreme edge of the road and they can enjoy whatever scraps of it they get. The road is not designed for bikes, it is designed for cars. That's why lanes are as wide as they are and speed limits are what they are. Bikes interfere with the efficiency of automobile traffic flow and automobile safety.

Cars should have primary domain over the road and the cyclists, who are primarily using that form of transportation as recreation or for lack of urgent travel, should defer to them. If you want to exercise, go to an exercise facility. If you want to get to work, use public transportation or drive (although I know there are a fair number of exceptions and a bicycle is faster and/or cheaper and those people are fine). But riding your bike for fun or because you want to get a workout in with your daily commute? Sorry but get off the damn road and make way for people who have business to do.

If a bike and a pedestrian get in a serious accident it can result in serious injury but very rarely death. If a bike is in a serious accident with a motor vehicle there is a decent chance of death and if its a big vehicle, the cyclist is getting picked up with a mop.
Does that apply to all the Koreans who use their bikes for business? What about those carts of OCC and other recyclables that clog the streets? Do they have to go too? What if a bike is the best way for someone to get to work? Is that another no go?

And what exactly is this automobile safety you refer to? You're not talking about in South Korea, are you?

If you're using your bike for business it's one thing, but if it's some dumb ajosshi just drifting aimlessly while intoxicated or a wannabe Lance Armstrong, get out of my way.

I say if cyclists want to drive on the road, get a license, registration, a plate, and follow the same rules. If not, stick to bike lanes and the sidewalk.

The lack of safety in Korea is exactly why the cyclists need to get off the road. They only make a crappy situation worse.
Blame the victim much?

Bicycles are a legitimate form of transportation, whether one is cycling to work or to a cafe. Are you for restricting the use of motor vehicles only for work purposes. Hyundai would have a hard time selling cars.

Besides the biggest traffic scofflaws are those driving for work--bus, truck, van and motorbike drivers.

Offline JahMoo

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #207 on: September 22, 2016, 12:42:20 PM »
ESPECIALLY motorbike drivers.

Offline David_Daytona

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #208 on: September 22, 2016, 03:54:07 PM »
There's a little thing I like to do...

"Blacks really need to take walking lessons."

Does that sound acceptable?

Offline Savant

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #209 on: September 22, 2016, 04:08:37 PM »
There's a little thing I like to do...

"Blacks really need to take walking lessons."

Does that sound acceptable?

There's a little thing I like to do...

Koreans are considered a race again? GTFO!

Online CO2

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #210 on: September 22, 2016, 04:14:57 PM »
There's a little thing I like to do...

"Blacks really need to take walking lessons."

Does that sound acceptable?

There's a little thing I like to do...

Koreans are considered a race again? GTFO!

Koreans are a culture and a race. Some countries are homogeneous and some aren't. Canadians do XXXXXX isn't racist. You can sound like a dick saying whatever it is you're saying but it ain't racist.

It's hard to draw a line with Japanese people, or Koreans etc. Is it racist? Koreans eat a lot of kimchi..........

NOT EVERYONE HERE BLAH BLAH

Is it racist? It's a culture that happens to be a race, too.

White Canadians are XXXXXXX.

Well, that's a different story.

There's no real answer here.
Yes, to dance beneath the diamond sky
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Offline Savant

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #211 on: September 22, 2016, 05:30:29 PM »
There's a little thing I like to do...

"Blacks really need to take walking lessons."

Does that sound acceptable?

There's a little thing I like to do...

Koreans are considered a race again? GTFO!

Koreans are a culture and a race. Some countries are homogeneous and some aren't. Canadians do XXXXXX isn't racist. You can sound like a dick saying whatever it is you're saying but it ain't racist.

It's hard to draw a line with Japanese people, or Koreans etc. Is it racist? Koreans eat a lot of kimchi..........

NOT EVERYONE HERE BLAH BLAH

Is it racist? It's a culture that happens to be a race, too.

White Canadians are XXXXXXX.

Well, that's a different story.

There's no real answer here.

Korean is an ethnic group of the Mongoloid race.

Black refers to race; Korean doesn't.

Offline Somebody

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #212 on: September 22, 2016, 11:38:27 PM »
There's a little thing I like to do...

"Blacks really need to take walking lessons."

Does that sound acceptable?

No, because blacks don't run into people. I think that's an inaccurate description of black people. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Offline some waygug-in

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #213 on: September 23, 2016, 03:47:36 AM »
Sounds like a race to the bottom.

 8)




Offline snorske

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #214 on: October 25, 2016, 03:02:02 PM »
gtfo with that silly race baiting nonsense.  We are talking about SERIOUS issues here.

The inability to walk in a civilized way is something that is GLARINGLY obvious in Korea, by Korean citizens.  Period.  There is no slicing it any other way.

A favorite game to play is 'how many people can you knock over on the running path'?  The zombies walk straight at you on the wrong side, not even blinking an eye.  Its really a great running motivator...if you speed up you can really get your shoulder into it!

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #215 on: October 25, 2016, 03:08:46 PM »
Take heed.
Yes, to dance beneath the diamond sky
With one hand waving free

Offline HaLo3

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #216 on: October 25, 2016, 03:43:14 PM »
Take heed.
Is that guy taking a poop on the escalator? Thats a new one. At least I hope so...

Offline Lurch

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #217 on: October 26, 2016, 08:08:33 AM »
There are some bike lanes in the town I live in. They're bumper to bumper parked cars. The ones the cars can't get into, they'll park across the ends. It's ridiculous.

Offline Pecan

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #218 on: October 26, 2016, 08:15:13 AM »
There are some bike lanes in the town I live in. They're bumper to bumper parked cars. The ones the cars can't get into, they'll park across the ends. It's ridiculous.
It is like that in many places throughout Seoul.

It can be quite frustrating and dangerous.

My main gripe about the situation, the government claims that space as "bike lane", so they can boast these bike-friendly claims, when in reality they are nothing more than curbside parking for cars.

Don't say "We have added 2,000K of bike lanes throughout the city." when in reality you have done nothing but create parking lanes for cars with incorrect signage.

Bike lane symbol=Parking for cars...

Offline HaLo3

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Re: Koreans really need to take walking lessons.
« Reply #219 on: October 26, 2016, 08:25:16 AM »
There are some bike lanes in the town I live in. They're bumper to bumper parked cars. The ones the cars can't get into, they'll park across the ends. It's ridiculous.
It is like that in many places throughout Seoul.

It can be quite frustrating and dangerous.

My main gripe about the situation, the government claims that space as "bike lane", so they can boast these bike-friendly claims, when in reality they are nothing more than curbside parking for cars.

Don't say "We have added 2,000K of bike lanes throughout the city." when in reality you have done nothing but create parking lanes for cars with incorrect signage.

Bike lane symbol=Parking for cars...
I have started cycling a ton more to get around and this is one of my biggest pet peeves.