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Author Topic: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)  (Read 3158 times)

Online zola

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #40 on: November 27, 2018, 02:59:39 PM »
The problem is May. You can't have someone doing the negotiations who doesn't believe in it and has shown little negotiation skill.

Saying Brexit is a bad idea based on these negotiations is like saying Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is a bad martial art because you're watching Butterbean use it against Jon Jones.
haha. butterbean. reminds me of K1, which i used to thoroughly enjoy as a kid. seems to have gone out of fashion these days sadly, perhaps because of the rise of UFC(?)
Those freak show fights novelty factor wears off after a while. And eventually everyone realized that any fight coming from a Japanese promotion had a better than good chance of being fixed.
Kpip! - Martin 2018

Offline Mr.DeMartino

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #41 on: November 27, 2018, 03:07:27 PM »
]
Those freak show fights novelty factor wears off after a while. And eventually everyone realized that any fight coming from a Japanese promotion had a better than good chance of being fixed.
I'll say this, I totally thought Sapp-Noguiera was going to be a total freak-show work of a fight and was utterly disinterested. However, the utter pummeling Noguiera took that fight and his obvious frustration until he secured the armbar convinced me otherwise. I think after that all the freak fights sucked.

Let's have Semmy Schilt fight some Japanese lightweight. Or Giant Silva vs. some Sumo guy in kickboxing...

Online zola

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #42 on: November 27, 2018, 03:19:01 PM »
]
Those freak show fights novelty factor wears off after a while. And eventually everyone realized that any fight coming from a Japanese promotion had a better than good chance of being fixed.
I'll say this, I totally thought Sapp-Noguiera was going to be a total freak-show work of a fight and was utterly disinterested. However, the utter pummeling Noguiera took that fight and his obvious frustration until he secured the armbar convinced me otherwise. I think after that all the freak fights sucked.

Let's have Semmy Schilt fight some Japanese lightweight. Or Giant Silva vs. some Sumo guy in kickboxing...
Hey, I like a good freak show as much as the next man. Some of those Saitama Super Arena New Year's Eve shows were insane. Pride had plans to have Mike Tyson (mid 2000s era) fight a kangaroo or something 6 months before the UFC bought them out.
Kpip! - Martin 2018

Offline Titus Groan

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #43 on: November 28, 2018, 10:37:28 AM »
   I'll just leave this here...

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bqGyHL8WJI

  Thanks!

Offline Aurata

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #44 on: November 28, 2018, 05:48:38 PM »
Globalists? As opposed to nationalists?  Thanks, I'll take the former.

"Globalism" is in fact the conquest and destruction of Britain. As it is, unrestricted immigration has already been rapidly transforming Britain to an islamic state under sharia law.


Quote from: SPQR
Again, who?  Trade between the EU and UK is huge.

UK is a net importer from the EU.

EU needs the UK more than the UK needs the EU.


Globalism / NATO / the EU is countries cooperating to uplift the world.

Is it co-operation or dictatorship? member states have transferred their sovereign rights to the EU and Union law overrides their national laws.

Britain had a taste of this tyranny when butchers were arrested and fined for continuing to sell meat by the pound. The UK was forced to surrender their system of measurements (pounds and ounces). That was just the start. Pretty soon.. every aspect of life was being dictated by the EU.


Quote
How does the EU uplift with the world with its labyrinthine style of government? One can have a common market and mutual cooperation without the bureaucratic boondoggle that is the EU.

Exactly, the British can establish new economic relationships with the EU just as the US has done.

They could even strengthen ties to other growing economies of the world if they want- on their own terms, without having to toe the Brussels line.

They would also potentially be able to take their own independent political position on world affairs, without having to toe the EU line ("Israel is bad! Russia is bad!").
Imagine your Korea...

Offline Rusty Brown

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2018, 02:54:19 AM »
I voted remain out of fear. Our government spent nine million pounds of tax payer's money on their scaremongering campaign. The experts have so far got a helluva lot of things wrong and the vitriol from remainers and the EU has been utterly appalling. So, to hell with the EU, and up yours, Scotland. You'll soon change your tune when you get flooded with foreigners.

Offline SPQR

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #46 on: November 29, 2018, 07:53:29 AM »
I voted remain out of fear. Our government spent nine million pounds of tax payer's money on their scaremongering campaign. The experts have so far got a helluva lot of things wrong and the vitriol from remainers and the EU has been utterly appalling. So, to hell with the EU, and up yours, Scotland. You'll soon change your tune when you get flooded with foreigners.

Out with foreigners!  Ein reich, ein volk, ein führer!

Online eggieguffer

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #47 on: November 29, 2018, 07:59:39 AM »
Do you want completely open borders?
Umm, no.
Well then, you're a Nazi :rolleyes:

Puerile.

Online Savant

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2018, 08:10:33 AM »
Do you want completely open borders?
Umm, no.
Well then, you're a Nazi :rolleyes:

Puerile.

Just the Jews and Muslims to kick out. Then, you're a Nazi.

I'm not in favor of complete open borders but I'm also not against denying people the right to legal migration and the taking in of refugees and those fleeing persecution.

So, not Germany's policy nor America First. Somewhere, in between.

Oh and Brexit is still a f@cktasrophe and Jacob Rees-Mogg is an upper-class cnut.

Online eggieguffer

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2018, 08:24:33 AM »
Quote
but I'm also not against denying people the right to legal migration and the taking in of refugees and those fleeing persecution.

That's a lot of negatives. Doesn't it mean you want to deny people the right to legal migration?

Assuming you're OK with legal migration, taking in refugees and those fleeing persecution. Who isn't?

Online Savant

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #50 on: November 29, 2018, 08:28:07 AM »
Quote
but I'm also not against denying people the right to legal migration and the taking in of refugees and those fleeing persecution.

That's a lot of negatives. Doesn't it mean you want to deny people the right to legal migration?

Assuming you're OK with legal migration, taking in refugees and those fleeing persecution. Who isn't?

No! If a country has a robust legal migration system then sure they have a right to apply.

America First doesn't want any people from less desirable countries.

Online eggieguffer

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #51 on: November 29, 2018, 08:33:08 AM »
Quote
but I'm also not against denying people the right to legal migration and the taking in of refugees and those fleeing persecution.

That's a lot of negatives. Doesn't it mean you want to deny people the right to legal migration?

Assuming you're OK with legal migration, taking in refugees and those fleeing persecution. Who isn't?

No! If a country has a robust legal migration system then sure they have a right to apply.

America First doesn't want any people from less desirable countries.

I think this is about the only thread on Waygook where US politics isn't on the agenda, so not interested in discussing it. Just wanted to curtail the Nazi name calling nonsense.

Online Savant

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #52 on: November 29, 2018, 08:43:20 AM »
Quote
but I'm also not against denying people the right to legal migration and the taking in of refugees and those fleeing persecution.

That's a lot of negatives. Doesn't it mean you want to deny people the right to legal migration?

Assuming you're OK with legal migration, taking in refugees and those fleeing persecution. Who isn't?

No! If a country has a robust legal migration system then sure they have a right to apply.

America First doesn't want any people from less desirable countries.

I think this is about the only thread on Waygook where US politics isn't on the agenda, so not interested in discussing it. Just wanted to curtail the Nazi name calling nonsense.

Agreed! Let's stick to looking at the lies, false hope and deceit perpetuated by the Pro-Brexit crowd.

Offline Mr.DeMartino

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #53 on: November 29, 2018, 09:23:39 AM »
Agreed! Let's stick to looking at the lies, false hope and deceit perpetuated by the Pro-Brexit crowd.
Yeah, not like the EU has ever traded in those. All political parties make optimistic claims, but the core issue of Brexit isn't NHS money or fishing waters, it's sovereignty, something the globalists just don't understand.

I would rather have my own bad government than the good government of an alien power.

Online Savant

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #54 on: November 29, 2018, 09:28:59 AM »
Agreed! Let's stick to looking at the lies, false hope and deceit perpetuated by the Pro-Brexit crowd.
Yeah, not like the EU has ever traded in those. All political parties make optimistic claims, but the core issue of Brexit isn't NHS money or fishing waters, it's sovereignty, something the globalists just don't understand.

I would rather have my own bad government than the good government of an alien power.

Optimistic claims is different from blatant lies.

Breaking News! Britain isn't the superpower it once was. The old days of Empire are long gone. Our Navy equivalent is some guys in a couple of rowing boats.

The Brexiteers wanted out from the EU but wanted to do none of the heavy lifting required to get a good deal for the UK.

Online tylerthegloob

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #55 on: November 29, 2018, 09:29:08 AM »
Agreed! Let's stick to looking at the lies, false hope and deceit perpetuated by the Pro-Brexit crowd.
Yeah, not like the EU has ever traded in those. All political parties make optimistic claims, but the core issue of Brexit isn't NHS money or fishing waters, it's sovereignty, something the globalists just don't understand.

I would rather have my own bad government than the good government of an alien power.

What does it mean for a government to be "one's own"?

Offline Mr.DeMartino

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #56 on: November 29, 2018, 10:00:29 AM »
What does it mean for a government to be "one's own"?
That the people of a nation are the final arbiter of any law and they have control over the leaders who make the laws.

Anyways, regardless of Brexit the EU is inherently incapable of existing for a sustained period of time. It's system of government is so labyrinthine and unaccountable that they will either bureaucracy themselves to death OR make some sort of overreach and it will eventually collapse.

Does anyone here actually think the EU's structure is good for governing 500 million people while maintaining transparency and accountability? Why support a structure that has inherent design flaws and seems destined for collapse. The EU is NOT the Leaning Tower of Pisa. It is a flawed design that should be torn down and perhaps people can come up with something better.

Online tylerthegloob

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #57 on: November 29, 2018, 10:28:17 AM »
What does it mean for a government to be "one's own"?
That the people of a nation are the final arbiter of any law and they have control over the leaders who make the laws.


But this isn't incompatible with globalism. Would you be opposed to a global union of nations structured similar to that of the the US (assuming the structure of the US government fits your description above)?

In other words, do you take issue with the structure of the EU or with the general project of building international organizations?

Offline SPQR

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #58 on: November 29, 2018, 11:11:54 AM »

I would rather have my own bad government than the good government of an alien power.


Right. So you would rather have a Stalin, Pol Pot, Hitler, Idi Amin as long as he's not a
bloody foreigner.

Right. (pronounced very slowly and mockingly)

Online JNM

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Re: Waygook's Unofficial 2nd Brexit Vote (The People's Vote)
« Reply #59 on: November 29, 2018, 11:31:06 AM »
Agreed! Let's stick to looking at the lies, false hope and deceit perpetuated by the Pro-Brexit crowd.
Yeah, not like the EU has ever traded in those. All political parties make optimistic claims, but the core issue of Brexit isn't NHS money or fishing waters, it's sovereignty, something the globalists just don't understand.

I would rather have my own bad government than the good government of an alien power.

Optimistic claims is different from blatant lies.

Breaking News! Britain isn't the superpower it once was. The old days of Empire are long gone. Our Navy equivalent is some guys in a couple of rowing boats.

The Brexiteers wanted out from the EU but wanted to do none of the heavy lifting required to get a good deal for the UK.
Re: Royal Navy

They still got nukes, so there’s that.