September 22, 2017, 01:28:59 PM


Author Topic: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer  (Read 1851 times)

Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #20 on: August 11, 2017, 05:46:09 PM »
Y'all want an adult conversation? Okay then.

Let's ignore the middle-school debate topic of "Women in the Workforce." I doubt any minds will be changed on that subject.

The firing of this man is indirectly the fault of the right wing and its philosophy. If not for at-will employment, this man would have had a better shot at keeping his job. If unions weren't as demonizied, he might have an organizaion to help him fight the dismissal. Instead, all he can do is lament over a pint and hope he is not completely blacklisted from the industry.

This is the corporate atmosphere you wanted, rightwingers. Remember that when it works against you.

Also, to person who called me a gaylord, come back to this thread when you finish with puberty.

Jobs such as his were never unionized. If you are a techie or a stockbroker or a lawyer, you have always played under a different set of rules than a factory worker or a teacher or a teamster.

He threatened google's brand. I may agree with him, but if I was a google shareholder I'd want his ass out and I think they should be able to.

I do think it's worrisome that what amounts to a borderline monopoly is a company that's committed to a "social diversity" view as its brand as opposed to a content neutral, wide open company, but that's google's choice and until they are broken up, it's how things are.

However, the internet is such a free marketplace that sooner or later some outfit will start that will offer the same things as google, facebook, and youtube that will be more diverse in political ideology and not weeded to a certain identity. They will rise, and google will have some level of decline. People will migrate there, that company will rise. 'googlize' itself, people will move on and that one will decline, etc. It's all a cycle.

The one area where google could be in trouble is that apparently this memo was in response to a request for company feedback. I'm not sure on the particulars of it becoming disseminated, but this could be troublesome. If the company solicited feedback from its employees, received feedback, and fired someone because of the feedback they gave, THAT is a problem.

Offline eggieguffer

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #21 on: August 11, 2017, 05:58:38 PM »
Quote
And while I vehemently disagree with his opinions

Did you read the whole thing, as I can't really see how anyone could 'vehemently' disagree with it? He cites sources and studies you might think are dodgy etc.. but none of this nature or nurture stuff has been proved definitively one way or another. If the science part isn't fully proven then how can you be so sure about the other stuff?
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 06:02:29 PM by eggieguffer »

Offline Rusty Brown

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2017, 06:07:12 PM »
Can't blame him. Google is populated by reactionary gaylords like you, Talawsohu. I'm sure his employers will get over their public embarrassment.

Wow. Both a homophobic slur, and the incorrect use of "reactionary". Ironic, in that people who use homophobic slurs are, almost by definition, reactionary.

Liberals are the new reactionaries. They are the ones opposed to true, meaningful social reform. They are the puritans of modern society. Gaylord is a playground slur, get over it.

Offline Talawsohu

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #23 on: August 11, 2017, 06:09:53 PM »
Quote
And while I vehemently disagree with his opinions

Did you read the whole thing, as I can't really see how anyone could 'vehemently' disagree with it? He cites sources and studies you might think are dodgy etc.. but none of this nature or nurture stuff has been proved definitively one way or another. If the science part isn't fully proven then how can you be so sure about the other stuff?


Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #24 on: August 11, 2017, 06:15:06 PM »
Liberals are the new reactionaries. They are the ones opposed to true, meaningful social reform. They are the puritans of modern society. Gaylord is a playground slur, get over it.

Leaving aside whether such slurs are okay here (free for all ala youtube or 'no hate' ala Twitter is fine by me either way, as long as it's applied fairly), it's just unimaginative. Isn't there a more creative playground insult you could come up with? Two thumbs down on 'gaylord' in my book. If I was Talawsohu, I wouldn't be sweating things if that's the best you can come up with.

Offline Talawsohu

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2017, 06:24:08 PM »
Also, to person who called me a gaylord, come back to this thread when you finish with puberty.


Liberals are the new reactionaries. They are the ones opposed to true, meaningful social reform. They are the puritans of modern society. Gaylord is a playground slur, get over it.

It's like I am seeing him grow up right before my eyes!

Offline Talawsohu

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #26 on: August 11, 2017, 06:25:51 PM »
Liberals are the new reactionaries. They are the ones opposed to true, meaningful social reform. They are the puritans of modern society. Gaylord is a playground slur, get over it.

Leaving aside whether such slurs are okay here (free for all ala youtube or 'no hate' ala Twitter is fine by me either way, as long as it's applied fairly), it's just unimaginative. Isn't there a more creative playground insult you could come up with? Two thumbs down on 'gaylord' in my book. If I was Talawsohu, I wouldn't be sweating things if that's the best you can come up with.

If I sweated that, I don't think I'd be allowed back in Baltimore.

Online zola

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #27 on: August 11, 2017, 06:36:52 PM »
The captain of my cricket team when i was a wee kid had the surname Gaylord. That's a character builder. There was also a kid with the family name of Ramsbottum. We were too young to find it funny though.

Offline donovan

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2017, 07:03:12 PM »
Not the same guy?... :sad:

Offline MayorHaggar

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #29 on: August 11, 2017, 07:13:19 PM »
The only mistake Google made was allowing some random employee to spam everyone's inbox with a bunch of psuedoscience.



It is hilarious seeing the alt-reich cry crocodile tears about how Silicon Valley is oppressing them and isn't allowing "a diversity of opinions," when modern conservatism is based on rejecting any kind of opposing view and dragging anyone through the dirt who isn't a cultist conservative. The vast majority of tech workers are male, and libertarian misogyny is really common among these techie bros. It's not like male techies are exactly being oppressed or anything.

Offline pkjh

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #30 on: August 11, 2017, 09:06:46 PM »
The only mistake Google made was allowing some random employee to spam everyone's inbox with a bunch of psuedoscience.

It is hilarious seeing the alt-reich cry crocodile tears about how Silicon Valley is oppressing them and isn't allowing "a diversity of opinions," when modern conservatism is based on rejecting any kind of opposing view and dragging anyone through the dirt who isn't a cultist conservative. The vast majority of tech workers are male, and libertarian misogyny is really common among these techie bros. It's not like male techies are exactly being oppressed or anything.
An EE major here, worked a few years in the field after I graduated, in Ottawa though. What you say is true. It's like their middle/high school years they were oppressed nerds, literally being bullied by athletes. But now as adults things have changed, they're nerds making good cash, so at times girls are now throwing themselves at them (especially in that Silicon Valley area). They are the new jocks.

Anyways it's not like high-tech geeks are more sexist than the rest of the population. The percentage is probably the same, but you have a more amplified attitude, where in many places like 100% of the your workforce is male. Where in other industries attitudes would be toned down because of the mere presence of a woman in the room. I personally spent a few years in a place where it was more like 17/20 male. However, we had quite a number of secretaries, and government consultants (which helps even the gender ratio) around, which helped quell a lot of the 'locker room' talk. I can just imagine what would be said if there were no women around...

Offline StillInKorea

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #31 on: August 11, 2017, 09:33:46 PM »
SJWs make me appreciate living in Korea. For all the BS we have to deal with here, we at least get to avoid their hysterical drama.

Offline eggieguffer

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #32 on: August 11, 2017, 09:41:27 PM »
Quote
Anyways it's not like high-tech geeks are more sexist than the rest of the population. The percentage is probably the same, but you have a more amplified attitude, where in many places like 100% of the your workforce is male. Where in other industries attitudes would be toned down because of the mere presence of a woman in the room. I personally spent a few years in a place where it was more like 17/20 male. However, we had quite a number of secretaries, and government consultants (which helps even the gender ratio) around, which helped quell a lot of the 'locker room' talk. I can just imagine what would be said if there were no women around...

That's actually what the guy was saying, that he thought a more diverse workforce would be a good thing. He was just questioning the right way to go about it.

What Google and some other companies seem to be saying is 'men and women are exactly the same.' 'More gender diversity is better for the company' Umm in that case, Why?
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 09:51:56 PM by eggieguffer »

Offline Aurata

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #33 on: August 11, 2017, 10:57:42 PM »
Google works hand in hand with the NSA and CIA to expand unconstitutional spying on everyone everywhere

Quote
Wikileaks Reveals Google's "Strategic Plan" To Help Democrats Win The Election, Track Voters

Google planned the creation of a voter tracking database, using smart phones:

Key is the development of a single record for a voter that aggregates all that is known about them.  In 2016 smart phones will be used to identify, meet, and update profiles on the voter.  A dynamic volunteer can easily speak with a voter and, with their email or other digital handle, get the voter videos and other answers to areas they care about (“the benefits of ACA to you” etc.)
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-11-01/wikileaks-reveals-googles-strategic-plan-help-democrats-win-election

...and also to suppress independent and dissenting thought and expression.

Quote
13 websites arbitrarily branded by Google as fake news or conspiracy sites whose readership Google has managed to reduce between 19 and 67 percent:

* wsws.org fell by 67 percent
* alternet.org fell by 63 percent
* globalresearch.ca fell by 62 percent
* consortiumnews.com fell by 47 percent
* socialistworker.org fell by 47 percent
* mediamatters.org fell by 42 percent
* commondreams.org fell by 37 percent
* internationalviewpoint.org fell by 36 percent
* democracynow.org fell by 36 percent
* wikileaks.org fell by 30 percent
* truth-out.org fell by 25 percent
* counterpunch.org fell by 21 percent
theintercept.com fell by 19 percent

It is completely obvious that none of these sites are fake news or conspiracy sites. These sites are under Google censorship because they question the official lies that are used to control the explanations given to the people.
Imagine your Korea...

Offline CDW

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #34 on: August 12, 2017, 11:07:36 AM »
Debra Soh, who has a PhD in sexual neuroscience, defends Damore.

"As mentioned in the memo, gendered interests are predicted by exposure to prenatal testosterone – higher levels are associated with a preference for mechanically interesting things and occupations in adulthood. Lower levels are associated with a preference for people-oriented activities and occupations. This is why STEM (science, technology, engineering and mathematics) fields tend to be dominated by men....

"In fact, research has shown that cultures with greater gender equity have larger sex differences when it comes to job preferences, because in these societies, people are free to choose their occupations based on what they enjoy.

"As the memo suggests, seeking to fulfill a 50-per-cent quota of women in STEM is unrealistic. As gender equity continues to improve in developing societies, we should expect to see this gender gap widen.

"This trend continues into the area of personality, as well. Contrary to what detractors would have you believe, women are, on average, higher in neuroticism and agreeableness, and lower in stress tolerance.

"Some intentionally deny the science because they are afraid it will be used to justify keeping women out of STEM. But sexism isn't the result of knowing facts; it's the result of what people choose to do with them."
https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/no-the-google-manifesto-isnt-sexist-or-anti-diversity-its-science/article35903359/?ref=http://www.theglobeandmail.com&

Offline eggieguffer

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #35 on: August 12, 2017, 11:19:28 AM »
Debra Soh, who has a PhD in sexual neuroscience, defends Damore.

"As mentioned in the memo, gendered interests are predicted by exposure to prenatal testosterone – higher levels are associated with a preference for mechanically interesting things and occupations in adulthood. Lower levels are associated with a preference for people-oriented activities and occupations. This is why STEM (science, technology, engineering and mathematics) fields tend to be dominated by men....

"In fact, research has shown that cultures with greater gender equity have larger sex differences when it comes to job preferences, because in these societies, people are free to choose their occupations based on what they enjoy.

"As the memo suggests, seeking to fulfill a 50-per-cent quota of women in STEM is unrealistic. As gender equity continues to improve in developing societies, we should expect to see this gender gap widen.

"This trend continues into the area of personality, as well. Contrary to what detractors would have you believe, women are, on average, higher in neuroticism and agreeableness, and lower in stress tolerance.

"Some intentionally deny the science because they are afraid it will be used to justify keeping women out of STEM. But sexism isn't the result of knowing facts; it's the result of what people choose to do with them."
https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/no-the-google-manifesto-isnt-sexist-or-anti-diversity-its-science/article35903359/?ref=http://www.theglobeandmail.com&

One solution would be just to pay everyone in stem fields less money, so they'd become like construction or sanitation. Fields dominated by men that no one talks about or cares.

Offline CDW

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #36 on: August 21, 2017, 08:03:38 AM »
"Really, it’s like being gay in the 1950s. These conservatives have to stay in the closet and have to mask who they really are. And that’s a huge problem because there’s open discrimination against anyone who comes out of the closet as a conservative."
-James Damore

It sounds like his lawsuit against Google has a reasonable chance of succeeding. It's illegal to fire an employee for merely raising concerns about working conditions.

" 'The crux of his claim is whether Google penalized him for raising concerns about working conditions (i.e., unfair treatment of white men?)' Sharpe said. 'Whether the manifesto really constitutes a "concern about working conditions" and whether he was acting for the good of others will be the dispositive issues. I am not aware of any cases that are exactly on point, but there are certainly cases that litigate this issue and cases where employees are returned to work.' "
http://www.businessinsider.com/james-damore-may-win-nlra-legal-case-google-2017-8

Offline JNM

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #37 on: August 21, 2017, 09:53:43 AM »
More likely a nice settlement with strings attached.

Offline Arabin

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #38 on: August 21, 2017, 12:14:37 PM »
"Really, it’s like being gay in the 1950s. These conservatives have to stay in the closet and have to mask who they really are. And that’s a huge problem because there’s open discrimination against anyone who comes out of the closet as a conservative."
-James Damore

It sounds like his lawsuit against Google has a reasonable chance of succeeding. It's illegal to fire an employee for merely raising concerns about working conditions.

" 'The crux of his claim is whether Google penalized him for raising concerns about working conditions (i.e., unfair treatment of white men?)' Sharpe said. 'Whether the manifesto really constitutes a "concern about working conditions" and whether he was acting for the good of others will be the dispositive issues. I am not aware of any cases that are exactly on point, but there are certainly cases that litigate this issue and cases where employees are returned to work.' "
http://www.businessinsider.com/james-damore-may-win-nlra-legal-case-google-2017-8

I like the gay in the 50's comment. Not melodramatic in the slightest. Because being beaten up and arrested for trying to have a love life is the same as having people sneer at you for being an entitled right wing manchild.

But I presume Google's very expensive lawyers will claim he was fired for bringing Google into disrepute. I haven't read the ten pages because life is too short but I would be very surprised if it confined itself to saying that the way diversity was handled at Google was a problem. Any tired biology/STEM argument can be seized upon to say this is why he was binned.

Manchild didn't help himself by going straight to Redpill youtubers when he was canned. That makes it very, very easy to paint him for just another angry virgin who think he is owed blowjobs and money by the virtue of his testes and pigmentation.

Even factoring a few media-whore lawyers willing to pro-bono this, Manchild will have to think very hard about suing Google. Because they have more resources than most nations and if he loses, and Google gets awarded costs, he is well and truly f**ked.

Offline Mr C

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Re: Google’s Firing of Anti-Diversity Memo Writer
« Reply #39 on: August 21, 2017, 12:29:25 PM »
I like Trump's response when he was asked about the gender pay gap:

"You're going to make the same if you do as good a job."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MioIksr8i00

Trump said it, so it must be true.

Wait.  Almost exactly not.

 

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