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Author Topic: When will Trump be impeached?  (Read 162841 times)

Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2100 on: June 18, 2018, 08:19:25 AM »
Crimea is nothing like Pearl Harbor.

Sevastapol is Russia's Black Sea port. It is of MAJOR strategic value ala Pearl Harbor. It is something that the Russians will go to war over, nuclear war even.

Do you feel like dying over who controls Sevastapol? I don't. I prefer to live in the real world where we aren't turning over Hawaii to the natives, Guantanamo Bay is ours, the Suez Canal is Egypt's, Gibraltar is the UK's, Jerusalem is Israel's, and those countries will not relinquish them without severe violence.

What's your plan gogators!? Sanctions? Russia will tolerate them to keep Sevastapol. How long will they continue? Go to war? Send massive amounts of arms to Ukraine?

Or we can all be adults and realize that Russia has her own sphere, just like we have the Monroe Doctrine.

Offline Dave Stepz

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2101 on: June 18, 2018, 08:31:09 AM »
Incredible.  Trump still thinks it is a Democrat policy to separate children from their parents at the border and he's using it as leverage to get them to negotiate.  Wow!
Didn't this policy begin under Obama? Or even before then?

George W Bush in 2008

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Trump’s repeated references to a Democratic law appear to involve one enacted in 2008 that was signed by a Republican president, George W Bush. It was focused on freeing and helping children who come to the border without a parent or guardian and did not call for family separation.

From the article.

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Do you have a specific, detailed policy alternative? Or are you just going to stomp and scream?

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The Democrats are forcing the breakup of families at the Border with their horrible and cruel legislative agenda. Any Immigration Bill MUST HAVE full funding for the Wall, end Catch & Release, Visa Lottery and Chain, and go to Merit Based Immigration. Go for it! WIN!

Dude, honestly, your president is tweeting stuff like this.  There are better ways to deal with it, the problem is Trump honestly thinks like this.  Mexico has already told him to stick his 'Mexico will pay for the wall' up his ass.  This tweet shows he wants the US to pay for it by suggesting the Democrats are holding it all up.  That is not what he promised pre-election.  At the moment, anything is better than Trump's ideas.

Offline Mr C

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2102 on: June 18, 2018, 11:53:36 AM »
And yet the comfort women. What's your position on that?

We already know you support the Confederate statues, i.e., not moving on.

We haven't gotten anywhere NK. All the gains have been on their end. And china's and russia's.

Seeing a pattern here?

Comfort women, while a serious issue, is not the same as a nuclear armed North Korea. Japan and South Korea are at peace and trading with each other. And while they may stomp their feet about islands and stuff, they aren't about to incinerate tens of thousands of civilians over it.

It's a statue. Freedom of expression. Put up your own statue 10 feet away giving the finger to the Confederate General. Or some slave embracing the general's daughter. If it's legal and fine for art displays featuring crucifixes in urine and for publications to mock the founder of Islam, then we can tolerate Confederate Generals. Make a statue or Hitler, Stalin, Tojo, and Bedford Forrest as the Village People in drag for all I care.
You, of course, are being flippant.  Think about why all those Confederate statues were erected.  This was a direct counterpoint to black voting, the rise of black middle class, etc.  These statues were to intimidate, to remind, and give racists a rallying point.

Serrano's art didn't "feature" a crucifix in urine, that was one of a large number of pieces in which he immersed many different objects in many different fluids (including bodily ones).  It has to be said, though, the "Piss Christ"  happens to look particularly amazing.
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North Korea and us haven't gotten anywhere. Everything has been minor and symbolic. The important thing now is to establish trust and reduce tension. The negotiations aren't over. You're declaring defeat in the 1st inning of a scoreless game where Kim got a base hit single and Trump drew a walk.
Funny, the only thing I thought about it beforehand was "I'm pretty sure even Trump isn't stupid enough to stop  Foal Eagle etc just in order to get a meaningless agreement."  Once again, he proved me wrong: He's that stupid!

Why increase the level of defense spending so substantially, if you won't even let the soldiers train on all the new weapons?
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Why can't Democrats Give Trump Credit?
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/06/trump-kim-jong-un-summit/562934/
'Cause he doesn't deserve any?

Offline gogators!

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2103 on: June 18, 2018, 11:54:33 AM »
Crimea is nothing like Pearl Harbor.

Sevastapol is Russia's Black Sea port. It is of MAJOR strategic value ala Pearl Harbor. It is something that the Russians will go to war over, nuclear war even.

Do you feel like dying over who controls Sevastapol? I don't. I prefer to live in the real world where we aren't turning over Hawaii to the natives, Guantanamo Bay is ours, the Suez Canal is Egypt's, Gibraltar is the UK's, Jerusalem is Israel's, and those countries will not relinquish them without severe violence.

What's your plan gogators!? Sanctions? Russia will tolerate them to keep Sevastapol. How long will they continue? Go to war? Send massive amounts of arms to Ukraine?

Or we can all be adults and realize that Russia has her own sphere, just like we have the Monroe Doctrine.
Tougher sanctions are definitely a start. Keeping russia out of the G-7. Stronger reactions and deterrents to their cyberhacking of US and Europe. Sending arms if that has a reasonable chance of succeeding.

Gibraltar, huh?
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Under the Gibraltar constitution of 2006, Gibraltar governs its own affairs, though some powers, such as defence and foreign relations, remain the responsibility of the British government.

Sounds nothing like Crimea.

Hawaii?
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The U.S. Department of the Interior plans to make it clear this morning that any government-to-government relationship with a future Native Hawaiian government is solely up to Native Hawaiians to determine.

Today Interior officials are expected to announce a rule, or “pathway,” for a future Native Hawaiian government to establish a so-called government-to-government relationship with the United States following a series of angry public hearings on the issue two years ago.

Sounds nothing like Crimea.

GTMO?
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A subsequent agreement in 1934 gave the U.S. the use of Guantanamo "in perpetuity," unless the U.S. either unilaterally abandons the base or both the U.S. and Cuba agree to end the lease.

Sounds nothing like Crimea.

Be an adult and get your facts straight. You wouldn't by chance be a fundamentalist Christian who believes prophecies concerning Jerusalem and Russia and so supports them in hopes it will hasten the endtimes?

Offline gogators!

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2104 on: June 18, 2018, 12:00:37 PM »
And yet the comfort women. What's your position on that?

We already know you support the Confederate statues, i.e., not moving on.

We haven't gotten anywhere NK. All the gains have been on their end. And china's and russia's.

Seeing a pattern here?

Comfort women, while a serious issue, is not the same as a nuclear armed North Korea. Japan and South Korea are at peace and trading with each other. And while they may stomp their feet about islands and stuff, they aren't about to incinerate tens of thousands of civilians over it.

It's a statue. Freedom of expression. Put up your own statue 10 feet away giving the finger to the Confederate General. Or some slave embracing the general's daughter. If it's legal and fine for art displays featuring crucifixes in urine and for publications to mock the founder of Islam, then we can tolerate Confederate Generals. Make a statue or Hitler, Stalin, Tojo, and Bedford Forrest as the Village People in drag for all I care.

North Korea and us haven't gotten anywhere. Everything has been minor and symbolic. The important thing now is to establish trust and reduce tension. The negotiations aren't over. You're declaring defeat in the 1st inning of a scoreless game where Kim got a base hit single and Trump drew a walk.

Why can't Democrats Give Trump Credit?
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/06/trump-kim-jong-un-summit/562934/
Supporting racism under the guise of free speech--what a surprise.

Kim got a stand-up triple and trumpy is arguing with the ump that it was a foul ball while replay clearly shows it was fair. trump is protesting the game on grounds it's provocative and a waste of money.



Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2105 on: June 18, 2018, 12:09:26 PM »
Tougher sanctions are definitely a start. Keeping russia out of the G-7. Stronger reactions and deterrents to their cyberhacking of US and Europe. Sending arms if that has a reasonable chance of succeeding.

What do you think is the likely outcome of such actions?

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Gibraltar, huh?
You don't think at some level, the Spanish think Gibraltar should be there's? It was taken through conquest. A simple map can look at that and see that it should rightfully belong to the Spanish if not for the legacy of war and imperialism. And if some Spanish government decided to move on it, you don't think the British would respond aggressively?

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Today Interior officials are expected to announce a rule, or “pathway,” for a future Native Hawaiian government to establish a so-called government-to-government relationship with the United States following a series of angry public hearings on the issue two years ago.

In other words, a largely symbolic representative government for local affairs, similar to Indigenous Americans and reservations.

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A subsequent agreement in 1934 gave the U.S. the use of Guantanamo "in perpetuity," unless the U.S. either unilaterally abandons the base or both the U.S. and Cuba agree to end the lease.

Cuba doesn't see it that way.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/21/raul-castro-demands-return-guantanamo-bay-obama-visit

You have to consider the Russian point of view as well, especially when they look at our own hypocrisy on the issue.

I prefer to deal with these things in realistic terms so that we can have peace. Not ship arms and weapons in a move that could end up with American troops fighting Russians over Crimea and the nuclear conflict that could ensue.

I believe that Crimea is something that Russia would go to nuclear war over, much as Israel is willing to bring down the whole house over Jerusalem or the British entering WWI upon the German invasion of Belgium or the way Japan entered WWII over the U.S. oil embargo or the Chinese attacked the UN Forces when they approached the Yalu River. At some point countries will choose to go down fighting rather than accept 'unacceptable' alternatives.

Crimea is that kind of 'red line' for Russia. Is that something we are willing to fight and die over?

Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2106 on: June 18, 2018, 12:15:22 PM »
Supporting racism under the guise of free speech--what a surprise.

I also support the construction and display of statues mocking Confederates in explicitly graphic terms. By your logic, I support anti-racism.

However, in my view, I support free speech and think that our laws are clear- We can regulate time, place, and manner, but not content or viewpoint.

If your side is so insecure about being able to win this battle in the free marketplace of ideas, that says something. I for one believe that the anti-racists can win and that getting 'even' or getting 'funny' is a much better tactic than saying free speech for their side but not for anyone else.

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Kim got a stand-up triple and trumpy is arguing with the ump that it was a foul ball while replay clearly shows it was fair. trump is protesting the game on grounds it's provocative and a waste of money.

It's a 9 inning game. Even if you think Kim got a standup triple instead of a single (everything we promised is reversible, and the "prestige" argument is ridiculous anti-Trump schpiel), it's still the 1st inning.

I'm sorry you and your side thinks the game is over in the 1st inning. That probably explains why you lost to Trump. While your side was focusing on small "wins" and "losses" of little significance, Trump was building an election winner.

Your side predicted Trump would never get the nomination, that he'd get creamed in the election, that he would start nuclear war, and that our economy would collapse. Not a good track record as far as prediction goes.

Online Mister Tim

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2107 on: June 18, 2018, 12:37:31 PM »

Didn't this policy begin under Obama? Or even before then?


Not quite.

While immigration has been criminalized to different degrees throughout history...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2018/05/10/sessions-is-criminalizing-immigration-violations-that-upends-centuries-of-history/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.3cb791cca182

It's only a recent policy that seeks to separate children from their parents...

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/21/us/trump-immigrant-families-separate.html?_r=0


It honestly seems more like an issue with Jeff Session's hateboner for immigrants than anything to do with how Trump feels about things, though it's discouraging that Trump seems to be fine using it as a political negotiation tactic.

Offline Mr C

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2108 on: June 18, 2018, 03:25:21 PM »
the "prestige" argument is ridiculous anti-Trump schpiel),

It simply isn't.  Saying it is is nothing other than pro-Trump nonsense.

Offline gogators!

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2109 on: June 18, 2018, 11:26:11 PM »
Supporting racism under the guise of free speech--what a surprise.

I also support the construction and display of statues mocking Confederates in explicitly graphic terms. By your logic, I support anti-racism.

However, in my view, I support free speech and think that our laws are clear- We can regulate time, place, and manner, but not content or viewpoint.

If your side is so insecure about being able to win this battle in the free marketplace of ideas, that says something. I for one believe that the anti-racists can win and that getting 'even' or getting 'funny' is a much better tactic than saying free speech for their side but not for anyone else.

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Kim got a stand-up triple and trumpy is arguing with the ump that it was a foul ball while replay clearly shows it was fair. trump is protesting the game on grounds it's provocative and a waste of money.

It's a 9 inning game. Even if you think Kim got a standup triple instead of a single (everything we promised is reversible, and the "prestige" argument is ridiculous anti-Trump schpiel), it's still the 1st inning.

I'm sorry you and your side thinks the game is over in the 1st inning. That probably explains why you lost to Trump. While your side was focusing on small "wins" and "losses" of little significance, Trump was building an election winner.

Your side predicted Trump would never get the nomination, that he'd get creamed in the election, that he would start nuclear war, and that our economy would collapse. Not a good track record as far as prediction goes.
BS on supporting hypothetical anti-confederate statues.  "The free marketplace of ideas" is utter nonsense. Money talks and conservatives like the kochs, mellons and coors are spending billions yearly to push right-wing ideology.

"My side"--repugnican thinking in a nutshell.

trumpy has declared again and again that NK nuclearization is a done deal. Yet you (and he) contradict that.

bone spurs lost the popular vote. He won due to the electoral college tilt to rural states and by energizing folks who don't normally vote. Research shows them to be fundamentally racist. ms-13 is the new willie horton.

The prestige argument is very real. How long have you lived in SK? You must have noticed, at least a bit, their desperation to be recognized internationally. NK is no different. Face, can you dig it?

Strike out!

 

Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2110 on: June 19, 2018, 06:55:05 AM »
the "prestige" argument is ridiculous anti-Trump schpiel),

It simply isn't.  Saying it is is nothing other than pro-Trump nonsense.

Before that the rest of the world viewed North Korea with deep distrust and suspicion. After that it's the same.

Before that inside North Korea you cheered for Kim or were shot. After that, it's the same.

Nothing changed simply by meeting. Get a clue.

Offline Dave Stepz

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2111 on: June 19, 2018, 07:14:25 AM »
the "prestige" argument is ridiculous anti-Trump schpiel),

It simply isn't.  Saying it is is nothing other than pro-Trump nonsense.

Before that the rest of the world viewed North Korea with deep distrust and suspicion. After that it's the same.

Before that inside North Korea you cheered for Kim or were shot. After that, it's the same.

Nothing changed simply by meeting. Get a clue.

Who is giving us the idea that it was win all over?  Trump

Who is bleating that NK's nuclear threat is 'over'?  Trump

Who is telling people to 'sleep well tonight'?  Trump

If that isn't a sign that the meeting 'changed' everything, then I don't know what does.

People would be happy to let the thing go, except for the one guy who makes it all about him.  Get a clue. 

Online Mr.DeMartino

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2112 on: June 19, 2018, 11:19:25 AM »

Who is giving us the idea that it was win all over?  Trump

Who is bleating that NK's nuclear threat is 'over'?  Trump

Who is telling people to 'sleep well tonight'?  Trump

If that isn't a sign that the meeting 'changed' everything, then I don't know what does.

People would be happy to let the thing go, except for the one guy who makes it all about him.  Get a clue.

What should Trump say?

"We have a long tedious process of many years ahead of us. Let's be lukewarm about it."

Or maybe "We have a framework, but I bet this all ends up a big fat waste of time"

Of course not. He should demonstrate a desire for the deal to work and extend a hand towards Kim to join the rest of the world.

Your criticism is hollow. Trump could go right, left, up or down and you'd say it's wrong no matter what. It's just reflexive anti-trumpism and it's not based on any objective standards.

Offline gogators!

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2113 on: June 19, 2018, 11:29:41 AM »

Who is giving us the idea that it was win all over?  Trump

Who is bleating that NK's nuclear threat is 'over'?  Trump

Who is telling people to 'sleep well tonight'?  Trump

If that isn't a sign that the meeting 'changed' everything, then I don't know what does.

People would be happy to let the thing go, except for the one guy who makes it all about him.  Get a clue.

What should Trump say?

"We have a long tedious process of many years ahead of us. Let's be lukewarm about it."

Or maybe "We have a framework, but I bet this all ends up a big fat waste of time"

Of course not. He should demonstrate a desire for the deal to work and extend a hand towards Kim to join the rest of the world.

Your criticism is hollow. Trump could go right, left, up or down and you'd say it's wrong no matter what. It's just reflexive anti-trumpism and it's not based on any objective standards.
That's a complete and utter falsehood.

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Another common reason why people indulge in lying is to improve their image or save face. They constantly wish to portray themselves as good, polite, successful, etc., in short, possessing all positive human qualities. Exaggeration and bluffing are two other types of lies, and methods adopted by people to impress or mislead others.

That shoes seems to fit you perfectly,sir. Should I ring it up for you?

Offline Dave Stepz

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2114 on: June 19, 2018, 03:56:57 PM »
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President Trump and two members of his cabinet mounted an aggressive defense on Monday of his policy of separating children from their parents at the border in response to a growing outcry from members of both parties.

“They could be murderers and thieves and so much else,” Mr. Trump said of the people crossing the border. “We want a safe country, and it starts with the borders, and that’s the way it is.”

On Tuesday, Mr. Trump is scheduled to go to Capitol Hill to address House Republicans, who are planning to vote on two immigration measures this week. In a Twitter post, Mr. Trump repeated his running blame of Democratic policies — “CHANGE THE LAWS!”

But no law actually requires that families be separated at the border.

Words fail again, especially with ridiculous line that it is a Democrat law, that he keeps repeating.   :rolleyes:  And to have a go at Merkel with a complete pile of crap tweet.  Winz all around. 

Online Savant

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2115 on: June 19, 2018, 04:31:51 PM »
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President Trump and two members of his cabinet mounted an aggressive defense on Monday of his policy of separating children from their parents at the border in response to a growing outcry from members of both parties.

“They could be murderers and thieves and so much else,” Mr. Trump said of the people crossing the border. “We want a safe country, and it starts with the borders, and that’s the way it is.”

On Tuesday, Mr. Trump is scheduled to go to Capitol Hill to address House Republicans, who are planning to vote on two immigration measures this week. In a Twitter post, Mr. Trump repeated his running blame of Democratic policies — “CHANGE THE LAWS!”

But no law actually requires that families be separated at the border.

Words fail again, especially with ridiculous line that it is a Democrat law, that he keeps repeating.   :rolleyes:  And to have a go at Merkel with a complete pile of crap tweet.  Winz all around.

He could, you know, issue an Executive Order. He loves showing those off.

Offline gogators!

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2116 on: June 19, 2018, 07:51:38 PM »
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There are 11 million unauthorized immigrants in this country. Every past administration has used some discretion in targeting whom to deport. They targeted those who were destroying society, not building it. They tried to take account of particular contexts, and they tried to show some sense of basic humanity.

But today, discretion and humanity are being stamped out. The Trump administration has embraced a “zero tolerance” policy. In practice that means that all complexity has to be reduced to uniformity. Compassion is replaced by a blind obedience to regulations. Context is irrelevant. Arrests are indiscriminate. All that matters is that the arrest numbers go up, so human beings in the system are reduced to numbers.

What’s most significant is this: The Trump administration immigration officials have become exactly the kind of monsters that conservatism has always warned against.

From dyed in the wool republican David brooks.

Offline Dave Stepz

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2117 on: June 20, 2018, 07:35:03 AM »
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The US is withdrawing from the United Nations human rights council, the Trump administration announced on Tuesday, calling it a “cesspool of political bias” that targets Israel in particular while ignoring atrocities in other countries.

The US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, said she had traveled to the council’s headquarters in Geneva a year ago to call for reforms, to no avail.

but...

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Donald Trump heads to Capitol Hill on Tuesday afternoon facing an extraordinary backlash from his own party – and the American public – over his policy of separating children from their parents at the southern US border.

The separations occur when, under a “zero tolerance” immigration policy, adults are arrested for crossing the border illegally. As children cannot be held in an adult jail, they are held separately.

Never a truer word spoken Mrs Haley.

Online Savant

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2118 on: June 20, 2018, 11:34:58 AM »
Apparently Ivanka whispered to her father that the optics of Trump Concentration Camps are not good politically.

Offline CDW

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Re: When will Trump be impeached?
« Reply #2119 on: June 20, 2018, 11:55:01 AM »
"When countries abuse us by sending their people up (not their best) we're not going to give anymore aid to those countries. Why the hell should we?"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZjL8MxqUHE&t=80

An American president puts America first. That's the way it should be.