October 19, 2017, 03:33:44 AM


Author Topic: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0  (Read 521473 times)

Offline Pecan

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3980 on: January 03, 2017, 10:43:05 PM »
This naming/title issue is easily solved when addressed on the first day.

Initiate the conversation by asking how they would like to be addressed (you can ask, "oh, how about x,y,z" to get your point across).

Then they will usually ask you the same or you can simply say please address me as...

I tell them, "PECAN TEACHER" is rude and Konglish, so please call me Mr. Pecan, not PECAN sownsangnim.

Over the years, it has only ever been an problem with one coteacher, who had many more pressing "issues", if you know what I mean.

It's pretty easy for most, as all of the textbooks use the correct honorifics.

Offline What?What?

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3981 on: January 04, 2017, 10:11:52 AM »
My CT's call me What?What? My students call me What?What? It's my name, so yeah whatever.

Rant: Camp. CT. Arrrrghhh. That is all. :rolleyes:
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Offline donovan

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3982 on: January 04, 2017, 10:25:31 AM »
This naming/title issue is easily solved when addressed on the first day.

Initiate the conversation by asking how they would like to be addressed (you can ask, "oh, how about x,y,z" to get your point across).

Then they will usually ask you the same or you can simply say please address me as...

I tell them, "PECAN TEACHER" is rude and Konglish, so please call me Mr. Pecan, not PECAN sownsangnim.

Over the years, it has only ever been an problem with one coteacher, who had many more pressing "issues", if you know what I mean.

It's pretty easy for most, as all of the textbooks use the correct honorifics.

sownsang = 손상: damaged

It's hard to hide the hurt, but I think they're trying to help you, Mr. Nut :afro: :afro: :afro:

Offline HyooMyron

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3983 on: January 04, 2017, 10:56:54 AM »
When I first came here, I used to get butt hurt when people called me 원어민. I finally confronted a co-teacher about it and she explained that it is very respectful.

Is it very respectful? It just means speaker of a foreign language. If your parents came to visit, they'd be 원어민. If your 4-year-old kid brother came to visit, he'd be 원어민.

원어민 강사 means foreign language instructor. It is a neutral term. (It is the term used in articles talking about foreign teachers committing crimes.)

Stay with me here, I know this is a difficult concept: 원어민 = our title. Using titles = respectful. Calling us 원어민 = respectful  :cheesy:

I'm well aware of the textbook definition of 원어민. But in everyday usage in a school setting, it is our job title. Technically, my 4 year old kid brother could come here and claim the title of "영어 원어민". But everyone knows that is a bit misleading, no?

Offline donovan

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3984 on: January 04, 2017, 11:33:36 AM »
When I first came here, I used to get butt hurt when people called me 원어민. I finally confronted a co-teacher about it and she explained that it is very respectful.

Is it very respectful? It just means speaker of a foreign language. If your parents came to visit, they'd be 원어민. If your 4-year-old kid brother came to visit, he'd be 원어민.

원어민 강사 means foreign language instructor. It is a neutral term. (It is the term used in articles talking about foreign teachers committing crimes.)

Stay with me here, I know this is a difficult concept: 원어민 = our title. Using titles = respectful. Calling us 원어민 = respectful  :cheesy:

I'm well aware of the textbook definition of 원어민. But in everyday usage in a school setting, it is our job title. Technically, my 4 year old kid brother could come here and claim the title of "영어 원어민". But everyone knows that is a bit misleading, no?

I'm not sure if 원어민 passes as a title. It ends with a generic 민 rather than a respectful 님. It'd be like walking around an office and calling everyone 회사원, although not really because at least 회사원 indicates that you're at least a worker, not just a speaker of an unspecified language. Add 강사 to 원어민 and then you're to about level with 회사원, which isn't saying all that much, as that comes off as very awkward and as such probably more disrespectful than not given that actual titles of respect do exist. That said, I don't believe anybody has ever addressed me as 원어민, but people do sometimes refer to me as a 원어민, which is perfectly fine.

Offline megeek23

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3985 on: January 04, 2017, 12:05:58 PM »
Has anyone ever found an effective way to handle loud street noise from those Bongo trucks playing obnoxious noise on loud speakers to sell their shit? Everyday at 10:00 a.m. one comes by. I'm up by then or at school, but being on vacation and hearing that everyday just annoys me so much. I've sent pics and video to the local police station but they told me  quote "we can't do anything about it because it is impossible to know when he will be there"; even though this adjoshi asshole shows up like clock work every day at the same time.

What should I do?


Offline yirgacheffe

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3986 on: January 04, 2017, 12:12:06 PM »
When I first came here, I used to get butt hurt when people called me 원어민. I finally confronted a co-teacher about it and she explained that it is very respectful.

Is it very respectful? It just means speaker of a foreign language. If your parents came to visit, they'd be 원어민. If your 4-year-old kid brother came to visit, he'd be 원어민.

원어민 강사 means foreign language instructor. It is a neutral term. (It is the term used in articles talking about foreign teachers committing crimes.)

Stay with me here, I know this is a difficult concept: 원어민 = our title. Using titles = respectful. Calling us 원어민 = respectful  :cheesy:

I'm well aware of the textbook definition of 원어민. But in everyday usage in a school setting, it is our job title. Technically, my 4 year old kid brother could come here and claim the title of "영어 원어민". But everyone knows that is a bit misleading, no?

I'm not sure if 원어민 passes as a title. It ends with a generic 민 rather than a respectful 님. It'd be like walking around an office and calling everyone 회사원, although not really because at least 회사원 indicates that you're at least a worker, not just a speaker of an unspecified language. Add 강사 to 원어민 and then you're to about level with 회사원, which isn't saying all that much, as that comes off as very awkward and as such probably more disrespectful than not given that actual titles of respect do exist. That said, I don't believe anybody has ever addressed me as 원어민, but people do sometimes refer to me as a 원어민, which is perfectly fine.

It's rude if they refer to / address you simply as 원어민. 원어민 선생님 is the polite way to refer to / address you if they are not using our names, and 원어민 강사 can be what they use to refer to you (also politely), but is kind of awkward when it's used to address you.

Offline HyooMyron

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3987 on: January 04, 2017, 12:19:29 PM »
When I first came here, I used to get butt hurt when people called me 원어민. I finally confronted a co-teacher about it and she explained that it is very respectful.

Is it very respectful? It just means speaker of a foreign language. If your parents came to visit, they'd be 원어민. If your 4-year-old kid brother came to visit, he'd be 원어민.

원어민 강사 means foreign language instructor. It is a neutral term. (It is the term used in articles talking about foreign teachers committing crimes.)

Stay with me here, I know this is a difficult concept: 원어민 = our title. Using titles = respectful. Calling us 원어민 = respectful  :cheesy:

I'm well aware of the textbook definition of 원어민. But in everyday usage in a school setting, it is our job title. Technically, my 4 year old kid brother could come here and claim the title of "영어 원어민". But everyone knows that is a bit misleading, no?

I'm not sure if 원어민 passes as a title. It ends with a generic 민 rather than a respectful 님. It'd be like walking around an office and calling everyone 회사원, although not really because at least 회사원 indicates that you're at least a worker, not just a speaker of an unspecified language. Add 강사 to 원어민 and then you're to about level with 회사원, which isn't saying all that much, as that comes off as very awkward and as such probably more disrespectful than not given that actual titles of respect do exist. That said, I don't believe anybody has ever addressed me as 원어민, but people do sometimes refer to me as a 원어민, which is perfectly fine.

Hmm after a short consideration, I don't think I would say 워어민 is a title either lol. It's just one of many ways someone can talk about you, while puttin' some respekt on it.
And same for me, 원어민 is always used to refer to me. I don't think anyone has used 워어민 to address me directly.

Offline donovan

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3988 on: January 04, 2017, 12:33:55 PM »
When I first came here, I used to get butt hurt when people called me 원어민. I finally confronted a co-teacher about it and she explained that it is very respectful.

Is it very respectful? It just means speaker of a foreign language. If your parents came to visit, they'd be 원어민. If your 4-year-old kid brother came to visit, he'd be 원어민.

원어민 강사 means foreign language instructor. It is a neutral term. (It is the term used in articles talking about foreign teachers committing crimes.)

Stay with me here, I know this is a difficult concept: 원어민 = our title. Using titles = respectful. Calling us 원어민 = respectful  :cheesy:

I'm well aware of the textbook definition of 원어민. But in everyday usage in a school setting, it is our job title. Technically, my 4 year old kid brother could come here and claim the title of "영어 원어민". But everyone knows that is a bit misleading, no?

I'm not sure if 원어민 passes as a title. It ends with a generic 민 rather than a respectful 님. It'd be like walking around an office and calling everyone 회사원, although not really because at least 회사원 indicates that you're at least a worker, not just a speaker of an unspecified language. Add 강사 to 원어민 and then you're to about level with 회사원, which isn't saying all that much, as that comes off as very awkward and as such probably more disrespectful than not given that actual titles of respect do exist. That said, I don't believe anybody has ever addressed me as 원어민, but people do sometimes refer to me as a 원어민, which is perfectly fine.

It's rude if they refer to / address you simply as 원어민. 원어민 선생님 is the polite way to refer to / address you if they are not using our names, and 원어민 강사 can be what they use to refer to you (also politely), but is kind of awkward when it's used to address you.

Right. So 선생님 is the respectful title. 원어민 only serves to specify which teacher but has absolutely nothing to do with degree of formality and can be cut out completely, just as you don't often address the science teacher as 과학 선생님. As incorrect and awkward 'Donovan Teacher' is to say in English, it's not a battle I'm particularly passionate about and most often choose not to pick it. So long as students say 'teacher' I know the student is trying to use English and is affording me as much respect as they do to all the other teachers.

Offline Kayos

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3989 on: January 04, 2017, 12:40:12 PM »
So, today has been a pretty bad day all around. I think I'm going through the anger stage of culture shock because every little thing set me off today. I've also been really upset lately as well. I'm only three months in but I am burnt out. My co-teacher is beginning to get on my nerves too. For example, I had to teach an after-school class with high schoolers. My co-teacher got a call from the high school teacher about the after-school class this morning but he refused to tell me until after the class was over. He came up to me when I returned from the high school saying "Oh, you had a high school class today?" When I told him "yes," he stated that he already knew and that the high school teacher had called him earlier. He then told me later that I should change the class time to the mornings even though he knows I have no control over my schedule. He's also always asking me how much I get paid, and asking about my college debt. I think he's doing it with kind intentions but at the same time, it starts to grate on my nerves because it's not really any of his business. I can't tell if he is trying to build a better relationship with me, especially since I can't speak Korean. But then he always compares me to the last foreign English teacher who could speak Korean. And he will repeatedly ask me if I can understand Korean even though I've told him multiple times, that I'm still in the beginning stages of learning Korean.

Then, with my high school class, I'm supposed to have a two week one hour camp with them, but none of them really want to be there. I've made games and tried to play them but the students have been forcing it so that one team wins and the game is over really quickly. They will then say class over, and I'm just so burnt out. I then have to tell them, "No, class is not over, we'll do something else." I've had the high school classes four times each week since I arrived in October and I'm running out of things to teach. Plus, only a few people at my school call me by name, the rest call me by foreign teacher. Not waygookin but wanamin. I'm not sure how to spell it in korean but I know that it's the politer version of waygookin.  My students and my co-teacher all reference me as foreign teacher. While it doesn't seem like a big deal, there are days where it makes me feel like less of a person because I do have a name. I'm trying to make the most of my situation but at the same time, I just really needed to vent. It can be really frustrating when things like this happen and it's nice to know that others have experienced similar experiences and made it through.

Keep your chin up.

Wanamin translates directly as foreign language instructor. Also using your job title is significantly more polite than using your name. Just wait. Eventually you'll be pissed off because you're being called on by name instead of title :p

As for the kids ending the game quick. Make them do it again. And again. And again. Eventually they give up.

+1 on the fact that wonomin is more polite. You know who never calls me by my title and only by my name? Jerk Boss. Everyone else who frequently calls me wonomin seem to actually respect me.

This may just be me, but I don't like being called by my title. I've gotten a lot of students to stop calling me "teacher" or "<name>-teacher" and to just use my first name.
I don't like formalities / formal situations. I enjoy laid back / casual ones. :P
My co-teachers call me by my first name too.

Offline moonbrie

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3990 on: January 04, 2017, 12:54:39 PM »
I wasn't making reference to anything about America, but simply talking about public schools in Korea.

Whoever told you that you weren't allowed to leave is misinformed.

Misinformed or not, they can still try to start shit if I leave. Even if I'm technically in the right I'm really done with being yelled at.

Offline welcomebackkotter

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3991 on: January 04, 2017, 01:21:34 PM »
ffs lady, when you plan everything for camp and give me a bare minimum of info as to what will happen during the day, then stumble in hungover 30 minutes late and go home as soon as camp is finished complaining of being sick - don't expect me to be sympathetic or kind to you - and don't expect me to pick up your slack.  You've got a problem, you better start dealing with deal with it!  I'm three days away from the end of this year, I'm so fuking over it I can't deal with your bullocks anymore.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 01:26:30 PM by welcomebackkotter »

Offline #basedcowboyshirt

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3992 on: January 04, 2017, 02:51:10 PM »
Most of my coworkers refer to me as 선생님 or 쌤, occasionally coupled with my name.

People who don't know me well refer to me as 원어민 선생님, which is totally fine. They refer to other teachers by their _____ 선생님 title, too.

There's one teacher who will repeatedly refer to me as 외국인 literally right in front of my to my other coworkers, and I can tell even they think it's super rude, because they'll pointedly refer to me as 선생님 when they address me around her.

Some peeps are just rude.

Offline kyndo

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3993 on: January 04, 2017, 03:21:01 PM »
I wasn't making reference to anything about America, but simply talking about public schools in Korea.

Whoever told you that you weren't allowed to leave is misinformed.
I've actually spent a lot of time looking into this -- whether or not employers in Korea are allowed to forbid their employees from leaving the premises during break time. Unfortunately, none of the Korean labour law sites mention anything about it (except for the fact that we are owed (at least) 30 minutes of break time where we can't be required to do any kind of work).

While they are allowed to do so in the UK, and in North America, I've heard a lot of NETs say that it's not legal here in Korea.
...But then again, a lot of NETs are full of $#!+.

If you've run across anything solid about what our rights are in this particular issue, I would really appreciate a link!!!


Offline yirj17

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3994 on: January 04, 2017, 03:30:36 PM »
I don't think my main school cares what I do during my lunch hour as long as I'm not getting into trouble. It's a middle school though.

I've a friend who works at an English town & elem. public school who got a lot of flak for going out to eat for lunch one time. So that friend has never done so again.

Offline CO2

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3995 on: January 04, 2017, 03:35:24 PM »
I don't understand some people. I get a 50 minute break. Leave me the hell alone! If I want to walk in a direction for 25 mins and then turn around and come back, that's my choice.

If I'm late coming back, fine, discipline me, that's fair. But preventative measures are only so useful.

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Ignoring isnít the same as ignorance, you have to work at it.

Offline The Arm

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3996 on: January 04, 2017, 03:37:31 PM »
But surely the point is that we're adults so there's no way you can tell me that I can't leave school at lunchtime.

I think it's one of those situations when this applies:

What are they going to do, fire you?

EDIT: Yea totally agree with CO2 above ^
« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 03:39:05 PM by The Arm »

Offline kyndo

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3997 on: January 04, 2017, 03:56:23 PM »
But surely the point is that we're adults so there's no way you can tell me that I can't leave school at lunchtime.
Well, most work places in commonwealth countries can and a few do -- especially in places where workplace liability is often an issue.

My school actually doesn't really care what I do when I'm on break, so it's not an issue for me personally. But not knowing the answer to a question bugs me.

Also, the issue has come up often enough that I know it'll come up again (and again and again) in the future, and I wanna sound smart and be able to give a definitive answer! :smiley:

I think it's one of those situations when this applies:
What are they going to do, fire you?
Wellllll... they could mess with your holiday schedules, farm you out for additional winter camps, have you do extra lessons, ask you to submit all your lesson plans for the year, make you edit essays, give you horrible evaluations, or any of a million other things that schools tend to do when they dislike their employees.
 I feel that whether or not schools are allowed to demand that I stay during breaks can result in different levels of resentment when I inevitably refuse to do so:undecided:
« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 04:07:15 PM by kyndo »

Offline CO2

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3998 on: January 04, 2017, 04:00:15 PM »
But surely the point is that we're adults so there's no way you can tell me that I can't leave school at lunchtime.

I think it's one of those situations when this applies:

What are they going to do, fire you?

EDIT: Yea totally agree with CO2 above ^

The infantalisation I've experienced here is astounding sometimes. We had Chinese delivery yesterday in the office (12 teachers) and we all wrapped up our plates and shit to return the stuff to the delivery guy.

 :-* "CO2, can you take this and put it outside the front door?"

 :police: "Yeah, no problem."

 :-* "Thanks."

So, I trudge off with a couple of other teachers and we all leave the plates out front for the delivery guy to pick up at his discretion.

 :-* sees me returning sans dish bag.

 :-* "Wow, good job!" *pats me on the back*

WOW! Did you know I can tie my own shoes too?  :rolleyes:
Ignoring isnít the same as ignorance, you have to work at it.

Offline #basedcowboyshirt

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Re: RANTING/VENTING MEGATHREAD 3.0
« Reply #3999 on: January 04, 2017, 04:14:43 PM »
But surely the point is that we're adults so there's no way you can tell me that I can't leave school at lunchtime.

I think it's one of those situations when this applies:

What are they going to do, fire you?

EDIT: Yea totally agree with CO2 above ^

The infantalisation I've experienced here is astounding sometimes. We had Chinese delivery yesterday in the office (12 teachers) and we all wrapped up our plates and shit to return the stuff to the delivery guy.

 :-* "CO2, can you take this and put it outside the front door?"

 :police: "Yeah, no problem."

 :-* "Thanks."

So, I trudge off with a couple of other teachers and we all leave the plates out front for the delivery guy to pick up at his discretion.

 :-* sees me returning sans dish bag.

 :-* "Wow, good job!" *pats me on the back*

WOW! Did you know I can tie my own shoes too?  :rolleyes:

I remember a while ago, after a school lunch, asked me if I knew how to take the subway home from a place that was literally two minutes away from the school.

Or teachers asking me where I do my shopping, and me responding that I do most of it online, and them asking, "How? Isn't it too hard?" Oh, yes... online shopping is too hard. I can't do it. Really?

The genuine surprise I sometimes see in people's faces when I tell them I do some incredibly mundane and normal task blows my mind.

 

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