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Author Topic: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation  (Read 46420 times)

Offline adamwatch

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #100 on: April 19, 2011, 04:35:23 PM »
I don't think its unreasonable for a no drinking policy at work, but after your work is finished and its not illegal then it should be your choice.  The Gepik thing is not just work it is your free time too.

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Offline justanotherwaygook

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #101 on: April 19, 2011, 04:43:07 PM »

That orientation is considered part of your working hours - you are still getting paid for it - I don't think it's unreasonable for an employer (The boss) to have restrictions on their employees while they're still under their payroll.


Under that interpretation I should get overtime.  Overtime is a whopping 7,000won/her (for non-teaching hours).  Under that theory, since I am under their direct control (as opposed to my normal life in which I still conduct myself in a reputable manner 24/7), I should be paid from 10am Monday to 11am Wednesday.  That's 49 hours.  Subtract my normal 24 hours (8/day).  I should get 25 hours of overtime, or 175,000 won.

Now of course, I'm being ridiculous and don't actually expect that.  But my point is that this regulation is beyond our normal working conditions.
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Offline timjspence

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #102 on: April 19, 2011, 04:46:30 PM »
I like to drink, but I'd respect this.  Some bad apples ruined it for everyone.  A few years ago somebody had have their stomach pumped, I mean dang...I'd say that not all the NETs at GEPIK can be trusted to act responsibly so we all suffer...

Offline justanotherwaygook

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #103 on: April 19, 2011, 04:54:37 PM »
I like to drink, but I'd respect this.  Some bad apples ruined it for everyone.  A few years ago somebody had have their stomach pumped, I mean dang...I'd say that not all the NETs at GEPIK can be trusted to act responsibly so we all suffer...

Eek  :o.  That is bad.  I wonder if stuff like this caused their insurance rates to go up.
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Offline Yu_Bumsuk

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #104 on: April 19, 2011, 05:51:58 PM »
I love you guys who have no problem with this. You have no idea how insulting they're being to you by KOREAN standards. It must be so nice to be so blissfully ignorant.

This thread is a good example of why I avoid any waygook PS stuff like the plague. To be treated like a child is one thing but to do so with a bunch of people who are happy to be treated like children is another.

Offline jrwhite82

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #105 on: April 19, 2011, 06:00:22 PM »
I love you guys who have no problem with this. You have no idea how insulting they're being to you by KOREAN standards. It must be so nice to be so blissfully ignorant.

This thread is a good example of why I avoid any waygook PS stuff like the plague. To be treated like a child is one thing but to do so with a bunch of people who are happy to be treated like children is another.

I agree.  The POLICE do the same thing in my home country.  I mean, I'm an even better driver when I drive drunk.  I make sure to go slower and obey stop signs and traffic lights.  But get this....they say it's against the rules and I'll be punished if I get caught!!!!  WTH?!?!  I don't know how other idiots in my home country can stand to agree with these FACIST policies.  It is totally an infringement on my human rights.  That's why I came to Korea.  To get away from this police state.  And then to hear that GEPIK is also treating its employees like SLAVES!  This is an outrage. 

/sarcasm off

Offline RatnaMH

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #106 on: April 19, 2011, 06:20:22 PM »
Maybe if people didn't act like stupid kids we wouldn't get treated that way...

I sure as hell wasn't happy to wake up and find someone puked on the window by our elevators...





Offline Craash

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #107 on: April 19, 2011, 07:15:35 PM »
I am not too happy about the alcohol ban.

I enjoy a couple of quiet drinks each night, which puts me to sleep.

If I can't smuggle a few drinks in, I won't be getting much sleep.

I also feel sorry for whoever has to share my room with me, as I am a very loud snorer. :-X

Offline jrwhite82

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #108 on: April 19, 2011, 07:25:08 PM »
I am not too happy about the alcohol ban.

I enjoy a couple of quiet drinks each night, which puts me to sleep.

If I can't smuggle a few drinks in, I won't be getting much sleep.

I also feel sorry for whoever has to share my room with me, as I am a very loud snorer. :-X

You know that drinking makes you snore right?

Offline jonpurdy

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #109 on: April 19, 2011, 07:44:28 PM »
So basically, here is the problem
P) People go to an orientation, get drunk and become unruly.
One solution to P is to not allow alcohol at the orientation.   If you can think of a different way of solving P that is actually feasible, let's hear it.

Well, my suggestion was to give them a warning or fire them on the spot. Though...

It's possible these NETs were fired when they caused trouble.   I'm sure it's possible.  Don't know how feasible it is because the public school is expecting a native teacher and doesn't want to not have one.

…you're right in that their school would have to wait a long time for a replacement. So I agree now that it's definitely easier for GEPIK to just ban alcohol rather than allow it and have lots of problems.

Though hasn't alcohol been banned in the past? I'm thinking that the ban might incite certain people to drink more just to show off or protest the ban or whatever.

The requirements are already, a bachelor's degree.   Which places the NET in the top 20% in his country as far as his education.   Adding to that, the requirement of a certification would weed them out, how exactly?

Presumably, those with certifications would be here as professional teachers and not willing to sacrifice their professional reputation by getting totally inebriated.

I've gone through all the pages of this thread and I didn't realize the sheer number of problems that GEPIK has had in the past. I do understand what GEPIK is trying to do and I can understand why the ban is in place. Though I still think hiring more qualified people would weed out even more people who would cause problems (and generally up the bar for public school teachers in Korea, though that's a totally different can of worms, heh).

Offline Ley_Druid

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #110 on: April 19, 2011, 08:08:40 PM »

What I don't get is why they just don't fire those few who do.
At my last two orientations, it was quite a lot more than a few.  There were easily over 100 people acting like idiots every night and morning of the orientation.  And to those who say this is treating us as children, well it seemed to me that a large number of the teachers were acting exactly like children.  It's so embarrassing as a foreigner to be compared to a lot of these other individuals.

Yes, it is important to remember that we are here as GUESTS. It is a PRIVILAGE to be here in Korea teaching English. I am not Korean and I do NOT have rights as Koreans do. I definatly do not have the RIGHTS granted to me by my country in another person's country.

You get paid to go to this thing. It is usually held during the work week, so being able to get out of class and see a bunch of people who natively speak your language is a treat in itself. You get paid to go. They feed you, house you, and even allow you to use all the electricity and water you reasonably want. On top of that, they offer computers to use and there si even a store on campus. They even have cell phone chargers there.

I have my own complains about the GEPIK orentation, but complaining about such a ban is silly. You don't have any RIGHTS here, you have PRIVILAGES. Don't bother letting it go to your head that they are taking away your RIGHT to drink. They don't take away anything. They didn't say you will die if you break the rules. They are rules, not unalterable scientific facts. It isn't impossible to drink there. But realize that there are consequences to your actions. If you choose to drink, you might lose your job. Tough cookies. I've had jobs that require even more PROFESSIONALISM and surely if I complained about what they asked, while I am getting paid, I'd would have been canned for sure. I believe that anybody who is thinking that they are above GEPIK's rules for a whole 2.5 days probably thinks they are better than Korean people. Sure, rip that one up guys.

Seriously, get your shit together. (Mods, go ahead and edit me if you must)

It isn't fair to all of us who decide to do things as we are asked when we are paid to. I feel like those who complain the loudest never had a job. They probably didn't have to work night jobs to go to school during the day. You do what you have to do. If complaining is what you do, make it your own crusade. If they ask me, I will tell them that I support any reasonable action to prepare us to be better teachers. There are millions of English speakers with degrees and just a few jobs. They could replace anybody in a heartbeat.

I bitch as much as anybody does about being in Korea. I vent a lot. I have to in order to get through the day. But the longer I am here, the more I realize that my bitching and venting is going down and those complaints are ever more trivial. This would be one of them as well. Go ahead and treat it like the 11th commandment:  Thou Shall Drinkith Wence Dusk Unto the Dawn of Every Morrow.

Offline christmas

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #111 on: April 19, 2011, 08:16:14 PM »
it doesn't concern me since i don't drink beside why would anyone drink at any orientations.

Offline singletrackmind

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #112 on: April 19, 2011, 08:23:21 PM »

That orientation is considered part of your working hours - you are still getting paid for it - I don't think it's unreasonable for an employer (The boss) to have restrictions on their employees while they're still under their payroll.


Under that interpretation I should get overtime.  Overtime is a whopping 7,000won/her (for non-teaching hours).  Under that theory, since I am under their direct control (as opposed to my normal life in which I still conduct myself in a reputable manner 24/7), I should be paid from 10am Monday to 11am Wednesday.  That's 49 hours.  Subtract my normal 24 hours (8/day).  I should get 25 hours of overtime, or 175,000 won.

Now of course, I'm being ridiculous and don't actually expect that.  But my point is that this regulation is beyond our normal working conditions.

I was paid 180,000 won for overtime each time I went to an orientation.  I'd assume you would as well, so I guess now you can quit whining about not being able to have a beer on company time.

Offline justanotherwaygook

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #113 on: April 19, 2011, 08:28:08 PM »


Yes, it is important to remember that we are here as GUESTS. It is a PRIVILAGE to be here in Korea teaching English. I am not Korean and I do NOT have rights as Koreans do. I definatly do not have the RIGHTS granted to me by my country in another person's country.

While one can definitely (watch your spelling  ;)) argue that there is discrimination against foreigners, including by the police, this is just being a little silly.  I have a right to not be beaten to death here.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2011, 08:35:01 PM by justanotherwaygook »
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portlandzach

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #114 on: April 19, 2011, 08:40:25 PM »
GOOD

Offline hunterst

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #115 on: April 19, 2011, 08:52:57 PM »

That orientation is considered part of your working hours - you are still getting paid for it - I don't think it's unreasonable for an employer (The boss) to have restrictions on their employees while they're still under their payroll.


Under that interpretation I should get overtime.  Overtime is a whopping 7,000won/her (for non-teaching hours).  Under that theory, since I am under their direct control (as opposed to my normal life in which I still conduct myself in a reputable manner 24/7), I should be paid from 10am Monday to 11am Wednesday.  That's 49 hours.  Subtract my normal 24 hours (8/day).  I should get 25 hours of overtime, or 175,000 won.

Now of course, I'm being ridiculous and don't actually expect that.  But my point is that this regulation is beyond our normal working conditions.

I was paid 180,000 won for overtime each time I went to an orientation.  I'd assume you would as well, so I guess now you can quit whining about not being able to have a beer on company time.

Do you know if this was through your school, if it is a standard thing.  This is enormously more important to me than drinking.  The thing for me is that this is something like an event.  People love drinking during events, that's why holidays and sports are so popular.  I think that for new people this could be very useful, but I know that many people going, like me, have been here for several months and won't get much out of the actual lectures.  My friends went and had fun, now I just want the same.

Offline justanotherwaygook

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #116 on: April 19, 2011, 09:19:54 PM »

That orientation is considered part of your working hours - you are still getting paid for it - I don't think it's unreasonable for an employer (The boss) to have restrictions on their employees while they're still under their payroll.


Under that interpretation I should get overtime.  Overtime is a whopping 7,000won/her (for non-teaching hours).  Under that theory, since I am under their direct control (as opposed to my normal life in which I still conduct myself in a reputable manner 24/7), I should be paid from 10am Monday to 11am Wednesday.  That's 49 hours.  Subtract my normal 24 hours (8/day).  I should get 25 hours of overtime, or 175,000 won.

Now of course, I'm being ridiculous and don't actually expect that.  But my point is that this regulation is beyond our normal working conditions.

I was paid 180,000 won for overtime each time I went to an orientation.  I'd assume you would as well, so I guess now you can quit whining about not being able to have a beer on company time.

Who said I was whining?

Seriously, I've created a monster.  I've turned this forum into Dave's.
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Offline wiggum2012

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #117 on: April 19, 2011, 09:52:35 PM »
Personally I couldn't care about the lack of alcohol, I've noticed there are far too many people who treat this job as an extension of college. Grow up, suck it in and if you don't like the rules leave.

Can we stop equating a fondness for alcohol with a lack of professionalism? Yes, I drink more in Korea than I did at home, and yes, I've gotten more drunk than was probably wise on certain occasions. But I also make sure that I am always fully prepared and am giving my students the best educational experience I am able to provide. I've never shown up drunk to work (a little hungover maybe, but that's usually after staff dinners), been late, called in sick, or otherwise unfit or unable to teach because of alcohol. Like it or not, you can't deny that drinking is a large part of the Korean social scene and those of us who partake in it shouldn't be vilified as unprofessional or immature.


Offline Yu_Bumsuk

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #118 on: April 20, 2011, 07:57:22 AM »
I love you guys who have no problem with this. You have no idea how insulting they're being to you by KOREAN standards. It must be so nice to be so blissfully ignorant.

This thread is a good example of why I avoid any waygook PS stuff like the plague. To be treated like a child is one thing but to do so with a bunch of people who are happy to be treated like children is another.

I agree.  The POLICE do the same thing in my home country.  I mean, I'm an even better driver when I drive drunk.  I make sure to go slower and obey stop signs and traffic lights.  But get this....they say it's against the rules and I'll be punished if I get caught!!!!  WTH?!?!  I don't know how other idiots in my home country can stand to agree with these FACIST policies.  It is totally an infringement on my human rights.  That's why I came to Korea.  To get away from this police state.  And then to hear that GEPIK is also treating its employees like SLAVES!  This is an outrage. 

/sarcasm off

Are you really so witless or do you just tend to show the same level or responsibility sitting in a hotel room as you would behind the wheel of a car?

Have you ever been on a staff retreat or workshop with Korean teachers? I'm guessing not. Here's what happens: after a long boring meeting every pigs out and breaks out the soju and beer. Then the guys take off to a noraebang / rooms salon and return to the hotel for a few more rounds. Someone breaks out the cards and the poker carries on perhaps all night while other teachers just pass out where they were sitting. The next morning everyone catches up on sleep on the bus or at any pointless morning meeting. This is usually mostly or all paid for with school money and is as much a bonding experience as anything else.

No booze, no gambling, and a curfew are what happens on a high school trip to Jejudo ... IF the homeroom teachers are really anal and can be arsed to enforce such rules. 'Cool' teachers might turn a blind eye or even let their students have a shot or two. But I'm guessing the GEPIK handlers won't be quite so cool with their adult charges.

I wonder if they'll make you kneel in a row and hold your hands up in their air if you're late for morning meetings?

Offline Burndog

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Re: Alcohol banned at GEPIK orientation
« Reply #119 on: April 20, 2011, 08:27:31 AM »
Yes YBS...except that when our Korean counterparts do that there aren't any newspaper articles decrying the horrible waste of public money during tough economic times.  As Brian and I have both mentioned...this is most likely because of the newspaper article last year that slagged off GEPIK Orientation as an orgy of boozing and anti-social behaviour. 

Unfortunately writing a news article about Korean teachers drinking probably wouldn't effect things...but an article that plays to the popular 'drunk foreign teacher' stereotype...as well as screaming about the need to tighten belts in a tough economic climate...well...unfortunately that has had an impact...and this is the impact.

Like I said...it's a shame...but at the same time why would GEPIK risk further embarrassment in the press?  I think that with funding so tight these days, anything they can do to protect the future of the program (and surely the negative press would not have pleased the big wigs at the GPOE) should be welcomed.  I'm of the opinion that having a job is more important than getting tipsy on a school night.