July 21, 2017, 05:45:30 PM


Author Topic: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]  (Read 116053 times)

Offline SteveBruce

  • Explorer
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #580 on: July 17, 2017, 04:13:45 PM »
- "why don't they go back to their home countries and find something better to do"
- also lives and works in South Korea



The hollowing out of the global middle class economy is really quite a big deal and a lot of people just stick their head in the sand and ignore it. Japan got hit with it first in the 1990's, then the US in the 2000's, the UK and other European countries after 2008, and now South Korea and even places like Australia. Economies look good on paper because real estate is (too) expensive and stocks are high, but younger people scrounge for good jobs and reasonable housing, and older people suffer too if they lose their jobs.

I knew I would get an asinine response like this one. I tried to make my point as clear as possible yet despite this, I still ruffled someones feathers. Either you didn't understand what I was trying to say or you fit the description of the sort of NET I was referring to, I'll let you choose which one that is.

At no point did I mention anything about going home. I was saying people lack the ambition to transcend the role of foreign English speaking clown. Meaning, working for a public school/hagwon masquerading as a teacher. If you bag a uni gig where you're being paid double, or open your own hagwon or something and stay in Korea that's awesome. Likewise with if you land a gig anywhere else in the world where you're doing better than what you're doing here (foreign English speaking clown).


Offline eggieguffer

  • The Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2821
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #581 on: July 17, 2017, 05:18:39 PM »
Quote

At no point did I mention anything about going home. I was saying people lack the ambition to transcend the role of foreign English speaking clown. Meaning, working for a public school/hagwon masquerading as a teacher. If you bag a uni gig where you're being paid double, or open your own hagwon or something and stay in Korea that's awesome. Likewise with if you land a gig anywhere else in the world where you're doing better than what you're doing here (foreign English speaking clown).

I don't really see why you're an English speaking clown at a hagwan or public school but suddenly you're awesome doing exactly the same thing at a uni to slightly older kids. Or do you only qualify for the awesome  tag if you're on twice the wage? - not many unis pay that by the way and a lot pay the same as hagwans




Offline CJ

  • Adventurer
  • *
  • Posts: 35
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #582 on: July 17, 2017, 06:22:23 PM »
Either way, by the next decade, there will be a decline.

Korea just isn't that good of a deal anymore if you're an E2. There's the apostille hassle and expense, the mediocre money and stressful workplace, and the inflexible visa conditions.

Vietnam is virtually on wage parity with Korea now and China is closing in. Anyone who values cultural experience as much as money will probably be opting for there.

How much comparison is there really, between "struggling to make friends in chingchongbuk-do" vs "rocking it in Saigon?"

Quote
I think in the 2020's, the gravy train will be over, even if we have a temporary reprieve.  There will still be native speakers, but will it end up more like Japan where you're poor?

I think we're already halfway there. The elementary jobs are shrinking, E2's are lessening and most jobs are being made into p/t or temp and filled by F-visas.

You'll be lucky earning $1400 USD in Vietnam minus tax without free flights, pension, good holidays, and a large bonus. You'll be forking out for your own apartment which aren't that cheap unless you're keen on living in a hovel. Saigon gets old real fast as does Hanoi. Great places to visit, but horrible to live in IMHO.  Go check it out for yourself.

As for Cambodia, the only decent gig in town is a place called ACE. While they pay a decent hourly rate, which depends on what type of classes you teach, when you add up the tonne of UNPAID holidays which amounts to about 10 weeks; you're saving diddly squat!

In relation to those saying get higher quals, I agree, but make sure they are proper quals like an Education degree or equivalent. Go check out salaries in Asia for most jobs where your Masters TEFOL/ Linguistics can be used, and then calculate how long it will take to pay off the fees. Is it really worth it?

Ride out the Korean gravy train people. Just learn how to budget and enjoy the outdoors and everything will be fine.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2017, 07:50:05 PM by CJ »

Offline Life Improvement

  • The Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2196
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #583 on: July 19, 2017, 09:04:56 PM »
In relation to those saying get higher quals, I agree, but make sure they are proper quals like an Education degree or equivalent. Go check out salaries in Asia for most jobs where your Masters TEFOL/ Linguistics can be used, and then calculate how long it will take to pay off the fees. Is it really worth it?

"I know teachers who have been working in Korea for decades, and the day they start generating more than 30-40 million won a year in income from their university employer will likely never come. Also, if your friend has or desires a family (i.e. spouse and kids), working in the ESL world isn't something they would be wise to pursue as a life-long pursuit unless they like having a very low budget lifestyle (i.e. small-medium size apartment, inability to save substantial piles of cash for retirement so they retire with dignity, lots of expenses with flying home to visit family, etc). That's why I recommend an M.A. with market value outside of Korea."

Offline jeremyheynen

  • Adventurer
  • *
  • Posts: 66
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #584 on: Yesterday at 11:29:44 AM »
I have been reading this post every time there is a new addition, and now feel the need to chime in.  I agree with much of the above, in that the end is near.  This is my last year and will be looking into other possibilities when I return home.  That being said I have found an online company in China, teaching ESL and it's not a great gig, but it supplements my income rather nicely.  I have posted this link on other boards and thought some EPIK teachers with nothing to do in the evenings might want to try this: https://www.DaDaABC.com/teacher/job/

I am in my second year with them and they have been legit. I have been making between 4-5 mil won a month for the past 5 months doing this (putting in a lot of hours, mind you)
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 01:03:55 PM by taeyang »

Offline kobayashi

  • Expert Waygook
  • ****
  • Posts: 703
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #585 on: Yesterday at 11:36:30 AM »
I have been reading this post every time there is a new addition, and now feel the need to chime in.  I agree with much of the above, in that the end is near.  This is my last year and will be looking into other possibilities when I return home.  That being said I have found an online company in China, teaching ESL and it's not a great gig, but it supplements my income rather nicely.  I have posted this link on other boards and thought some EPIK teachers with nothing to do in the evenings might want to try this: https://www.dadaabc.com/teacher/job/

I am in my second year with them and they have been legit. I have been making between 4-5 mil won a month for the past 5 months doing this (putting in a lot of hours, mind you)

as i've pointed out multiple times before, doing this is an outright violation of the EPIK contracts, as well as your E-2 visa conditions.

there are also a lot of implications for tax that people need to be aware of, and you may find yourself being done for tax evasion either by the korean National Tax Service or else the tax authorities in their home countries.

please, don't encourage people to engage in white collar crime.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 01:09:09 PM by taeyang »

Offline jeremyheynen

  • Adventurer
  • *
  • Posts: 66
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #586 on: Yesterday at 11:49:40 AM »
Hahaha  I was expecting a hater to post right away.  I checked with immigration and this is NOT a violation of the E2 VISA as this job has nothing to do with Korean Immigration.  It is a grey area when it comes to Labour law, however.  if you declare it as income here you need to pay taxes on it.  but feel free to continue posting knee-jerk uninformed opinion as fact.

Offline IRL_sean

  • Waygookin
  • *
  • Posts: 2
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #587 on: Yesterday at 11:56:05 AM »
Either way, by the next decade, there will be a decline.

Korea just isn't that good of a deal anymore if you're an E2. There's the apostille hassle and expense, the mediocre money and stressful workplace, and the inflexible visa conditions.

Vietnam is virtually on wage parity with Korea now and China is closing in. Anyone who values cultural experience as much as money will probably be opting for there.

How much comparison is there really, between "struggling to make friends in chingchongbuk-do" vs "rocking it in Saigon?"

Quote
I think in the 2020's, the gravy train will be over, even if we have a temporary reprieve.  There will still be native speakers, but will it end up more like Japan where you're poor?

I think we're already halfway there. The elementary jobs are shrinking, E2's are lessening and most jobs are being made into p/t or temp and filled by F-visas.

You'll be lucky earning $1400 USD in Vietnam minus tax without free flights, pension, good holidays, and a large bonus. You'll be forking out for your own apartment which aren't that cheap unless you're keen on living in a hovel. Saigon gets old real fast as does Hanoi. Great places to visit, but horrible to live in IMHO.  Go check it out for yourself.

As for Cambodia, the only decent gig in town is a place called ACE. While they pay a decent hourly rate, which depends on what type of classes you teach, when you add up the tonne of UNPAID holidays which amounts to about 10 weeks; you're saving diddly squat!

In relation to those saying get higher quals, I agree, but make sure they are proper quals like an Education degree or equivalent. Go check out salaries in Asia for most jobs where your Masters TEFOL/ Linguistics can be used, and then calculate how long it will take to pay off the fees. Is it really worth it?

Ride out the Korean gravy train people. Just learn how to budget and enjoy the outdoors and everything will be fine.

Do you have any actual experience that living in Vietnam sucks? Or did you just visit there, decided you "saw enough" (like you would even have insider information as a non-local)  after visiting the hot TripAdvisor spots and concluded that people wouldn't enjoy living there?

Online z80

  • Expert Waygook
  • ****
  • Posts: 642
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #588 on: Yesterday at 12:11:21 PM »
Hahaha  I was expecting a hater to post right away.  I checked with immigration and this is NOT a violation of the E2 VISA as this job has nothing to do with Korean Immigration.  It is a grey area when it comes to Labour law, however.  if you declare it as income here you need to pay taxes on it.  but feel free to continue posting knee-jerk uninformed opinion as fact.

It is a violation of the E2 visa. It is not a grey area.

Offline kobayashi

  • Expert Waygook
  • ****
  • Posts: 703
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #589 on: Yesterday at 12:28:35 PM »
Hahaha  I was expecting a hater to post right away.  I checked with immigration and this is NOT a violation of the E2 VISA as this job has nothing to do with Korean Immigration.  It is a grey area when it comes to Labour law, however.  if you declare it as income here you need to pay taxes on it.  but feel free to continue posting knee-jerk uninformed opinion as fact.

so you checked with immigration - the same immigration that you can call 3 different times and get 3 different answers from? the same immigration that issued E-2 visas to those canadians at that 'international school', then deported them for having the wrong visa - that immigration issued in the first place? yeah, great, glad you checked with that immigration  :rolleyes:

and what do you mean "if" you report it as income? if you are here on an E-2 visa you are a resident of korea for tax purposes, which means you have a legal requirement to report that income on your year-end tax settlement as according to korean tax law worldwide income is taxable for people who are korean tax residents. failure to report that income is tax evasion.

and guess what's going to happen when you report it? the NTS is going to see quite easily that you've violated your contract as well as your visa. it's not going to take a genius to see that.

Offline taeyang

  • Moderator - LVL 4
  • Waygook Lord
  • *
  • Posts: 5365
  • Gender: Male
Re: The End of Native Teachers/EPIK/NETs in Korea [Mega Thread]
« Reply #590 on: Yesterday at 01:10:16 PM »
stay on topic please.

any further posts not on topic will be removed, and their posters will be warned.
use google to search the site

site:waygook.org XXXX

replace 'XXXX' with your search term

 

Recent Lesson Plans

Buy/Sell/Trade

Employment