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Author Topic: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD  (Read 5459 times)

Online #basedcowboyshirt

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2012, 05:21:54 PM »
I'd rather be an American in Detroit than a Korean (other than a very rich one) in Korea any day.

As has been said, despite all the jeong and uri nara bs, Koreans do not look out for anyone outside their familly circle and are very cut throat about ripping each other off and judging each other.  Add the constant pressure from familly and society to conform to confucian culture, over study and over work, constant judgement every second of your life (have been told first hand that I am lucky not to be a Korean in Korea due to this - by Koreans) it's no surprise a lot of them jump of roofs and bridges. 

I would never have made it past 18 I doubt.

Agreed completely.  The Confucian hierarchy, being pushed around by bosses/people 'higher up' the ladder than you would have done me in.  There are sh*tty places in the U.S. and people in very tough situations, but we have this tremendous social freedom in Western countries to be an individual that really does not exist in much of the world, where commitments to the collective group are put first.  It's a freedom I'm going to appreciate on a much deeper level than I did before.

I actually agree. I've never encountered a more self-serving cultural mindset anywhere. The 정 kindness only exists in certain contexts, and for the most part, people here will happily (I use the term loosely, we've already established people aren't happy) step over any- and everyone to get where they want. How many times have you ever seen a Korean person show a shred of kindness to a disabled or homeless person on the street? Unlike back home, where (if you're a special kind of jerk) you can (maybe) ignore someone who needs help by blaming it on drugs, here, you'll see people walk past horribly crippled or aged people without even a glance.


Offline livzy

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #21 on: June 10, 2012, 05:40:26 PM »
I'd rather be an American in Detroit than a Korean (other than a very rich one) in Korea any day.

As has been said, despite all the jeong and uri nara bs, Koreans do not look out for anyone outside their familly circle and are very cut throat about ripping each other off and judging each other.  Add the constant pressure from familly and society to conform to confucian culture, over study and over work, constant judgement every second of your life (have been told first hand that I am lucky not to be a Korean in Korea due to this - by Koreans) it's no surprise a lot of them jump of roofs and bridges. 

I would never have made it past 18 I doubt.

Agreed completely.  The Confucian hierarchy, being pushed around by bosses/people 'higher up' the ladder than you would have done me in.  There are sh*tty places in the U.S. and people in very tough situations, but we have this tremendous social freedom in Western countries to be an individual that really does not exist in much of the world, where commitments to the collective group are put first.  It's a freedom I'm going to appreciate on a much deeper level than I did before.

I actually agree. I've never encountered a more self-serving cultural mindset anywhere. The 정 kindness only exists in certain contexts, and for the most part, people here will happily (I use the term loosely, we've already established people aren't happy) step over any- and everyone to get where they want. How many times have you ever seen a Korean person show a shred of kindness to a disabled or homeless person on the street? Unlike back home, where (if you're a special kind of jerk) you can (maybe) ignore someone who needs help by blaming it on drugs, here, you'll see people walk past horribly crippled or aged people without even a glance.

I thought that was because in Asia people (proudly) take care of their own kin and leave others to do the same?

Offline kps1

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2012, 01:58:02 PM »
Yeah the poor community aspect of Korean society is ironic given the whole 우리나라 rhetoric and the supposed collectivist ideals that foreigners love to talk about.
The reality is that Koreans in cities are unlikely to even know their neighbors and generally treat each other like crap, or least cool distance.
Cant tell you how tired I get of hearing uri nara ESOOOOUUUU, followed up by a weigukin duli. It's all garbage. My gf has ridiculous work hours, and no paid overtime. Her job isn't very difficult, but still, I would have flipped out and gotten fired already if I was doing hers.

Offline flasyb

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #23 on: June 11, 2012, 02:06:35 PM »
I actually agree. I've never encountered a more self-serving cultural mindset anywhere. The 정 kindness only exists in certain contexts, and for the most part, people here will happily (I use the term loosely, we've already established people aren't happy) step over any- and everyone to get where they want. How many times have you ever seen a Korean person show a shred of kindness to a disabled or homeless person on the street? Unlike back home, where (if you're a special kind of jerk) you can (maybe) ignore someone who needs help by blaming it on drugs, here, you'll see people walk past horribly crippled or aged people without even a glance.

I thought that was because in Asia people (proudly) take care of their own kin and leave others to do the same?

Given the increasing suicide rates of old people and the number of poor old people I see when I head to Seoul, I doubt that's as true as Koreans would have you believe.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

We are not "guests" in Korea. Korea didn't invite us over for Pimms in the garden. We are paid employees.

Offline livzy

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #24 on: June 11, 2012, 04:29:39 PM »
I actually agree. I've never encountered a more self-serving cultural mindset anywhere. The 정 kindness only exists in certain contexts, and for the most part, people here will happily (I use the term loosely, we've already established people aren't happy) step over any- and everyone to get where they want. How many times have you ever seen a Korean person show a shred of kindness to a disabled or homeless person on the street? Unlike back home, where (if you're a special kind of jerk) you can (maybe) ignore someone who needs help by blaming it on drugs, here, you'll see people walk past horribly crippled or aged people without even a glance.

I thought that was because in Asia people (proudly) take care of their own kin and leave others to do the same?

Given the increasing suicide rates of old people and the number of poor old people I see when I head to Seoul, I doubt that's as true as Koreans would have you believe.

Any proven stats for that (bolded) statement? Also I was talking about Asia in general, I didn't specifically pick on Koreans like you did.

Offline flasyb

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #25 on: June 11, 2012, 04:48:52 PM »
I actually agree. I've never encountered a more self-serving cultural mindset anywhere. The 정 kindness only exists in certain contexts, and for the most part, people here will happily (I use the term loosely, we've already established people aren't happy) step over any- and everyone to get where they want. How many times have you ever seen a Korean person show a shred of kindness to a disabled or homeless person on the street? Unlike back home, where (if you're a special kind of jerk) you can (maybe) ignore someone who needs help by blaming it on drugs, here, you'll see people walk past horribly crippled or aged people without even a glance.

I thought that was because in Asia people (proudly) take care of their own kin and leave others to do the same?

Given the increasing suicide rates of old people and the number of poor old people I see when I head to Seoul, I doubt that's as true as Koreans would have you believe.

Any proven stats for that (bolded) statement? Also I was talking about Asia in general, I didn't specifically pick on Koreans like you did.

Sure.

I'm quoting sections of the articles rather than the full articles. Links should work though.

http://english.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2012/03/31/2012033100375.html

Quote
In 1996, the suicide rate was higher among people in their 20s and 30s, but while the figure is declining among these age groups, it is rising among people over 40. The reason suicide became the No. 1 cause of death for young people in Korea is that deaths caused by other factors decreased sharply. Suicide among people over 65 jumped from 10.5 percent to 28.1 percen

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/world/2012-04/24/c_131548536.htm
Quote
"South Korea's rising suicide rate is largely attributed to the rapid increase in elderly suicide rates," the official was quoted by Yonhap as saying.

South Korea has the highest suicide rate among the member countries of the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD). In 2010, the rate of suicide for the elderly over the age of 65 was 72 per 100,000, more than twice higher than the country's total suicide rate. The country's suicide rate for 2010 was 31.2 per 100,000.

The suicide rate is actually falling among those in their 20s and 30s. The failure of Koreans to care for the elderly in their families is causing suicide rates to spike again. Double the national rate of one of the most suicide prone nations in the world? That's an INSANE figure.


I'm not "picking on" Korea. You talked about Asia. I mentioned Korea because it's the only Asian country I've ever lived in, it's the country I'm living in now and this is a forum mainly about teaching in Korea. That's not "picking on". It's just being relevant.

Plus, many people regard talking about "Koreans doing this" and "Koreans doing that" as too much generalising. Talking about all Asian people in that way is too broad a generalisation even for me to get involved in so I prefer to bring it back to Korea.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

We are not "guests" in Korea. Korea didn't invite us over for Pimms in the garden. We are paid employees.

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #26 on: June 12, 2012, 02:33:20 AM »
Part of me think that Korean culture is just inherently alienating. There are so many rigid categories and so many barriers to communication and understanding in place that it's no wonder that people are so sad.

Offline Aegy

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #27 on: June 12, 2012, 04:33:05 AM »
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that Korea has the highest suicide rates in the world.  The country came from nothing after the Korean War to an economic powerhouse by everyone working their tails off, and the way of thinking hasn't adapted fast enough to modern day society.  That doesn't mean we can't be happy here though :)

Offline master pandemonium

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #28 on: June 12, 2012, 05:09:22 AM »
Precisely, Aegy. I'm happy here because I don't have to live like a Korean. It really is a breeze to live here as a foreigner.  You don't have to play by the strict, rigid rules that apply. You aren't a part of the culture(and that is okay with me). As long at that pay shows up each month, I'm gold. However, if I had to live like a Korean here, I would be quite sad.

Offline livzy

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #29 on: June 12, 2012, 10:04:26 AM »
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that Korea has the highest suicide rates in the world.  The country came from nothing after the Korean War to an economic powerhouse by everyone working their tails off, and the way of thinking hasn't adapted fast enough to modern day society.  That doesn't mean we can't be happy here though :)

It's number 2, just behind Sweden  :o

NB It seems to be the way for dodgy politicians to deal with corruption investigations....

Offline Gansie

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Re: Koreans become more miserable - qualify of life near bottom of OECD
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2012, 03:22:50 PM »
Quote
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that Korea has the highest suicide rates in the world.

I read somewhere that the Scandinavian countries with their supposed high suicide rates are also ranked among the happiest in the world. So strangely enough there isn't always a correlation between happiness (or lack thereof) and suicide.

Also, some sources quote Sweden to have the highest rate and others state that it isn't actually that high... ::)

http://homepage.mac.com/jrc/contrib/sweden_suicide.html

The sad thing about Korea to me is how many of my co-workers realise that the whole system in the workplace is unfair and expects way too much of them and yet they feel like they can't change it. Especially my co-workers who have lived and worked abroad.

 

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